Reason Studios shares their roadmap (September 7, 2021)

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rootwheel
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Post 08 Nov 2021

guitfnky wrote:
08 Nov 2021
how can you do that if you don’t have Reason or a subscription already? I’m asking because I honestly don’t know.
I think they've hidden all the download links now. They've deliberately made it nigh-on-impossible to find download links to even try 'demo mode'. I think the only way to download now is to create an account and enter payment details first - at which point you don't need demo mode because you'll be on a Reason+ trial.

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EnochLight
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Post 08 Nov 2021

guitfnky wrote:
08 Nov 2021
how can you do that if you don’t have Reason or a subscription already? I’m asking because I honestly don’t know. if you can, that’s…something—
It's literally at the link of the post you quoted.
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guitfnky
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Post 08 Nov 2021

Pepin wrote:
08 Nov 2021
EnochLight wrote:
08 Nov 2021


Why? I mean, again - I'm sure I'll be called an "apologist" :lol: but there is a certain level of aptitude required for buying and trying stuff. If it were me, and I subbed to try for $1 but at the end of the day, decided I wanted to buy a perpetual for $499, unless I have dementia I'd most certainly cancel my sub after buying it outright. If I forgot I subbed that easily, then I have bigger problems to worry about!
You can blame users who fall into this trap all you want, but the trap wouldn't exist at all if RS didn't proactively create it.

It's user hostile design if you funnel prospective customers toward a trial for a product they don't want and then charge them for it even after they buy the product they did want from the beginning. RS could easily have linked the demo version on the shop page for Reason 12. That would have been the user friendly approach.

Yes, consumers should be careful when shopping, but that doesn't excuse companies who actively take advantage of consumers who aren't.
👆🏼👆🏼👆🏼👆🏼👆🏼

exactly this.

it’d be one thing if RS were a brand new company, and this is how they came out of the gate with their brand new product, Reason. but they already had a perfectly fine system for people to demo the software—one that wasn’t consumer-unfriendly. they scrapped that and replaced it with one that actively is. that’s pretty boneheaded unless you’re more interested in $ at all costs than you are in doing right by your customers.
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guitfnky
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Post 08 Nov 2021

EnochLight wrote:
08 Nov 2021
guitfnky wrote:
08 Nov 2021
how can you do that if you don’t have Reason or a subscription already? I’m asking because I honestly don’t know. if you can, that’s…something—
It's literally at the link of the post you quoted.
fair enough. still end up at the same place though. having to jump through hoops to find that is still fundamentally less user-friendly than the transparent process in the past.
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DaveyG
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Post 08 Nov 2021

dvdrtldg wrote:
08 Nov 2021
Every now & then I check this thread, just to remind myself why I should never check this thread
Yeah, the subject is roadmap but it's turned into endless bickering about trials and demos. On most forums the mods would have stepped in and got the thread back on track but here they are part of the endless bickering!

rootwheel
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Post 08 Nov 2021

guitfnky wrote:
08 Nov 2021
they already had a perfectly fine system for people to demo the software—one that wasn’t consumer-unfriendly. they scrapped that and replaced it with one that actively is.
I hadn't thought of this but yes there is essentially no proper demo of perpetual license any more - just Reason+.

I've worked out that if you want an old fashioned 'demo mode', without making an account, you can download via the torrent links here: https://help.reasonstudios.com/hc/en-us ... BitTorrent but it's not particularly well documented anywhere that this is an option for customers new to the Reason platform.

I guess ultimately Reason Studios really only want Reason+ customers now. Sooner or later that probably will be the only option. I know they've tried to quash such talk in the past but I don't trust that to stand the test of time - and I don't trust in such a business decision to ever be on some road map that gets shared with the punters. I predict this will happen before Reason 13 and obviously there will be a big backlash but they'll carry on with it anyway because it's the only way they can now conceive of making the business viable to their investors...

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Creativemind
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Post 08 Nov 2021

orthodox wrote:
08 Nov 2021
Creativemind wrote:
08 Nov 2021


You pretty much summed it up but basically - so they can get your credit card details and also fingers crossed some people won't realise they have to manually stop it themselves and be charged a month's subscription so therefore makes them money they DEFINITELY wouldn't have had before. Even Dick Turpin wore a mask.

