What features does Reason DAW have that others don't?

This forum is for discussing Reason. Questions, answers, ideas, and opinions... all apply.
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Marco Raaphorst
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Post 04 Sep 2020

For sounddesigners it's also great that when you create for example Subtractor patches in R11 you can load these in older versions. Often in DAW the presets are not downward compatible. In Reason they are and it's great.
Marco Raaphorst

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EnochLight
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Post 04 Sep 2020

Image


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mcatalao
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Post 04 Sep 2020

plaamook wrote:
04 Sep 2020
mcatalao wrote:
04 Sep 2020


Well... Try working 4 hours on a project without saving and having a power down, to see if that doesn't hurt.
I bet.
I’ve only had that from logic.I’ve never had Reason crash on me like that.
Few times due to soothe update but that’s fixed.
A power down would be external to reason, so the problem exists independently of reason's stability with is undeniable (less now with VST's but still undeniable). It would happen with any software. The difference is reason can have the project only in memory and you'd ultimately loose it, and cubase and others will have the project saved in your hdd.

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Marco Raaphorst
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Post 04 Sep 2020

Power down? I never had this issue. Recording with laptops works great. I am using Ableton mostly when I am on a location and need to multitrack stuff.
Marco Raaphorst

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plaamook
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Post 04 Sep 2020

I’ve never had a power down.
Soothe 2 would crash. Reason just blink off.
Never happened on anything but a jam. Lucky.

DaveyG
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Post 04 Sep 2020

plaamook wrote:
03 Sep 2020
What other DAWs allow you to open multiple song files at once?
Studio One
Cubase
Live

to name the ones I know about....

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plaamook
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Post 04 Sep 2020

DaveyG wrote:
04 Sep 2020
plaamook wrote:
03 Sep 2020
What other DAWs allow you to open multiple song files at once?
Studio One
Cubase
Live

to name the ones I know about....
That’s a relief!
That’s pretty crucial to how I work so if reason pegs it, there’s hope of continuing!
I’ve only used logic really. Other than reason.

Troublemecca
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Post 06 Sep 2020

chaosroyale wrote:
31 Aug 2020
the pointless "SSL" desk which recreates the limitations of an out-of-date piece of gear from decades ago, instead of innovating and making an original "Reason mixing desk". Honestly one of the most headscratching decisions by Reason in the last 10 years. Even Paul Frindle who designed the actual SSL says he doesn't understand why people waste their time trying to copy it, forgoing all the advances in modern technology and GUI. He already moved on to making newer and better tools.
This... I went with 11 to use in Logic, because when it came to mixing, once you got past the educational, 'how cool!' implementation of a live mixing board, Reason feels unnecessarily cumbersome... that and not being able to input precise digital values, instead relying on turning a digital representation of a physical knob... is maddening. I understand that people have produced great music with far greater limitation, but forcing them upon you offering no alternative leads one to stray, as I have. That said, I still highly recommend Reason, but it's my go-to for creativity, not productivity.

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stratatonic
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Post 06 Sep 2020

A metronome icon that doesn't do anything when you click it.

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guitfnky
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Post 06 Sep 2020

Troublemecca wrote:
06 Sep 2020
chaosroyale wrote:
31 Aug 2020
the pointless "SSL" desk which recreates the limitations of an out-of-date piece of gear from decades ago, instead of innovating and making an original "Reason mixing desk". Honestly one of the most headscratching decisions by Reason in the last 10 years. Even Paul Frindle who designed the actual SSL says he doesn't understand why people waste their time trying to copy it, forgoing all the advances in modern technology and GUI. He already moved on to making newer and better tools.
This... I went with 11 to use in Logic, because when it came to mixing, once you got past the educational, 'how cool!' implementation of a live mixing board, Reason feels unnecessarily cumbersome... that and not being able to input precise digital values, instead relying on turning a digital representation of a physical knob... is maddening. I understand that people have produced great music with far greater limitation, but forcing them upon you offering no alternative leads one to stray, as I have. That said, I still highly recommend Reason, but it's my go-to for creativity, not productivity.
I agree that the SSL mixer is sort of unnecessary, but that’s also why I don’t get how people think it’s so cumbersome. Reason lets me do 90% of my mixing work right in the rack. the only time I go to the mixer view is to work on setting sends, changing pan widths, or bussing stuff together. honestly the way it works is the opposite of cumbersome, IMO. the cumbersome part of Reason (for me) is almost completely in the shortcomings of the sequencer.

