Is there a Reason user "personality"?

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Jagwah
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Post 23 May 2021

scotward57 wrote:
23 May 2021
But by and large, there's this arrogant vibe about Reason not being music software for grown ups...
The exact same thing was 'vibed' about FL Studio for the longest time.

It would be a different story if Reason had simplified the music making process for kids and rappers so music can be generated very easily with a few button pushes, but it remains that Reason is a professional DAW and those opinions about Reason from random forumites are just that. I remember Reason being touted as an overly complicated DAW because of the cabling system. It's just people ignorantly jumping on a bandwagon as they obviously do not understand what they are talking about, so bully for them.

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joeyluck
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Post 23 May 2021

I found it funny that in the past in forums and discussions like Sonic Talk, they would make jokes about Reason users being elitists... And that knowing how hardware is pacthed and routed was prerequisite, even though the software has always does most all of it for you unless you want to experiment. And then the world exploded with Eurorack and modular synth software/plugins, and those same people are all about it.

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motuscott
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Post 23 May 2021

chaosroyale wrote:
23 May 2021
"Reason can load all my files from 2001 that I am still working on"
That's cold
The Now Sound of MIDI Thru 🧂

chaosroyale
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Post 23 May 2021

You're making a really good point here - FL Studio was looked down on as just a toy, even more than Reason.

But now, FL Studio is name dropped by massive hitmakers, while Reason still has the same reputation. In the real world, away from fanboys and forums, Musicians I work with are ALWAYS surprised if I talk about doing something in Reason- they all assume I use Live.

But I don't know why. Maybe part of it is marketing - Reason never really pushes itself as a serious professional tool in advertising. It's all "Reason is FUN!!" not "introducing the most cutting-edge tools for producing", i dunno....

Jagwah wrote:
23 May 2021
scotward57 wrote:
23 May 2021
But by and large, there's this arrogant vibe about Reason not being music software for grown ups...
The exact same thing was 'vibed' about FL Studio for the longest time.

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Quarmat
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Location: Europe

Post 24 May 2021

We are animals, we have pattern recognition scripts as well as face recognition scripts hardcoded into our brains.

Reason has many faces. Subtractor with his clean blue and grey face, Malstrom with her green mane, Kong and his bumpy pads and pale yellow tint, are all things we can relate to, know as friends, spot from miles away or amidst a huge crowd. They are alive.
Other software do not have this feeling. Loading a pop-up window with a vst instrument it's not the same: VST gui has its own style, might have or have not knobs, faders etc. It will never be the same as firing up Reason and find its fauna right on the place you remembered it was.

Reason users are human, alive. They feel their DAW like the hunter-gatherer know his bow, feels the forest, knows every rock and tree, can hear a deer from a distance.

You can't have this in ableton, come on. We all know that.

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guitfnky
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Post 24 May 2021

Quarmat wrote:
24 May 2021
We are animals, we have pattern recognition scripts as well as face recognition scripts hardcoded into our brains.

Reason has many faces. Subtractor with his clean blue and grey face, Malstrom with her green mane, Kong and his bumpy pads and pale yellow tint, are all things we can relate to, know as friends, spot from miles away or amidst a huge crowd. They are alive.
Other software do not have this feeling. Loading a pop-up window with a vst instrument it's not the same: VST gui has its own style, might have or have not knobs, faders etc. It will never be the same as firing up Reason and find its fauna right on the place you remembered it was.

Reason users are human, alive. They feel their DAW like the hunter-gatherer know his bow, feels the forest, knows every rock and tree, can hear a deer from a distance.

You can't have this in ableton, come on. We all know that.
I feel every bit as connected to the music making experience in Ableton as I do in Reason. it doesn't feel less tactile or immediate. it's just as inspiring, and enjoyable as Reason (not to mention less frustrating, in some really fundamental ways). it feels just as alive. it just looks very different.

bangaio
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Post 24 May 2021

EdGrip wrote:
23 May 2021
It's probably also significant that Reason grew out of Rebirth, which was basically an Acid/dance music/X0X emulator for junglists and ravers. That's its real roots.
I think you will struggle to find junglists who wanted 808, 909 or 303 devcies. An EMU ultra or AKAI S3000XL maybe but not acid lines. Other than that :thumbup:

Tinnitus
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Post 24 May 2021

Popey wrote:
23 May 2021
I am not sure if you can lump reason users with a certain personality as the reality is everyone is different however what I would say is that their is a lot of love for reason and this can cause people to be defensive of it and feel upset when it is criticised.

As for a cult? No way just people that love reason (even those moaning about lack of features do so as they want reason to be better for their own personal needs).
This perfectly reflects what I've been reading in my relatively short time with Reason.
People are defensive because they passionately love the product and are concerned that it may turn into something else ( eg R+ sub only or just a RRP with the sequencer stagnating or being sold off when the investors want their return (eg to Waves)).

This is mainly due to the perceived lack of engagement/acknowledgement by RS with their user community ( although this feels like it is slowly improving).

