New Pricing for Reason 12 - Upgrades now 199 from 129

[Vyckeil]

With the sudden steep price increase, I'm officially done with investing my money in Reason. I spent a lot of money on REs and that's going to be it for me. With all the bugs in the new release, worsening performance with each release, lack of basic features found in most DAWs, implementing features far too late... I'm staying with 11 suite. Multithreading still doesn't work properly, delay compensation doesn't work properly, still no VST3 support, they're slowly moving to a subscription model, they never integrated ReCycle, and the fact that it feels like they abandoned the DAW portion of the software. I can't even recommend it to people anymore because the other options are just a much better investment in money and time.

At this point I'd rather invest in Bitwig, VCV rack and keep upgrading Studio One. I've been waiting for a new combi and high resolution for so long that I just adapted around it and I don't care anymore and moved on.

I'll always have a soft spot for Reason and I'll keep using it, but there are much better toys and tools on the market these days.

[Proboscis]

With the sudden steep price increase, I'm officially done with investing my money in Reason. I spent a lot of money on REs and that's going to be it for me. With all the bugs in the new release, worsening performance with each release, lack of basic features found in most DAWs, implementing features far too late... I'm staying with 11 suite.

You're lucky to be in such a position. With a collection of paid-for RE's, plus the bundle of Reason REs that came with R11Suite, you've got a ton of 'toys' that you can keep using as you join the exile to another DAW platform.

For those without another DAW already, the prospect of moving on for R11 users is one of many opportunities. $60 for Reaper, $free for Cakewalk, or another %20 to buy into Bitwig during a crossgrade offer (and a WHOLE SWAG of new toys for forty dollars more)

I'm not so fortunate. Being on Reason 10, there's no escape without penalty. I either buy into the Reason upgrade, or abandon the many REs I own and move to another DAW.

Small comfort at least, that the products I've paid for will keep working precisely as they did when I paid for them. The growing disdain I have every time I launch Reason is something I'll have to manage for myself.

I'm not even confident that there will be a Reason13 for me to buy, now that we've entered into the realm of subscription.

[Vyckeil]

[
You're lucky to be in such a position. With a collection of paid-for RE's, plus the bundle of Reason REs that came with R11Suite, you've got a ton of 'toys' that you can keep using as you join the exile to another DAW platform.

For those without another DAW already, the prospect of moving on for R11 users is one of many opportunities. $60 for Reaper, $free for Cakewalk, or another %20 to buy into Bitwig during a crossgrade offer (and a WHOLE SWAG of new toys for forty dollars more)

I'm not so fortunate. Being on Reason 10, there's no escape without penalty. I either buy into the Reason upgrade, or abandon the many REs I own and move to another DAW.

Small comfort at least, that the products I've paid for will keep working precisely as they did when I paid for them. The growing disdain I have every time I launch Reason is something I'll have to manage for myself.

I'm not even confident that there will be a Reason13 for me to buy, now that we've entered into the realm of subscription.

I understand your RE situation and I know it sucks. At least, Reason 10 has Ableton Link. As far as I know, Bitwig supports it natively. There's also a plugin for Reaper, but I haven't tested it. Here's a link I found in 5 second Google search : https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=254027

There are many ways you can sync DAWs and apps together through various software and more finicky methods. You don't have to stay stuck with Reason even though it's less than optimal.

[raymondh]

With the sudden steep price increase, I'm officially done with investing my money in Reason. I spent a lot of money on REs and that's going to be it for me. With all the bugs in the new release, worsening performance with each release, lack of basic features found in most DAWs, implementing features far too late... I'm staying with 11 suite.

You're lucky to be in such a position. With a collection of paid-for RE's, plus the bundle of Reason REs that came with R11Suite, you've got a ton of 'toys' that you can keep using as you join the exile to another DAW platform.

