Reason now the eurorack of software?

[BRIGGS]

[Carpainter]

Eurorack is the hardware version of Reason.

[buddard]

I would argue that VCV Rack is the closest thing we have to Eurorack in software. And around 2.0 they will release a VST plugin version!

[Jackjackdaw]

Trouble with using Reason as a modular setup is that all the utilities are buried in devices that have a different primary function. Need an envelope follower? Hack a Pulveriser or a Neptune or something. Need a cycling envelope? Hack a Europa. Need a uni-polar lfo from Pulsar? Forget about it. Reason has excellent modulation routing throughout but it's not a modular synth in the same way Eurorack is.

[Carpainter]

I would argue that VCV Rack is the closest thing we have to Eurorack in software. And around 2.0 they will release a VST plugin version!

Yeah, VCV Rack is essentially a Eurorack emulator, but Reason is the closest you can get to a modular hardware setup in DAW form. No other DAW developer has felt the need to emulate the look and feel of a modular hardware interface. Instead, they all seem content to make DAWs that mostly look and feel like computer programs rather than environments to create music.

[scratchnsnifff]

I would argue that VCV Rack is the closest thing we have to Eurorack in software. And around 2.0 they will release a VST plugin version!

Yeah, VCV Rack is essentially a Eurorack emulator, but Reason is the closest you can get to a modular hardware setup in DAW form. No other DAW developer has felt the need to emulate the look and feel of a modular hardware interface. Instead, they all seem content to make DAWs that mostly look and feel like computer programs rather than environments to create music.

i one hundred percent agree.

thats one of the smaller reasons as to why i stuck with reason over logic or ableton.

i was going to get logic, but i didn't want a mac
ableton seemed like a terrible place for learning synths/effects/sequencers

the cool thing about reason is that it is an actual studio and everything looks like actual equipment.
some of the newer synths stray from the realism of the older synths. but either way, reason is definitely the most user friendly for beginners.

as for the modular side of it all, id actually say yes. it is a modular environment. maybe not 100000000% spot on with a eurorack system. but the idea of modular (everything speaks with everything else), this is why i think of it as an actual modular DAW.

its not limited to just modulation signals. you can route Gate and Note CV to have one synth control others, you can have audio split between synths.

all of the key elements of what makes modular environments modular.

also, reason is my favorite because it has the best stock synths/effects imo.
ableton has a way better selection of stock effects, but i can't find any better stock synths. FL studio is 2nd place for stock synths (also has some really nice Fx as well)

but FL also has computer feel to it.
reason is the only environment that is welcoming to a new comer everything is well thought out and it all makes sense. you have the rack, mixer and sequencer .
use the rack to build synths, sequencer to play the synths/automation, and use the mixer for send/return FX and other mixing purposes. Reason is just the most complicatedly simple program. this is why i love it. lol hope i didn't ramble too much. it is an interesting topic though

[ShelLuser]

IMO Reason has always been the Eurorack of software, I felt this way ever since I started off with Reason 4. Its whole modular setup was actually one of the main reasons why I bought Reason 4 even though I already had Live 8 Suite (+ Max for Live) at my disposal (well, that and Malstr0m).

I can do tons within Live and for me Push (2) + Live is the ultimate combo, especially if you add Reason into that mix. But I can do stuff in Reason which I can't (easily) do in Live. And one huge aspect of that are the virtual cables. It's so much better if you can really visualize what you're doing (like re-routing signals) using cables (even virtual ones) in comparison to a routing matrix or routing controls (such as in Live).

[Oquasec]

Reaktor, Softtube & Reason have been around FOREVER

[Reasonable man]

I dont know if you can send notes to track with other eurorack workflows or software systems.Maybe, maybe not.
I love the sound engineering modules. Watch alot of the hardware videos and try imitiating the voltage block module in particular by using the Psq .Its totally doable..... and all the wiring and cv functions are there with some workarounds so i think there is just about enough there . Talking the signal through something like delta to polish or change things further i guess is something that would be alot harder achieved in the hardware world too

[kinkujin]

I would argue that Reason software is way to inexpensive to be considered that eurorack of software.

[spazione]

With reason you can't build a synth from scratch with all the classic components like VCOs, VCFs, ENVs, VCAs, etc, etc If you take this aspetc you can't consider Reason as modular synth software. Only the Complex-1 Modular Synthesizer is something that comes close to the eurorack world... but it has very few components compared to the Eurorack world or VCV rack

[integerpoet]

I would argue that Reason software is way to inexpensive to be considered that eurorack of software.

This forum needs a like button.

[lowtom]

With reason you can't build a synth from scratch with all the classic components like VCOs, VCFs, ENVs, VCAs, etc, etc If you take this aspetc you can't consider Reason as modular synth software. Only the Complex-1 Modular Synthesizer is something that comes close to the eurorack world... but it has very few components compared to the Eurorack world or VCV rack

I strongly disagree. Flip the rack with the Tab button and CV madness awaits you, where only limit is your imagination.
Almost any device can be treated as "classic components" source with LFO's, Oscilators, Envelopes and so on.

