What happened to the mixer?

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Ninjadog
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Joined: 05 Feb 2015

Post 14 Jun 2020

It's been a long while since fired up Reason, I was very active with it from 1.0 and upgraded with each new version till 3.0. Did not feel a need to upgrade till around 7.0. The jump from 3 to 7 just wrecked my workflow as everything was different, plus the laptop I had back in 2010 was pretty crappy and couldn't handle too much. Long story short I built a new computer recently and I threw Reason 7 on to get back into producing. I'm sure it's even a stretch for the guys on 11 to remember what 7 was like but among my many questions is is the 14:2 mixer even used anymore? All the instruments just get their little "Mix" mixer thing and from there virtual wires to the Master Section? (As provided by the default new song) Virtual wires??? I kinda cant get over that lol.
Guess I got a bunch of manual reading to do.

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Loque
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Post 14 Jun 2020

Holy sh!t! Finally someone who complains, that Reason has improved or changed over the years!

I use the rack Mixers only in Combinators or if i need to do some quick mixing for sidechaining or stuff like that. Everything else goes through the SSL main Mixer.
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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motuscott
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Location: the New York

Post 14 Jun 2020

Ninjadog wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Guess I got a bunch of manual reading to do.
Reading is FUNdamental.
Vlad the thread stopper πŸ§‚

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Loque
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Post 14 Jun 2020

motuscott wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Ninjadog wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Guess I got a bunch of manual reading to do.
Reading is FUNdamental.
fun-da-mental?
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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BRIGGS
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Location: Orange County California

Post 14 Jun 2020

Loque wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
motuscott wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020

Reading is FUNdamental.
fun-da-mental?
lol!!!

Image

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Ninjadog
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Post 14 Jun 2020

Loque wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Holy sh!t! Finally someone who complains, that Reason has improved or changed over the years!

I use the rack Mixers only in Combinators or if i need to do some quick mixing for sidechaining or stuff like that. Everything else goes through the SSL main Mixer.
I didn't mean to come across as complaining...I'm lost

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Loque
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Post 14 Jun 2020

Ninjadog wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Loque wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Holy sh!t! Finally someone who complains, that Reason has improved or changed over the years!

I use the rack Mixers only in Combinators or if i need to do some quick mixing for sidechaining or stuff like that. Everything else goes through the SSL main Mixer.
I didn't mean to come across as complaining...I'm lost
You will understand my comment, if you made your 100th post :-D

NP, just check out the manual about the SSL mixer. If you like, you still can work as in Reason 3 with the old Mixer only... Just connect your devices manually to the 14:4 Mixer (drag&drop a device in the rack with holding shift does not automatically create a mixer channel or a connection).
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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Ninjadog
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Post 14 Jun 2020

Loque wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Ninjadog wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020

I didn't mean to come across as complaining...I'm lost
You will understand my comment, if you made your 100th post :-D

NP, just check out the manual about the SSL mixer. If you like, you still can work as in Reason 3 with the old Mixer only... Just connect your devices manually to the 14:4 Mixer (drag&drop a device in the rack with holding shift does not automatically create a mixer channel or a connection).
Don't worry I made thousands of posts when the PUF was still around, I am no stranger to the Reason needs this, why did they do that, VST blah blah blah shenanigans. That shit has always been a constant.
Oh yeah I forgot what a big deal the SSL was when it came out. I was just more surprised they took away some of the cabling cause it's always been there. I mean I get it now we can make unlimited instruments without having to make extra mixers and whatnot, and looks like there is a ton of other stuff you can do with way more flexibility.

I guess more or less I had to make a comment about how I was stoked to make a song and was like what the hell is all this stuff now. I must have done it 3.0 style when I first got 7 because I don't remember anything about the new (non)routing or the Mix strip. I did use Reason for a good decade, but it's also been about a decade since I last used it. I'm pretty much a noob again I feel like.

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joeyluck
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Post 14 Jun 2020

Welcome back to Reason! So yeah, Reason has been around for 20 years and the "new" mixer has been around for 10 years. So half of Reason's lifetime :)

sdst
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Post 14 Jun 2020

Ninjadog wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
is the 14:2 mixer even used anymore?
I still use it as the main mixer, Sometimes I forget the existence of the big mixer

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Ninjadog
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Post 14 Jun 2020

joeyluck wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Welcome back to Reason! So yeah, Reason has been around for 20 years and the "new" mixer has been around for 10 years. So half of Reason's lifetime :)
Thanks bud

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Benedict
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Post 14 Jun 2020

The "SSL" Mixer is a great upgrade and a real game-changer that now (at R11) makes Reason a nicer mixing platform than anything else I have tried (big words I know but I find the Reason layout so clear and therefore easy).

