match tempo to existing audio clips

This forum is for discussing Reason. Questions, answers, ideas, and opinions... all apply.
User avatar
integerpoet
Posts: 14
Joined: 30 Dec 2020
Location: East Bay, California

Post 30 Dec 2020

I have some audio clips to which I want to add a click-track.

The good news is there are a thousand million billion ways to click. :-)

The bad news is that the clips change tempo in the middle (from 61 to 66, FWIW).

I've tried to automate a tempo change in the transport track, but every approach I've taken has induced clips to stretch (even though I've marked them to avoid stretching).

I've even tried splitting each of the clips into two pieces, one for the slower/earlier portion and one for the faster/later portion.

Note I am not trying to do creative things to the audible result. I want the clips to sound just the way they came to me.

I want to adjust Reason *around* the existing clips so the sequencer clicks in synchrony.

I feel like the app must be capable and the problem is me. Can anyone point at a tutorial for this sort of thing?

I'm on 11.3.6d3 (12159) at the moment.

djsmex
Posts: 135
Joined: 23 Aug 2016

Post 04 Jan 2021

I believe you can disable stretch on the audio track, this should allow you to set the tempo without affecting the audio. I think it's something like right-click the clip to disable stretch.

User avatar
MrFigg
Posts: 5953
Joined: 20 Apr 2018

Post 04 Jan 2021

integerpoet wrote:
30 Dec 2020
I have some audio clips to which I want to add a click-track.

The good news is there are a thousand million billion ways to click. :-)

The bad news is that the clips change tempo in the middle (from 61 to 66, FWIW).

I've tried to automate a tempo change in the transport track, but every approach I've taken has induced clips to stretch (even though I've marked them to avoid stretching).

I've even tried splitting each of the clips into two pieces, one for the slower/earlier portion and one for the faster/later portion.

Note I am not trying to do creative things to the audible result. I want the clips to sound just the way they came to me.

I want to adjust Reason *around* the existing clips so the sequencer clicks in synchrony.

I feel like the app must be capable and the problem is me. Can anyone point at a tutorial for this sort of thing?

I'm on 11.3.6d3 (12159) at the moment.
Here you go.
丰2ॐ

User avatar
miyaru
Posts: 182
Joined: 28 Oct 2019
Location: Zaanstad, The Netherlands

Post 04 Jan 2021

Impressive MrFigg, have to try that if I got some time......
Greetings from Miyaru.
Prodaw i7-7700, 16Gb Ram, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 3rd gen, Reason Suite 11, Live Suit 10, Push2, Presonus Eris E8, Lexicon MPX1,
Korg N1, Korg R3, NI Massive, Rob Papen's Predator 2, Sonarworks Reference 4 and Scaler.

User avatar
MrFigg
Posts: 5953
Joined: 20 Apr 2018

Post 04 Jan 2021

miyaru wrote:
04 Jan 2021
Impressive MrFigg, have to try that if I got some time......
It works really well. I had some old 4-track tapes I recorded with a friend 30 years ago. Took off her vocal track into Reason then matched up the tempo using the technique in the video. Really great. Just follow the steps.
丰2ॐ

User avatar
integerpoet
Posts: 14
Joined: 30 Dec 2020
Location: East Bay, California

Post 04 Jan 2021

djsmex wrote:
04 Jan 2021
I believe you can disable stretch on the audio track, this should allow you to set the tempo without affecting the audio. I think it's something like right-click the clip to disable stretch.
These days I disable stretch almost by reflex right after import. :-) It seems to affect resizing a clip, but in this case I'm not resizing a clip; I'm changing the tempo of the project overall.

User avatar
MrFigg
Posts: 5953
Joined: 20 Apr 2018

Post 04 Jan 2021

integerpoet wrote:
04 Jan 2021
djsmex wrote:
04 Jan 2021
I believe you can disable stretch on the audio track, this should allow you to set the tempo without affecting the audio. I think it's something like right-click the clip to disable stretch.
These days I disable stretch almost by reflex right after import. :-) It seems to affect resizing a clip, but in this case I'm not resizing a clip; I'm changing the tempo of the project overall.
...so didn’t the tutorial video show you how to do that?
丰2ॐ

User avatar
integerpoet
Posts: 14
Joined: 30 Dec 2020
Location: East Bay, California

Post 04 Jan 2021

MrFigg wrote:
04 Jan 2021
integerpoet wrote:
30 Dec 2020
I have some audio clips to which I want to add a click-track…
Here you go. (YouTube link.)
The tools featured in that video are familiar. But note how the goal of the video is to "correct" (normalize) tempo drift. And that's what the video accomplishes. It's cool but not quite what I am after.

My recordings aren't drifting. I have two spans of samples, one very deliberately at 61 BPM (solid) and other very deliberately at 66 BPM (solid). I can also see these numbers on the sheet music that was the reference for these spans. :-) The piece simply has two BPMs; normalizing to a single BPM would be introducing error.