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EdwardKiy
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Post 15 Sep 2020

My ode to Reason:

1. The biggest thing for me is the "honest" attitude of creating music - Reason is a hardware emulation first and foremost. It stays connected with how music is made in the real world of hardware instruments, real studios and real people. It teaches you about types and ways of signals passing before they become sound. This knowledge is transferable - It's the real deal, not a gimmick. For this reason DAWs like FL and Live remain in the realm of toys for me, although I use Live as a sequencer. In their race to develop frameworks and give the fastest way for users to do A and B, those DAWs became like high-speed highways, where it's hard to go off track and create something actually new. I think it is for this reason these other two DAWs I've named can only boast a couple flavor-of-the-month artists as their champions, whereas Reason lent a hand to acts like OK Go, Madonna, Rihanna, Beyonce, Drake, Merilyn Manson, Dr. Dre, the Prodigy, 50 cent, Timbaland, Pharell, Missy, Claude Von Stroke, Guy Called Gerald, Dj Pierre etc. Most of them are genre-defining.

So what I love about Reason is you have all those new cutting edge frameworks tucked under the hood, but it knows to let you be an artist with just a brush, a sheet of paper and a bit of paint, if this analogy makes any sense.

2. Stemming in #1, the #2 would be the rack and its routing capabilities, giving you literally limitless options for instruments and processing if you're completely in a box and on a budget. VSTs and REs are nice, but you don't need them in Reason. Not NEED-need them. Studio One, Live, Reaper and FL studio (of those I used), in comparison are nothing but sequencers and they rely on outside instruments with their lives. Their proprietary instruments are just shit, to put it mildly. Example: Live is supposedly good for making dubstep music, but here's a whoopsie - has no default instruments to make dubstep with. You will have to buy Serum at the very least for that.

3. Also stemming in #1, the SSL mixer is divine. I don't get people criticizing it as an "old piece of hardware". Doesn't bother you that it happens to be the pinnacle of audio engineering, the best humanity has to offer? Literally - the best. So what's so bad about the best? It also fits perfectly within the Reason music-making paradigm. I have yet to see any limitations of the SSL mixer, so I really don't get it. I can also have it on a separate screen. Oh, and it costs $50'000 as a hardware unit. I like.

4. Pitch editor. Rivaled only by melodyne, which is a VST. Reason Pitch Editor is versatile but less forgiving, and this educated me a lot.

5. Stability. This shouldn't be taken lightly. REs are more expensive than VSTs for a reason. I've been to quite a few studios in the past few months and I've seen Logic and Cubase choke and freeze during heavy use. In a situation of a live performance, a singer with a lot of backing vocals and relying on autotune, would want reliability first and foremost and Reason's rack extensions are unparalleled for that. This is why I think they are worth the extra money.

6. The full package. While some DAWs may be stronger in some aspects, Reason seems to be quite capable in all of them. Just a few more sequencer fixes and I can abandon the Ableton monstrosity.

7. Considering the full package, Reason is very affordable. You can officially purchase a second-hand whatever-version license from any user, upgrade it on a sale - BOOM, you're in with the latest version of Suite for less than $350.

P.S. I've seen Logic die 5 times in just 4 studio session with my own eyes, run on a state-of-the-art studio MacPro with roughly the same load Reason handled on my ryzen3800x home pc like a piece of cake. I realize this must have been quite out of the ordinary, or no one would ever use Logic, but this proved to me that Apple stability is a marketing myth. Reason died on me just once in almost a year now and only when I loaded a whole bunch of freeware VSTs.

chaosroyale
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Post 15 Sep 2020

I'm not gonna dispute your choices, because they seem very personal and they make sense depending on the user (I've personally never had a problem with any modern software crashing, and I don't think the Reason instruments are especially good*, so ymmv)

But as for the SSL, don't take it from me, take it from Paul Frindle, the guy who actually designed the damn thing.

quote:
"...every time I see yet another 'SSL-esque' GUI with yet another supposed 'copy' my heart sinks further.
Knowing what I know, there's no way that I want what we made back then (let alone an incomplete 'emulation' of one of them) because we have moved on so much further than the restrictions which applied in those days."

