Anyone still find subtractor irreplaceable?

[BRIGGS]

I just spent 2+ hours comparing all my synths. I found some curious things between the old and new synths. Long story short, for me, older reason synths seem more versatile in a few ways. Yeah, the new stuff sounds better, but work needs to happen quickly.

BTW, I can't get Complex-1 or monotone to retrigger on new legato notes. Am I doing it wrong, or maybe it's an oversight, or bug?

What are your experiences?

[zoidkirb]

I just spent 2+ hours comparing all my synths. I found some curious things between the old and new synths. Long story short, for me, older reason synths seem more versatile in a few ways. Yeah, the new stuff sounds better, but work needs to happen quickly.

BTW, I can't get Complex-1 or monotone to retrigger on new legato notes. Am I doing it wrong, or maybe it's an oversight, or bug?

What are your experiences?

Subtractor is always fun to use. It just fits well.
Monotone has kinda taken over for me as a go to bass. monotone has a re trigger mode.....It's to the right of the portamento controls.

[BRIGGS]

I just spent 2+ hours comparing all my synths. I found some curious things between the old and new synths. Long story short, for me, older reason synths seem more versatile in a few ways. Yeah, the new stuff sounds better, but work needs to happen quickly.

BTW, I can't get Complex-1 or monotone to retrigger on new legato notes. Am I doing it wrong, or maybe it's an oversight, or bug?

What are your experiences?

Subtractor is always fun to use. It just fits well.
Monotone has kinda taken over for me as a go to bass. monotone has a re trigger mode.....It's to the right of the portamento controls.

Complex-1 has a retrigger button too. I tried them both. They seem to not like legato lines coming from the matrix. Subtractor has zero issues.

[Loque]

Subtractor has zero issues.

That's not true. The envelopes do not fully return to 0 if they are finished. Well, you can call it analog if you want

Europa and others have the same bugs. Only Thor is clean!

[zoidkirb]

Subtractor is always fun to use. It just fits well.
Monotone has kinda taken over for me as a go to bass. monotone has a re trigger mode.....It's to the right of the portamento controls.

Complex-1 has a retrigger button too. I tried them both. They seem to not like legato lines coming from the matrix. Subtractor has zero issues.

Ah gotcha! I'm not much of a matrix user so I really don't know. Maybe routing matrix thru cv player tap into another player could do the trick

[Chizmata]

I just spent 2+ hours comparing all my synths. I found some curious things between the old and new synths. Long story short, for me, older reason synths seem more versatile in a few ways. Yeah, the new stuff sounds better, but work needs to happen quickly.

BTW, I can't get Complex-1 or monotone to retrigger on new legato notes. Am I doing it wrong, or maybe it's an oversight, or bug?

What are your experiences?

monotone surely is an alternative to sub tractor for basslines, but in the end both have some unique capbilies, like subs still great fm synthesis. the thing about most synths is that they basically do the same, just with different routings - and then they have ONE unique function that separates their sound from the rest. tbh getting a new synth is less about new sound capabilities but more about stimulating your creativity in different ways with the different routings/workflows the synths offer.

[tronam]

Subtractor may be downright ancient by modern standards, but it's still special and I haven't really run across another synth quite like it. I still use it along with Thor quite regularly.

[guitfnky]

I don’t use it too often, but the default patch you get when you first drag it into a session is excellent if you’re looking for a nice round bass guitar-like sound. you can tell it’s electronic if it’s by itself, but in a mix, it can sound pretty convincing. all without even needing to tweak the thing. still holds up.

[TritoneAddiction]

I don’t use it too often, but the default patch you get when you first drag it into a session is excellent if you’re looking for a nice round bass guitar-like sound. you can tell it’s electronic if it’s by itself, but in a mix, it can sound pretty convincing. all without even needing to tweak the thing. still holds up.

Yep i agree the bass guitar patch is surpisingly useful.

Other than that I've never really liked Subtractor that much. Not saying it's useless or anything. I just prefer other synths way more. It's like why use it when I find other stuff more fun to work with?

[Periwinkle]

I think Subtractor has sentimental value for many people because it's been there since the beginning. I think it's a very usable synth and its low CPU usage (I think) make it good for sketching out ideas.

Having said that, having recently purchased Legend, I think I may be using Subtractor less. Legend really is soooooooo good.

