VST developer question

[MDTerps2015]

We have waves who charges that WUP prices every year to upgrade your vst's. Slate i think is by subscription for all of their products. Who in the heck has damn good vst's without all of the added costs of subscriptions and WUP's. Kind of like how RE's work. You buy the RE and you get to use it for as long as you have Reason but if there is an upgrade you don't have to buy it. Im looking and looking for that company who has vst's that you just buy and use without any strings attached. Any suggestions.

[Oquasec]

Thousands of vsts on the market that don't follow a subscription model.

[SA Studio]

And Waves plugs dont stop working if you don't decide to upgrade them.

No VST's stop working if you don't update them.

They do not phone-home to the developer nor are they on any kind of time-release.

VST's do not stop working if you do not update them. They will always work just fine.

[MDTerps2015]

And Waves plugs dont stop working if you don't decide to upgrade them.

No VST's stop working if you don't update them.

They do not phone-home to the developer nor are they on any kind of time-release.

VST's do not stop working if you do not update them. They will always work just fine.

SO what you are saying is I can buy them and I "DO NOT" have to upgrade unless there is a bug????? So if there is a bug is the upgrade for free????? I know I'm asking a lot for regular users like me to answer. I love the Waves products but like I said I would rather not go into subs and wup's. Thanx for answering SA. I thought maybe there is a company out there like Props where you try, then buy, and then make the choice of whether to upgrade or upgrade to fix downloads. I mean who is to say a vst developer make a vst and knowing a bug is with it its content, puts it out anyway and then we have to pay for the upgrade through WUP.

[normen]

And Waves plugs dont stop working if you don't decide to upgrade them.

No VST's stop working if you don't update them.

They do not phone-home to the developer nor are they on any kind of time-release.

VST's do not stop working if you do not update them. They will always work just fine.

Not true, at least not in a realistic environment where you update and change the rest of the system. See 32bit, see MacOS or Windows updates breaking compatibility. If you are a version back you will have to update the plugin to get the fix.

If the SSL Listen Mic Compressor plugin had been a RE I could still download and install it.

And to the OP: The thing is that native plugins mean A LOT of work for the developers. Keeping them compatible to changes in the OSs etc. is pretty involved stuff. You have multiple platforms, multiple formats so you have to have at least one computer for each OS (version!) and whatnot. For REs the dev doesn't have to do that work.

[MDTerps2015]

And Waves plugs dont stop working if you don't decide to upgrade them.

No VST's stop working if you don't update them.

They do not phone-home to the developer nor are they on any kind of time-release.

VST's do not stop working if you do not update them. They will always work just fine.

Not true, at least not in a realistic environment where you update and change the rest of the system. See 32bit, see MacOS or Windows updates breaking compatibility. If you are a version back you will have to update the plugin to get the fix.

If the SSL Listen Mic Compressor plugin had been a RE I could still download and install it.

And to the OP: The thing is that native plugins mean A LOT of work for the developers. Keeping them compatible to changes in the OSs etc. is pretty involved stuff. You have multiple platforms, multiple formats so you have to have at least one computer for each OS (version!) and whatnot. For REs the dev doesn't have to do that work.

Maybe I'm just duh on the whole subject. I guess in simpler terms, I'm looking for a vst company like waves (because I'm obsessive compulsive) to keep all of my products within the same company (LMAO, thats obsessive compulsive) that works like Props and RE's. Their selection is incredible but you don't buy them, you rent them and then have to pay every year for them. Im not doing that no matter how good they are. I understand your response Normen and to be truthfully honest with you, Im only looking for vocal vst's and a few vsti synths lateron just to have fun with. Im not making any money because its just a hobby. I would like to get my vst's and never go back to the website again.

[darkmaer]

Slate isn't subscription based only. You can purchase each to own for good. No monthly stuff.