Basically when you add a new sound creating a device like a synth a Mix Channel is created that is auto-routed to a clone of itself in the Mixer. That routing can be undone, re-routed etc if wanted (creatures like parallel added as time went by). I can't recall if R7 had the pop-up Spectrum/EQ window (F2) but that is a great way to use the desk EQ.

If memory serves correctly Older projects open with the 14:2 and then gives an option to transform to SSL routing. No changes to sound (as no new components are on). there was a Vid or two on the transition process.

:-)

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Ninjadog
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Post 15 Jun 2020

Benedict wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
The "SSL" Mixer is a great upgrade and a real game-changer that now (at R11) makes Reason a nicer mixing platform than anything else I have tried (big words I know but I find the Reason layout so clear and therefore easy).

Basically when you add a new sound creating a device like a synth a Mix Channel is created that is auto-routed to a clone of itself in the Mixer. That routing can be undone, re-routed etc if wanted (creatures like parallel added as time went by). I can't recall if R7 had the pop-up Spectrum/EQ window (F2) but that is a great way to use the desk EQ.

If memory serves correctly Older projects open with the 14:2 and then gives an option to transform to SSL routing. No changes to sound (as no new components are on). there was a Vid or two on the transition process.

:-)
That's what was throwing me off, there was no mixer!

I'm thinking I still know Reason good enough to start a new song. New Song opens up a rack with a Hardware Interface, and a Master Section with a couple of RV7000's Echo and a DDL1 routing thru the FX Send and Returns. Master Section master outs go to the Hardware Interface but I can't expand the HI to see where they land. I'm thinking that's odd...I'll just add a mixer. I looked at how I would route it in and got lost again...So thought I'll just make an instrument and see what happens.
So made a Subtractor and played it thru my controller, worked fine. Flip the rack - Subs routed to the Mix and nothing from the Mix to anything...I'm pretty confused by this point and I knew from old Reason the first instrument would get auto routed into the Hardware Interface and the next one you create wouldn't have anywhere to get plugged in - hence the need for a mixer. Made about 20 more instruments and finally clued in there is no more need for a mixer as I knew it. By now my inspiration is long gone and I'm getting overwhelmed by all the new inputs and the programmer and the insert FX button on the back of the Mix... Made a beat and let my daughter smash the keys a bit and could only smile because Reason was still fun.

Took that long detour to realize I could have made a mixer and the next instruments I create get routed to it, but I'm already seeing the potential in the new 10 year old way.

And yes V7 has that Spectrum window with F2...Damn I shudder to think how long before I would have noticed. Thanks for that.

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Benedict
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Location: Gold Coast, Australia

Post 15 Jun 2020

Reason now uses a three-pane/window format. I have Mixer and Seq in one monitor and Rack in the other.

If you only have one monitor screen then you may have to use the F4, 5 & 6 keys to see each clearly. You can juggle them onto one screen too.



:-)

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Ninjadog
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Post 15 Jun 2020

Benedict wrote: ↑
15 Jun 2020
Reason now uses a three-pane/window format. I have Mixer and Seq in one monitor and Rack in the other.

If you only have one monitor screen then you may have to use the F4, 5 & 6 keys to see each clearly. You can juggle them onto one screen too.



:-)
Thanks again! It's all coming together now

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bxbrkrz
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Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 15 Jun 2020

Benedict wrote: ↑
15 Jun 2020
Reason now uses a three-pane/window format. I have Mixer and Seq in one monitor and Rack in the other.

If you only have one monitor screen then you may have to use the F4, 5 & 6 keys to see each clearly. You can juggle them onto one screen too.



:-)
Love it!

True
Posts: 198
Joined: 09 Feb 2015

Post 15 Jun 2020

The windows can also be detached so that the mixer, the rack, and the sequencer can be navigated using Alt+Tab or, what is it on Mac, Cmd+Tab?

That's generally how I do it. The main downside is that the mixer doesn't have the transport bar. You can also just detach one window and leave the others attached, if you want.

ab459
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Location: Minsk Belarus

Post 15 Jun 2020

sdst wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Ninjadog wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
is the 14:2 mixer even used anymore?
I still use it as the main mixer, Sometimes I forget the existence of the big mixer
After upgrade to 10, initially i had doing the same, since did not appreciate SSL benefits (maybe yet). Plus these invisible (wi-fi?) auto-connections from each synth, in my opinions go against initial Reason aesthetic. This really puzzled me like the author of the topic.
And i could still use my "non-ssl" default template with 14:2, but found that he had problems with latency compensation in sends (well, expireenced users will explain better), while SSL have auto compensation. So was forced to leave this idea, and move to general boat.

Edit: though today with R11 i'm more often use Rack plugin, that really magic thing.
Last edited by ab459 on 15 Jun 2020, edited 1 time in total.

