Reason updates (11.3.7 / 11.3.8) and Reason+

[hurricane]

Perhaps Mattias and JP should take their, um discussion elsewhere. A public spat between a Product Manager and an RE Dev is not going to help anything.

Was going to say similar thing.
Sort things out in a private discussion guys.

Speak for yourself. I want to hear it.

[EdwardKiy]

Sort things out in a private discussion guys.

YOU go sort things out in a private discussion.

[guitfnky]

anyone who wants to see people air dirty laundry in public should get off the internet and go watch Desperate Housewives.

[EnochLight]

anyone who wants to see people air dirty laundry in public should get off the internet and go watch Desperate Housewives.

[TrueStory]

I haven't see this much backlash in the digital world since the Cyberpunk 2077 disappointment on last gen consoles. Perhaps it's too early to say but so far the Roaring 20's are not looking good.

[Ermitage]

Between me acquiring Maschine, Komplete Kontrol, Komplete package + Sounds subscription,

You cannot come out the gate with Reason+ at a $20 pricing model with your only marketing grab as a bunch of content and possibly some user requested features in v12. . . we're working on it.

There is absolutely no reason to compete against Arcade, Splice, Sounds, etc. I get it though. You want to create an ecosystem so for 20 bucks a person can cancel THOSE subscriptions and work in the Reason ecosystem alone. How many people do you think will do that just to have the same complaints the core users have a problem with.

I'm so confused why you didn't give Reason 12 out to people and raise the value of the DAW, THEN launched the subscription. Therefore the people who were drooling to try Reason instantly finally has a cheap barrier of entry to test the cool new upgraded R12. Instead this has turned into another wait and see game with yet the obvious conclusion of losing CORE users. Why would you taunt core users. WHY.

There's more to this story but ill leave it at that for now.

You can. There'll always be a large demographic of consumers who are uncritical and who never passed the marshmellow test. If you can effectively target those you will be able to sustain your business, even if your product is outdated.

Just look at the casino-fication of the gaming industry with their microtransactions bullshit.

But you know, that's their call. It's just unfortunate, given that they are sitting on a product that clearly has the potential to be the software equivalent of the TE OP-1, but has instead become an Akai Timbre Wolf.

[EdwardKiy]

anyone who wants to see people air dirty laundry in public should get off the internet and go watch Desperate Housewives.

Nobody wants to see any laundry here, just talk on main issues, but if there must be laundry flying around to accommodate this - then so be it

[sprinkles__]

Nobody wants to see any laundry here, just talk on main issues, but if there must be laundry flying around to accommodate this - then so be it

Knickers to the lot of you!

knickers.jpg (222.83 KiB) Viewed 3190 times

[hurricane]

anyone who wants to see people air dirty laundry in public should get off the internet and go watch Desperate Housewives.

Pffff....Reasontalk is WAY more entertaining thankyou

[miscend]

Mattias, there isn't any mention of you personally in JP's post. Regardless of his talk about Quartet, which is hard for an outsider to adjudicate, I feel he's just expressing frustration at the way Reason+ is turning out for us 3rd party developers. I don't want to attribute malice to anyone, I love Reason like many others here, but the way 3rd party developers have been relegated to being an afterthought on your site seems pretty dismissive of the contributions they've made over the years to the platform. If you want to interact with the community, you could do a lot of good if you just addressed the issues raised in a forthright manner. That would certainly help.

There's more to this, its an ongoing beef and there are other posts in older threads. JP has not been happy ever since Reason 11 included BBD style modulation effects because he believes that stops people buying his own BBD chorus RE. The implication being that RS shouldn't add new built-in devices in updates as this causes conflict with commercial 3rd party REs. I actually own Chenille and I think it's different enough to Quartet.

[r2101]

i like the positive vibe

on a serious note...this might have fared better if they made this some kind of embedded patch/refill shop directly inside reason. would have worked with the name too... instead of the subscription thing.

[EnochLight]

The implication being that RS shouldn't add new built-in devices in updates as this causes conflict with commercial 3rd party REs.

I'd rather not see RS stop creating useful RE's and stop providing them inside of stock Reason by default. I think both Europa and Grain took Reason to a higher level, and had they been sold separately as 100% optional RE's, Reason would be far worse off than it is today. There were some wavetable and granular offerings in the shop when Grain/Europa appeared in version 10, but I can't recall if those devs got pissed off or not. I can only imagine including both Europa and Grain were competing against their offerings, anyway.