How waves works is like this. The WUP can be handy and benefit you if you own like all their mercury bundle. What it does is allows you to get any new plugin that comes out and is in that bundle. So if they come out with 10 plugins (non-licensed: Abby road and SSL for example aren't included in their main bundles) you'll get those 10 plugins, just login and download and add the license to your computer. That is super handy and a money saver. 2, you don't have to keep it updated every year. This is something that they make sure their plugins are always working on the newest computer platforms. So when a new OS comes out and it doesn't work, they make sure to get their plugins working despite being 20 years old. So you pay the WUP and you get your favorite plugins again working in your new system.
It can also come in handy when they upgrade to a new version. For example I have the waves Element. They came out with a version 2. They give you a free year of WUP when you purchase a plugin for that specific plugin. My WUP had ran out. I didn't need to purchase it again if I didn't want to cause the synth was still working, but if I had WUP I'd get the version 2 without having to pay another $70-200 depending on getting for sale to get the second version. So I paid the I think $30 and got the second one.

WUP overall general purpose was though if your plugins stop working due to incompatibility then paying the WUP will get them working on the newer systems. But there are other bonuses like the getting free plugins if they get added to a bundle and upgrades to newer versions of plugins.

Overall I haven't payed for the WUP in the years that I've owned waves yet except to get an upgrade on element.

[SA Studio]

Sorry, double post

[SA Studio]

And Waves plugs dont stop working if you don't decide to upgrade them.

No VST's stop working if you don't update them.

They do not phone-home to the developer nor are they on any kind of time-release.

VST's do not stop working if you do not update them. They will always work just fine.

Not true, at least not in a realistic environment where you update and change the rest of the system. See 32bit, see MacOS or Windows updates breaking compatibility. If you are a version back you will have to update the plugin to get the fix.

If the SSL Listen Mic Compressor plugin had been a RE I could still download and install it.

And to the OP: The thing is that native plugins mean A LOT of work for the developers. Keeping them compatible to changes in the OSs etc. is pretty involved stuff. You have multiple platforms, multiple formats so you have to have at least one computer for each OS (version!) and whatnot. For REs the dev doesn't have to do that work.

{It's really best explained above = IF you have a compatibility issue, you will likely* need to pay a small update fee} However, what I'm saying is very factual - your plugs are going to keep working even if you don't pay for updates.


I've got VST's I've owned across multiple installs of different OS's - I have Waves plugs that I've never updated once that still work - again, you're not talking about what I'm talking about and you're only going to confuse people here.

Some of my 32 bit plugs work just fine that I've owned nearly ten years that went from 32 bit Vista to 64 bit Win 7

I could write a book about this stuff

EDIT: maybe OSX updates "break compatibility" but I can assure you, Windows updates, even entire OS updates, are not "breaking compatibility" and I have years of watching and NOT ONE VST I have ever stopped working or had a remote issue or problem

*some developers have free updates if there's a new OS

[SA Studio]

I had the thought earlier today to take a pic of my "recently used" section when I use Reaper.


When I say I use VST plugs all the time, I'm completely not joking. Some of those in that list are 32bit plugs that have survived multiple OS changes and moving from one computer to the next.

I could teach a tutorial on each one of those plugs there. I use them. Extensively, and know them very well. But all those plugs there, besides the Softube one, are old. I bought almost all of them a long time ago.

They all work fine and have for years across multiple installations and different OS updates.

Nothing broken. Ever.

[eusti]

I've got VST's I've owned across multiple installs of different OS's - I have Waves plugs that I've never updated once that still work - again, you're not talking about what I'm talking about and you're only going to confuse people here.

Some of my 32 bit plugs work just fine that I've owned nearly ten years that went from 32 bit Vista to 64 bit Win 7

I could write a book about this stuff

EDIT: maybe OSX updates "break compatibility" but I can assure you, Windows updates, even entire OS updates, are not "breaking compatibility" and I have years of watching and NOT ONE VST I have ever stopped working or had a remote issue or problem

No real experience with VSTs here, but Normen is right about Mac OS X updates breaking program compatibility a lot of times...
I'm kind of envious of PC users in that regard... :/

D.

