Why is Reason Lacking in so many popular DAW lists for 3rd party products

[Mistro17]

As more products come out I think existing ones lose popularity. If you go back to the late 90's so much stuff no longer exists or just a shell of existence. It's loyal users that keep them afloat. Cakewalk was always in front of the pack with 64 bit and Pro Tools was one of the last 32 bit only.

These type of questions could be asked of anything like why isn't the Les Paul or Strat popular among metal players.

I don't think age have anything to do with it. I remember when it was Reason and Fruity Loops being talked about the most in my neighborhood. In fact I recently met someone who told me he still uses Reason and it was his first DAW. Reason is still popular for many musicians. Fruity Loops is still listed among the popular DAWs in most cases even being used for orchestral music these days.

I can't help but think there's a lack of communication somewhere. Why does a NI Keyboard have to be almost hacked into the preferences to use with Reason for example? Why are companies selling plugins and gear not thinking about Reason users? Or is this something that can change from the staff of Reason itself? Or did the Reason user base shrink THAT much so companies just don't bother on resources? I mean Reason Users have GAS too.

[Billy+]

I still hold out hope that the developers will stick to their word that R12 is going to be the best Reason it can be

but I personally wont be buying an upgrade until I see it first.

Well, I can’t say anything bad about R12. I say this although I left Reason back in 2019 because of - you guessed it - the sequencer and switched to Presonus Studio One.

But after a while I upgraded to R12 because of the simpler approach with hybrid (hardware modular) setups. I consider R12 as quite stable. And even if I no longer use it as DAW, I‘m quite happy to have it in my toolbox.

crazy thing is I've held off using other DAW's for years,

I had a copy of protools that I never installed,
I had a copy of bitwig that I never installed,

simply because I love Reason even with its lack at the time of vst support but once it got added I started wanting more and my eyes got opened to other devices that for the most part work far better then RE's especially players and are generally far cheaper.

I'm sure I've said it a thousand times by now :-

if R12 had added vst midi support and fixed a few long term bugs I would have paid the full upgrade price without a second thought.

they didn't so I won't be and unfortunately now I've brought Live suite with better support for the stuff I'm interested it makes absolutely no sense creatively to buy R12.

[Billy+]

Looks like the Live marketing team is out in force today.

to be fair, its the main DAW that Reason studios wanted us to move to....

[motuscott]

They hate us because we're beautiful

[bxbrkrz]

I have to go back to what I felt Reason was about: killing hardware. As a concept GAS was not a thing. Now it is. A DAW was not a thing. it was a midi sequencer controlling your outboard gear.

This is why Reason had no midi out. But that was a lie. Midi out was always in Reason. For your midi controllers, but not for midi notes and sequencing your hardware. It was a sneaky way to force you to kill your hardware. They lost that battle.

Re is sublime as a platform. But what happened to "Convert your VST into a Re in no time!" (paraphrasing the marketing message from back then). Another battle lost.

Maybe the product you create feels so perfect you go blind, looking at its brilliance for too long.

[arnigretar]

I'm not sure why it's not on those lists - maybe just because it is not as popular. It's like asking a person why *that* great album isn't charting higher (selling better) because it's such a great album. majority don't want great stuff - they want what other people are using/buying. They want what is played on the radio. Propellerhead have always been like IDM or ambient in a sense that it's great and wonderful - but doesn't sell as well as Hip Hop, Rock and Pop. OK way off topic and putting my pipe down. On a side note: happy easter!

[mimidancer]

Looks like the Live marketing team is out in force today.

to be fair, its the main DAW that Reason studios wanted us to move to....

To be fair, you have what you want in Live so why are you here? That is confounding to me. I don't want to hear about what reason does not have. It did not have those things when you signed up. I do not want the Live workflow. That is why I use reason. I have never once popped over there to tell live users why I don't use live. I do understand why people use it for performance. It was meant to be performed. Just like Reason is meant to be a hardware studio emulation. I have never seen an SSL mixer fold up into a folder.

