Reason doesn’t work on modern computers?

[rootwheel]

The mess they've made out of Reason 12 does not instil me with a lot of confidence they'll have a solid ARM build ready any time soon - or that they will release it for free for current license holders like they did with Reason 3.0.5.

Sure, and maybe they'll require us to pay for the upgrade with our prized internal organs and sign a binding contract in blood etched by a quill forged from the still-growing femurs of a baby Swan.

No. We can safely say it will be a free upgrade.

Come on with the non-sequiturs already. Might as well claim they'll increase the price to £5,000 if we're just gonna be making stuff up without any rhyme or reason.

I'd say there's no more than a 0.3% chance M1 support skips R12 It's just highly unlikely.

I guess only time will tell if your faith was misplaced or my cynicism was too great

[guitfnky]

now who's being childish?

You've lost me.

That isn't an insult. It's a statement of fact.

The complexities involved in things like software development, or putting the man on the moon are unimaginable to most people. You just wouldn't have any idea what's involved without having worked on something with the same level of inherent complexity."

a statement of fact? that’s incredibly presumptuous. I’ve worked with very complex software nearly every day, all day, for years, in a technical capacity (i.e. not an end user). I’m well aware of the complexities involved. a huge part of my job is to explain to other people that “it’s not that simple, and here’s why…” but that’s beside the point. the point is you don’t know anything about anyone here other than the fact that we’re all Reason users, so to assign ignorance like that to try to make some kind of point is, well…childish.

you write much, but say little, so I’m not going through the rest of that.

[QVprod]

As I mentioned, some daws only got m1 support within the last couple of months. Had the bug not happened, it would have come earlier. Basically, the whining about how much time it's taken ignores that it took other daws and lots of other software products ROUGHLY just as long.

Now the misconception about quality control and rushing the product out.

Quality control, first of all wouldn't have made m1 support come out earlier, they'd still have to fix the bug. Second of all, it's a bug that is too rare for quality control (as it's dependant on user environment, and in a nutshell is the exact type of bug that can miss even the best quality control). This is true in theory and practice.

So even with the absolute best QC available and not rushing to get it out the door, you'd still be without M1 support, because it just wouldn't have been released and people would be whining about R12 taking soooo looong, ... "are we there yet?".

The mess they've made out of Reason 12 does not instil me with a lot of confidence they'll have a solid ARM build ready any time soon - or that they will release it for free for current license holders like they did with Reason 3.0.5. They really had their shit together back in 2006; they even released separate Intel and PPC builds to keep things running as fast as possible for both user bases. It took them only 5 months from the January 2006 release of Intel Macs to put Reason out for x86 OSX in May 2006. We're way past 5 months availability for ARM Macs now. Here's the cool release information about 3.0.5 from back in the heady days of 2006:

Reason 3.0.5 will only be available in the Intel format, and will not run on PowerPC-based Mac computers. This is contrary to Apple's recommendation to developers, which is to ship a combined PPC and Intel-Mac application in a package called a Universal Binary. Based on the Propellerheads' commitment to always provide the highest possible performance on all computer platforms supported, Propellerhead made the decision to deviate from Apple's recommendation. A Universal Binary actually contains two compiled applications, one for PPC and one for Intel. To create a Universal Binary, Propellerhead would need to use Apple's XCode compiler for both the PPC and Intel versions of the program. By contrast, the shipping version of Reason for PPC computers (version 3.0.4) is compiled with Motorola's CodeWarrior compiler. Unfortunately, internal performance testing shows that compiling Reason for PPC using Apple's XCode compiler creates a significantly slower program than the shipping 3.0.4 version that is available today. For this reason it has been decided to keep the two versions separate for the time being. While this creates a small inconvenience in that users have to manually determine which version is the right one to install, this is by far outshined by the advantages of having maximum performance.

The major difference between then in now seems to be pretty much outlined in this quote you shared. Chances are, they’re probably doing a universal binary this time (R12 still needs to work on a 2019 Mac in the M1 version) and Reason was a considerably lighter program back then with only internal instruments, no Rack extensions or VST support and we’re probably not mid development on a new version yet. New version releases were much slower back then. Nonetheless, all developers are taking their time with M1 support. Some audio interfaces aren’t even compatible yet.