[SA Studio]

I've got VST's I've owned across multiple installs of different OS's - I have Waves plugs that I've never updated once that still work - again, you're not talking about what I'm talking about and you're only going to confuse people here.

Some of my 32 bit plugs work just fine that I've owned nearly ten years that went from 32 bit Vista to 64 bit Win 7

I could write a book about this stuff

EDIT: maybe OSX updates "break compatibility" but I can assure you, Windows updates, even entire OS updates, are not "breaking compatibility" and I have years of watching and NOT ONE VST I have ever stopped working or had a remote issue or problem

No real experience with VSTs here, but Normen is right about Mac OS X updates breaking program compatibility a lot of times...
I'm kind of envious of PC users in that regard... :/

D.

I totally have zero experience with updating Mac and over the last few updates, watching close friends go thru a mini-hell and reading forums definitely let me know that it's a much bigger crap-shoot of if your stuff's still going to work after the new OS. That's incredibly weird to me, and I feel especially bad for people who endure it. Yeah, I don't even really buy new plugs any more because I've been set for a while. Simply saying, lots of my stuff is old and has managed to be transferred/still working, etc.

Apologies if I came off too strongly. I'm really looking forward to 2-3 months into the update where a lot of things are going to settle out. Many worries that a lot of us had had for a while, truly, are going to go away. We'll likely find new ones but yeah. What's about to happen is big

[Gulale]

I'm on mac, I have bought Over 2 k worth of Waves plugins and never upgraded. It has been over 5 years now I think. The possibility of breaking the software is rare to my knowledge and everything has passed its WUP except the recent ones which I bought last and this year. However, the WUP is capped on 300 USD that is the maximum it goes. To be honest, I wouldn't mind to pay 300 after 5 years but I know it is not even necessary. I usually don't jump to the recent OS. I just did on Sierra but still I have no issue. Man other companies charge for one plugin to upgrade starting from 50 to 100 bucks per plugin. 300 USD for 600 plugins I'm in. Most importantly 300 dollar after 10 and 15 years later. Thats when I need it.

[normen]

{It's really best explained above = IF you have a compatibility issue, you will likely* need to pay a small update fee} However, what I'm saying is very factual - your plugs are going to keep working even if you don't pay for updates.


I've got VST's I've owned across multiple installs of different OS's - I have Waves plugs that I've never updated once that still work - again, you're not talking about what I'm talking about and you're only going to confuse people here.

Some of my 32 bit plugs work just fine that I've owned nearly ten years that went from 32 bit Vista to 64 bit Win 7

I could write a book about this stuff

EDIT: maybe OSX updates "break compatibility" but I can assure you, Windows updates, even entire OS updates, are not "breaking compatibility" and I have years of watching and NOT ONE VST I have ever stopped working or had a remote issue or problem

*some developers have free updates if there's a new OS

Right.. Fact remains that you will not get compatibility fixes. You have a fixed compiled binary for a very specific operating system. Using a 32bit bridge is kind of like saying "But I can use windows 3.11 in a VM!! It will never die!!!".

And yeah, you give me your anecdotal info, I give you mine. I had several plugins that I can't use anymore, be it because they were discontinued and didn't get updates or be it because I didn't want to pay money for an update that doesn't give me any new features.

So anyway, as I was saying to the OP, developing native plugins is MUCH MUCH more support work than developing REs and if you want the same one-installer-niceness you'll have to stick with one company developing and selling the plugins, like the cancer of the industry Waves Audio.

[-008']

Right.. Fact remains that you will not get compatibility fixes. You have a fixed compiled binary for a very specific operating system. Using a 32bit bridge is kind of like saying "But I can use windows 3.11 in a VM!! It will never die!!!".

And yeah, you give me your anecdotal info, I give you mine. I had several plugins that I can't use anymore, be it because they were discontinued and didn't get updates or be it because I didn't want to pay money for an update that doesn't give me any new features.

So anyway, as I was saying to the OP, developing native plugins is MUCH MUCH more support work than developing REs and if you want the same one-installer-niceness you'll have to stick with one company developing and selling the plugins, like the cancer of the industry Waves Audio.

