help! how to sidechain external track with neutron

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snaa
Posts: 18
Joined: 28 Apr 2017

29 Apr 2017

Cant figure out how to connect this in reason. Maybe its me, or maybe its the beta? maybe i'm missing something.
Usually I just use the SSL or a side chain combinator patch for sidechaining a bass with a kick.
i'm trying to do this with neutron with the dynamic eq, bass freq triggered by a kick on separate track.
How do I connect this? Via the side chain input? or via audio in? tried both, no result..

Hope someone has a idea, thanks!

snaa
Posts: 18
Joined: 28 Apr 2017

03 May 2017

maybe external sidechain isnt possible because vst2.4 & vst3 is needed?

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chimp_spanner
Posts: 2908
Joined: 06 Mar 2015

03 May 2017

I don't have this plugin so I can't test for you, but have you expanded the CV programmer to reveal the "optional" inputs and outputs on the back? Some of the plugins I've tried like the compressors from NI Komplete actually have a secondary input for side-chaining. Might be the case that Neutron has this too. You'll know if it does because inputs 3/4 will have green lights above them to show that they're active and ready to receive audio!

snaa
Posts: 18
Joined: 28 Apr 2017

03 May 2017

yes i've checked this before, inputs are green, but i guess i have to experiment more. but thanx!

snaa
Posts: 18
Joined: 28 Apr 2017

03 May 2017

Yesss! solved!

instead of taking the usual parallel output of the mix track (kick) to input 3-4 in neutron (bass), go to cv-programmer, take output 3-4 of neutron (kick) to input 3-4 neutron (bass)
makes sense haha, i'm just not used to this new way of thinking with vst & cv connections etc. but its sooooo awesome!!!

Majuscule
Posts: 1
Joined: 28 Oct 2017

28 Oct 2017

Hi! I have the same question and was so glad to find your thread! Maybe I'm missing something though, because I haven't gotten your instructions to work for me yet.

I've tried to attach screenshots of my setup. I've got an occasional bassy growl and I want the lowest freqs of the kick drum to get out of the way when that happens. I've got a Neutron applied to each track. In the kick Neutron, I created a dynamic EQ node and turned on Ext. Full, then routed Optional Audio Out 3-4 of the growl to Optional Audio Out 3-4 of the kick.

Even so, the kick still appears to be responding to internal input when I watch that dynamic EQ node. Or is it responding to all of the tracks in my project? Wish there was more detailed documentation on this from iZotope! :|
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S1lent5t0rm
Posts: 1
Joined: 23 Nov 2017

23 Nov 2017

I have the same issue, but I think I managed to create a workaround. I'm using Reason 10 and Neutron 2. I'm a fairly new user, so please let me know if this works for you and/or leave some constructive feedback. I also want to see this work as streamlined as possible! :)

1. Create a parallel channel for the sidechain source.
2. Connect the direct out of the parallel channel to its sidechain input. This breaks the signal chain so you won't hear the parallel channel.
3. In Reason's main mixer activate the compressor on the parallel channel.
4. Set the compressor to taste. For example, when using a kick as sidechain source, activate Fast, set a high ratio, low treshold and low release. You should see the compressors LED's light up on every kick. You now basically have a muted parallel channel which compresses itself...
5. Connect the Gain reduction CV out (on the back of the parallel channel, next to the Key LED) to Modulation CV 1 of the Neutron you want to send the parallel channel to. You now have a CV signal corresponding to the compression of the parallel channel being sent to the CV input of the destination Neutron.
6. Use the CV programmer on the front of the destination Neutron to control parameters.

For example: for side chain compression, open the destination Neutron, activate Compressor 1 and set the Treshold of Band 1 to 0 (all the way to the top). Now return to the CV programmer and send a negative amount (try -100 for the most drastic effect) from CV1 to C1 B1 Treshold (that's the treshold you just set to 0 in Neutron itself). Now play your track and watch the treshold meter jump down on every kick. As a result, you should see gain reduction being applied (when using a ratio value higher than 1:1 for Band 1).

antic604

06 Feb 2018

It seems iZotope products were updated and they mention "Support for Reason 10" specifically:
https://www.kvraudio.com/news/izotope-u ... d-rx-40207

I'm at work now, but hopefully it means sidechaining works now :)

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jzquantum
Posts: 67
Joined: 17 Jan 2015
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04 Apr 2018

Did anyone get this to work (Neutron 2 EQ Ext. Full side chain ducking)? I've tried both ideas in this thread and my bass still ducks to itself. I just mailed iZotope about it. We'll see what they say.