[Chizmata]

consider that thor, malström, subtractor etc were made in times before rack extensions and therefore had to be as versatile as possible to make the DAW good. todays downloadable synths might not even want to be more than a niche device.

[BRIGGS]

consider that thor, malström, subtractor etc were made in times before rack extensions and therefore had to be as versatile as possible to make the DAW good. todays downloadable synths might not even want to be more than a niche device.

good point!

[BRIGGS]

Subtractor has zero issues.

That's not true. The envelopes do not fully return to 0 if they are finished. Well, you can call it analog if you want

Europa and others have the same bugs. Only Thor is clean!

lolz!!! Ever find a malstrom with it's amp envelopes stuck open? It's happened a few times to me.

[BRIGGS]

Subtractor may be downright ancient by modern standards, but it's still special and I haven't really run across another synth quite like it. I still use it along with Thor quite regularly.

Sometimes, old is better. Wine or cheese comes to mind, in this case.

[guitfnky]

Having said that, having recently purchased Legend, I think I may be using Subtractor less. Legend really is soooooooo good.

I haven’t heard a better-sounding traditional synth Rack Extension (or stock device) than The Legend. nothing comes close, IMO. Subtractor is better to use in the background, to augment other stuff, but if you need sounds that will hold up in center stage, The Legend is way more appropriate.

[NekujaK]

I routinely use Subtractor to layer sub bass into tracks. I have many other tools capable of the same thing, but Subtractor is always my go-to, and seems to deliver the best results for me.

Also, I'm not a synth guy and don't program synths, but... Subtractor is the one synth I fully grok and can competently tweak if I want to get my hands dirty

[Carpainter]

I wasn't impressed with Subtractor when I first got Reason 1. My favorite soft synth at the time (Synoptic Probe) ran circles around it, but I got tired of importing audio samples from Probe into NN19, so Subtractor eventually became my main synth. I grew to like it because it was so efficient that I could create synth stacks without worrying about maxing out my CPU. Stacking instruments was a monumental pain in the ass before Combinator came out, but I couldn't do anything like that with other soft synths at the time, and the results were worth the effort.

I switched to Thor and never really looked back after Reason 4. Some people say that they prefer Subtractor's snappier envelopes, but Thor's envelopes feel fine to me, and its oscillators and filters are just plain better. To this day, Thor is usually the first synth that I load up after opening Reason because it strikes such a good balance between flexibility, sound quality, and CPU efficiency.

Complex-1 is becoming my new favorite bass synth. It's also really good at SH101-style leads because it sounds better in the higher registers than Thor or Subtractor. If it was polyphonic, I would probably use it for pads too. The oscillator and filter sections sound incredible, and it's surprisingly light on the CPU. I love running it through Quartet to fatten up its already impressive oscillators.

[Reasonable man]

Over a year ago i bought fabfilter twin 2 to use as a subtractive synth over subtractor (was cheaper than antidote at that time) In fairness i dont think i will use subtractor again . To me , using it is more a reason thing than a professional thing..it needs too much work with inserts and doubling,trebling up etc. and i can still hear that thin screechiness. Some people like this about it.
Complex is my new fav synth (like most others here but the amp envelope is wholly inaccurate (maybe this is deliberate design/imitation thing) and is probably the cause of any retrigger problem...it's just a very dissapointing envelope all round..almost completley ineffective.

[Steedus]

the Wonderbas patch is my go to default bass patch.

[Oquasec]

The different waveforms that aren't the analog ones actually give a lot of interesting tones too...
Subtractor's only real drawback imo was the preloaded waveforms.

[NostraDAWmus]

nothing software is irreplacable,- only hardware is.

P.

[moneykube]

subtractor is a low cpu use workhorse... very usable then and now... would be nice to change waveforms so I'm still hoping for a version 2 but won't hold my breath... I guy can dream

[ShelLuser]

I don't use it often anymore but I definitely wouldn't want to miss out on it. Modern synths may have a better sound, but just as you said: they're usually also more difficult to set up which is where Subtractor can shine.

[Oquasec]

Gets less use cuz of 50 other synths.
But it's quick for dialing in the usual.

[jlgrimes]

Subtractor is a very old softsynth but it can sound surprisingly solid in certain applications. It works particularly well for bass, even basic leads, and pads it can do a decent job. It definitely isn't the cleanest sounding synth. It has some of the qualities we used to associate with "bad" digital, aliasing, grainy etc, but that probably adds to some of its character.