[Loque]

The implication being that RS shouldn't add new built-in devices in updates as this causes conflict with commercial 3rd party REs.

I'd rather not see RS stop creating useful RE's and stop providing them inside of stock Reason by default. I think both Europa and Grain took Reason to a higher level, and had they been sold separately as 100% optional RE's, Reason would be far worse off than it is today. There were some wavetable and granular offerings in the shop when Grain/Europa appeared in version 10, but I can't recall if those devs got pissed off or not. I can only imagine including both Europa and Grain were competing against their offerings, anyway.

Yea, Grain is really good. Just give me some FM and stuff like that, blow up the mod matrix and i am a happy chap.

[MaMue]

what just happend...

[Auryn]

There's more to this, its an ongoing beef and there are other posts in older threads. JP has not been happy ever since Reason 11 included BBD style modulation effects because he believes that stops people buying his own BBD chorus RE.

The internet used to be for porn, now it seems to be for beefs. Actually I wasn't defending JP as much trying to get Mattias to see there's a pretty obvious reason why many of us are upset, and trying to get him to comment on the dismissive attitude RS seems to have towards 3rd party developers. Alas, he would rather produce some kind of nondescript word salad about emotions.

The implication being that RS shouldn't add new built-in devices in updates as this causes conflict with commercial 3rd party REs. I actually own Chenille and I think it's different enough to Quartet.

The implication you draw here doesn't really follow. I'd say that if RS develops built-in devices that are very close in concept or functionality to existing 3rd party RE's that they should at least be mindful that they are hurting the market for those 3rd parties. These are the same people who helped grow and populate the RE market to begin with with high quality, unique devices. So, in order not to appear as a bunch of ungrateful jackasses, it's probably better to do create something really different. It feels a bit like supermarkets that create their own, store-brand version of a succesful 3rd party product, and then shove away the original somewhere on the bottom shelf. It's a shameful practice.

[stratatonic]

i like the positive vibe

on a serious note...this might have fared better if they made this some kind of embedded patch/refill shop directly inside reason. would have worked with the name too... instead of the subscription thing.

"The Heart of Reason+ is the Sound Design Playground - The Rack.
The Rack can be used as plugin with any music production software.

You can also use it inside Reason in our...

Included DAW.jpeg (72.81 KiB) Viewed 3052 times

.
.
Semantics, I guess, but it really makes it seem like Reason standalone is just an afterthought now. Like, we're going to concentrate on Devices and the Rack and, well, if you want to continue on, we have this ok kind of sequencer that you can finish off to sound like you.

[Auryn]

I'd rather not see RS stop creating useful RE's and stop providing them inside of stock Reason by default. I think both Europa and Grain took Reason to a higher level, and had they been sold separately as 100% optional RE's, Reason would be far worse off than it is today. There were some wavetable and granular offerings in the shop when Grain/Europa appeared in version 10, but I can't recall if those devs got pissed off or not. I can only imagine including both Europa and Grain were competing against their offerings, anyway.

I thought Europa was too similar too Expanse, which was a hugely popular RE at the time. I think Blamsoft was pretty unhappy about it but it has been a while so I may be misremembering. I think these kind of dubious practices do drive away talented developers like Blamsoft. Who knows what other cool synths we would have gotten if RS hadn't gone down this path?

[easyrider]

Just bought the suite....didn’t own any of the REs...

[vertibration]

I look at it this way, a third party dev has a choice to sell on the Reason marketplace. Reason can release their own synths and effects. Those synths and effects could be similar. They arent the same. So if they arent the same, then I dont see the problem. If I were in their shoes, I would use the reason marketplace to help launch my own brand, and release VST's outside of the RE market place. If you only sell on the RE marketplace, you are putting all your eggs in one basket, and I am not sure that is a good business strategy

[hurricane]

dv.png (12.09 KiB) Viewed 3036 times

The comments under the Reason + video are also entertaining. Finally the people revolt. This is GREAT.

[sprinkles__]

what just happend...

manbun sops

[orthodox]

The comments under the Reason + video are also entertaining. Finally the people revolt. This is GREAT.

Revolve a thumb, you mean?
Also, I don't see anything great, as that does not help bring in new users.

[bxbrkrz]

Getting to 100 pages of people rage slowed down a bit. Very disappointing.

[hurricane]

Revolve a thumb, you mean?

Well, I don't think they can physically storm the Reason Studios Castle...

[sprinkles__]

Is reason† (rip) targeted at 8 year olds or what?