As far as release. The roadmaps shared with us are for Reason 12 specifically. I forgot where I read it, but there won’t be a Reason 13 this year.

[challism]

Perhaps the title of this thread should be Reason doesn't work on M1. It seems to work just fine* on Windows-based machines.

*for most users (according to RS)

[Last Alternative]

But I had tons of problems with Reason on multiple PCs, including a beast PC my electronic technician dad helped me build and maintain which is why I switched to Apple, only to be further disappointed. Too many bugs, poor performance, and company getting more money-hungry over time giving less and taking more so.. that’s my feelings about it. And I know software is always prone to bugs. Part of life but for years I hated using Reason now due to video and audio glitches while they told me to use low res and low quality settings modes as a “workaround” and there’s really no excuse for that.

[avasopht]

you write much, but say little, so I’m not going through the rest of that.

Very childish.

And for the record, no, I did not "assign ignorance to prove a point". You admitted it - this is not stuff most people are aware of. You did nothing to suggest you had any in-depth knowledge. It's pretty stupid to make out my only motivation for not perceiving you as having decades of experience was just because I wanted to prove a point (yet I cannot think of a single point I could want to make that would require me to assign ignorance, which is what makes the accusation ridiculous).

Also so we're clear: I've developed a GUI system with hardware acceleration and a level of abstraction that was platform independent (and have worked on a variety of processors). I say that not to pull rank by the way, but so that we're a little more clear where I'm coming from (ESPECIALLY because the false accusations of my intent). I could still be terribly wrong about Reason Studios, of course, but when false accusations and being casually thrown about, clarity is paramount to dispel any unnecessary presumptions.

In fact I probably was of a similar opinion until I did the math on the production ramifications of just the testing. There is a limited testing budget, so even ignoring development, just having an additional platform target requires an allocation of testing resources plus a $100k-500k capital cost of M1 machines to develop and test with!

[guitfnky]

You are right, I don't know anything about anyone here other than the fact we're all Reason users.

But you are wrong that I "assign ignorance like that to make some kind of point." That's a stupid accusation because, as you know, it's MORE LIKELY that you're not an expert mechanic than you are an expert mechanic unless stated otherwise, right? So to conclude the ONLY reason I assigned ignorance was to make a point is pretty silly. Nothing you wrote suggested you had any in-depth knowledge, and what you were saying just does not sound correct. So it came across as ignorant.

…

assuming someone doesn’t understand something because of probabilities is still an assumption. what purpose does that assumption serve if not to make your point? anyhoo, yet another example of what they say about assumptions being proven true…

[avasopht]

assuming someone doesn’t understand something because of probabilities is still an assumption. what purpose does that assumption serve if not to make your point? anyhoo, yet another example of what they say about assumptions being proven true…

I am happy to admit I was mistaken.

But you accused me of ONLY assigning ignorance to prove a point, which makes no sense.

That is a false motivation you ASSUMED.

The purpose of the assumption is to make sense of where someone is coming from in order to communicate concisely rather than verbosely and in a formal manner. WE ALL MAKE THOSE TYPES OF ASSUMPTIONS. It's why you ASSUMED my motivations. Typically people INFER things during an interaction. It saves us from having to interview each other in-depth and communicate verbosely.

Sometimes we're right. Sometimes we're wrong.

Usually, people just correct each other and peacefully move on.

For instance, when you presumed I didn't know Reason 12 was high DPI. I've no idea why you made that assumption. Or when you presumed I only presumed your position to prove a point (you were wrong).

Do you see me acting towards you about it the same way you are acting towards me? No.

[selig]

OK 'children', back on topic please.

[DaveyG]

Those two should get their own forum at bicker.com

[mickeysternum]

Probably been covered here but I run whatever the latest Rosetta versions they release of Ableton 11 and Logic are + Reason 10 on an M1 Pro and they all run totally fine, with a lot of CPU headroom. I expect I'll do this for another year until I can guarantee Apple Silicon versions of all my plugins, there's a lot I got that the developers seem to have either left behind or haven't updated in a long time so maybe this doesn't happen for a very long time

[guitfnky]

OK 'children', back on topic please.

shouldn’t you give yourself a warning for personal attacks?