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United South
Posts: 151
Joined: 27 Dec 2017

05 Apr 2018

jzquantum wrote:
04 Apr 2018
Did anyone get this to work (Neutron 2 EQ Ext. Full side chain ducking)? I've tried both ideas in this thread and my bass still ducks to itself. I just mailed iZotope about it. We'll see what they say.
For those having issues getting Neutron to work these are the steps:
1) Choose a Bass in combinator add a Neutron

2) Choose a kick add a Neutron select (masking) and a drop down menu will display a Neutron 2. Select it now you will see both audio waves in kick neutron. Select Inverse Link.

3) No other wiring is required,Neutron will detect the other Neutron.


Works perfect for me just tried in Reason.
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antic604

06 Apr 2018

^ won't that increase the kick & reduce the bass, though? that's what Inverse Link does

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United South
Posts: 151
Joined: 27 Dec 2017

06 Apr 2018

antic604 wrote:
06 Apr 2018
^ won't that increase the kick & reduce the bass, though? that's what Inverse Link does
Usually that’s what you want from ducking low end. You don’t want to lose your kick behind the bass. But it doesn’t even matter with the Inverse link because what ever frequencies you add to one the other goes down.

antic604

06 Apr 2018

United South wrote:
06 Apr 2018
antic604 wrote:
06 Apr 2018
^ won't that increase the kick & reduce the bass, though? that's what Inverse Link does
Usually that’s what you want from ducking low end. You don’t want to lose your kick behind the bass. But it doesn’t even matter with the Inverse link because what ever frequencies you add to one the other goes down.
No, it matters. Sidechain compression/EQ is used when you have a kick and bass that each in itself has the right amount of low-end, but when playing together they have too much. Therefore you duck one of them - usually the bass - to make room for the other, so that their total signal isn't too much. The technique you're describing - while useful in some cases - will still result in too much low end, but not because of summing of two signals, but as a result of boosting one of them too much.

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United South
Posts: 151
Joined: 27 Dec 2017

06 Apr 2018

antic604 wrote:
06 Apr 2018
United South wrote:
06 Apr 2018


Usually that’s what you want from ducking low end. You don’t want to lose your kick behind the bass. But it doesn’t even matter with the Inverse link because what ever frequencies you add to one the other goes down.
No, it matters. Sidechain compression/EQ is used when you have a kick and bass that each in itself has the right amount of low-end, but when playing together they have too much. Therefore you duck one of them - usually the bass - to make room for the other, so that their total signal isn't too much. The technique you're describing - while useful in some cases - will still result in too much low end, but not because of summing of two signals, but as a result of boosting one of them too much.
"Sidechain compression/EQ is used when you have a kick and bass that each in itself has the right amount of low-end, but when playing together they have too much. Therefore you duck one of them - usually the bass - to make room for the other, so that their total signal isn't too much".


You said no but basically repeated what I just said about the kick ducking the bass? When you're trying to duck kick and bass it has nothing to do with adding too much lowend. What the ducking concept is trying to do is solve two sound sources fighting for the same frequency. You don't have to boost much if you already have a good mix imo. Btw I use it in a subtractive way by lowering the bass just a little to help clear a path for the kick.

antic604

07 Apr 2018

United South wrote:
06 Apr 2018
You said no but basically repeated what I just said about the kick ducking the bass?
No, we're still talking two different things.

Let's consider an example: A low-end of 100% is the level that can be appropriately reproduced by the speaker. Let's say we have a Bass that has 80% of that low-end and we have a Kick, that also has 80% of the low-end. If we play both sound at once, we get 160%, ie. a distortion.

In order to remedy the situation, we should employ sidechain compression or EQ: when Kick hits, Bass is reduced by eg. 60pp to 20%, therefore the sum of both signals is 100% and plays OK.

Conversely, the technique you're proposing - Inverse Link - would also reduce bass by 60pp to 20%, but at the same time would increase the kick by 60pp to 140%. If we sum the sounds, we'll get 160% and - again - distortion.

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United South
Posts: 151
Joined: 27 Dec 2017

07 Apr 2018

antic604 wrote:
07 Apr 2018
United South wrote:
06 Apr 2018
You said no but basically repeated what I just said about the kick ducking the bass?
No, we're still talking two different things.

Let's consider an example: A low-end of 100% is the level that can be appropriately reproduced by the speaker. Let's say we have a Bass that has 80% of that low-end and we have a Kick, that also has 80% of the low-end. If we play both sound at once, we get 160%, ie. a distortion.

In order to remedy the situation, we should employ sidechain compression or EQ: when Kick hits, Bass is reduced by eg. 60pp to 20%, therefore the sum of both signals is 100% and plays OK.

Conversely, the technique you're proposing - Inverse Link - would also reduce bass by 60pp to 20%, but at the same time would increase the kick by 60pp to 140%. If we sum the sounds, we'll get 160% and - again - distortion.
"You don't have to boost much if you already have a good mix imo"

antic604

08 Apr 2018

United South wrote:
07 Apr 2018
"You don't have to boost much if you already have a good mix imo"
:?

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