Some shady lawyer come up with as a way to dupe people legally say 10 years ago or more. "Let's put in the fine print that no-one reads (and obviously in lawyer speak probably) that the subscription will automatically roll over if you don't cancel it and think how many people we can legally con out of money before they realise, and it will be legal and there's nothing they can do about it.
What kind of person are you talking about who isn't aware of the automatic subscription deployment? One should be a complete idiot.

I even received an email 3 days before my card was charged, saying "Your Reason+ Trial is About to Expire.... Your trial will convert to a full-price subscription on May 22, 2021".
Good for you, you got an e-mail and you saw it. Well done sir. Good job you didn't like go away for a few days and left your phone at home or many other gazillion reasons you may not have seen it. Maybe you were in hospital, maybe you had a bereavement and weren't in the checking your e-mail mood. The fact of the matter is, is you shouldn't have to cancel it. Also, for me, my Reason e-mail's don't come into my e-mail account I use now. Haven't used it in 8 years. I started a new e-mail account and very rarely use my old one.
:reason:

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avasopht
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Post 08 Nov 2021

BriocheBaps wrote:
08 Nov 2021
Again I must ask what you hope this toxic pedantry will achieve?
Toxic pedantry according to who kiddo?

I've clearly explained the technical background and why it's important.

Unless you've got a substantial rebuttal beyond empty weasel words that carry no meaning beyond a cheap ad hominem, you've actually said nothing other than calling names.
---

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joeyluck
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Post 08 Nov 2021

DaveyG wrote:
08 Nov 2021
dvdrtldg wrote:
08 Nov 2021
Every now & then I check this thread, just to remind myself why I should never check this thread
Yeah, the subject is roadmap but it's turned into endless bickering about trials and demos. On most forums the mods would have stepped in and got the thread back on track but here they are part of the endless bickering!
I created a thread about the Reason demo mode and made it a sticky. I was hoping that would help.

Also, mods are too often accused of being fanboys who are trying to silence people when asking people to move on about a topic... I guess these small website changes are related to the topic. I'd rather have the one thread than several threads about each individual detail.

Popey
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Post 08 Nov 2021

Roadmap :lol:
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michael.jaye
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Post 08 Nov 2021

Popey wrote:
08 Nov 2021
Roadmap :lol:
Roadblock.

kbard
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Post 09 Nov 2021

joeyluck wrote:
08 Nov 2021
Yes Reason+ was originally 30 days for free, then 7 days for free, and now the first 30 days for $1.

So if you want to be able to open your saved projects, export audio, use the REs you've purchased you'll need to buy Reason. If you want that plus have access to all of the REs by Reason Studios, and access sound packs via Companion you would either need to subscribe to give Reason+ a spin for $1. It's unrestricted access to all of those features.

But Reason has always had a demo mode: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=7525554
Joey that's a bit hidden thing isn't it. Very cryptic. It assume that the user know this forum exist only to be able to follow what you posted. Many people don't know for this forum. I realized this when watching Reason youtube videos with Ryan. I don't think many potential users would know this forum exist and then it's seems a bit of a stretch to make account here, ask or search how to trial.

The way you did it and described is in that thread is awesome but it's a sort of a hack isn't it. Let's face it: another Siziph task just left to discourage free trial.

And from my understanding it's half solution not the way trial worked at all. With trial you were able to trial Reason and few REs as well. Now with your hack you can only trial Reason. I wonder what and how RE developers feel about this. Because I just realized that even that aspect now is crippled. No way to try Reason along with few REs someone might be interested to.

My question is - if this is intended way of trialing Reason 12 without credit card - why it isn't on their official page with a button saying "Trial".

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joeyluck
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Post 09 Nov 2021

kbard wrote:
09 Nov 2021
joeyluck wrote:
08 Nov 2021
Yes Reason+ was originally 30 days for free, then 7 days for free, and now the first 30 days for $1.

So if you want to be able to open your saved projects, export audio, use the REs you've purchased you'll need to buy Reason. If you want that plus have access to all of the REs by Reason Studios, and access sound packs via Companion you would either need to subscribe to give Reason+ a spin for $1. It's unrestricted access to all of those features.

But Reason has always had a demo mode: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=7525554
Joey that's a bit hidden thing isn't it. Very cryptic. It assume that the user know this forum exist only to be able to follow what you posted. Many people don't know for this forum. I realized this when watching Reason youtube videos with Ryan. I don't think many potential users would know this forum exist and then it's seems a bit of a stretch to make account here, ask or search how to trial.

