My journey with Reason+

[selig]

I love the idea of being forced to make a purchase against your will, some strong marketing going on there!
Anyone who has any experience with RS knows how slow things go and how few request have ever been answered directly, so I'd suggest "doubtful" is simply our 'resting face' since day one rather than anything recent!

I can think of various scenarios where somebody would feel forced to sub in order to access a device they’re interested in because the other option is to spend 500 bucks on a daw they’re not intending to use plus whatever the cost of the device they are interested in. So I see where that statement by Antic604 is coming from. I’m sure you do too.

You mean to say someone is being forced into going with the cheeper option? /s
I am honestly not following this line of thinking, that's all.
No one is forced to do anything in any of the scenarios mentioned, and there are plenty of other options on the market if you really feel forced to purchase Reason.
If someone WANTS Reason, they are now free to choose from a couple of options - each has it's pros and cons as have been pointed out here repeatedly. There isn't one "best" solution for everyone here, we all place value on stuff in different ways.

In fact, there are more options than ever at present. I really don't see any "forcing" going on, and not even sure what that would even look like. If for example, the bosses at RS literally said "how can we force them to purchase this" and someone answered with a solution - what would that be?

[PhillipOrdonez]

I’ll try to come up with an example off the top of my head.

Say you heard about this new device which is unique and has no real equivalent, let’s call it objekt.

You want it, you need it, cause it does that with no other device can. What are your options? Pay a monthly fee to use it? What if you prefer to buy outright? Well now you got to shell 500 plus 99 for the device. But you didn’t want anything but this device alone, so you’re forced to go against your principles of not subscribing to software, and are FORCED to subscribe IF you want to use that device, and suffer the consequences of subscribing instead of buying.

See?

[joeyluck]

I’ll try to come up with an example off the top of my head.

Say you heard about this new device which is unique and has no real equivalent, let’s call it objekt.

You want it, you need it, cause it does that with no other device can. What are your options? Pay a monthly fee to use it? What if you prefer to buy outright? Well now you got to shell 500 plus 99 for the device. But you didn’t want anything but this device alone, so you’re forced to go against your principles of not subscribing to software, and are FORCED to subscribe IF you want to use that device, and suffer the consequences of subscribing instead of buying.

See?

I don't see how anybody is forced into anything. If a purchase doesn't make sense for me, I don't make that purchase. There are Reason users in this thread who own Reason who are dead set on waiting for a sale on Objekt before they get it, yet there is someone out there who feels forced to get it and forced to subscribe to have it?

This sounds more like instead of being forced to pay $499+$99, you have the option to subscribe. You aren't forced to buy the software. It sounds more like you are describing an offer too good to refuse. This argument can go all different ways.

[PhillipOrdonez]

Joey, if I was that person I would prefer to just buy the device for 99 instead of paying 20 bucks x month Or 500 plus 99.

In 5 months you’ve paid more than the 99 of the device and got nothing to show for it if you don’t want to pay more.

But since that’s not an option and subscribing is not worth it, I would not spend any money instead and live without the device cause all options suck balls.

[avasopht]

I’ll try to come up with an example off the top of my head.

Say you heard about this new device which is unique and has no real equivalent, let’s call it objekt.

You want it, you need it, cause it does that with no other device can. What are your options? Pay a monthly fee to use it? What if you prefer to buy outright? Well now you got to shell 500 plus 99 for the device. But you didn’t want anything but this device alone, so you’re forced to go against your principles of not subscribing to software, and are FORCED to subscribe IF you want to use that device, and suffer the consequences of subscribing instead of buying.

See?

It sounds a lot more like you are describing some inner conflict (that I can relate to) created by the combination of:

1. A product that has sparked your desire.
2. But grossly overvalued, so is hard to justify a purchase.



There might even be a sense that the company parting ways with your interest while they seek out shinier customers who are happy to subscribe for life.



Something about it just doesn't feel right (I say after just subscribing to R+ for a year).

[selig]

I’ll try to come up with an example off the top of my head.

Say you heard about this new device which is unique and has no real equivalent, let’s call it objekt.

You want it, you need it, cause it does that with no other device can. What are your options? Pay a monthly fee to use it? What if you prefer to buy outright? Well now you got to shell 500 plus 99 for the device. But you didn’t want anything but this device alone, so you’re forced to go against your principles of not subscribing to software, and are FORCED to subscribe IF you want to use that device, and suffer the consequences of subscribing instead of buying.

