Andrew Skelton / SOFTPHONICS on VST in Reason 9.5

[Audiotic]

Imho One of the most dedicated and talented Reason Users and Refill producers and his take on VST in Reason:

[QVprod]

I can never get the automatic assumption that people interested in VST are so they can pirate them. I have serious doubts that people who pirate have bought many or any RE and have probably pirated the Refills they use as well. Devs won't be losing any money there.

[marcuswitt]

Hi folks,

Andrew's opinion is respected, first of all. It really is.

And although I think that I got his point, I got to say that I'm not skeptical and negative about VST support in Reason 9.5 at all. From my point of view, VST support opens new doors for the users, but nobody has to feel being forced to walk through that doors. I personally find it amazing to have the chance to try and to use VSTs within the Reason environment, it's yet another nice extension to Reason's modular approach. I'm happy that I can use some VST plugins for mixing, such as some plugins from IK Multimedia or things like UVI's SparkVerb, which - BTW - kicks ass IMHO. But still I can work in Reason like I always did before 9.5. And like I said before, nobody forces us to use VST, but if we want to use VST plugins then we can use them. And the way the Propellerheads have integrated the VST interface into Reason is fantastic, I think. I find it fantastic because the workflow in terms of using VSTs is nearly the same as working with stock devices and REs, plus the fact that all three formats, stock devices, REs and VSTs, can be used side-by-side within a Combinator. So, not too much changes from my perspective, VST just gives us more toys to play around and to experiment with. Isn't that what many among us were asking for? Other opinions (and even take-downs) are welcome.

[Blast]

People who hate VSt in reason are just damn selfish people. if you don't like vst then don't use it because there are lot of other users who spent a lot of money on VSts and would like to use them in the DAW of their choice.Reason fanboys its time to stop whining and move on, and try to understand how business work. (apple once said that they will never make a large screen IPhone. ala iPhone 6 plus)

[sonicbyte]

I agree in part, but honestly the only thing I need from the vst world are the orchestral libraries for kontakt or similar standalone products like EWS or Vienna. And I really doubt the SDK and/or RE format could catch up the memory efficiency and audio streaming ability of those kind of massive sample based products in the near future.
I tried and bought lots of Andrew products for that style of music I need and some are ok but none of them are at that level, even the best RE for this (StringWerk from E-Instruments) fall shot and is expensive for what it does.

Also I LOVE Reason and I don't want to use any other daw ever in my life. So for me this is the perfect world where I hopefully I'll be able to use Reason as my only daw and at the same time those vsts to create the music I want.
And in my case at least I will still buy any RE that is good and useful to support the format. If PH are serious and as they said they will give more importance than ever to the RE format, then as Andrew said, the users will naturally purchase RE instead of VSTs and maybe someday VSTs devs will port everything to RE. Who knows...

[Softphonics]

People who hate VSt in reason are just damn selfish people. if you don't like vst then don't use it because there are lot of other users who spent a lot of money on VSts and would like to use them in the DAW of their choice.Reason fanboys its time to stop whining and move on, and try to understand how business work. (apple once said that they will never make a large screen IPhone. ala iPhone 6 plus)

Andrew here, and to the original poster, thanks for sharing my ramblings.

I think I need to point out that I have tons of VST's I use them in Ableton Live or Bitwig Studio when I need to, so this post in particular "Blast" is an example of someone who wasnt listening to my point.
Sure when I do my design work for Native Instruments, and a host of other vst makers like Rob Papen etc.. I use another DAW, and still will do that going forward.

This is not an anti vst post, but rather a reality check about what RE could be!

-VST was always going to happen sometime,
-RE can be better than Vst if Props and developers worked together quicker and more proactively


Andrew

[PurpleMonkeyDishes]

It is really sad that people don't actually listen to what you are saying Andrew before posting childish replies.

It is clear that you believe RE can succeed now even more in a VST world, but that also relies on public support when applicable,

Good on you

[PurpleMonkeyDishes]

It is really sad that people don't actually listen to what you are saying Andrew before posting childish replies.

It is clear that you believe RE can succeed now even more in a VST world, but that also relies on public support when applicable, And Propellerhead to move faster

Good on you

[Blast]

People who hate VSt in reason are just damn selfish people. if you don't like vst then don't use it because there are lot of other users who spent a lot of money on VSts and would like to use them in the DAW of their choice.Reason fanboys its time to stop whining and move on, and try to understand how business work. (apple once said that they will never make a large screen IPhone. ala iPhone 6 plus)

Andrew here, and to the original poster, thanks for sharing my ramblings.