[bxbrkrz]

[aeox]

With reason you can't build a synth from scratch with all the classic components like VCOs, VCFs, ENVs, VCAs, etc

You can!

[miscend]

I would argue that VCV Rack is the closest thing we have to Eurorack in software. And around 2.0 they will release a VST plugin version!

This ^

[rorystorm]

Just watched vcv rack's promo for its v2 release in November. It'll be us$99 for the studio version on sale and us$149 afters. Worth it? I'm undecided. Theres some great sounding modules in there but its real power is in the various sequencers and modulating devices like the Turing machine but I'm not sure how they'd work in the Reason vst environment. On the other hand some of the Mutable Objects devices are incredible. So...... what to do.

[Faastwalker]

There’s an obvious comparison due to Reason’s virtual cabling technology, which of course we’ve had from day 1. These days software like VCV Rack, Softube Modular, Reaktor Blocks, Cherry Audio Voltage Modular (there are quite a few out there now) are more direct comparisons to Eurorack. But Reason pre-dates everything out there in software but quite a number of years. It’s definitely the original virtual modular software environment.

——————————————————————————————————

Another aspect of Reason, which is think is criminally overlooked and undersold, is its potential when directly integrated with Eurorack and indeed other synth hardware. I first saw this demonstrated by Peff around 12 years ago. In the video (see below) he is using Reason 4.0 to control his Oberheim SEM analogue synth via a DC coupled MOTU interface. I was blown away by this when I first saw it and wanted to try it ever since.

These days there are a lot more options to achieve this kind of set-up. I finally realised this idea a few years ago utilising an Expert Sleepers Eurorack module, an ADAT capable audio interface and some indispensable RE’s from RoboticBean, namely his CV-I/O bundle. With this setup the integration between Reason and Eurorack is phenomenally powerful …….. but it rarely gets a mention! I hear a lot more about (for example) Live’s CV Tools, similar in Bitwig and VCV used in this capacity. But very rarely Reason, even though it’s been capable of this forever!

Anyway, here’s the video from Peff from (uploaded June, 2009) demonstrating some of these ideas. I have been meaning to do some videos of my own demonstrating Reason used in conjunction with Eurorack. I really need to do this as there are very few demonstrations of this out there and it frustrates me because Reason is so bloody good at doing it and, as discussed, has been for a very, very long time;

[Catblack]

My eurorack is the eurorack of software.

I have like 3 O_Cs, 2 Dust of Time, 2 SMRs, Qu-Bit Nebulae, Electrosmith Daisy, Mutable Warps(x2), 2 flavors of Clouds, 3 Rings, Pam's New Workout, Braids, Plaits, Nutella Tsunami, Westlicht Performer, Grids, Yarns, Frames, Stages, several Peaks, a Temps Utile, and a uDervish. Some of those I built and flashed the chips myself.

I will say that I like having multiple versions of modules because Reason spoiled me.

I've also said many times that I got into eurorack because there was an 'existential disconnect' between my midi controllers and Reason. I much prefer the experimentation I get from tangible knob twisting on my eurorack. I probably can get to 80% of a nice enough sound, quickly, using Reason. But damn if staring at the screen and turning one knob at time (or worse, spending 1-2 minutes per rack extension trying to figure out what's remotemapped into what on screen,) isn't a DECADES long frustration for me.

[DJMaytag]

Trouble with using Reason as a modular setup is that all the utilities are buried in devices that have a different primary function. Need an envelope follower? Hack a Pulveriser or a Neptune or something. Need a cycling envelope? Hack a Europa. Need a uni-polar lfo from Pulsar? Forget about it. Reason has excellent modulation routing throughout but it's not a modular synth in the same way Eurorack is.

Get the CV Tools bundle. I have a massive Eurorack setup and send a shit ton of Reason CV to real world CV’s through a big Expert Sleepers hardware setup.

The CV Tools bundle is an absolute godsend for generating and manipulating CV’s. I don’t recall all the great utilities out there by name/dev, but next time I fire up my computer & Reason, I will make note of some of the essentials that do make Reason feel pretty damn close to like using real modular hardware.

[Jagwah]

I would argue that VCV Rack is the closest thing we have to Eurorack in software.

Agreed. Vcv rack and eurorack would both only have a small handful of people making actual music in the traditional sense.

My little city actually has a monthly modular synth meetup where you bring along your synth and have a jam for about 20 minutes while others listen. It's right in the heart of the City too. I only hear blips and bleeps but damn cool ones. It is usually filmed so if I remember I will post a link here to one of their YouTube videos.

[DJMaytag]

I would argue that VCV Rack is the closest thing we have to Eurorack in software.

Agreed. Vcv rack and eurorack would both only have a small handful of people making actual music in the traditional sense.

My little city actually has a monthly modular synth meetup where you bring along your synth and have a jam for about 20 minutes while others listen. It's right in the heart of the City too. I only hear blips and bleeps but damn cool ones. It is usually filmed so if I remember I will post a link here to one of their YouTube videos.

