What makes Reason a great “Idea Starter”?

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Djstarski
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Post 24 May 2023

guitfnky wrote:
23 May 2023
Andy wrote:
23 May 2023
What makes Reason a great “Idea Starter”?

Ease of use.

And what is the difference between a full blown DAW and a creative “idea starter”?

A full blown DAW gets you "further". But they can also be idea starters. Marketing as great idea start is very strange to me. Any other DAW manufacturer can make that claim.
"DAW X is a great idea starter and much, much more. Get your songs from start to finish without the need to use another platform".

The idea starter push seems very limiting but hey I don't do marketing nor do I know anything about their business. Something must be working for them.
👆🏼👆🏼this

the ideas come from the person. the only benefit Reason or any other DAW has is that it will tend to lead you down a particular path that that DAW is best suited for.

when I use Reason, I’m more likely to use virtual instruments and generate MIDI with Players. when I use Ableton, I tend to experiment more with song structures on the fly, and feel equally at home working with virtual and real instruments. when I use Reaper, I find myself sticking mainly to real instruments.

whichever I choose to work in there’s never, ever a lack of ideas.

at the end of the day, workflow is king, and Reason’s workflow may work better for certain genres—for those who care about such things—but the thought that it’s better than anything else at helping with “ideas” is just marketing.
This makes a lot of sense to me .

You can get an idea started on a piano or guitar .

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selig
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Post 24 May 2023

guitfnky wrote:
23 May 2023
at the end of the day, workflow is king, and Reason’s workflow may work better for certain genres—for those who care about such things—but the thought that it’s better than anything else at helping with “ideas” is just marketing.
Is it JUST marketing if it is true for me?
Reason IS better than anything else I’ve tried at helping with ideas, which is not marketing it’s simply fact. I use it for ambient, pop, reggae, chillout, etc. It’s not better for any one genre I’ve found so far. I also play guitar and piano, and I use Reason to work with those instruments to ‘start ideas’, and without Reason I’d only get so far with those instruments alone. My ideas include arrangements which I cannot perform all the parts for on piano or guitar.

So is it just marketing if it is true for me?

I guess my original question should have been more aimed at folks for whom Reason IS a good idea starter tool, and why that is true for those folks.
I don’t mind entertaining the other question being asked, which is more about whether Reason is a good idea starter for everyone - but we already know that no single tool is a good tool for everyone so I’m not sure there’s much to discuss there. Anyway, carry on y'all, great discussion!
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Fotu
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Post 24 May 2023

Simplicity / ease of use... more specifically the absense of the now how do I do that? pauses and research that can squelch creative momentum, which I experience more often with my other more capable but complex DAW.

But it's a trade-off... As I get deeper into production and tweaks, the Reason answer to how do I do that? can become with enormous difficulty; the usual tech trade-off between simplicity and capability,

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guitfnky
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Post 24 May 2023

selig wrote:
24 May 2023
guitfnky wrote:
23 May 2023
at the end of the day, workflow is king, and Reason’s workflow may work better for certain genres—for those who care about such things—but the thought that it’s better than anything else at helping with “ideas” is just marketing.
Is it JUST marketing if it is true for me?
Reason IS better than anything else I’ve tried at helping with ideas, which is not marketing it’s simply fact. I use it for ambient, pop, reggae, chillout, etc. It’s not better for any one genre I’ve found so far. I also play guitar and piano, and I use Reason to work with those instruments to ‘start ideas’, and without Reason I’d only get so far with those instruments alone. My ideas include arrangements which I cannot perform all the parts for on piano or guitar.

So is it just marketing if it is true for me?

I guess my original question should have been more aimed at folks for whom Reason IS a good idea starter tool, and why that is true for those folks.
I don’t mind entertaining the other question being asked, which is more about whether Reason is a good idea starter for everyone - but we already know that no single tool is a good tool for everyone so I’m not sure there’s much to discuss there. Anyway, carry on y'all, great discussion!
if you, or anyone else can name one idea Reason (or any other DAW) has ever created for anyone, absent a user, I’ll concede the point.