I think I need to point out that I have tons of VST's I use them in Ableton Live or Bitwig Studio when I need to, so this post in particular "Blast" is an example of someone who wasnt listening to my point.
Sure when I do my design work for Native Instruments, and a host of other vst makers like Rob Papen etc.. I use another DAW, and still will do that going forward.

This is not an anti vst post, but rather a reality check about what RE could be!

-VST was always going to happen sometime,
-RE can be better than Vst if Props and developers worked together quicker and more proactively


Andrew

I must agree with you too that Props didn't do enough with the RE SDK. I own a lot of RE too and still hope that some of my favorite VSt make it to the RE format as well, but at present time Props are still not attracting the major VSt developers.Lets just appreciate the fact that we have the option to use VSt in Reason and hope the Props will continue further develop the RE format.

[IdoAudio]

People who hate VSt in reason are just damn selfish people. if you don't like vst then don't use it because there are lot of other users who spent a lot of money on VSts and would like to use them in the DAW of their choice.Reason fanboys its time to stop whining and move on, and try to understand how business work. (apple once said that they will never make a large screen IPhone. ala iPhone 6 plus)

Would not normally comment but "That little fire in your profile pic" is obviously a representation of your personality

In the video Andrew clearly says "VST was always going to happen in reason at some point, and HAD TO HAPPEN to build the user base"

So what are you smoking blast, that has made your interpretation so twisted? Seriously it was a very balanced opinion! Re did us until now, let us not forget that.

[Softphonics]

I must agree with you too that Props didn't do enough with the RE SDK. I own a lot of RE too and still hope that some of my favorite VSt make it to the RE format as well, but at present time Props are still not attracting the major VSt developers.Lets just appreciate the fact that we have the option to use VSt in Reason and hope the Props will continue further develop the RE format.

Good to hear man. Yes I believe that RE can learn from vst and become better. It is just a question of will it happen sooner or later? that bit is down to Props and developers, but I also wanted to "take my hat off" to the boutique developers who have given us what we have so far.
While everyone was looking on the horizon for the big boys to jump into RE development, there was tons of really interesting characters developing RE's sitting up all night coding and all on a whim, no budgets, no idea of how it would sell. Just taking the sdk and working with it.

It is important to recognise the positives in everything.

I hope that my point about RE maturing into a beast is more clear now, Im not the best at Vloging.

[Blast]

People who hate VSt in reason are just damn selfish people. if you don't like vst then don't use it because there are lot of other users who spent a lot of money on VSts and would like to use them in the DAW of their choice.Reason fanboys its time to stop whining and move on, and try to understand how business work. (apple once said that they will never make a large screen IPhone. ala iPhone 6 plus)

Would not normally comment but "That little fire in your profile pic" is obviously a representation of your personality

In the video Andrew clearly says "VST was always going to happen in reason at some point, and HAD TO HAPPEN to build the user base"

So what are you smoking blast, that has made your interpretation so twisted? Seriously it was a very balanced opinion! Re did us until now, let us not forget that.

Just to let you know I owned quite a bit of RE and love the RE format. I am just sick of all the ranting. Accept VST in Reason and move on and lets hope to see a more and improve RE SDK in the future.

[Catblack]

I thought you made some great, valid points Andrew. Thank you.

[ltbrunt00]

He has a valid point but there are those like myself that spend money on Refills, RE's and VSTs. If RE's were an accepted format outside of reason we probably would not be having this discussion. I can't wait to fire up all the VST's I have acquired in reason. I Also hope Softphonics keeps making refills in this new world. Some of there refills should come bundled with Reason.

[marcuswitt]

People who hate VSt in reason are just damn selfish people. if you don't like vst then don't use it because there are lot of other users who spent a lot of money on VSts and would like to use them in the DAW of their choice.Reason fanboys its time to stop whining and move on, and try to understand how business work. (apple once said that they will never make a large screen IPhone. ala iPhone 6 plus)

Would not normally comment but "That little fire in your profile pic" is obviously a representation of your personality

In the video Andrew clearly says "VST was always going to happen in reason at some point, and HAD TO HAPPEN to build the user base"

So what are you smoking blast, that has made your interpretation so twisted? Seriously it was a very balanced opinion! Re did us until now, let us not forget that.