That defensive behaviour can be misconstrued as cultish behaviour.

mravdirato
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Post 24 May 2021

scotward57 wrote:
23 May 2021
I've read some other forums like KVR and what other folks are saying about Reason 12. Almost universally, there is a nastolgia about and a recognition that Reason played a huge role in music production at a time when music software felt like working on an Excel spreadsheet.

But by and large, there's this arrogant vibe about Reason not being music software for grown ups and that the typical Reason user lives in a cult. I guess we just mindlessly obey whatever Reason Studios Inc. tells us to think and buy. I've heard similar things about so-called Apple fanboys.

I personally find that notion silly. I really enjoy the hardware rack paradigm, but don't wish to be burdened with the clutter or expense of owing too much hardware. Am I not the target customer for Reason Studios Inc?

Would you consider that a personality issue or belonging to a cult? I don't. Actually I'm more offended by users who think Reason should be more like other DAWs. But I digress.

Is there a Reason user "type" that I'm not aware of?
".....not being music software for grown-ups."

YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING ME. DID YOU FLIP THE RACK AROUND FOR THEM??? XD

(That works for me every time XD)

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arnigretar
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Post 24 May 2021

Point is... a lot of people will say something about something. And post that something on some forums. Even though they know nothing about it. I remember hearing this from the beginning. This opinion was heard even though props changed their system with Record. Still this rumour echos on. But most people who know how it is to write music and/or release music know what's up. Reason is great for many. It's different then other platforms and that maybe appears appealing to some. And there isn't a user personality of Reason anymore. In the beginning most of the users were making electronica music. It came to life from ReBirth and grew from there. Today - and many moons ago - users have been using Reason to make any kind of music. Maybe it started when Record came on, maybe sooner. But the Reason tracks that were shared on the old propellerheads.se forum back in the day were almost all in the field of some genre of electronica. So the user personality back then was just the local techno nerd composing inside the rack. At least to me. Of course there could be many on here who don't connect to that. Nor with electronica. Anyway, I don't think there is a Reason user personality. Like I don't think there is a Ableton Live user personality. We are different and make all kinds of music today. And we all have different opinions! Just looking through this forum regularly clears that for me! :D

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Enlightenspeed
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Post 24 May 2021

scotward57 wrote:
23 May 2021
But by and large, there's this arrogant vibe about Reason not being music software for grown ups and that the typical Reason user lives in a cult.
This attitude didn't start with "Reason Vs DAWs", it was a hardware vs software kinda thing at first, but because Reason was front and centre of the software side for so long, it ended up as principle target when all the hardware people started moving to a more rounded software dependence; prior to that they only ever tended to have Cubase doing the advanced MIDI stuff. The arguments have morphed over the years and they've never really became any closer to the truth.

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deigm
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Post 24 May 2021

scotward57 wrote:
23 May 2021
I guess we just mindlessly obey whatever Reason Studios Inc. tells us to think and buy. I've heard similar things about so-called Apple fanboys.
I use reason because I like it. I must be brainwashed. :shock:

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Ahornberg
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Post 24 May 2021

deigm wrote:
24 May 2021
scotward57 wrote:
23 May 2021
I guess we just mindlessly obey whatever Reason Studios Inc. tells us to think and buy. I've heard similar things about so-called Apple fanboys.
I use reason because I like it. I must be brainwashed. :shock:
I use reason because I'm used to use it. Maybe I'm brainwashed too ... :wtf:

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adfielding
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Post 24 May 2021

scotward57 wrote:
23 May 2021
But by and large, there's this arrogant vibe about Reason not being music software for grown ups
I would hate to work with anyone who would look down on a person producing good quality results solely because of the tools they choose to use. Funnily enough, I have never ever worked with anyone like that. Interesting how that works.

edit: on the flip side, I don't really understand blind loyalty to products, either. I frequently dip into other DAWs and venture outside of Reason, doesn't mean I like Reason any less - I just prefer using different tools for different jobs. A change is also a nice thing from time to time as well.

scotward57
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Post 01 Jun 2021

adfielding wrote:
24 May 2021
scotward57 wrote:
23 May 2021
But by and large, there's this arrogant vibe about Reason not being music software for grown ups
I would hate to work with anyone who would look down on a person producing good quality results solely because of the tools they choose to use. Funnily enough, I have never ever worked with anyone like that. Interesting how that works.

edit: on the flip side, I don't really understand blind loyalty to products, either. I frequently dip into other DAWs and venture outside of Reason, doesn't mean I like Reason any less - I just prefer using different tools for different jobs. A change is also a nice thing from time to time as well.
All excellent points! Thank you for your perspective!

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plaamook
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Post 02 Jun 2021

I personally get a little kick out of making and selling music and sound design on a platform that some pepole snub their noses up at.
At times I have seen what man thought he saw.