[selig]

OK 'children', back on topic please.

shouldn’t you give yourself a warning for personal attacks?

"I warn myself," said Pippi. "First I warn myself in a nice friendly way; and then, if I don't mind, I warn myself again more sharply; and if I still don't mind, then I'm in for a spanking--see?"

[EnochLight]

But I had tons of problems with Reason on multiple PCs, including a beast PC my electronic technician dad helped me build and maintain which is why I switched to Apple, only to be further disappointed. Too many bugs, poor performance, and company getting more money-hungry over time giving less and taking more so.. that’s my feelings about it. And I know software is always prone to bugs. Part of life but for years I hated using Reason now due to video and audio glitches while they told me to use low res and low quality settings modes as a “workaround” and there’s really no excuse for that.

It's just bizarre, and apparently subjective - because Reason has ran fine on my aging (10+ year old) PC that I personally built except for one of the point updates during 12 that killed my SSD and bogged it down with search (that was fixed a version or two ago). Meanwhile, Reason on Macs couldn't even use Retina displays for the past decade until 12, so I guess not getting M1 support just yet shouldn't be surprising. At least it's publically on the road map, though!

[moneykube]

shouldn’t you give yourself a warning for personal attacks?

"I warn myself," said Pippi. "First I warn myself in a nice friendly way; and then, if I don't mind, I warn myself again more sharply; and if I still don't mind, then I'm in for a spanking--see?"

spankings are good
I am totally unimpressed with apple... refused to get the M1 because of the reasons above... bought an i7 Mac mini , a little over 2 years ago... nothing but problems... in just over 2 years they had to replace 3 logic boards and a power supply... their support is a joke... I have used Macs for 30 plus years and never seen such incompetence in quality and support... they young people called support were not even born when I started using Macs... they always have the same mantra... get the newest os... use the following key commands I know inside and out... they always need to google the lame answers they give... guess what... I find more answers than they do using google. During the last logic board/power supply repair, 2 different departments told me they are constantly fixing their terrible logic boards... when I was there they had 2 powerbooks in need of logic boards and waiting for parts... they say they have many such repairs every week. When you talk to Apple directly they have no knowledge of this common problem... the first logic board blew up 6 of my powered drives by sending powered drives power... I would get a message on the screen that said there is not enough power to power the drives... they are powered drives... they need no power ! So essentially it cost me over 1000 dollars to replace the drives their logic board and a firmware update fried with no recompense... 8 trips to the apple store over an hour away costing 40 bucks a trip these days.... Countless hours waisted restoring the system countless times to what it was... weeks copying the data I was paranoid enough to but on multiple drives... Had I not done thisI would have lost my entire music and film career of terabytes of files. They say if the logic board goes again then I receive a replacement computer which will require likely a month to reinstall all the programs I purchased... their design is flawed... in the past if a component went you replaced that component. Now EVERY hardware issue is related to the logic board because everything is incorporated on their logic boards... Once a fan boy of Macs... PC's are looking better each day. I doubt I will buy another Mac again. The time and money that have been waisted due to their terrible newer design is unbelievable... I used to trouble shoot countless Macs in professional studios for film and video...I have 9 older apple devices in my room that still work... some are 25 plus years old. Apple has lost it's way and I am not even remotely surprised reason studios has not made the m1 chip versions compatible with reason... I have read so many bad reviews of said chip it isn't funny. I could go on... but hey... just a warning to those that are thinking of going the Apple route... Danger Will Robinson Danger !

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BTW... the rare times the Mac is not in for repair or being restored ... it does play nice with reason 11 although, I have to run a fan on it to keep it from melt down... it gets super hot !

[Oberlai]

Guessing you're on Mac? Macs can be troublesome with software, and in my humble opinion, music production is the worst thing you can use it for since you might usually need numerous different softwares/VSTs (from different developers at that) in one project. But if you do have a Mac, I feel Reason would be a very good choice Try the latest demo first if you want to test compatibility. If that runs, at least you know you can use stock + REs.