For those without another DAW already, the prospect of moving on for R11 users is one of many opportunities. $60 for Reaper, $free for Cakewalk, or another %20 to buy into Bitwig during a crossgrade offer (and a WHOLE SWAG of new toys for forty dollars more)

I'm not so fortunate. Being on Reason 10, there's no escape without penalty. I either buy into the Reason upgrade, or abandon the many REs I own and move to another DAW.

Small comfort at least, that the products I've paid for will keep working precisely as they did when I paid for them. The growing disdain I have every time I launch Reason is something I'll have to manage for myself.

I'm not even confident that there will be a Reason13 for me to buy, now that we've entered into the realm of subscription.

I would strongly encourage you to upgrade before the price increase.
the R11 Reason Rack Plug In really works well, and it will 'unlock' Reason for you in whatever DAW you decide to use.

Then you can try the low cost Reaper path, which is a great DAW but with a pretty ugly stock devices and no pile of bundled samples.
But even if you purchased a DAW with lots of toys, I'm guessing you'd still want to reach for a Pulveriser or SSL EQ from time to time...

[ltbrunt00]

I have been using Reason since the beginning, have brought many rack extensions and always upgrade as a means to show support. Reason 12 is sort of let down. I usually keep comments like that to myself. I would gladly upgrade for $199.99 if there is Value. Reason twelve is not really worth 129 IMO. I rarely use combinators and though Mimic is great isn't something that I will use often. I was expecting more in the stock mixing plugins, mixer, updates to the sequencer, Video audio syncing and better integrate the tools window into the general DAW GUI. This seems as though $200 for future upgrades is a push to get people into Reason+. Reason+ Also doesn't work for me since all it really gives us is sound packs which If I needed something I would just purchase them outright. Give us bigger DAW updates vs only Instruments and I would happily pay $199.99. As it stands Reason I upgraded to Reason 12 but will likely be using Reason 11 until there some updates to the DAW. Also Reason 12 takes rack devices and combines them into combinators which kills my computers resources. This happens on 60 plus channels and Reason 12 grinds to a halt. Reason 11 is working just fine and I will stick with that for the foreseeable future.

[Proboscis]

I would strongly encourage you to upgrade before the price increase.
the R11 Reason Rack Plug In really works well, and it will 'unlock' Reason for you in whatever DAW you decide to use.

Warning: 'Poor me' rant start:

Not an option, either now or in the foreseeable future, regardless of the price increase. I turned 50 two days ago, I'm unemployed, live alone with no family, savings have long ago vanished, under pandemic isolation, unable to cover my rent, and rely on a church charity service to obtain food. I'm in rather bad health that I can't get treatment for, and I wonder every day when my electricity is going to be shut off.

/rant

It's an interesting take you've offered though, about RRP. While I find the half-baked 'hi-res' rollout to be completely unsatisfactory, none of that should impact hosting the RRP in another DAW. My gripes elsewhere are round the low-res browser menu...and as I'm noticing today, the blurry transport bar.

And while the pain of learning a new DAW is daunting, I do have a copy of Reaper, and have previously put in about 50 hours of use over a couple of years for non-music editing gigs (and have taken some deep-dives into Reaper's archaic customization parameters). So the transition won't be quite as challenging as it could be for a first-time Reaper novice.

It would have been nice to think that, if/when my shitty situation improves, that I might have rewarded myself with Reason12. But when that time comes, I'll be up for $199. For today, ReasonStudios could offer flash $30 sale, and that's still out of reach.

[Proboscis]

But even if you purchased a DAW with lots of toys, I'm guessing you'd still want to reach for a Pulveriser or SSL EQ from time to time...

haha, not Pulverizer, I never use it. But I would 100% still love to cross-integrate plenty of other stock + third party Reason RE devices into a new environment. So I agree with your sentiment.

You've inspired the rest of my day, Raymond. While I have the the active R+ trial, out of interest I am going to try RRP out in Reaper now

[Neo]

This is a great example of some calm and collected thoughts and criticisms about Reason 12, the price change, etc.

Good rant/shared thoughts.

[bquimby]

I have used Reason since 3. I am now on 11, and though I can afford the upgrade to 12, consequent to this upgrade price increase, I have determined that 11 is the last Reason Studios product I will pay for.

