What I don't understand about the Reason Upgrade vs Reason+....

[tomusurp]

So I've been a Reason user for quite a while. Currently I own Reason 11 Suite and also subscribed to Reason+

Since there is currently a 50% discount for Reason 12 upgrade, I was ready to upgrade until I came across the comparison chart for Reason 12 vs Reason+

Reason 12 perpetual is missing quite of bit of stuff compared to Reason+ in terms of instruments and effects as shows here https://help.reasonstudios.com/hc/en-us ... -included-

And here it literally says "Reason+ is a subscription service, which gives you access to the latest version of Reason (currently Reason 12)"

So wouldn't it make sense if we upgraded to Reason 12 that we should be able to get every module and update there is until Reason 13 rolls in? This honestly just seems like a screwup. Why would we not get the updates and new modules that are still under the Reason 12 umbrella? I get it, they are trying to restrict certain things to get people on Reason+ but that is just bad business. If you buy a perpetual to the most current version then we should be entitled to everything Reason+ has, UNTIL they unveil Reason 13. At which point then if we upgrade again, we are once again entitled to everything Reason+ WILL HAVE DURING THE REMAINDER OF THE VERSION, and so on and so on.

Creating such a weird disconnection really does not look good. If you are going to provide perpetual licenses, then don't leave out a chunk of a version and only save it for subscribers. I hope someone from the Reason team reads this, but if this is a way to earn more from long-time perpetual license holders (by having them also subscribe to test new updates and modules IN THE SAME VERSION they upgraded to) don't you think there would be more perpetual holders upgrading to current versions if you did a more normal way I outlined? You would still have many other type of users who subscribe because they either can't afford a perpetual or are testing out the program. It's a healthier business model for the longrun. I have nothing against companies who do subscriptions as long as they also offer perpetuals, but this type of way is definitely shady since you are literally restricting parts of version development only for Reason+ but yet advertising perpetual version upgrades.

[joeyluck]

I think you misunderstand.

Propellerhead/Reason Studios has sold optional REs separately from Reason since the inception of the RE format over a decade ago.

Reason+ is access to Reason "plus" everything else made by Reason Studios. It is a way to get access to Reason and all of the optional devices without having to purchase them all.

Reason itself and the perpetual license have not been stripped down. That have not moved built-in devices out of Reason and into Reason+/the shop. Even with Reason+ and the shop, they continue to add devices to Reason (such as Mimic).

So you can buy Reason and get all of the devices that are included and you can purchase any additional REs that you want.

[tomusurp]

I think you misunderstand.

Propellerhead/Reason Studios has sold optional REs separately from Reason since the inception of the RE format over a decade ago.

Reason+ is access to Reason "plus" everything else made by Reason Studios. It is a way to get access to Reason and all of the optional devices without having to purchase them all.

Reason itself and the perpetual license have not been stripped down. That have not moved built-in devices out of Reason and into Reason+/the shop. Even with Reason+ and the shop, they continue to add devices to Reason (such as Mimic).

So you can buy Reason and get all of the devices that are included and you can purchase any additional REs that you want.

I think that's worse. You can call them Rack Extensions but it's all Rack Extensions. The "built-in" modules are also just rack extensions that are specifically embedded in the "core" program. My point is all these new modules whether instrument, effect, or player, were built under Reason 12 timeframe. I get that you're saying we can purchase them individually and come close to the experience of Reason+ but there's a lot of great modules, which would be a ton more money to get the Reason+ experience. It would make more sense in that case to provide a "Suite License" or whatever you want to call it, to be able to download all new modules that were created during the timeframe of a version.

Not to mention and correct me if I'm wrong, don't these new modules become a part of Reason 13 core at some point? If that's the case and they are developing these new modules during a version timeframe and only allowing complete access to subscribers is just flawed business model. It sways major favor towards subcription and puts a heavy price on perpetual. Not to mention forces perpetuals to wait until the next version to theoretically acquire those new modules at a much cheaper price via version upgrade.

I know I'd be asking for too much for Reason to provide something like Lifetime updates like FL Studio, but at least take one aspect of their Tier system. For example their ALL Plugin Tier is the highest and gives you instant option to update when new version or module is available. The lower tiers will still give you option to update "version" with option to buy a new module.

Reason has effectively removed the "Suite" experience from perpetual and transferred it to Reason+, and the only way to experience the "full" version is by either buying a bunch of Rack Extensions for a very high total sum or subscribing. Again, flawed and imbalanced business model. I love the program and I don't mind them offering subscriptions and not having lifetime updates, but offer a "Suite" perpetual, it's only right. If Reason 12 is simply a "Standard" now at normally $199 update and $499 new user, then provide a "Suite" option for a higher but reasonable price like $299/$699 just an example. And then anytime they develop new modules under a specific version's timeframe, "Suite" owners have access to download it same as Reason+ subscribers. It's only right.