The way you did it and described is in that thread is awesome but it's a sort of a hack isn't it. Let's face it: another Siziph task just left to discourage free trial.

And from my understanding it's half solution not the way trial worked at all. With trial you were able to trial Reason and few REs as well. Now with your hack you can only trial Reason. I wonder what and how RE developers feel about this. Because I just realized that even that aspect now is crippled. No way to try Reason along with few REs someone might be interested to.

My question is - if this is intended way of trialing Reason 12 without credit card - why it isn't on their official page with a button saying "Trial".
It's the way I demoed Reason initially and every new version up until Reason 8. Demo mode was the only way to try Reason before Reason 8.

Demo mode is not a hack, but Reason Studios could do a better job mentioning it.

And like I said, perhaps it will be easier for them to distinguish it for users now that Reason+ no longer has a trial. Some may say they no longer have a "free trial", but if you pay money, even $1, that's not a trial. That's purchasing a month for a discount.

kbard
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Post 09 Nov 2021

joeyluck wrote:
09 Nov 2021


Demo mode is not a hack, but Reason Studios could do a better job mentioning it.

And like I said, perhaps it will be easier for them to distinguish it for users now that Reason+ no longer has a trial. Some may say they no longer have a "free trial", but if you pay money, even $1, that's not a trial. That's purchasing a month for a discount.
I used word "hack" which is a wrong. I wanted to say in the context of this situstion that user need to know a lof of cryptic factors in order to try the software.

And even if they do realize existence of your thread somehow - it's a lot to do just to demo software. And this way it isn't what it used to be, it isn't fully working at all. Demo is not what free trial used to be.

As I said 1$ initially is not the problem. Really it's small amounnt. The problem is making people onboard. I explained it well in previous post - sorry my english is bad. My point is many people without CC won't be able to try it anymore and then act accordingly.

I have yet to see any DAW company requiring credit card in order to fully test their software for a limited time.

It feels like they are so desperate to meet numbers in dollars.

That's just my speculation and opinion not the way how things may be.

Have a great day.

Eddi-16
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Post 09 Nov 2021

Back to topic please.

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SJLx84
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Post 09 Nov 2021

avasopht wrote:
08 Nov 2021
BriocheBaps wrote:
08 Nov 2021
Again I must ask what you hope this toxic pedantry will achieve?
Toxic pedantry according to who kiddo?

I've clearly explained the technical background and why it's important.

Unless you've got a substantial rebuttal beyond empty weasel words that carry no meaning beyond a cheap ad hominem, you've actually said nothing other than calling names.
Accuses of ad hominem, calls me (a 37 year old man) "kiddo" in response to having their toxic behaviour called out.

I rarely come to this forum but it's one of the most toxic messageboards on the Internet. The mods need to start shutting this type of nonsense down harder. Jesus christ.
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EnochLight
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Post 09 Nov 2021

BriocheBaps wrote:
09 Nov 2021
I rarely come to this forum but it's one of the most toxic messageboards on the Internet. The mods need to start shutting this type of nonsense down harder. Jesus christ.
Clearly you haven't spent any time over at KVR or Gearslutz (now Gear"space"). For what it's worth, we have shut down a lot of crap over the past several months, and banned more abusers than we can keep track of. It's a never-ending battle, I'm afraid - especially as Reason's popularity has skyrocketed since going RRP.

That said, I don't agree that this is "one of the most toxic messageboards on the Internet". For the most part, users are just expressing their frustration at how things have been going the past year. You may not agree with a lot of what is being said, or how it's phrased, but that doesn't make it any more "toxic pedantic" than any other place on the Internet. Hell, I don't agree with a lot of what is said, but we're a forum - people are going to express opinions - simple as that. If you want an echo chamber of positivity in things only you like, maybe a Facebook group would be a better fit for you.
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avasopht
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Post 09 Nov 2021

BriocheBaps wrote:
09 Nov 2021
avasopht wrote:
08 Nov 2021
Unless you've got a substantial rebuttal beyond empty weasel words that carry no meaning beyond a cheap ad hominem, you've actually said nothing other than calling names.
Accuses of ad hominem, calls me (a 37 year old man) "kiddo" in response to having their toxic behaviour called out.