When the subscription model was introduced, I suspected that there would be some kind of attempt by Reason Studios to "encourage" permanent license users to move towards subscription, and here, it seems, is their strategy. I would now expect the permanent licensing model for Reason to disappear within the next 2-3 years (perhaps sooner). I will not subscribe, since I do not see subscription models for core productivity software as being viable for non-professional users, i.e. people who are hobbyists and thus not able to write off the subscription cost as a business expense. This is for many reasons, but chiefly a) if one's circumstances change, and one can no longer afford the subscription, one effectively loses access to one's creations in their original form, and also (in this case) to devices native to the application for which one has additionally paid, and b) the subscription price can be increased at will by the vendor, and one's only recourse if one is unhappy with such increases is to end up in the same situation as with a), which seems coercive to me.

I am fortunate to have another DAW to use (Cubase) , but I have always found Reason to be both intuitive to use, and very flexible in many ways. It's a shame.

As an aside, I was not aware until now that the company had brought in private equity funding, but, having worked in the financial services sector for over two decades now, and having seen similar shifts in revenue strategy in other companies acquired by investors, the changes in Reason Studios of the last few years now make more sense to me. Investors like that are interested only in doing the minimal required to improve the bottom line before divesting. They don't care in the slightest about the quality of the products made by the businesses they invest in, or about the experience of the people who use those products, nor even about improving those products, save only in the case that such factors increase revenue. If they make decisions over the time of their ownership that mean the business will ultimately tank five minutes after they divest, that's fine. I make no ethical judgement with that observation - it's just how the investment business works. So I'll be academically interested to see how the next few years pan out for Reason. But I won't have a dog in the race any more...

[Crumbfort]

Sooo yeah, this definitely rubs me the wrong way. I do music for a living, and have used Reason since version 3. I don't enjoy being pushed into updating to 12 before the price goes up top $200. I will never subscribe as I already own SO many rack extensions (also, I don't do music software subs, ever). Yes, they're trying to push people towards their sub model, but, ugh.

Also, there have been reports of 12 crashing a lot in Reaper on W10 (which I use). Now I have to decide if I'm going to update in the HOPES that this will be fixed somewhat promptly, which is never a wise course of action.

Salty.png (437.88 KiB) Viewed 2547 times

[AttenuationHz]

I wouldn't encourage anyone to upgrade because of a ticking clock of a price increase. Anyone doing so is only playing into RS hands and falling for their BS making it much harder for others. It is a game of attrition they're playing with users, break them down to a point were there is enough on board that they convince the others that it is beneficial to upgrade before the price gets increased.

I would highly recommend nobody upgrades until you have all your information. There is a possibility of using reward points to get a Reason Upgrade and a possible sale in November (reward points with sale may not be possible, either one or the other I think, but that too is being looked at) buying now or before November makes little to no sense. By all means do what is best for yourself! But make that decision based on facts not recommendations.

[polysix]

For me, reason was the only DAW I worked with for many years and which I found to be unrivaled. I cannot judge whether 199 € are justified or necessary. But for me there are enough other alternatives today that I find even better. An upgrade for 199 € is just too much for me. And reason + is out of the question at all. To bind me more and more?
That just doesn't appeal to me anymore and doesn't give me enough for my money.

[raymondh]

I would strongly encourage you to upgrade before the price increase.
the R11 Reason Rack Plug In really works well, and it will 'unlock' Reason for you in whatever DAW you decide to use.

Warning: 'Poor me' rant start:

Not an option, either now or in the foreseeable future, regardless of the price increase. I turned 50 two days ago, I'm unemployed, live alone with no family, savings have long ago vanished, under pandemic isolation, unable to cover my rent, and rely on a church charity service to obtain food. I'm in rather bad health that I can't get treatment for, and I wonder every day when my electricity is going to be shut off.