See?

No, I don't. That makes no sense. Maybe because you are talking about "principles" that not everyone shares?
The words "forced" and "suffering" are the give aways we are coming from different planets here…

[PhillipOrdonez]

Great.

[selig]

Joey, if I was that person I would prefer to just buy the device for 99 instead of paying 20 bucks x month Or 500 plus 99.

In 5 months you’ve paid more than the 99 of the device and got nothing to show for it if you don’t want to pay more.

But since that’s not an option and subscribing is not worth it, I would not spend any money instead and live without the device cause all options suck balls.

If I had something for 5 months and have nothing to show for it at the end of the five months that's on me.

When I was in high school I borrowed a PAIA synth for around 5 months, then had to give it back. I did the same thing with a tape recorder for a few years in high school. I didn't own them but I was damn sure to get something out of the time I had with them!!!

[QVprod]

Joey, if I was that person I would prefer to just buy the device for 99 instead of paying 20 bucks x month Or 500 plus 99.

In 5 months you’ve paid more than the 99 of the device and got nothing to show for it if you don’t want to pay more.

But since that’s not an option and subscribing is not worth it, I would not spend any money instead and live without the device cause all options suck balls.

If I was that person and didn’t want to subscribe, (as you said) I’d learn to live without it or find something close to equivalent elsewhere. That’s a loss for RS not for the user. But I’d imagine their target subscriber customers are those who want more than just one device.

[Loz84]

I got Reason initially because of a friend's recommendation, and I stayed with it because it's a sound designers dream. When I tried out the subscription it felt like I needed to use everything, which was a lot of learning before I could adapt it to my workflow. In the end I decided it was better to buy the perpetual licenses and focus on learning one device inside and out at a time. I can only imagine new sounds because my familiarity with the devices is strong enough that I can create routing configurations without being at the computer, without that it makes starting new things more cumbersome. Reason comes with enough stock devices that you would never run out of sound creation options, it the Jew devices do help with the imagination.
The R+ sound packs are good for users that just want to play something, like Arcade, but likely less so for those who love to tinker. Also, if I had R+ and bought the third party extensions that could really start racking up costs, no pun intended.

[mcatalao]

I dont mind a subscription based system.

However I agree the pricetag for r+ is too high comparing to others.

And i don't like the idea of having to upgrade a reason peepetual to keep opening your fkles if you opt out the subscription. For me a 2 year sub should give you acces to a perpetual licence or else you need to pay the perpetual upgrade when getting out.

[antic604]

I dont mind a subscription based system.

vs.

I don't like the idea of having to upgrade a reason peepetual to keep opening your fkles if you opt out the subscription.

That's how subscriptions work, though.

It's not a rent-to-own model.

It's like Netflix, with whom Reason Studios competes now, BTW. You watch a movie or a series, but once you stop paying all you're left with are vague memories, a mere facsimile, usually not detailed enough to recreate the actual thing in its entirety

[selig]

It's like Netflix, with whom Reason Studios competes now, BTW. You watch a movie or a series, but once you stop paying all you're left with are vague memories, a mere facsimile, usually not detailed enough to recreate the actual thing in its entirety

You’ve just described life IMO. You pay to watch a movie/play/concert, and after you leave the theater all you’re left with are vague memories, etc. Same for a good meal at a restaurant, which I’d never be able to recreate anyway.

OTOH, if after watching a movie or series on Netflix you ARE able to recreate the actual thing in it’s entirety you’re a better human than I am. I can’t even remember how the last episode of my favorite show I watched last night ended…

[joeyluck]

Yeah and then when they add a new season, or a movie you want to watch, or a series or movie you want to rewatch, you resubscribe. Simple.

Speaking of remaking movies, have you not seen Be Kind Rewind?

[antic604]

It's like Netflix, with whom Reason Studios competes now, BTW. You watch a movie or a series, but once you stop paying all you're left with are vague memories, a mere facsimile, usually not detailed enough to recreate the actual thing in its entirety

You’ve just described life IMO. You pay to watch a movie/play/concert, and after you leave the theater all you’re left with are vague memories, etc. Same for a good meal at a restaurant, which I’d never be able to recreate anyway.

Correct. If you unsubscribe from life, e.g. stop earning money, eating, breathing, etc.; then you're unable to access those experiences anymore.

Therefore, Reason+ is the natural, God-given state of things, whereas perpetual license Reason is a sinful abomination.

QED

I'll get my coat...