I rarely come to this forum but it's one of the most toxic messageboards on the Internet. The mods need to start shutting this type of nonsense down harder. Jesus christ.
Sure don't sound like a substantial rebuttal to me :thumbdown:

You tend to get more friendly responses from others when you don't lead with accusations, insults, ad-hominem, and name calling.

Tbh, I had no idea how old you are until you told me. My apologies sincerely for offending you about the whole age thing.

So let's get back to the topic at hand. There's no use in quarreling eh.
---

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Billy+
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Post 09 Nov 2021

Sorted :thumbup:
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Heater
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Post 09 Nov 2021

Billy+ wrote:
09 Nov 2021
Sorted :thumbup:

IMG_2870.PNG
LOL. Seems about right.

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guitfnky
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Post 09 Nov 2021

BriocheBaps wrote:
09 Nov 2021
avasopht wrote:
08 Nov 2021


Toxic pedantry according to who kiddo?

I've clearly explained the technical background and why it's important.

Unless you've got a substantial rebuttal beyond empty weasel words that carry no meaning beyond a cheap ad hominem, you've actually said nothing other than calling names.
Accuses of ad hominem, calls me (a 37 year old man) "kiddo" in response to having their toxic behaviour called out.

I rarely come to this forum but it's one of the most toxic messageboards on the Internet. The mods need to start shutting this type of nonsense down harder. Jesus christ.
if this is one of the most toxic messageboards you've ever encountered, you should consider yourself lucky. 😅
I write good music for good people

https://slow-robot.com/
https://slowrobot.bandcamp.com/

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Creativemind
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Post 09 Nov 2021

guitfnky wrote:
09 Nov 2021
BriocheBaps wrote:
09 Nov 2021


Accuses of ad hominem, calls me (a 37 year old man) "kiddo" in response to having their toxic behaviour called out.

I rarely come to this forum but it's one of the most toxic messageboards on the Internet. The mods need to start shutting this type of nonsense down harder. Jesus christ.
if this is one of the most toxic messageboards you've ever encountered, you should consider yourself lucky. 😅
I agree. It's relatively pleasant on this forum. Has the occasional moment but KVR and Gearspace can be a lot worse, a lot.
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plaamook
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Post 10 Nov 2021

Creativemind wrote:
09 Nov 2021
guitfnky wrote:
09 Nov 2021


if this is one of the most toxic messageboards you've ever encountered, you should consider yourself lucky. 😅
I agree. It's relatively pleasant on this forum. Has the occasional moment but KVR and Gearspace can be a lot worse, a lot.
The current state of things round here isn't a great indicator. Lots of frustrated people around for obvious reasons.
It's not usually like this.
Whatever 'this' means.
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Threpus
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Post 10 Nov 2021

I just want a stable copy of Reason. I asked support if I (being an owner of 12) could have access to the last version of 11 until they get this sorted out. I was told that they "no longer support" 11- which is a circular argument: they're saying they don't deal with 11 because they don't deal with 11.

I went more than 3 years without a single crash- and I use Reason for hours a day- to experiencing regular crashes with 12. I found the installer for 10 on a backup drive (which is what I was running prior to my "upgrade" to 12) and have been using that for a couple of days now- and I've got that snappy, stable experience again.

What justification can there be for denying people a stable copy? Shouldn't the customers get to decide whether or not to forgo new features if it suits their needs? If it means that projects from later versions won't open, or that you can't use these silly sound packs, or whatever else, fine- just make it known and give people a choice. We are owed that much.

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Ottostrom
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Post 10 Nov 2021

Threpus wrote:
10 Nov 2021
I just want a stable copy of Reason. I asked support if I (being an owner of 12) could have access to the last version of 11 until they get this sorted out. I was told that they "no longer support" 11- which is a circular argument: they're saying they don't deal with 11 because they don't deal with 11.

I went more than 3 years without a single crash- and I use Reason for hours a day- to experiencing regular crashes with 12. I found the installer for 10 on a backup drive (which is what I was running prior to my "upgrade" to 12) and have been using that for a couple of days now- and I've got that snappy, stable experience again.

What justification can there be for denying people a stable copy? Shouldn't the customers get to decide whether or not to forgo new features if it suits their needs? If it means that projects from later versions won't open, or that you can't use these silly sound packs, or whatever else, fine- just make it known and give people a choice. We are owed that much.
I don't know how you worded your request to support and I don't know how this is a reoccurring problem but here are the download links to all versions which you can use if you own R12:
https://www.reasonstudios.com/en/reason/updates

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