Waves truly is the cancer of the industry.

I bought Codex synth from them last year (their synths and instruments suck!) and already it doesn't work and their online system is trying to shake me down. I couldn't even download the goddam thing after my last OS re-install without them harassing me for the WUP again. I gave up on Waves for the second time after that.

It's funny to me because Waves is actually everything [certain people] ever accused propellerhead of being ... overpriced, no support, money--hungry, buggy...you are only RENTING the plugs you don't own anything, etc etc. Yeah that's Waves.

Meanwhile I have RE from developers that have literally died, and those still work. -_-

I honestly have to wonder, Is it only the cracked versions that run flawlessly, don't require WUP, and never need updating? Because all my paid plugins from Waves are worthless...

[Exowildebeest]

Right.. Fact remains that you will not get compatibility fixes. You have a fixed compiled binary for a very specific operating system. Using a 32bit bridge is kind of like saying "But I can use windows 3.11 in a VM!! It will never die!!!".

And yeah, you give me your anecdotal info, I give you mine. I had several plugins that I can't use anymore, be it because they were discontinued and didn't get updates or be it because I didn't want to pay money for an update that doesn't give me any new features.

So anyway, as I was saying to the OP, developing native plugins is MUCH MUCH more support work than developing REs and if you want the same one-installer-niceness you'll have to stick with one company developing and selling the plugins, like the cancer of the industry Waves Audio.

Meanwhile I have RE from developers that have literally died, and those still work. -_-

Cynical as that remark may be in this context, I think that's a truly beautiful thing. Living on in the rack.

[-008']

Right.. Fact remains that you will not get compatibility fixes. You have a fixed compiled binary for a very specific operating system. Using a 32bit bridge is kind of like saying "But I can use windows 3.11 in a VM!! It will never die!!!".

And yeah, you give me your anecdotal info, I give you mine. I had several plugins that I can't use anymore, be it because they were discontinued and didn't get updates or be it because I didn't want to pay money for an update that doesn't give me any new features.

So anyway, as I was saying to the OP, developing native plugins is MUCH MUCH more support work than developing REs and if you want the same one-installer-niceness you'll have to stick with one company developing and selling the plugins, like the cancer of the industry Waves Audio.

Meanwhile I have RE from developers that have literally died, and those still work. -_-

Cynical as that remark may be in this context, I think that's a truly beautiful thing. Living on in the rack.

Sorry, I did not mean to sound so cynical, it's only a matter of fact. A bit grim yes, and maybe not entirely fair since it isn't sold any longer, but those of us who have it, it still works. Come to think of it, I own VST from people still very much alive, in business and selling licenses, that have never been updated, and still never had the kinks worked out. So maybe it is entirely relevant in this argument, idk.

Anyway from what little I knew him, (worked thru his betas and contributing patches and demos) Brian wouldn't have said it any differently. He was really smart and a funny, no-b.s. kind of guy. The same way I'd describe most of you guys here

[SA Studio]

{It's really best explained above = IF you have a compatibility issue, you will likely* need to pay a small update fee} However, what I'm saying is very factual - your plugs are going to keep working even if you don't pay for updates.


I've got VST's I've owned across multiple installs of different OS's - I have Waves plugs that I've never updated once that still work - again, you're not talking about what I'm talking about and you're only going to confuse people here.

Some of my 32 bit plugs work just fine that I've owned nearly ten years that went from 32 bit Vista to 64 bit Win 7

I could write a book about this stuff

EDIT: maybe OSX updates "break compatibility" but I can assure you, Windows updates, even entire OS updates, are not "breaking compatibility" and I have years of watching and NOT ONE VST I have ever stopped working or had a remote issue or problem

*some developers have free updates if there's a new OS

Right.. Fact remains that you will not get compatibility fixes. You have a fixed compiled binary for a very specific operating system. Using a 32bit bridge is kind of like saying "But I can use windows 3.11 in a VM!! It will never die!!!".