I agree with him 100%

* except Malstrom which is quirky and fun, and Subtractor, which is the best-designed subtractive synth in any DAW but really needs updating.
EdwardKiy wrote:
15 Sep 2020
My ode to Reason:

3. Also stemming in #1, the SSL mixer is divine. I don't get people criticizing it as an "old piece of hardware". Doesn't bother you that it happens to be the pinnacle of audio engineering, the best humanity has to offer? Literally - the best. So what's so bad about the best? It also fits perfectly within the Reason music-making paradigm. I have yet to see any limitations of the SSL mixer, so I really don't get it. I can also have it on a separate screen. Oh, and it costs $50'000 as a hardware unit. I like.

Tiny Montgomery
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Post 15 Sep 2020

I wonder if Madonna logs in here under a pseudonym?

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guitfnky
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Post 15 Sep 2020

the SSL is decent, but calling it “the best” is a hell of a stretch. especially considering how they’ve implemented it. like I’ve said, it’s not *that* cumbersome considering you can avoid using it most of the time (depending on your workflow), but if you do prefer to work in the mixer view, I have to concede it’s absolutely not implemented well.

as for how it sounds, well sure, it’s great for the bare necessities, but there are better EQs out there now, and better compressors. that’s just a fact. and since you can put them where you want, and route them how you want in the rack, it makes using these features in the SSL kind of pointless a lot of the time (though they are handy if you just need some quick and dirty compression or EQ when doing tracking). even using the SSL devices instead of their counterparts in the mixer makes more sense, for the same reason.

chaosroyale
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Post 15 Sep 2020

Actually, no I can't let this go. This is, like, the opposite of true. The Prodigy did not use Reason for their first genre-defining albums, and only used it for part of their later work. Basically every cutting edge piece of electronic music you hear on the internet these days is done with FL or Live, none of those kids are using Reason. Timbaland and all the major acts you listed use Protools and Cubase, they just happen to have a ton of other software and hardware lying around too because they have a lot of money to spare. A lot of producers in Asia use Logic because Macs. Reason users are a minority in the industry.
EdwardKiy wrote:
15 Sep 2020
My ode to Reason:
I think it is for this reason these other two DAWs I've named can only boast a couple flavor-of-the-month artists as their champions, whereas Reason lent a hand to acts like OK Go, Madonna, Rihanna, Beyonce, Drake, Merilyn Manson, Dr. Dre, the Prodigy, 50 cent, Timbaland, Pharell, Missy, Claude Von Stroke, Guy Called Gerald, Dj Pierre etc. Most of them are genre-defining.

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EdwardKiy
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Post 15 Sep 2020

chaosroyale wrote:
15 Sep 2020
Actually, no I can't let this go. This is, like, the opposite of true. The Prodigy did not use Reason for their first genre-defining albums, and only used it for part of their later work. Basically every cutting edge piece of electronic music you hear on the internet these days is done with FL or Live, none of those kids are using Reason. Timbaland and all the major acts you listed use Protools and Cubase, they just happen to have a ton of other software and hardware lying around too because they have a lot of money to spare. A lot of producers in Asia use Logic because Macs. Reason users are a minority in the industry.
I cannot check for a fact they did, we only have heresay and snippets like these: of timbaland using Reason and such. We know for sure some of Rihanna's and Beyonce's music was also made in Reason from the interviews of their producers and also the last 3 on my list. This is still hell of a lot, if you compare them to Live's Skrillex and FL's Avicii.

far as I can tell, all studios have cubase, logic and pro tools or at least two of them. This is what's backed by the industry and Reason cannot compete with that. I still stand by that Reason is still a much better overall package than Live or FL. I'm using Live as a sequencer and Reason for recording vocals and I wish I could just be using Reason, because Live feels a bit sterile, a bit plastic. Maybe it's a UI thing - I don't know.

You've touched on a string though. I'll trust that some of the cutting edge electronic music is made with FL and Live. That's nobody I know, so I probably missed some great music and now my heart is full of sorrow. If you have any to share, would you please? I'm dead serious - there's that "what you listening to" thread in the Kitchen that I gloss over time to time. I'll show you mine.