/rant

It's an interesting take you've offered though, about RRP. While I find the half-baked 'hi-res' rollout to be completely unsatisfactory, none of that should impact hosting the RRP in another DAW. My gripes elsewhere are round the low-res browser menu...and as I'm noticing today, the blurry transport bar.

And while the pain of learning a new DAW is daunting, I do have a copy of Reaper, and have previously put in about 50 hours of use over a couple of years for non-music editing gigs (and have taken some deep-dives into Reaper's archaic customization parameters). So the transition won't be quite as challenging as it could be for a first-time Reaper novice.

It would have been nice to think that, if/when my shitty situation improves, that I might have rewarded myself with Reason12. But when that time comes, I'll be up for $199. For today, ReasonStudios could offer flash $30 sale, and that's still out of reach.

I'm sorry to hear about your personal situation mate. Firstly, happy big birthday!!!! My thoughts are with you and wish you the very best.

On Reaper, I was completely lost with it initially, and would have given up with it if it weren't for the brilliant tutorial videos, Reaper Mania and also the Reaper Blog. Reaper Mania has a Reaper 6 series that is worth watching completely. Not only do the videos demystify Reaper, they're quite inspiring too. Maybe you're already past that point having invested 50 hrs!

[raymondh]

But even if you purchased a DAW with lots of toys, I'm guessing you'd still want to reach for a Pulveriser or SSL EQ from time to time...

haha, not Pulverizer, I never use it. But I would 100% still love to cross-integrate plenty of other stock + third party Reason RE devices into a new environment. So I agree with your sentiment.

You've inspired the rest of my day, Raymond. While I have the the active R+ trial, out of interest I am going to try RRP out in Reaper now

That's great, I'm happy about that

Cheers!

[avasopht]

I would strongly encourage you to upgrade before the price increase.
the R11 Reason Rack Plug In really works well, and it will 'unlock' Reason for you in whatever DAW you decide to use.

Warning: 'Poor me' rant start:

Not an option, either now or in the foreseeable future, regardless of the price increase. I turned 50 two days ago, I'm unemployed, live alone with no family, savings have long ago vanished, under pandemic isolation, unable to cover my rent, and rely on a church charity service to obtain food. I'm in rather bad health that I can't get treatment for, and I wonder every day when my electricity is going to be shut off.

/rant

It's an interesting take you've offered though, about RRP. While I find the half-baked 'hi-res' rollout to be completely unsatisfactory, none of that should impact hosting the RRP in another DAW. My gripes elsewhere are round the low-res browser menu...and as I'm noticing today, the blurry transport bar.

And while the pain of learning a new DAW is daunting, I do have a copy of Reaper, and have previously put in about 50 hours of use over a couple of years for non-music editing gigs (and have taken some deep-dives into Reaper's archaic customization parameters). So the transition won't be quite as challenging as it could be for a first-time Reaper novice.

It would have been nice to think that, if/when my shitty situation improves, that I might have rewarded myself with Reason12. But when that time comes, I'll be up for $199. For today, ReasonStudios could offer flash $30 sale, and that's still out of reach.

The blurriness should be sorted out eventually ...

...however, this is partially dependent on your GPUs 3D acceleration capabilities and settings.

An i5 should be fine - this is the sort of workload they're made for, but these types of graphical glitches, when they do show up unexpectedly will just take a little extra time to address because there are so many different GPUs with unique environments (e.g. power-saving settings and conditions and temperature considerations) as well as user GPU acceleration preferences that can never really be known ahead of time.

I'm not making excuses or taking any sides, this is just from my own personal experience writing code for GPUs (and some of the workarounds I've come across).

Anyways, check your PM, I've found something I think you'd like

[whitewolfmusic]

This is a great example of some calm and collected thoughts and criticisms about Reason 12, the price change, etc.