I"m glad to be close enough to Chicago to be able to hit up several different meetups, plus be able to go to Knobcon, which happened this past weekend.

These were some pics from my display table (Madisynths, see links in signature) at the convention:

Knobcon 1

64Br1Z4%TtmA4Vc6H5d30g_thumb_a2ef.jpg (355.4 KiB) Viewed 2161 times

Knobcon 2 - The Frequency Central display rack

odKPpEmYQjCHz7ZqObMokg_thumb_a2ea.jpg (395.69 KiB) Viewed 2161 times

Knobcon 3 - The BIG synths

H8SI6cv9S6+y5As3KQ4%OQ_thumb_a2f5.jpg (332.81 KiB) Viewed 2161 times

Good times this past weekend!

[DJMaytag]

To the "modular tools" question earlier:

Expert Sleepers Silent Way VST Suite. Sure, it's a VST and you do have to buy it if you want all of the tools available, but some of the basic VST's like their SW LFO plugin are awesome for creating differently shaped LFO's than what you'll find in Reason. Also, the LFO can sweep a full cycle across 128 bars, if not even longer, if you want VERY slow LFO's. I use their other plugins to send signals from Reason to the outside world via their ES-3, ES-5, 2x ESX8-CV's, 2x ESX-8GT's, and 2x ESX-8MD's Eurorack modules (there's also an ES-6 from bringing real world CV into Reason).

CV-I & CV-O from Robotic Bean. Hugely useful for taking audio signals and converting them to and from CV signals. Largely used with the Expert Sleepers stuff above (those plugins are all audio outputs that need to be converted to CV when used within Reason).

Tonic Mint CV Tools bundle EVERYONE should buy this bundle, and it's stupidly low priced for the value you get out of it. CV Pistons is a nod to DivKid's OCHD, but FAR more capable, especially considering it can be an octature LFO. Unipolar and bipolar outputs, which is nice to have them simultaneously available, unlike RS's Pulsar. CV Ranger is nice for when an RE/device doesn't have a way to shift/scale/offset its output. CV Origami is pretty cool to do wave shaping and other manipulations of CV. CV Pad... I haven't used yet, but when I get a controller that would work well with it, it appears to be capable of a lot of cool stuff. There's a couple more in this bundle, and they're all great tools.

VCA's. Lots to choose from here. Selig Gain, kHs Gain, Lectric Panda AMP, Modrack VCA, Andrew Russell's Dual CV Source, plus quite a few more.

[AttenuationHz]

This thread should really be other software. I would have to agree with RB and VCV Rack is actually modelled from Eurorack. Nothing even comes close to it not even Chery-Audio and Softube Modular or Reactor Blocks. Reason is no where near any of these both in terms of UI and from a complete Eurorack sandboxed experience and to gain all tools you must pay for them. Does Reason have sample and hold, quantizers for random signal generators, logic or comparator signal utilization, attenuators are locked into what devices have them and there is complete bottleneck from patching wires compared to all of the above plus it separates Control Voltage from Audio Signals, it is either or. Complex does try to compete with the other software but that too has its limitations and is in no way Eurorack, at best an inferior Reactor Blocks because you are still limited to the amount wires and connections you can make - it is also quite annoying to use compared to all of the above because you can't plug out from an output especially where cables are not stacked. The brilliant idea of bringing the back of the rack to front has never been expanded upon nor is it (correct me if I'm wrong) an option for the SDK, there would have been so many devices released with routing cables on the front if there was and Reason then would be competing with the many modules that are available both in Eurorack format and its software equivalence.

However if Reason completely opens up the back of the rack and allows all devices to be coupled to the back and add more CV options as well as the option to connect Audio and CV it would compete with all of the above, a combinator comes close to the experience but it fundamentally lacks what the others offer because of limitations to connections. There are devices with lots of CV on the back but in recent times CV connections have be sliding and slipping away because the vast majority of users simply do not know how to utilise it fully.

[Jagwah]

However if Reason completely opens up the back of the rack and allows all devices to be coupled to the back and add more CV options as well as the option to connect Audio and CV it would compete with all of the above, a combinator comes close to the experience but it fundamentally lacks what the others offer because of limitations to connections. There are devices with lots of CV on the back but in recent times CV connections have be sliding and slipping away because the vast majority of users simply do not know how to utilise it fully.

Not only that but RS seem to have been sadly phasing CV out over the past years. They have added nothing CV related, only third parties have and have done tremendous things there, the Players - no CV no where (yes Reason is incapable of polyphonic CV but the sentiment remains), the new Combinator only had a few CV ins when it could have EASILY had 64 inputs and even a bunch of outputs because why not unless there is some motive there, plus when was the last time they talked about how cool CV is in any of their videos / blogs?

I wish CV in Reason was embraced and encouraged especially by RS instead of sitting up the back collecting virtual dust. I can only assume kids see too much complication when they look at something like that, ipso facto, no CV from RS.