[deeplink]

If you currently subscribed to R+ then I am not sure why you are considering upgrading to R12?

You already have Reason 12.

[Loque]

Reason perpetual is like you buy a car.

Reason+ is like joining a service where you can drive any car of them for free as long as you are subscribed to the service.

And if, let's say, you buy a car from BMW, even if you buy it now, you won't own all BMW build before automatically as included in your buy.

Simple as that...

[joeyluck]

I get that you're saying we can purchase them individually and come close to the experience of Reason+ but there's a lot of great modules, which would be a ton more money to get the Reason+ experience. It would make more sense in that case to provide a "Suite License" or whatever you want to call it, to be able to download all new modules that were created during the timeframe of a version.

It sounds like you get it and are making a case for the value and purpose behind Reason+
They did try a Suite version before, with Reason 11 Suite, but then discontinued it in favor of Reason+ subscription. I think if someone wants everything, a subscription is the more cost effective approach and easier to manage. Otherwise, you just buy the plugins you want.

Not to mention and correct me if I'm wrong, don't these new modules become a part of Reason 13 core at some point? If that's the case and they are developing these new modules during a version timeframe and only allowing complete access to subscribers is just flawed business model. It sways major favor towards subcription and puts a heavy price on perpetual. Not to mention forces perpetuals to wait until the next version to theoretically acquire those new modules at a much cheaper price via version upgrade.

No, there's no guarantee of that. There have been a few devices in the past from the shop that have been included later, but it wasn't immediate and it has only been a few. Pulsar (released during R6.5, 2012) was built into Reason 9 (2016) and Rad Piano (released during R6.5, 2012) and Synchronous (released during R7.1, 2014) were built into Reason 10 (2017). That was before they tried a Suite version and of course before Reason+. REs like Polar, Radical Keys, Rotor, etc. that have been in the shop for over a decade and the other 20+ REs in the shop have not been included and built into Reason at any point.

[TritoneAddiction]

As much as I hate any form of subscription model, I think the options RS offer right now are pretty fair. If I for some unimaginable reason decided to start subscribing I would at least expect to get some kind of benefit from it. Otherwise it would be completely useless.

Are you sure you have a need to own every new RS device anyway? I mean they release some good stuff for sure. But personally half of their RE releases don't even interest me. I simply buy those I want. Usually you can use the reward points as well since it's RS own stuff.

[RobBarnett]

If you intend to continue subscribing to R+, you could always sell your R11 Suite Licence. You'll still have access to all of the Reason Studios made Rack Extensions included in your 11 Suite licence AND your sale of R11 Suite includes the licence transfer of the Suite REs (beneficial to the buyer). This is what I did when I decided subscription was the better option for me

[Ichooselife]

bro it’s all just worthless , it will all become worthless at some point , and it’s only about the here and now , let me explain with all the cracked versions being done now ( reason 12 cubase 12 / , you would think they would be more kind to the user base wouldn’t you ? because we choose to pay in a world where everything seems free online ( there’s so much good free stuff free music etc ) and it doesn’t feel like stealing in the sense of taking candy from a baby or an old ladies purse does it ? so shouldn’t that make them care about us more as like an old band touring? ( which is how most bands make money now , we are supporting there band! why everyone else downloads there music for free ) you would think that would make them care ( thank you reason fans for supporting us they should say ! wrong ! they only care about making money now grabbing as much as they can before things change because we live in a world now where media isn’t that sustainable so much ( new bands come along quickly and , people want new stuff all the time , so they roll on trying to keep those people happy more than the people that want to own something,
by giving new content and so the people that haven’t seen all the older stuff go ohhhh new song /new content this looks good let’s have a look , we here we are the fans who was there from the beginning a dying breed holding on to our perpetual licences ( our first cd or vinyl albums , we’re like the people who still want to play our cd collection, and we go in the store and there’s not many left to buy , soon there won’t be any . and as bad as this sounds you will choose to download it for free so you can have it forever , or you’ll join spotify ( subscription)

[crimsonwarlock]

let me explain with all the cracked versions being done now ( reason 12 cubase 12 / , you would think they would be more kind to the user base wouldn’t you ? because we choose to pay in a world where everything seems free online ( there’s so much good free stuff free music etc ) and it doesn’t feel like stealing in the sense of taking candy from a baby or an old ladies purse does it ?

It's not allowed to discus cracks here on the forum, let alone actually endorsing it.

[Ichooselife]

let me explain with all the cracked versions being done now ( reason 12 cubase 12 / , you would think they would be more kind to the user base wouldn’t you ? because we choose to pay in a world where everything seems free online ( there’s so much good free stuff free music etc ) and it doesn’t feel like stealing in the sense of taking candy from a baby or an old ladies purse does it ?