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Hazel
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Post 02 Jun 2021

Personally, from my experience, people whom have a complaint about someone else's ways of creating things often times don't have much to show for what they have done themselves, albeit for maybe a bunch of loops to jam on. It is what it is. If you are entirely completing projects, then I don't see what the problem would be. There is a human trait to have posturing and gatekeeping I suppose, but whatever... I don't think it makes a lot of difference in the end. If you've got a thing going, and it works, why not do it?

kitekrazy
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Post 04 Jun 2021

I don't think it is any different with other DAWs. It's the pros who don't suffer from insecurity issues. Pro Tools use to be inferior to other DAWs coming late to 64bit. They are use to the workflow and for them time is money.

Every DAW has its fanboys. I still remember a guy getting torched over Sonar 6 because he didn't like the GUI and was moving on.

The one that gets annoying is FL users think Image Line is going to go under because of their lifetime updates despite the developers letting them know they are set financially.

As some mature you don't hear such things as "don't be a noob and use this DAW or that DAW sucks or it's a toy.

I've collected a lot DAWs and the one used a lot by the professional industry is Cubase and I don't really care for it.

EdGrip
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Post 04 Jun 2021

The one that gets annoying is FL users think Image Line is going to go under because of their lifetime updates despite the developers letting them know they are set financially.
Ah mate, not a week goes by on this forum without someone declaring "RS are in trouble" because they released a new synth or whatever.

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integerpoet
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Post 04 Jun 2021

kitekrazy wrote:
04 Jun 2021
It's the pros who don't suffer from insecurity issues. Pro Tools use to be inferior to other DAWs coming late to 64bit. They are use to the workflow and for them time is money.
I know a guy who does scoring work in Hollywood and loathes Pro Tools but feels stuck with it because everybody else in the industry assumes it. He says his view is not uncommon; PT is apparently the Microsoft Word of audio engineering for film production though it gives few joy. I am not sure this comment is actually relevant to the thread, but evidently once I get started typing I am going to hit the Submit button regardless.

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selig
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Post 04 Jun 2021

integerpoet wrote:
04 Jun 2021
kitekrazy wrote:
04 Jun 2021
It's the pros who don't suffer from insecurity issues. Pro Tools use to be inferior to other DAWs coming late to 64bit. They are use to the workflow and for them time is money.
I know a guy who does scoring work in Hollywood and loathes Pro Tools but feels stuck with it because everybody else in the industry assumes it. He says his view is not uncommon; PT is apparently the Microsoft Word of audio engineering for film production though it gives few joy. I am not sure this comment is actually relevant to the thread, but evidently once I get started typing I am going to hit the Submit button regardless.
I've always seen Pro Tools as being for engineers, not arrangers/composers/musicians/etc. That's where it's still popular as far as I am aware from my friends who are still using it 24/7 in Nashville. And if I'm tracking a band, editing, or automating moves on a big mix, I prefer it hands down.
But for MAKING music, I've been a Reason head for almost 20 years now and. Though I was a Pro Tools geek for 20 years I never used it to create songs (I used Studio Vision with my PT hardware in the 1990s, and Reason from 2003 on).

As far as what I see, the majority Reason "personality" is a creative type first and a technical type second whereas Pro Tools is popular with the opposite types - in my experience. ;)
Selig Audio, LLC

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integerpoet
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Post 04 Jun 2021

selig wrote:
04 Jun 2021
As far as what I see, the majority Reason "personality" is a creative type first and a technical type second whereas Pro Tools is popular with the opposite types - in my experience. ;)
That explains my friend, then. He writes and performs most everything himself. And he loves Reason. But he feels stuck in Pro Tools jail due to file formats and other such issues. I haven't spoken to him about this in a while but I bet he loves that RRP is now available as AAX. (I imagine he has to bounce all MIDI to audio before sharing a project anyway because I can't imagine anybody could stand to never use any non-stock plugin no matter how good their base DAW is.)

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plaamook
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Post 05 Jun 2021

I almost went to study sound design at NFTS in England (got in but declined) and everything there for SD was PT. I like pt but I’m not interested in the cost and price structure subscription crap. I’d only consider it if reason proper shits the bed.
The way I work is way more in line w SD that composition in the usual sense so it suits me but I’ve heard similar complaints about its limitations from a composing point of view.
At times I have seen what man thought he saw.

bangaio
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Joined: 18 Jan 2015

Post 05 Jun 2021

EdGrip wrote:
23 May 2021
It's probably also significant that Reason grew out of Rebirth, which was basically an Acid/dance music/X0X emulator for junglists and ravers. That's its real roots.
I can't think of a single "jungliest" from the late 90s who would have dreamt of using Rebirth but you are right - Reason was just a massively flexible rebirth that was jacked up to 11 or at least it was for me.

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plaamook
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Post 05 Jun 2021

I’ve had less snobbish remarks about using Reason than people just scratching their heads about why anyone would put up with its limitations.
This was mostly pre audio and pre vst but still, the incomplete half asses implementations continue eh.
No one is gonna look at the sequencer and think it’s a serious pro-platform.
At times I have seen what man thought he saw.

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