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EdwardKiy
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Post 15 Sep 2020

chaosroyale wrote:
15 Sep 2020

But as for the SSL, don't take it from me, take it from Paul Frindle, the guy who actually designed the damn thing.

quote:
"...every time I see yet another 'SSL-esque' GUI with yet another supposed 'copy' my heart sinks further.
Knowing what I know, there's no way that I want what we made back then (let alone an incomplete 'emulation' of one of them) because we have moved on so much further than the restrictions which applied in those days."

I agree with him 100%

* except Malstrom which is quirky and fun, and Subtractor, which is the best-designed subtractive synth in any DAW but really needs updating.
This is very cool. So what's better and why? Like I said, it didn't cap me on anything just yet, and I'd like to think I've made some music.

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bxbrkrz
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Post 15 Sep 2020

EdwardKiy wrote:
15 Sep 2020
My ode to Reason:

1. The biggest thing for me is the "honest" attitude of creating music - Reason is a hardware emulation first and foremost. It stays connected with how music is made in the real world of hardware instruments, real studios and real people. It teaches you about types and ways of signals passing before they become sound. This knowledge is transferable - It's the real deal, not a gimmick. For this reason DAWs like FL and Live remain in the realm of toys for me, although I use Live as a sequencer. In their race to develop frameworks and give the fastest way for users to do A and B, those DAWs became like high-speed highways, where it's hard to go off track and create something actually new. I think it is for this reason these other two DAWs I've named can only boast a couple flavor-of-the-month artists as their champions, whereas Reason lent a hand to acts like OK Go, Madonna, Rihanna, Beyonce, Drake, Merilyn Manson, Dr. Dre, the Prodigy, 50 cent, Timbaland, Pharell, Missy, Claude Von Stroke, Guy Called Gerald, Dj Pierre etc. Most of them are genre-defining.

So what I love about Reason is you have all those new cutting edge frameworks tucked under the hood, but it knows to let you be an artist with just a brush, a sheet of paper and a bit of paint, if this analogy makes any sense.

2. Stemming in #1, the #2 would be the rack and its routing capabilities, giving you literally limitless options for instruments and processing if you're completely in a box and on a budget. VSTs and REs are nice, but you don't need them in Reason. Not NEED-need them. Studio One, Live, Reaper and FL studio (of those I used), in comparison are nothing but sequencers and they rely on outside instruments with their lives. Their proprietary instruments are just shit, to put it mildly. Example: Live is supposedly good for making dubstep music, but here's a whoopsie - has no default instruments to make dubstep with. You will have to buy Serum at the very least for that.

3. Also stemming in #1, the SSL mixer is divine. I don't get people criticizing it as an "old piece of hardware". Doesn't bother you that it happens to be the pinnacle of audio engineering, the best humanity has to offer? Literally - the best. So what's so bad about the best? It also fits perfectly within the Reason music-making paradigm. I have yet to see any limitations of the SSL mixer, so I really don't get it. I can also have it on a separate screen. Oh, and it costs $50'000 as a hardware unit. I like.

4. Pitch editor. Rivaled only by melodyne, which is a VST. Reason Pitch Editor is versatile but less forgiving, and this educated me a lot.

5. Stability. This shouldn't be taken lightly. REs are more expensive than VSTs for a reason. I've been to quite a few studios in the past few months and I've seen Logic and Cubase choke and freeze during heavy use. In a situation of a live performance, a singer with a lot of backing vocals and relying on autotune, would want reliability first and foremost and Reason's rack extensions are unparalleled for that. This is why I think they are worth the extra money.

6. The full package. While some DAWs may be stronger in some aspects, Reason seems to be quite capable in all of them. Just a few more sequencer fixes and I can abandon the Ableton monstrosity.

7. Considering the full package, Reason is very affordable. You can officially purchase a second-hand whatever-version license from any user, upgrade it on a sale - BOOM, you're in with the latest version of Suite for less than $350.