And yeah, you give me your anecdotal info, I give you mine. I had several plugins that I can't use anymore, be it because they were discontinued and didn't get updates or be it because I didn't want to pay money for an update that doesn't give me any new features.

So anyway, as I was saying to the OP, developing native plugins is MUCH MUCH more support work than developing REs and if you want the same one-installer-niceness you'll have to stick with one company developing and selling the plugins, like the cancer of the industry Waves Audio.

Ok. First, lets all drop any pretensions. I hear what you're saying. Kind of. You responded to me rudely as if you were the only one that knew what was going on. I still don't get what you're saying.

The part in bold: Let us know what products stopped working. Why is it that people say they have problem plug-ins, but literally never say what they are. There's actualy very high odds I've heard of the plug and perhaps can help you. But you're still not saying what actually stopped working. That's......weird to me.

I can provide detailed lists of the VST's I own and all the problems I've had with them over ten years. I can call them all out by name and likely have well over 100.

So anyway, people need to stop making claims things stopped working without ever saying what the product is or was! Why not let us all know so we don't buy the same thing?

[joeyluck]

{It's really best explained above = IF you have a compatibility issue, you will likely* need to pay a small update fee} However, what I'm saying is very factual - your plugs are going to keep working even if you don't pay for updates.


I've got VST's I've owned across multiple installs of different OS's - I have Waves plugs that I've never updated once that still work - again, you're not talking about what I'm talking about and you're only going to confuse people here.

Some of my 32 bit plugs work just fine that I've owned nearly ten years that went from 32 bit Vista to 64 bit Win 7

I could write a book about this stuff

EDIT: maybe OSX updates "break compatibility" but I can assure you, Windows updates, even entire OS updates, are not "breaking compatibility" and I have years of watching and NOT ONE VST I have ever stopped working or had a remote issue or problem

*some developers have free updates if there's a new OS

Right.. Fact remains that you will not get compatibility fixes. You have a fixed compiled binary for a very specific operating system. Using a 32bit bridge is kind of like saying "But I can use windows 3.11 in a VM!! It will never die!!!".

And yeah, you give me your anecdotal info, I give you mine. I had several plugins that I can't use anymore, be it because they were discontinued and didn't get updates or be it because I didn't want to pay money for an update that doesn't give me any new features.

So anyway, as I was saying to the OP, developing native plugins is MUCH MUCH more support work than developing REs and if you want the same one-installer-niceness you'll have to stick with one company developing and selling the plugins, like the cancer of the industry Waves Audio.

Ok. First, lets all drop any pretensions. I hear what you're saying. Kind of. You responded to me rudely as if you were the only one that knew what was going on. I still don't get what you're saying.

The part in bold: Let us know what products stopped working. Why is it that people say they have problem plug-ins, but literally never say what they are. There's actualy very high odds I've heard of the plug and perhaps can help you. But you're still not saying what actually stopped working. That's......weird to me.

I can provide detailed lists of the VST's I own and all the problems I've had with them over ten years. I can call them all out by name and likely have well over 100.

So anyway, people need to stop making claims things stopped working without ever saying what the product is or was! Why not let us all know so we don't buy the same thing?

You literally just said that "*some developers have free updates if there's a new OS"
Yes, yes they do

[SA Studio]

I'm on mac, I have bought Over 2 k worth of Waves plugins and never upgraded. It has been over 5 years now I think. The possibility of breaking the software is rare to my knowledge and everything has passed its WUP except the recent ones which I bought last and this year. However, the WUP is capped on 300 USD that is the maximum it goes. To be honest, I wouldn't mind to pay 300 after 5 years but I know it is not even necessary. I usually don't jump to the recent OS. I just did on Sierra but still I have no issue. Man other companies charge for one plugin to upgrade starting from 50 to 100 bucks per plugin. 300 USD for 600 plugins I'm in. Most importantly 300 dollar after 10 and 15 years later. Thats when I need it.

Thanks for backing me up Gulale.

An experienced reply sure is better than people suggesting you use pirated software

[SA Studio]

{It's really best explained above = IF you have a compatibility issue, you will likely* need to pay a small update fee} However, what I'm saying is very factual - your plugs are going to keep working even if you don't pay for updates.