It's not allowed to discus cracks here on the forum, let alone actually endorsing it.

i’m not discussing actual cracks or where to get them
and i’m not endorsing or
praising anything mate ( people are not stupid they know stuff excists ) did you not get the point of what i meant ? i paid for my licence the same as you so i really don’t get your point mate ? your just picking out parts you dont like, it’s taking out of context when you highlight one part of the conversation away from
the full meaning .

[tomusurp]

Except it’s not cost effective because Reason new version come out about every 3 years so even if you’re on yearly Reason+ that would make it $600 per version, and guess what that’s a subscription, you don’t even own the program!

And your last paragraph proves how bad of a development process and business model it is. Why not include anything new by Reason Studios in the next version? It’s an attempt for other potential portals of profit but it’s a bad business model when you’re swaying a Suite experience in favor of Reason+. Like how do you NOT have a suite license for a DAW, it’s almost baffling. They can make it so simple. Include a suite license for a reasonable price and allow real-time updates to anything new added to a version/Reason+ and also reduce subscription to $10 per month. Guaranteed perpetual buyers will come back and increase and so will subscriptions, but no instead they offer an incomplete perpetual and definitely not cost effective subscription.

I get that you're saying we can purchase them individually and come close to the experience of Reason+ but there's a lot of great modules, which would be a ton more money to get the Reason+ experience. It would make more sense in that case to provide a "Suite License" or whatever you want to call it, to be able to download all new modules that were created during the timeframe of a version.

It sounds like you get it and are making a case for the value and purpose behind Reason+
They did try a Suite version before, with Reason 11 Suite, but then discontinued it in favor of Reason+ subscription. I think if someone wants everything, a subscription is the more cost effective approach and easier to manage. Otherwise, you just buy the plugins you want.

Not to mention and correct me if I'm wrong, don't these new modules become a part of Reason 13 core at some point? If that's the case and they are developing these new modules during a version timeframe and only allowing complete access to subscribers is just flawed business model. It sways major favor towards subcription and puts a heavy price on perpetual. Not to mention forces perpetuals to wait until the next version to theoretically acquire those new modules at a much cheaper price via version upgrade.

No, there's no guarantee of that. There have been a few devices in the past from the shop that have been included later, but it wasn't immediate and it has only been a few. Pulsar (released during R6.5, 2012) was built into Reason 9 (2016) and Rad Piano (released during R6.5, 2012) and Synchronous (released during R7.1, 2014) were built into Reason 10 (2017). That was before they tried a Suite version and of course before Reason+. REs like Polar, Radical Keys, Rotor, etc. that have been in the shop for over a decade and the other 20+ REs in the shop have not been included and built into Reason at any point.

[Ichooselife]

Except it’s not cost effective because Reason new version come out about every 3 years so even if you’re on yearly Reason+ that would make it $600 per version, and guess what that’s a subscription, you don’t even own the program!

And your last paragraph proves how bad of a development process and business model it is. Why not include anything new by Reason Studios in the next version? It’s an attempt for other potential portals of profit but it’s a bad business model when you’re swaying a Suite experience in favor of Reason+. Like how do you NOT have a suite license for a DAW, it’s almost baffling. They can make it so simple. Include a suite license for a reasonable price and allow real-time updates to anything new added to a version/Reason+ and also reduce subscription to $10 per month. Guaranteed perpetual buyers will come back and increase and so will subscriptions, but no instead they offer an incomplete perpetual and definitely not cost effective subscription.

It sounds like you get it and are making a case for the value and purpose behind Reason+
They did try a Suite version before, with Reason 11 Suite, but then discontinued it in favor of Reason+ subscription. I think if someone wants everything, a subscription is the more cost effective approach and easier to manage. Otherwise, you just buy the plugins you want.



No, there's no guarantee of that. There have been a few devices in the past from the shop that have been included later, but it wasn't immediate and it has only been a few. Pulsar (released during R6.5, 2012) was built into Reason 9 (2016) and Rad Piano (released during R6.5, 2012) and Synchronous (released during R7.1, 2014) were built into Reason 10 (2017). That was before they tried a Suite version and of course before Reason+. REs like Polar, Radical Keys, Rotor, etc. that have been in the shop for over a decade and the other 20+ REs in the shop have not been included and built into Reason at any point.

i do agree polar and any effects like that you shouldn’t have to pay for them
as extra
reason drum kits and pianos they should be standard


tom think about it one upgrade every 2-3 years at £99 or £199 or £19.99 per month £240 per year do the math bruv of course they don’t want perpetual licence holders for much longer , grab the version you got and if you happy keep it forever , fcuk all this upgrading all the time bollox anyway .