Dave Beep
Posts: 27
Joined: 16 May 2020

Post 15 Jun 2020

Ninjadog wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
Virtual wires??? I kinda cant get over that lol.
I've used Reason since V2 and get your confusion a little. I think you need to see it like this:

The "new" mixer is automatically connected to the hardware interface. You don't need to worry about connecting anything to the HI yourself. If you create a device it automatically connects to the "new" mixer. You don't need to create the mixer first, it's always there, and expands to fit your needs.

So:
- new project
- create subtractor
- subtractor appears in the rack window with a "header" device for it's mix channel. The subtractor is wired to that mix channel.
- look at the mixer window and you can see there is now a channel for the subtractor
- the subtractor *is* wired to the mixer channel, the "header" device is the representation within the rack of that mixer channel.

I'm happy with that. It's still connected with wires.

Don't get me started with player devices though. Relying on pure magic they are :evil:

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r2101
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Joined: 21 Oct 2018

Post 15 Jun 2020

i can relate to the confusion about the new mixer and stuff. used reason 3.0 until 2015. happy discovering :)

the good news is that you can still use a template with the 14:2 mixer. but then again the new mixer is quite nice (more send fx etc).

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Ninjadog
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Joined: 05 Feb 2015

Post 15 Jun 2020

It's partly my fault. I was like I've used Reason for 10 years, I don't need to RTFM. Apparently I do. Still it's nice to know I'm not alone in my confusion.
I can totally get down with the new mixer, I just never knew where it was.

True
Posts: 198
Joined: 09 Feb 2015

Post 15 Jun 2020

Ninjadog wrote: ↑
15 Jun 2020
Still it's nice to know I'm not alone in my confusion.
Certainly not alone. I know that I was very confused by it when it first appeared. I had Record combined with Reason, so I had it when it first came out. It took some time before I completely understood the black magic behind it all.

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Benedict
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Location: Gold Coast, Australia

Post 15 Jun 2020

ab459 wrote: ↑
15 Jun 2020
these invisible (wi-fi?) auto-connections from each synth, in my opinions go against initial Reason aesthetic.
I think that there is some sense of confusion - understandable. I perceive the Mix Channel that shows in the Rack and the Mix Channel that appear in the SSL as being the same object in two places at once, not two separated devices. This may seem outside of conventional reality but at the same time fits with quantum thinking. Much like how we can start thinking of a person moments before the phone rings/pings. They are there yet somehow here enough to have us think of them.

:-)

ab459
Posts: 217
Joined: 28 Dec 2018
Location: Minsk Belarus

Post 16 Jun 2020

Benedict wrote: ↑
15 Jun 2020
ab459 wrote: ↑
15 Jun 2020
these invisible (wi-fi?) auto-connections from each synth, in my opinions go against initial Reason aesthetic.
I think that there is some sense of confusion - understandable. I perceive the Mix Channel that shows in the Rack and the Mix Channel that appear in the SSL as being the same object in two places at once, not two separated devices. This may seem outside of conventional reality but at the same time fits with quantum thinking. Much like how we can start thinking of a person moments before the phone rings/pings. They are there yet somehow here enough to have us think of them.

:-)
Well yes, anyway i found as well that Players conception also as mentioned not use wires, but it convenient in use things, fortunately or not.
So, in any case very difficult to stay in classic aestethic and do not use new stuff.

jlgrimes
Posts: 484
Joined: 06 Jun 2017

Post 16 Jun 2020

Ninjadog wrote: ↑
14 Jun 2020
It's been a long while since fired up Reason, I was very active with it from 1.0 and upgraded with each new version till 3.0. Did not feel a need to upgrade till around 7.0. The jump from 3 to 7 just wrecked my workflow as everything was different, plus the laptop I had back in 2010 was pretty crappy and couldn't handle too much. Long story short I built a new computer recently and I threw Reason 7 on to get back into producing. I'm sure it's even a stretch for the guys on 11 to remember what 7 was like but among my many questions is is the 14:2 mixer even used anymore? All the instruments just get their little "Mix" mixer thing and from there virtual wires to the Master Section? (As provided by the default new song) Virtual wires??? I kinda cant get over that lol.
Guess I got a bunch of manual reading to do.
The SSL mixer did add a good bit of complexity to Reason but it was mostly for the better.

1. A compressor for each channel
2. A better EQ for each channel
3. A master bus compressor.
4. Eight sends.
5. Effects insert section.
6. Somewhat easier way to sidechain
7. Parallel channels.
6. Busses.
7. Input gain.
8. Ways to try different routings of compressor EQ.


Biggest gripe is Reason's mixer is more cumbersome (takes alot of GUI real estate) compared to other DAWS but I'd take Reasons current implementation over their old 14:2 mixer (although it worked good for just songwriting).

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