[QVprod]

Fair to note that Reason has pretty much always been lacking in midi controller support. Hence why the Nektar stuff was so popular amongst us. We were finally seen.. and seen first at that

I think not listing Reason for VST compatibility is just force of habit. It wasn't compatible for many years.

[mimidancer]

Fair to note that Reason has pretty much always been lacking in midi controller support. Hence why the Nektar stuff was so popular amongst us. We were finally seen.. and seen first at that

I think not listing Reason for VST compatibility is just force of habit. It wasn't compatible for many years.

I have never had reason recognize what I plug in. Their unwillingness to commit people to write the code for current hardware is a weakness. They forget where they came from. They should be working with other companies the way they worked with cubase in the beginning.

[dioxide]

I have to agree with that. When every hardware manufacturer decides you're not important enough to support then it's up to Reason Studios to employ someone to do this and not simply keep repeating the line that it's up to manufacturers. Things have improved a little recently but previously the list of Remote controllers looked like the 2001-04 MIDI Controller Museum.

[PhillipOrdonez]

to be fair, its the main DAW that Reason studios wanted us to move to....

To be fair, you have what you want in Live so why are you here? That is confounding to me. I don't want to hear about what reason does not have. It did not have those things when you signed up. I do not want the Live workflow. That is why I use reason. I have never once popped over there to tell live users why I don't use live. I do understand why people use it for performance. It was meant to be performed. Just like Reason is meant to be a hardware studio emulation. I have never seen an SSL mixer fold up into a folder.

Exactly right!

[bxbrkrz]

Poll: is Reason your exclusive DAW in 2023, Yes. No.

[crimsonwarlock]

Poll: is Reason your exclusive DAW in 2023, Yes. No.

YES

[Popey]

Poll: is Reason your exclusive DAW in 2023, Yes. No.

Good question and for me the answer is No.

Reason for me is now a brilliant collection of players, synths and fx that I use every time I create.

[DaveyG]

Poll: is Reason your exclusive DAW in 2023, Yes. No.

Not even close. In fact recently the random failure of the offline authorisation has annoyed me so much that I tend to render the RRP tracks to audio sooner rather than later so I can unload the RRP tracks and avoid the sporadic login prompt and the s-l-o-w loading time. I think I'm using Reason less than I ever have, with the gap being filled by Pigments and the plugin version of FL Studio. For me pretty much the only reason to still use Reason is the players.

[bxbrkrz]

Poll: is Reason your exclusive DAW in 2023, Yes. No.

No.

[bxbrkrz]

Poll: is Reason your exclusive DAW in 2023, Yes. No.

Not even close. In fact recently the random failure of the offline authorisation has annoyed me so much that I tend to render the RRP tracks to audio sooner rather than later so I can unload the RRP tracks and avoid the sporadic login prompt and the s-l-o-w loading time. I think I'm using Reason less than I ever have, with the gap being filled by Pigments and the plugin version of FL Studio. For me pretty much the only reason to still use Reason is the players.

Do you still own your music production if you have zero access to it?

[selig]

Reason isn't a DAW, it is a VSE, a Virtual Studio Environment. And as a VSE it is without any real competition. I tried to use Reaper as a VSE, and used its configurability to try to get there. Customized that thing for over a decade and finally gave up. When you consider Reason to be a DAW, it has to compete with all other DAWs, but look at it as a VSE and every other DAW can only dream of competing with Reason.

For me, it is as simple as that

Maybe I’m totally missing the point, but is that not a distinction without a difference? I’ve always considered Pro Tools etc to be a virtual studio environment. With Pro Tool’s audio recorder, mixer, and FX devices I felt that the modern studio was finally and fully represented in a virtual state. Without audio recording, I cannot see a product earning the name VSE, and Reason didn’t start that way. As an audio engineer working in recording studios I may be biased, but I also had a decent MIDI setup at home since the mid 1980s - which i didn’t consider to be a studio until a few years later when I added Pro Tools and thus audio recording. Again, the audio part may just be because of my day job in recording studios.

IMO, Reason started as a virtual instrument rack (VIR) and still seeks to retain that title with RRP.