After watching the video, I'm thinking it's possible that the problem is that as a file is imported its samples become a clip with a single BPM. I might have an idea of how to solve this by using a temporary document…

User avatar
MrFigg
Posts: 5953
Joined: 20 Apr 2018

Post 04 Jan 2021

integerpoet wrote:
04 Jan 2021
MrFigg wrote:
04 Jan 2021

Here you go. (YouTube link.)
The tools featured in that video are familiar. But note how the goal of the video is to "correct" (normalize) tempo drift. And that's what the video accomplishes. It's cool but not quite what I am after.

My recordings aren't drifting. I have two spans of samples, one very deliberately at 61 BPM (solid) and other very deliberately at 66 BPM (solid). I can also see these numbers on the sheet music that was the reference for these spans. :-) The piece simply has two BPMs; normalizing to a single BPM would be introducing error.

After watching the video, I'm thinking it's possible that the problem is that as a file is imported its samples become a clip with a single BPM. I might have an idea of how to solve this by using a temporary document…
Why don’t you mix down the first section, export it as audio then do the same for the next section then drag both into a new session and join them?
丰2ॐ

fretshot7
Posts: 500
Joined: 02 Apr 2018

Post 04 Jan 2021

nice one 👍🏼

User avatar
integerpoet
Posts: 14
Joined: 30 Dec 2020
Location: East Bay, California

Post 04 Jan 2021

MrFigg wrote:
04 Jan 2021
Why don’t you mix down the first section, export it as audio then do the same for the next section then drag both into a new session and join them?
I may ultimately be forced to do that, but I have been trying to construct a single document with both tempos for workflow reasons. I may have to cut my losses and do this the hard way.

For what it's worth, the task at hand isn't making music so much as pre-music reference tracks. I have many parts — say eight — which need a click added. My normal workflow for this is to solo the click track and one part track and then export. Doing this eight times gives me eight exported files which I then distribute to musicians.

Under this scheme, I must do that twice, once at 61 BPM and once at 66 BPM. And then I must join all those sixteen files and export a third time, producing a third set of files, for a total of twenty-four. (The musicians will receive only the final eight.)

I'll eventually get the desired result, but as a workflow it doesn't scale nicely. Also, it feels like cutting and splicing analog tape. :-)

User avatar
integerpoet
Posts: 14
Joined: 30 Dec 2020
Location: East Bay, California

Post 04 Jan 2021

integerpoet wrote:
04 Jan 2021
I have been trying to construct a single document with both tempos for workflow reasons. I may have to cut my losses and do this the hard way…
…or not. Victory! Here's what I did:

1. Understand that although an input file may lack tempo data, a clip does not. As soon as a clip appears in a document, it acquires tempo data from the location at which it was inserted. Thereafter, as that clip moves around, it carries that original tempo data and adapts to the tempo of its new location.

2. Make two documents, one at the first tempo and one at the second. Add your input files to both. Disable stretching for all resulting clips.

3. In the first document, find where the tempo changes, truncate your clips (drag the trailing edges to the left) and add automation at that point. (Make sure the tempo changes instantaneously; you're not looking for a gradual morph.) You have no clips beyond the tempo change, so nothing stretches when the tempo changes.

4. In the second document, find where the tempo changes and remove all samples before then (drag the leading edges to the right).

5. Copy the clips from the second document. Set the insertion point within the first document to where the tempo change automation occurs. Paste; new tracks appear. Drag the pasted clips up into their matching locations in the old tracks; the shift key will help keep the timing right. Delete the new tracks.

6. Add a click-track and whatever else prompted all this effort. :-)

I wrote this up after succeeding and didn't retrace my steps to make sure this writeup is absolutely accurate, so your mileage may vary. The most important thing is to keep the first item in mind. As long as you never expose a clip to a tempo which it does not already have, you'll stay out of serious trouble.

User avatar
integerpoet
Posts: 14
Joined: 30 Dec 2020
Location: East Bay, California

Post 10 Jan 2021

MrFigg wrote:
04 Jan 2021
...so didn’t the tutorial video show you how to do that?
Though this tutorial didn't apply to the problem I had at the time, it does apply to the new problem I have now, and I would not have guessed how to do this, so I appreciate the link even more.

P.S. This video is the best ad for Allihoopa I've ever seen. I remember poking around on it and even posting a couple of things, but I didn't grasp the potential over and above other collab sites of that era. The vision of that project was truly great. I wish it had taken off because it seems like it would have been a watershed moment for music in general.

  • Information
  • Who is online

    Users browsing this forum: CommonCrawl [Bot], dpandri, froggo_gfx, rcbuse, Trendiction [Bot], TritoneAddiction and 9 guests