P.S. I've seen Logic die 5 times in just 4 studio session with my own eyes, run on a state-of-the-art studio MacPro with roughly the same load Reason handled on my ryzen3800x home pc like a piece of cake. I realize this must have been quite out of the ordinary, or no one would ever use Logic, but this proved to me that Apple stability is a marketing myth. Reason died on me just once in almost a year now and only when I loaded a whole bunch of freeware VSTs.
100%
If only I could find a 9000 K, with infinite channel strips for just $50k :puf_smile:

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Creativemind
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Post 15 Sep 2020

stratatonic wrote:
06 Sep 2020
A metronome icon that doesn't do anything when you click it.
:lol:

I suggested ages ago that there should be a preference to have it swing or stationary.
:reason:

Propellerhead Reason 11.3 / Cockos Reaper 6.14 / Cakewalk By Bandlab / Pro Tools First / Steinberg Cubase LE 5
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chaosroyale
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Joined: 05 Sep 2017

Post 15 Sep 2020

I agree that Timbo uses Reason sometimes, but he also uses a SID station, and I don't think you would credit that with being a major part of the music industry. He always references Protools whenever he talks about working in a studio.

*EDIT: now I think of it, Reason still has some currency with Hip-Hop producers because of the hardware and MPC-like aspects of it. If Reason Studios want to capitalize on that, they should update KONG and really get all the Hip-Hop heads on board. That could be a perfect niche market which other DAWs don't appeal to as strongly.

You are absolutely right that one of the main factors is that major studios usually have PT and Cubase "as standard" but that's not exactly a point in favour of Reason.

What's better than an SSL..in the real world you mean? Paul Frindle's next project was the OXF-R3 which was highly rated by people in the movie soundtrack industry. Personally, I don't care about analog mixing desks any more, because software is so much more convenient for me. I am happy to use any modern desk for recording and then do all my mixing on a PC.

In the DAW world, literally anything is better than an SSL. Reason really dropped the ball there. Only 2 parametric EQ's per channel? Exactly 4 sends whether you need 4, or 6, or zero? It's software ffs!! You could have as many as you like. Let the users customize their default channel strip with as few or as many sends, EQs and so on as they need. The built-in compressor is pretty useless for anyone who works like me (I hate auto-makeup gain!!). Plus the visualization is terrible. The EQ window is imprecise and ugly, the channel level meters do not show moving average and peak at the same time.

etc etc etc.

Recommendations for cutting edge music - there is so much out there maybe it's fastest to go on youtube or spotify and type in "drum and bass mix 2020" or "ambient mix 2020" or whatever genre you are into and just search for individual artists when you hear something you like. I don't know much about pop, so my recommendations would probably suck for most people. One pop artist I thought was doing some interesting sound design was Sophie ("faceshopping" was her big hit) (yeah, I know, I know, that's old now, I'm out of touch) and she uses Live. Sevdaliza is another good modern artist, don't know what she uses. All I know is, whenever I meet a young artist they are always talking about Live or FL (or recently StudioOne), never Reason.

Anyway - one can use any DAW to make cutting edge music. They all have perfect sound and access to VSTs so there is no limit. The only important thing is what you enjoy using. I love starting tracks in Reason because of the fun factor, but because of all the workarounds I get fed up quickly and finishing them becomes a chore. For big projects like soundtracks that is sometimes a dealbreaker. It's a shame because Reason is...almost...my perfect DAW. I hate the look and feel of Live (shame - because it has great features), and Reaper is kind of amazing but just something about it is boring. But they can all do lots of things that Reason should be able to do in 2020.

It's also rather worrying seeing so many replies in this thread saying "only reason can do (really common and basic thing that all other DAWs can do)" - I feel like Reason Studios and Reason users are stuck in a bubble where they think that an "SSL compressor" is somehow special or cool in 2020, or that the Reason EQ window is anything other than a janky embarrassment that was mediocre even when it was released in 2011...jeez, 9 years ago!!! and still no updates...
EdwardKiy wrote:
15 Sep 2020
re: music producers
re: about the SSL

