Can anybody explain Mimic's mono modes?

[Loque]

I wouldn't rule out it isn't user error. I'm almost certain it is.

Guess Gorilla Texas will live with HIS bug and moves on...

[MattiasHG]

If I understand this thread correctly, you're not necessarily talking about Mono vs. Poly, you're talking about note priority and retrigger behavior. In Mimic's Mono mode (both Legato and Retrig) it uses Last Note Priority and retriggers a held note on release of another.

This is the most common note priority and behavior in software and in playable instruments like synths and it's what we chose for Mimic. Right now there's no option to not retrigger a held note on release of a second note in Mimic. The best way to avoid that retrigger is if you hold C then play G, make sure you release C first. We'd have to add another voice mode to support not retriggering.

And yes, other samplers can work differently, for example Ableton's Simpler has no Note Off retrigger when set to 1 voice, there's no dedicated Mono mode—only number of voices. This also has its cons as you can't sample say a synth lead or flute and play it as expected on the keyboard. You'd get around it in the same way as with Mimic, play it differently.

In case you just want more of a drum sampler behavior (play key/pad, play entire sample, but mono so only one sample at a time) you can achieve this by using Mono, a long Envelope release and playing short notes. Every new slice will "choke" the last slice played.

I wouldn't rule out it isn't user error. I'm almost certain it is.

No it isn't.

Though it can be discussed what's positive about the no-retrigger-on-release behavior. I'm not sure there's a reason to not release the first note pressed before the second note's released.

[Goriila Texas]

You answered my question and I appreciate everyone who tried and confirmed this behavior from Reasons samplers. This behavior is not to be expected not from hardware which I’ve checked on my TriTon Studio to all other software samplers none behave like Reason’s samplers. The burden of proof is on any of the RS apologists who hate the truth. I’ve stated several software samplers that don’t do this so the notion that it should be expected in Reason is a false narrative.

I’ll try to check Kontakt today since it’s the sampler I’ve used the most that is still available. But I used CMI/Akai S900/Sample Cell/Kontakt (among others) for quite a while before I used Reason for the first time - I don’t remember Reason samplers doing anything differently than any of the previous hardware/software I used previously but could be wrong as it’s been a few decades since I made the switch!

I admit I’m now not quite clear what the question is, and I realize I’m not being that clear either since we don’t seem to be on the same page. That said, ‘writing’ about music/sound is not always clear and a video/audio example showing the two different behaviors would make it clear (I can make a video later if it will help).
But I also understand if you’re simply frustrated and want to move on, especially if you’re already not a fan of Reason’s workflow.

[PhillipOrdonez]

I wouldn't rule out it isn't user error. I'm almost certain it is.

I won’t rule it out either, but I’d say it’s unlikely if it works in other samplers but not in Reason.
I think the clue is in why one would want/need to continue to hold a note that is not making any sound…

Precisely the reason I was asking him exactly that at the beginning only to be told not to focus on the workflow. ‍♂️

[Goriila Texas]

Thanks for the response and clarification I’ll check this out when I get home.

If I understand this thread correctly, you're not necessarily talking about Mono vs. Poly, you're talking about note priority and retrigger behavior. In Mimic's Mono mode (both Legato and Retrig) it uses Last Note Priority and retriggers a held note on release of another.

This is the most common note priority and behavior in software and in playable instruments like synths and it's what we chose for Mimic. Right now there's no option to not retrigger a held note on release of a second note in Mimic. The best way to avoid that retrigger is if you hold C then play G, make sure you release C first. We'd have to add another voice mode to support not retriggering.

And yes, other samplers can work differently, for example Ableton's Simpler has no Note Off retrigger when set to 1 voice, there's no dedicated Mono mode—only number of voices. This also has its cons as you can't sample say a synth lead or flute and play it as expected on the keyboard. You'd get around it in the same way as with Mimic, play it differently.

In case you just want more of a drum sampler behavior (play key/pad, play entire sample, but mono so only one sample at a time) you can achieve this by using Mono, a long Envelope release and playing short notes. Every new slice will "choke" the last slice played.

I wouldn't rule out it isn't user error. I'm almost certain it is.

No it isn't.

Though it can be discussed what's positive about the no-retrigger-on-release behavior. I'm not sure there's a reason to not release the first note pressed before the second note's released.

[Goriila Texas]

What's the chances of you telling the team to upgrade Mimic with a no-trigger option and a play button like Grain?

If I understand this thread correctly, you're not necessarily talking about Mono vs. Poly, you're talking about note priority and retrigger behavior. In Mimic's Mono mode (both Legato and Retrig) it uses Last Note Priority and retriggers a held note on release of another.

This is the most common note priority and behavior in software and in playable instruments like synths and it's what we chose for Mimic. Right now there's no option to not retrigger a held note on release of a second note in Mimic. The best way to avoid that retrigger is if you hold C then play G, make sure you release C first. We'd have to add another voice mode to support not retriggering.

And yes, other samplers can work differently, for example Ableton's Simpler has no Note Off retrigger when set to 1 voice, there's no dedicated Mono mode—only number of voices. This also has its cons as you can't sample say a synth lead or flute and play it as expected on the keyboard. You'd get around it in the same way as with Mimic, play it differently.

In case you just want more of a drum sampler behavior (play key/pad, play entire sample, but mono so only one sample at a time) you can achieve this by using Mono, a long Envelope release and playing short notes. Every new slice will "choke" the last slice played.

I wouldn't rule out it isn't user error. I'm almost certain it is.

No it isn't.

Though it can be discussed what's positive about the no-retrigger-on-release behavior. I'm not sure there's a reason to not release the first note pressed before the second note's released.

[selig]

You answered my question and I appreciate everyone who tried and confirmed this behavior from Reasons samplers. This behavior is not to be expected not from hardware which I’ve checked on my TriTon Studio to all other software samplers none behave like Reason’s samplers. The burden of proof is on any of the RS apologists who hate the truth. I’ve stated several software samplers that don’t do this so the notion that it should be expected in Reason is a false narrative.

Agreed - did you think that’s what i was saying?

[Jackjackdaw]

Just out of interest, why do you want to have your finger held down on a key with no expectation of it making any further noise?

[Bes]

oh that came up earlier in the thread.. since the pads are momentary, op wants to control the length of a note (like a bass) but not have it re trigger

[MattiasHG]

What's the chances of you telling the team to upgrade Mimic with a no-trigger option and a play button like Grain?

Not zero but can't make any promises

oh that came up earlier in the thread.. since the pads are momentary, op wants to control the length of a note (like a bass) but not have it re trigger

The current best way to do that is using Decay/Release to control the sample length, but it'll lead to a fading curve which might not always be what you want.

If you have a set length you want, you can load the samples in multi-slot mode and simply set the start/end marker in the sample display. Then set each slot to Mono Retrig and it'll play one sample at a time. This doesn't give you direct control over the length but rather a fixed length, but it alleviates the need to hold down the pads and allows pads that only sends short triggers.

[Bes]

i would have gone for the parallel approach and put two mimics in multi-slice mode inside a combinator.
keeping one mimic dedicated for whatever sample i didn't want retriggered and have the combi editor send all other triggers to the 2nd mimic