Reason is only a funnel for OUR ideas. it doesn’t help us come up with them. it will guide us in a particular direction, because it has its own constraints. it’s why we tend to think of tools as helping us be creative. it helps form our ideas into its mold.

it’s not a bad thing—it’s how all DAWs/tools work. but when we insinuate any tool is somehow more conducive to creativity, yeah, that’s absolutely just marketing.

point is, we tend to get into these silly “this DAW vs. that one” discussions because we’re coming at it from a flawed perspective. we trick ourselves into thinking our DAW of choice is the best at generating ideas, instead of just being the best choice for our way of working. there’s overlap, but they’re not at all the same thing. that’s why that framing is just marketing.
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guitfnky
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Post 24 May 2023

to put that more succinctly—creativity is never about the tools, it’s always about the creator.

every DAW is a tool used to create.

no DAW is a creator.
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brianwdowliong
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Post 24 May 2023

For myself, fast to generate ideas, ability to quickly put together device and effect chains and of course, the cabling has always been fun. Now that it can be used as a VST, it's even more flexible to move your ideas around between different daws. I've been a user since 2.0, and even it continues to be fun to use for me.

And quite frankly, in these days of VSTs and the transportability of those between different daws, is any daw in fact able to take all music to100% complete?

Each DAW has its own flavour, history, workflow approach, user community and the company's vision for their product roadmap. Grateful to be living in an age where there is so much choice in the creative music tools that are available.

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Timmy Crowne
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Post 24 May 2023

guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023
we trick ourselves into thinking our DAW of choice is the best at generating ideas, instead of just being the best choice for our way of working.
If I’ve tricked myself into thinking my DAW is the best, and that idea encourages me to create, how does it continue to be an illusion?

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guitfnky
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Post 24 May 2023

Timmy Crowne wrote:
24 May 2023
guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023
we trick ourselves into thinking our DAW of choice is the best at generating ideas, instead of just being the best choice for our way of working.
If I’ve tricked myself into thinking my DAW is the best, and that idea encourages me to create, how does it continue to be an illusion?
it makes it easier to think the tools we choose are more important than they actually are in the creative process, and makes it easier to try to blame our own creative failures on tools that don’t live up, rather than taking responsibility when we’re struggling.
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selig
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Post 24 May 2023

guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023
Timmy Crowne wrote:
24 May 2023


If I’ve tricked myself into thinking my DAW is the best, and that idea encourages me to create, how does it continue to be an illusion?
it makes it easier to think the tools we choose are more important than they actually are in the creative process, and makes it easier to try to blame our own creative failures on tools that don’t live up, rather than taking responsibility when we’re struggling.
OK, gonna agree but also get us back on topic: what makes Reason the tool you reach for when you are feeling musically creative? Or do you prefer some other tool instead?
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guitfnky
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Post 24 May 2023

selig wrote:
24 May 2023
guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023


it makes it easier to think the tools we choose are more important than they actually are in the creative process, and makes it easier to try to blame our own creative failures on tools that don’t live up, rather than taking responsibility when we’re struggling.
OK, gonna agree but also get us back on topic: what makes Reason the tool you reach for when you are feeling musically creative? Or do you prefer some other tool instead?
immediacy. Reason’s strong suit is that most aspects of the app follow a clear (usually visible) signal flow. and the QOL features it does have are smartly implemented, instead of awkwardly abstracted behind layers of menus or options.

I do prefer other options from a DAW perspective these days—Ableton is just really quick/easy to use, and Reaper’s vocal pitch correction plug-in surprisingly crushes everything I’ve ever tried in both results and workflow.

musically/idea-wise, these days I mainly start with guitars, and reach for synths, etc. to help fill things out. I’ve tried getting to grips with Pigments lately, but find it more frustrating than anything Reason has to offer. it sounds great, but I “get” the Reason synths more (many of them, anyway 😅).
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Crumbfort
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Post 24 May 2023

selig wrote:
24 May 2023
What makes Reason the tool you reach for when you are feeling musically creative? Or do you prefer some other tool instead?
I'll admit I vastly prefer Bitwig for sheer fun/musical creativity. Bitwig really feels like what I wished Reason would become, and then some. I haven't used the Reason DAW itself in ages (I just use the VST in Reaper or Bitwig), and they'd really have to overhaul/add a LOT of things to draw me back in. It used to bum me out a lot, but I've accepted that Reason will never be the DAW I'd like it to be, and that's ok.
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EnochLight
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Post 24 May 2023

guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023
to put that more succinctly—creativity is never about the tools, it’s always about the creator.
I see this parroted a lot, and frankly - it's a load a shit IMHO. Obviously the creator has a lot to do with it, but the tools absolutely can have a massive effect on just how inspired you are to create - not to mention - affect the quality of what you create. You could be a freak'n musical genius producer, but if all you have is a couple of wooden sticks and a coffee can, you're not going to get very far without better tools. Sit genius producer in front of a DAW with some grade-A plugins, and they'll do far, far more creating - with much higher quality.