I've got VST's I've owned across multiple installs of different OS's - I have Waves plugs that I've never updated once that still work - again, you're not talking about what I'm talking about and you're only going to confuse people here.

Some of my 32 bit plugs work just fine that I've owned nearly ten years that went from 32 bit Vista to 64 bit Win 7

I could write a book about this stuff

EDIT: maybe OSX updates "break compatibility" but I can assure you, Windows updates, even entire OS updates, are not "breaking compatibility" and I have years of watching and NOT ONE VST I have ever stopped working or had a remote issue or problem

*some developers have free updates if there's a new OS

Right.. Fact remains that you will not get compatibility fixes. You have a fixed compiled binary for a very specific operating system. Using a 32bit bridge is kind of like saying "But I can use windows 3.11 in a VM!! It will never die!!!".

And yeah, you give me your anecdotal info, I give you mine. I had several plugins that I can't use anymore, be it because they were discontinued and didn't get updates or be it because I didn't want to pay money for an update that doesn't give me any new features.

So anyway, as I was saying to the OP, developing native plugins is MUCH MUCH more support work than developing REs and if you want the same one-installer-niceness you'll have to stick with one company developing and selling the plugins, like the cancer of the industry Waves Audio.

Ok. First, lets all drop any pretensions. I hear what you're saying. Kind of. You responded to me rudely as if you were the only one that knew what was going on. I still don't get what you're saying.

The part in bold: Let us know what products stopped working. Why is it that people say they have problem plug-ins, but literally never say what they are. There's actualy very high odds I've heard of the plug and perhaps can help you. But you're still not saying what actually stopped working. That's......weird to me.

I can provide detailed lists of the VST's I own and all the problems I've had with them over ten years. I can call them all out by name and likely have well over 100.

So anyway, people need to stop making claims things stopped working without ever saying what the product is or was! Why not let us all know so we don't buy the same thing?

You literally just said that "*some developers have free updates if there's a new OS"
Yes, yes they do

Ummm...excuse me. I'm trying to be helpful here. I'm sensing like you're trying to catch me in something?

Yes = Some developers offer hotfixes and all kinds of little updates here and there = RE's get updates the same exact way.

Joey, read other people's replies. There's other people who have never needed to update their VST's to keep them working. Maybe OS updates arent the be all end all = I wouldn't know because I've literally never had a problem in 10 years with things like you've described. I'm very willing to help you if you describe your scenario.

Is this a Mac issue you're dealing with?

[normen]

So anyway, people need to stop making claims things stopped working without ever saying what the product is or was! Why not let us all know so we don't buy the same thing?

Well I gave one example right in the first post where I mentioned this. If you don't read my posts properly I can get that you interpret them strangely and think I am rude or anything.. Sorry if you think so but I am just expressing my opinion just like you do and have no intentions to change my attitude when I do so.

[joeyluck]

{It's really best explained above = IF you have a compatibility issue, you will likely* need to pay a small update fee} However, what I'm saying is very factual - your plugs are going to keep working even if you don't pay for updates.


I've got VST's I've owned across multiple installs of different OS's - I have Waves plugs that I've never updated once that still work - again, you're not talking about what I'm talking about and you're only going to confuse people here.

Some of my 32 bit plugs work just fine that I've owned nearly ten years that went from 32 bit Vista to 64 bit Win 7

I could write a book about this stuff

EDIT: maybe OSX updates "break compatibility" but I can assure you, Windows updates, even entire OS updates, are not "breaking compatibility" and I have years of watching and NOT ONE VST I have ever stopped working or had a remote issue or problem

*some developers have free updates if there's a new OS

Right.. Fact remains that you will not get compatibility fixes. You have a fixed compiled binary for a very specific operating system. Using a 32bit bridge is kind of like saying "But I can use windows 3.11 in a VM!! It will never die!!!".