[crimsonwarlock]

Reason isn't a DAW, it is a VSE, a Virtual Studio Environment. And as a VSE it is without any real competition. I tried to use Reaper as a VSE, and used its configurability to try to get there. Customized that thing for over a decade and finally gave up. When you consider Reason to be a DAW, it has to compete with all other DAWs, but look at it as a VSE and every other DAW can only dream of competing with Reason.

For me, it is as simple as that

Maybe I’m totally missing the point, but is that not a distinction without a difference? I’ve always considered Pro Tools etc to be a virtual studio environment. With Pro Tool’s audio recorder, mixer, and FX devices I felt that the modern studio was finally and fully represented in a virtual state. Without audio recording, I cannot see a product earning the name VSE, and Reason didn’t start that way. As an audio engineer working in recording studios I may be biased, but I also had a decent MIDI setup at home since the mid 1980s - which i didn’t consider to be a studio until a few years later when I added Pro Tools and thus audio recording. Again, the audio part may just be because of my day job in recording studios.

IMO, Reason started as a virtual instrument rack (VIR) and still seeks to retain that title with RRP.

Maybe you missed my smiley, and the fact that I totally made up the term VSE

But aside from the fact that my post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek, I think it was pretty clear what I was pointing at. And I was not referring to how Reason started out, I was referring to how I perceive it today in its current state. The 'virtual studio' aspect as it is available in the Reason DAW is pretty much absent in everything else. And it is the determining factor in my current workflow, so there's that

[robussc]

Poll: is Reason your exclusive DAW in 2023, Yes. No.

Yes

[RobC]

Because everyone already knows Reason. : )

Well, because it's too good to be true
it´s time to hype our coder heroes outside RT

"I remember the days where the discussion comes up, wich daw engine has the best sound"

I already spread it to a coder. : )

The Reason sound sounds ~ 8 dB quieter. x D

[MarkTarlton]

Is reason my main DAW? - No

One thing that would be welcomed out of the hundred other basic wishes on my list, is to be able to select "bounce mixer channels" with multiple audio channels having different lengths, and have the option to retain the exact length, currently you only get loop or song length, so only where you put the loop indicators or the songs end length.

Oh and a HUGE one, have the option to select and choose import sample/bit rate, you get it for exporting, but not importing

There are way too many features missing for it to be my main DAW.

[Mistro17]

Poll: is Reason your exclusive DAW in 2023, Yes. No.

It's half and half for me these days precisely because of the topic here. The other DAW I have is Cubase 12 pro. I can just plug stuff in and it's mapped and supported. I can buy some software and see Cubase on the list of supported DAWs and find info about how to use it with Cubase specifically which seem to be diminished with Reason with so many new products. But I will never uninstall my copy of Reason. I still enjoy making music with it and work faster in Reason than I do Cubase likely because I used Reason way longer and it's my 1st DAW. Besides I have so many unfinished songs going on in there I just wish there was more support between new hardware and current software options. My main question is if developers of 3rd party product care about Reason users and why they don't list it in their promos or manuals. Perhaps it's a combination of both Reason not reaching out and DAW bias perception within 3rd party developers?

[bxbrkrz]

Poll: is Reason your exclusive DAW in 2023, Yes. No.

It's half and half for me these days precisely because of the topic here. The other DAW I have is Cubase 12 pro. I can just plug stuff in and it's mapped and supported. I can buy some software and see Cubase on the list of supported DAWs and find info about how to use it with Cubase specifically which seem to be diminished with Reason with so many new products. But I will never uninstall my copy of Reason. I still enjoy making music with it and work faster in Reason than I do Cubase likely because I used Reason way longer and it's my 1st DAW. Besides I have so many unfinished songs going on in there I just wish there was more support between new hardware and current software options. My main question is if developers of 3rd party product care about Reason users and why they don't list it in their promos or manuals. Perhaps it's a combination of both Reason not reaching out and DAW bias perception within 3rd party developers?

Not exclusive. No then

[Mistro17]

Not exclusive. No then

I get it But that fact should have no influence over Reason 3rd party support or mention. Plenty people have Studio One and Logic and enjoy great support for both for example.