On topic: for me, Reason is just flat out inspiring to work in (between its ease of use and the rack paradigm). I've got Live 11 Suite, and while it's a massively powerful DAW that can easily do a lot more than Reason ever will, I just don't find it nearly as inspiring to work in as I do Reason. Hence, Reason is a great "idea starter" by leaps and bounds for me. I'll contrast that to Reaper, which I also used for years (begrudgingly), and while it may be super powerful and one of the lightest/leanest DAW's on the planet, I find it about as inspiring to work in as staring at a freshly painted wall and waiting for it to dry.
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guitfnky
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Post 24 May 2023

EnochLight wrote:
24 May 2023
guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023
to put that more succinctly—creativity is never about the tools, it’s always about the creator.
I see this parroted a lot, and frankly - it's a load a shit IMHO. Obviously the creator has a lot to do with it, but the tools absolutely can have a massive effect on just how inspired you are to create - not to mention - affect the quality of what you create. You could be a freak'n musical genius producer, but if all you have is a couple of wooden sticks and a coffee can, you're not going to get very far without better tools. Sit genius producer in front of a DAW with some grade-A plugins, and they'll do far, far more creating - with much higher quality.
you’re right. it’s your opinion.

no one with that level of talent would make those kinds of excuses.
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Jackjackdaw
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Post 25 May 2023

I have a notepad that is a great idea starter, the ui is great, a blank page and easily held mechanical pencil. It doesn’t have my ideas for me but it does facilitate starting them. I consider it a better idea starter than a chalk board or scratching sticks in the sand. But maybe that’s just the marketing…

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EnochLight
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Post 25 May 2023

guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023
you’re right. it’s your opinion.

no one with that level of talent would make those kinds of excuses.
No amount of talent will allow you to produce a great banger if your only tools aren’t up to snuff.
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guitfnky
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Post 25 May 2023

EnochLight wrote:
25 May 2023
guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023
you’re right. it’s your opinion.

no one with that level of talent would make those kinds of excuses.
No amount of talent will allow you to produce a great banger if your only tools aren’t up to snuff.
there’s an old adage that says a good craftsman never blames their tools. yeah.
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motuscott
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Post 25 May 2023

Fotu wrote:
24 May 2023
the absense of the now how do I do that?
:thumbs_up:
Who’s using the royal plural now baby? 🧂

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selig
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Post 25 May 2023

guitfnky wrote:
25 May 2023
EnochLight wrote:
25 May 2023


No amount of talent will allow you to produce a great banger if your only tools aren’t up to snuff.
there’s an old adage that says a good craftsman never blames their tools. yeah.
OK, point taken - but this thread is about folks who use Reason as an “idea starter”, so it starts with the assumption that tools are used (if not needed) be that pen/paper or music creation software. From there we discuss why the tools (Reason specifically, although other tools are useful to discuss for comparison) work for us, or why not.
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guitfnky
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Post 25 May 2023

selig wrote:
25 May 2023
guitfnky wrote:
25 May 2023


there’s an old adage that says a good craftsman never blames their tools. yeah.
OK, point taken - but this thread is about folks who use Reason as an “idea starter”, so it starts with the assumption that tools are used (if not needed) be that pen/paper or music creation software. From there we discuss why the tools (Reason specifically, although other tools are useful to discuss for comparison) work for us, or why not.
yeah, got it, but you’re moderating the wrong guy. I didn’t bring it back up. I’m going to respond if someone says something to me that warrants response. maybe reach out to Enoch. 🤷🏻‍♂️
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DaveyG
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Post 25 May 2023

In Reason it's players that make it a quick and easy song starter but these days I probably start as many songs in FL Studio as in Reason.
FL Studio doesn't have players as such but it does have some generative stuff, an excellent step sequencer and a superb Piano Roll, which includes the ability to use slide notes.