And yeah, you give me your anecdotal info, I give you mine. I had several plugins that I can't use anymore, be it because they were discontinued and didn't get updates or be it because I didn't want to pay money for an update that doesn't give me any new features.

So anyway, as I was saying to the OP, developing native plugins is MUCH MUCH more support work than developing REs and if you want the same one-installer-niceness you'll have to stick with one company developing and selling the plugins, like the cancer of the industry Waves Audio.

Ok. First, lets all drop any pretensions. I hear what you're saying. Kind of. You responded to me rudely as if you were the only one that knew what was going on. I still don't get what you're saying.

The part in bold: Let us know what products stopped working. Why is it that people say they have problem plug-ins, but literally never say what they are. There's actualy very high odds I've heard of the plug and perhaps can help you. But you're still not saying what actually stopped working. That's......weird to me.

I can provide detailed lists of the VST's I own and all the problems I've had with them over ten years. I can call them all out by name and likely have well over 100.

So anyway, people need to stop making claims things stopped working without ever saying what the product is or was! Why not let us all know so we don't buy the same thing?

You literally just said that "*some developers have free updates if there's a new OS"
Yes, yes they do

Ummm...excuse me. I'm trying to be helpful here. I'm sensing like you're trying to catch me in something?

Yes = Some developers offer hotfixes and all kinds of little updates here and there = RE's get updates the same exact way.

Joey, read other people's replies. There's other people who have never needed to update their VST's to keep them working. Maybe OS updates arent the be all end all = I wouldn't know because I've literally never had a problem in 10 years with things like you've described. I'm very willing to help you if you describe your scenario.

Is this a Mac issue you're dealing with?

No. It's a VST issue. Most developers have two main operating systems to keep up with. Some develop for one, others for three. If they don't update their plugins to work with the latest version of anybody's OS, that is an issue. That is on them. If it's discontinued, you can bet it won't be updated.

You've made a general claim that nobody has to update plugins in order for them to continue to work into the future. You have acknowledged that some developers offer updates when there's a new OS... There you have it. Developers updating plugins to work and users using those updates to have the plugins work. And when some developers don't update, they sometimes don't work. Seems easy enough to comprehend to me.

[MDTerps2015]

Right.. Fact remains that you will not get compatibility fixes. You have a fixed compiled binary for a very specific operating system. Using a 32bit bridge is kind of like saying "But I can use windows 3.11 in a VM!! It will never die!!!".

And yeah, you give me your anecdotal info, I give you mine. I had several plugins that I can't use anymore, be it because they were discontinued and didn't get updates or be it because I didn't want to pay money for an update that doesn't give me any new features.

So anyway, as I was saying to the OP, developing native plugins is MUCH MUCH more support work than developing REs and if you want the same one-installer-niceness you'll have to stick with one company developing and selling the plugins, like the cancer of the industry Waves Audio.

Waves truly is the cancer of the industry.

I bought Codex synth from them last year (their synths and instruments suck!) and already it doesn't work and their online system is trying to shake me down. I couldn't even download the goddam thing after my last OS re-install without them harassing me for the WUP again. I gave up on Waves for the second time after that.

It's funny to me because Waves is actually everything [certain people] ever accused propellerhead of being ... overpriced, no support, money--hungry, buggy...you are only RENTING the plugs you don't own anything, etc etc. Yeah that's Waves.

Meanwhile I have RE from developers that have literally died, and those still work. -_-

I honestly have to wonder, Is it only the cracked versions that run flawlessly, don't require WUP, and never need updating? Because all my paid plugins from Waves are worthless...

Well thats literally the answer I was looking for. I am running Yosemite on Mac and if I buy plug ins now and buy a new Mac later this year from this five year old one, I will lose everything because Im not paying twice for them. My Rack extensions would still work moving everything to a new computer which I plan on doing. Like I said this is a hobby and I am not paying for things two or three times just to keep them working. When they hold you hostage for more money, that is a complete no. So I guess my question is which is the best "most used" "popular" quality driven plugins with out all of the bull????? BTW I knew waves was a good company but the more I talked to people, the more it sounded like a money grab.