[selig]

You’ve just described life IMO. You pay to watch a movie/play/concert, and after you leave the theater all you’re left with are vague memories, etc. Same for a good meal at a restaurant, which I’d never be able to recreate anyway.

Correct. If you unsubscribe from life, e.g. stop earning money, eating, breathing, etc.; then you're unable to access those experiences anymore.

Therefore, Reason+ is the natural, God-given state of things, whereas perpetual license Reason is a sinful abomination.

QED

I'll get my coat...

To be clear, I have absolutely no reason to move to a subscription myself. I like to think I'm being objective when looking at the options, and just because something makes zero sense for me doesn't mean I can't see the possibility of it making sense for others. That's all that I'm saying here, I have no horse in this race and don't feel that emotional about the subject one way or the other.

[avasopht]

At least we have the option of an all you can eat subscription, I guess.

And maybe it is exactly what it was intended to be - that option.

[joeyluck]

At least we have the option of an all you can eat subscription, I guess.

And maybe it is exactly what it was intended to be - that option.

Yeah it's like I said in that other thread about Suite, Reason+ is the simpler and more straightforward option for those want it all. And they presented it as such when the released Reason+ and discontinued Suite.

Subscribing to Reason+ is a guarantee that any device or feature we release will show up in your rack on day one. This was something we got a lot of feedback on with Reason Suite. It was unclear if devices or features would be included in the future, if there was a special upgrade path, or if it was a one-time bundle. To make things clearer, we’ve discontinued Reason Suite. Now we can comfortably say that Reason+ is the choice if you want it all.

https://www.reasonstudios.com/blog/what ... or-reason/

[Popey]

Although I am not personally a fan of subscription I can see how for some people they may be the perfect solution. I do think Phillip O is correct though as for non reason users there is no way to "own" a re you like unless you buy full perpetual or subscribe (and that would get expensive fast even if you stopped and started). This is where the empty rack concept a lot have discussed would come into play.

Personally I think if someone bought a re (for arguments sake objekt) they are then more likely to buy more especially during sales if they have the empty rack as a gateway.

In one way I hope r+ brings in a sustainable revenue so there is less need for perpetual versions more often. I personally think reason are still not a giant company so have to split time between new devices (for r+exclusivity) and qol updates and would not be opposed to longer time frames between perpetual versions if they brought a big bang for the buck so to speak.

[avasopht]

In one way I hope r+ brings in a sustainable revenue so there is less need for perpetual versions more often. I personally think reason are still not a giant company so have to split time between new devices (for r+exclusivity) and qol updates and would not be opposed to longer time frames between perpetual versions if they brought a big bang for the buck so to speak.

That would be ideal.

However, the objective of VCs will be to sell RS to a suitable company.

The obvious top picks are:

1. Presonus
2. Steinberg/Yamaha
3. Ableton

Next up:

4. ImageLine
5. Bitwig
6. Roland (pushing it a little)

And failing that:

7. Cockos (pushing it even further)
8. Apple
9. InMusic
10. Netflix (apparently their #1 competitor )

...

However someone else could see the value.

For example:

1. Raspberry Pi Foundation (imagine being able to carry around Reason on a portable credit-card sized computer) ...
2. Microsoft
3. Meta
4. Disney
5. A wealthy music mogul who just wants to keep it available for future music makers (Taylor Swift, Jay-Z, etc.)
6. SoundCloud

There are lots of unlikely businesses that could benefit from owning RS.

[DaveyG]

How tragically ironic it would be if Netflix bought 'em....

[antic604]

The obvious top picks are:

1. Presonus
2. Steinberg/Yamaha
3. Ableton

Next up:

4. ImageLine
5. Bitwig
6. Roland (pushing it a little)

ImageLine has been on a shopping spree recently, acquiring UVI and Melda, so I'd actually put them on top.

Bitwig I think is smaller than Reason in terms of user-base and revenues (although, hopefully, not for long).

[DaveyG]

ImageLine has been on a shopping spree recently, acquiring UVI and Melda

They also own W.A. Production, which explains IL's latest addition to FL Studio - FL Cloud, basically a marketplace for the zillions of (very average) sample collections from WA Prod.

[tewoc]

hi all,

so if they would just update the DAW to a competitive level - which would not be that much as many think - reason could become so much more than it is now in the industry.
It is just so extremely strange why they have let this opportunity slip by over the years and continue not to take advantage of it. Simply inexplicable.

[Bes]

lol