This one I just found also is a great insight into WHY people who grew with Reason since the early versions may be disappointed by the last few updates. The guy explains it quite well, and it could be interesting to hear for some Reason Studios staff. After watching this, I realize that one thing I would love to see is a large push from Reason Studios to get many high quality VST plugins and their manufacturers over to the Rack Extension format. Because the original vision of having everything well integrated remains a great idea, and I love the RE format. It's just that so far, mostly only indie developers put some mediocre stuff in there. But I want the powerful tools from iZotope, Native Instruments, Arturia, Waves, etc. as well-made Rack Extensions. It is a much better format than VST, because of the central and great distribution, the integration and unified interface design language. If we'd get much more of these beloved plugins as RE and a UI overhaul with DAW improvements, Reason itself would finally feel again like its original vision would grow and stay intact.

[joeyluck]

So did the person in the last video figure out how to update REs to hi-res?

[whitewolfmusic]

So did the person in the last video figure out how to update REs to hi-res?

Yes, one of the top comments is that he learned syncing REs will do it.

[Melody303]

so far, mostly only indie developers put some amazing stuff in there

Fixed that for you.

[Melody303]

This one I just found also is a great insight into WHY people who grew with Reason since the early versions may be disappointed by the last few updates. The guy explains it quite well

I just wasted half an hour listening to that nonsense.
He couldn't even do a minute or two of research to get his facts straight?
The Combinator came out in Reason 3, not 2.5.
Record was integrated into Reason 6, not 8/9.
Rack Extensions came in 6.5, not in 9.
VST integration came in 9.5.
If you need 4 instances of Thor to come out with a "fat" sound, you don't know how to design sounds. I manage on one Subtractor (the synth we had back in Reason 1).

And that whole argument at the end about the problem being that there's too many developers and too many producers? My god. I can't even.

[Proboscis]

I just wasted half an hour listening to that nonsense.

I only stayed for the swearing.

Had to laugh at around 7:20, when he talks about the new Combinator

"I don't even know what the fuck I'm looking at"

.....On a stock, standard R12 Combinator, identical in appearance to the previous one, but for two relocated buttons.

[Faastwalker]

I just wasted half an hour listening to that nonsense.

I only stayed for the swearing.

Had to laugh at around 7:20, when he talks about the new Combinator

"I don't even know what the fuck I'm looking at"

.....On a stock, standard R12 Combinator, identical in appearance to the previous one, but for two relocated buttons.

Just shy of 34 minutes of whining bollox! Some people will just never be satisfied with anything

[PhillipOrdonez]

This is a great example of some calm and collected thoughts and criticisms about Reason 12, the price change, etc.

This one I just found also is a great insight into WHY people who grew with Reason since the early versions may be disappointed by the last few updates. The guy explains it quite well, and it could be interesting to hear for some Reason Studios staff. After watching this, I realize that one thing I would love to see is a large push from Reason Studios to get many high quality VST plugins and their manufacturers over to the Rack Extension format. Because the original vision of having everything well integrated remains a great idea, and I love the RE format. It's just that so far, mostly only indie developers put some mediocre stuff in there. But I want the powerful tools from iZotope, Native Instruments, Arturia, Waves, etc. as well-made Rack Extensions. It is a much better format than VST, because of the central and great distribution, the integration and unified interface design language. If we'd get much more of these beloved plugins as RE and a UI overhaul with DAW improvements, Reason itself would finally feel again like its original vision would grow and stay intact.

The plosives...

[Melody303]

The Combinator came out in Reason 3, not 2.5.
Record was integrated into Reason 6, not 8/9.
Rack Extensions came in 6.5, not in 9.
VST integration came in 9.5.
If you need 4 instances of Thor to come out with a "fat" sound, you don't know how to design sounds. I manage on one Subtractor (the synth we had back in Reason 1).

I commented that in reply to the video. He replied: "If you are knit picking every little update I mentioned you clearly missed the entire point of the video. And I Assure you that will never be on my level with sound design. How many people are buying your presets and synths?"

[EnochLight]

I commented that in reply to the video. He replied: "If you are knit picking every little update I mentioned you clearly missed the entire point of the video. And I Assure you that will never be on my level with sound design. How many people are buying your presets and synths?"

Sounds like someone's fragile male ego got bruised in that thread!