And then is is my more orthodox way of starting a song where I have a few chords or a melody in my head. In those cases I go straight for Studio One and start playing with the chord track and/or Scaler 2, usually just with boring old stock piano or string sounds.

It's probably also worth mentioning that if I do use Reason to start a song it's almost always as a plug-in to Studio One rather than standalone. It would be great if you could export the rack in Reason Standalone and import it into the RRP. (I'm trying not to moan about the loss of Rewire again....)

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huggermugger
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Post 25 May 2023

Fotu wrote:
24 May 2023
Simplicity / ease of use... more specifically the absense of the now how do I do that?
Judging by the many elementary, face-palm worthy questions that "producers" post on the FB groups, there is no absence of "now how do I do that?" For the computer illiterati, of whom there are many, and all of the RTFM-o-phobes, Reason is a daunting as any other DAW.

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bxbrkrz
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Post 25 May 2023

guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023
Timmy Crowne wrote:
24 May 2023


If I’ve tricked myself into thinking my DAW is the best, and that idea encourages me to create, how does it continue to be an illusion?
it makes it easier to think the tools we choose are more important than they actually are in the creative process, and makes it easier to try to blame our own creative failures on tools that don’t live up, rather than taking responsibility when we’re struggling.
R12 was the greatest idea starter for me to get Live Suite. Booyaka!



To all. Don't be afraid to get out of your confort zone, or your inspiration will crystallize. Forever.
757365206C6F67696320746F207365656B20616E73776572732075736520726561736F6E20746F2066696E6420776973646F6D20676574206F7574206F6620796F757220636F6D666F7274207A6F6E65206F7220796F757220696E737069726174696F6E2077696C6C206372797374616C6C697A6520666F7265766572

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guitfnky
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Post 25 May 2023

bxbrkrz wrote:
25 May 2023
guitfnky wrote:
24 May 2023


it makes it easier to think the tools we choose are more important than they actually are in the creative process, and makes it easier to try to blame our own creative failures on tools that don’t live up, rather than taking responsibility when we’re struggling.
R12 was the greatest idea starter for me to get Live Suite. Booyaka!



To all. Don't be afraid to get out of your confort zone, or your inspiration will crystallize. Forever.
:lol: shots fired!

great point too. there are songs I’m very proud of that would not have even existed had I just stuck to using Reason, or Live, or Reaper, or Digital Performer, etc., and using different tools pushes each song in a different direction.
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bxbrkrz
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Post 25 May 2023

guitfnky wrote:
25 May 2023
bxbrkrz wrote:
25 May 2023

R12 was the greatest idea starter for me to get Live Suite. Booyaka!

[Shabba!]

To all. Don't be afraid to get out of your confort zone, or your inspiration will crystallize. Forever.
:lol: shots fired!

great point too. there are songs I’m very proud of that would not have even existed had I just stuck to using Reason, or Live, or Reaper, or Digital Performer, etc., and using different tools pushes each song in a different direction.
Yep. Hardware, a pen and a sheet of paper are included.
Reason is one of many idea starters. If you play an instrument, picking it up wanting to play it comes first - before [whatever daw].
757365206C6F67696320746F207365656B20616E73776572732075736520726561736F6E20746F2066696E6420776973646F6D20676574206F7574206F6620796F757220636F6D666F7274207A6F6E65206F7220796F757220696E737069726174696F6E2077696C6C206372797374616C6C697A6520666F7265766572

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Timmy Crowne
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Post 25 May 2023

selig wrote:
25 May 2023
From there we discuss why the tools (Reason specifically, although other tools are useful to discuss for comparison) work for us, or why not.
When I feel like creating something quick and dirty, when I have an idea I want get recorded before I forget it, when I know how everything should sound, I reach for Reason.

When I feel like creating something deep, when I want to discover, when I don’t know how things should sound and I want to be surprised, I reach for Bitwig.

When I feel like working with others, recording and mixing lots of audio, keeping everything organized and versioned, laid out nicely on one screen, ready to publish, I reach for Logic.

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