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EnochLight
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Post 15 Sep 2020

chaosroyale wrote:
15 Sep 2020
*EDIT: now I think of it, Reason still has some currency with Hip-Hop producers because of the hardware and MPC-like aspects of it. If Reason Studios want to capitalize on that, they should update KONG and really get all the Hip-Hop heads on board. That could be a perfect niche market which other DAWs don't appeal to as strongly.
If the climate over at the MPC-forums are to be believed, Reason is very much alive and well among the hip-hop community. They've been on board for quite some time.
Win 10 | Reason 11 Suite |  Studio One 4.5 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | Reactor 1TB SSD | RME Babyface Pro | Nektar Panorama P-4 | Akai MPC Live 2 | Roland System 8 | Roland TR-8 with 7x7 Expansion | Roland TB-3 | Roland VT-4 | Roland MX-1

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EdwardKiy
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Post 15 Sep 2020

Creativemind wrote:
15 Sep 2020
stratatonic wrote:
06 Sep 2020
A metronome icon that doesn't do anything when you click it.
:lol:

I suggested ages ago that there should be a preference to have it swing or stationary.
I'd like it to make a different single farting sound each time you press it and then at one point it becomes a little melody.

chaosroyale
Posts: 417
Joined: 05 Sep 2017

Post 15 Sep 2020

Yeah that's good to hear. Honestly, given the legendary status of the MPC and the 808 in Hip-Hop, Reason has a ready-made cool factor built-in. Kong is seriously 80% of the way to being the best drum machine on a DAW, but, as usual, they never updated it and they damn thing is half-assed. For example, making layered kicks and snares is standard practice, but Kong does not allow you to individually tailor the sample start and end points or -more importantly- the envelopes or filters for each layer in a single pad. Plus, the envelope generator is very limited. Imagine if it had variable curves, and each layer could have its own curve and each sample could be tweaked a little different. Plus those FX... ugh... the comp is basic af, the distortion is terrible, the reverb is an absolute joke and sounds like some cheap Korg FX from the late 90s. Considering they already had Scream and the RV7000 when they made Kong, those cheap-sounding FX were inexcusable even when it was released. All of this could be done easily with current Reason tech and without changing Kong significantly. They are so close to having a winner in Kong.
EnochLight wrote:
15 Sep 2020
chaosroyale wrote:
15 Sep 2020
*EDIT: now I think of it, Reason still has some currency with Hip-Hop producers because of the hardware and MPC-like aspects of it. If Reason Studios want to capitalize on that, they should update KONG and really get all the Hip-Hop heads on board. That could be a perfect niche market which other DAWs don't appeal to as strongly.
If the climate over at the MPC-forums are to be believed, Reason is very much alive and well among the hip-hop community. They've been on board for quite some time.

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EnochLight
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Post 15 Sep 2020

chaosroyale wrote:
15 Sep 2020
Yeah that's good to hear. Honestly, given the legendary status of the MPC and the 808 in Hip-Hop, Reason has a ready-made cool factor built-in. Kong is seriously 80% of the way to being the best drum machine on a DAW, but, as usual, they never updated it and they damn thing is half-assed. For example, making layered kicks and snares is standard practice, but Kong does not allow you to individually tailor the sample start and end points or -more importantly- the envelopes or filters for each layer in a single pad. Plus, the envelope generator is very limited. Imagine if it had variable curves, and each layer could have its own curve and each sample could be tweaked a little different. Plus those FX... ugh... the comp is basic af, the distortion is terrible, the reverb is an absolute joke and sounds like some cheap Korg FX from the late 90s. Considering they already had Scream and the RV7000 when they made Kong, those cheap-sounding FX were inexcusable even when it was released. All of this could be done easily with current Reason tech and without changing Kong significantly. They are so close to having a winner in Kong.
I can't argue with that - Kong is one of my favorite devices in Reason, but it's certainly showing its age. It's a decade old as of last month. Would certainly love to see a "Kong MK2" that takes it to the next level.

I doubt we'll see anything like that anytime soon, though - if ever. :(
Win 10 | Reason 11 Suite |  Studio One 4.5 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | Reactor 1TB SSD | RME Babyface Pro | Nektar Panorama P-4 | Akai MPC Live 2 | Roland System 8 | Roland TR-8 with 7x7 Expansion | Roland TB-3 | Roland VT-4 | Roland MX-1

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bxbrkrz
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Post 15 Sep 2020

The latest Maschine+ made look at the MK3, and how it could be used as a Kong controller via MaschineRMK3. Very impressive.

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