Just to let you know I owned quite a bit of RE and love the RE format. I am just sick of all the ranting. Accept VST in Reason and move on and lets hope to see a more and improve RE SDK in the future.

I think you're right, mate. And I'm sure that PPH will push the RE format forward.

[QVprod]

I think I need to point out that I have tons of VST's I use them in Ableton Live or Bitwig Studio when I need to...

Sure when I do my design work for Native Instruments, and a host of other vst makers like Rob Papen etc.. I use another DAW, and still will do that going forward.

This is not an anti vst post, but rather a reality check about what RE could be!

-VST was always going to happen sometime,
-RE can be better than Vst if Props and developers worked together quicker and more proactively


Andrew

Here I can agree with you. Though I can also understand someone believing you were anti VST because of the piracy comment. Overall, I believe opening Reason to VST forces Props to really to get the RE sdk up to par with everything now being in direct competition, although they were always in competition for users who aren't Reason only. We've had larger developers put out subpar REs and smaller devs put out amazing ones. I see the amazing ones continuing to be created.

[Iapetus 9]

Thanks for the thoughts.

The only prob I have with VST are the pirates and shitleeches that come with it. I hope that any threads or links to cracked plugins will be deleted and users banned. Support the Devs as you would hope that people support you. That said, I'm excited, and if everything works as great as they say, then I'm finally back to one DAW after all these years. RE's still need some TLC, and I'd much rather support them. I sure hope it happens and they don't go the way of the dodo.

[bunja]

I've bought a few rack extensions 'and a couple refills (i only have essentials 9 'and since the beta , ive tried out lots of free vst and or ( computer music free plugins) all ive decided to add to my collection is camelcrusher , camel alchemy player cm ,tdr nova , tal vocoder and thats it and a free autotune type plugin and zplane cm , i wont be adding many vst (oh and xln audio upright piano ) which was a free download given by focusrite , so many of the free vst are 32 bit , the RE format has to grow and be allowed to make useful free Re, as well as cheaper Re, for now for me i always wait for sales because a lot of the stuff i like is expensive , most people are just gonna add a synth here and some uad or waves plugs with , vst any more than that your killing yourself even all the people that have over 100 rack exyensions or vst ? Why ?? What u gonna do with all that go through a million presets to find the one u want sculp 100 patches one for every synth , i once see a guys computer full of every cracked plugin going, needless to say that guy never made one song . Thats why i went for essentials this time limiting myself , vst just means i can add a few things to make up for not having the full version , vst is a good thing unless you just want it so u can tell your freinds you have all the famous brands in your daw and just stare at it for hours dreaming bout making music lol.

[bunja]

Refills are always good but some of the refills i had in reason 7 (sold it) dont work in essentials 9 (wont sell ) i think it would be nice for essentials cut down versions of refills some people aint big spenders like me i wont be buying many vst really ,

[strangers]

He has a valid point but there are those like myself that spend money on Refills, RE's and VSTs. If RE's were an accepted format outside of reason we probably would not be having this discussion. I can't wait to fire up all the VST's I have acquired in reason. I Also hope Softphonics keeps making refills in this new world. Some of there refills should come bundled with Reason.

I'm in this same boat. Pirating isn't going anywhere and neither are the people who actually pay. I've bought an embarrassing amount of refills (including a Softphonics refill), samples and one shots over the past few months. The addition of VST's isn't going to stop people from recognizing and paying for quality RE's and refills.

Pirated VST's will surely flood into Reason the end of this month, but it is what is it. Know that there are still plenty of paying users to keep things flowing.

[davidvilla]

[Deleted by a moderator]

[AzureEyes]

This whole argument is irrelevant and has no point. Let people use what they want and if people aren't making money. That's their problem and they have to find a solution to it!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[PurpleMonkeyDishes]

[Deleted by mods]

[Jmax]

I'll never stop buying RE, I purchased the Spire RE yet already have the VST counterpart.

Andrew makes a great point about the stability in Reason, rock solid.

I have always used Studio One or Ableton to run VST. But never liked the sequencers of both.

For me, it will be wonderful to run a VST and working with the Reason sequencer, FX, Mixer. That to me is the joy, perhaps not the VST so much. Just the workflow. Although I know there will be bugs, time will tell in how it goes along.

[WongoTheSane]

Just a friendly reminder to keep it civil, guys, or the ban hammer will strike with full force. Andrew's point is fair enough that we can debate it without stooping to personal attacks.