Announcing Reason 11

This forum is for discussing Propellerhead's music software. Questions, answers, ideas, and opinions... all apply.
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Jagwah
Posts: 1538
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

Reason 7 FTW

gbball
Posts: 1
Joined: 09 Sep 2019

Post 09 Sep 2019

Hi everyone,

This is my first post, but hopefully, it provides a bit of a different perspective from a lot of what I've read here.

First of all, I am primarily a visual artist and game developer who wanted to learn how to use a DAW to make game music and beats in 2015. I did an exhaustive search of all the DAWs that seemed popular at the time such as FL Studio, Studio One and Bit Wig which I tried out. I also consulted with my father in law who is a professional musician and read several reviews on all the top music sites. At the time I had no idea about anything to do with synthesis and very basic music theory (I didn't know what a chord or key was).

Anyways, I had messed around with Figure on my iPhone and played around with a few music-making apps on the iPad, but up until that point, that was the extent of my music-making experience.

After reading and trying everything, I was going to decide between Reason 8, Studio One and FL Studio. I really liked FL Studio and the fact that it had free updates and a bigger community. Studio One seemed interesting but I couldn't figure out how to get it working, and the same thing for Bit Wig. So it came down to Reason and FL Studio for me and the main deciding factor ended up being the modular nature of Reason. The routing, the ability to experiment and create seemed limitless. It felt like a great place to create while being simple enough to pick up and actually make something with. Also, the videos on the Reason website were very helpful for a beginner like me.

I've since invested more money in Rack Extensions than I'd like to admit, picked up a new DAW - Reaper - because I liked the price and how it works with audio better than Reason (also, it's nice to be able to export mp3s), and done every update in Reason which I still consider my main DAW. In the future, I might pick up FL Studio because I like the piano roll and the beat making system, but it still wouldn't be my main DAW because Reason is a powerhouse for creativity and it is clearly one of the most innovative DAWs on the market. I see people on here complaining about what it can't do, but it seems to me the opposite is true also and that Reason is the most unique DAW on the market.

I've been lucky in that through my short time with Reason, a lot of important updates have been made, such as VST support, the addition of wavetable synthesizers, the addition of Player Devices, and now the Reason rack as a VST. I think this is incredible and I don't see it as Reason throwing in the towel at all.

I often see people online who seem envious of certain Reason instruments and wish that they could buy them as VSTs and use them in their DAW of choice. Now they can. Also, another thing that people aren't talking about which I think is really brilliant. Reason has effectively found a way to decouple the Reason rack from the DAW which was probably a big barrier to making improvements on the DAW portion of the application. By virtue of separating the DAW and the Rack, they are now free to make a modern DAW that can compete with the others on the market. I'm not saying this will in fact happen, but all indications seem to point to that being the case. And worst-case scenario, if they don't you can use Reason's instruments in another DAW of your choice. For me, Reason and Reaper complement each other perfectly.

I have a history of using non-standard digital tools to do my work because I care a lot about the workflow. For that reason, I chose 3D Coat instead of Zbrush, TVPaint instead of Photoshop, Blender instead of Maya and more recently, Reason instead of Studio One/Live/FL Studio/Cubase/etc. Sure, the tools I use sometimes lack some of the bells and whistles of their more popular competitors, but they're often far more innovative and offer superior productivity in many situations. I definitely count Reason among that group and I would be hard-pressed to switch to something else permanently at this point.

So I for one and excited about the direction of Reason. I might investigate other DAWS in the future, but only because I think it's completely natural to use the appropriate tool for certain jobs. I do that with art software and I see no issue doing that with music software either. I think Reason just clicks with some people more than others, and for others, another DAW might fit better for them too, but at least now they can bring some of what they like in Reason with them.

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Loque
Posts: 5800
Joined: 28 Dec 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

Uhh... Nice comment. Yes, we often forget what Reason CAN do...

And very interesting statement about decoupling of the rack and the "DAW"...
:reason: 10, Win10 64Bit.

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miscend
Posts: 1312
Joined: 09 Feb 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

Proboscis wrote:
08 Sep 2019
Or for all we know, with the growth of billionaire businessmen in China, we might be seeing a sell off of Reason to a 'new rich' guy in Shanghai who wants to have a cool brand in his portfolio. It's not often that a DAW becomes available for sale.
Like the dot com multi millionaire that owns Reaper. For him Reaper is a personal labour of love and not about making money.

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boingy
Posts: 708
Joined: 01 Feb 2019

Post 09 Sep 2019

gbball wrote:
09 Sep 2019
Hi everyone,

This is my first post, but hopefully, it provides a bit of a different perspective from a lot of what I've read here.

First of all, I am primarily a visual artist and game developer who wanted to learn how to use a DAW to make game music and beats in 2015. I did an exhaustive search of all the DAWs that seemed popular at the time such as FL Studio, Studio One and Bit Wig which I tried out. I also consulted with my father in law who is a professional musician and read several reviews on all the top music sites. At the time I had no idea about anything to do with synthesis and very basic music theory (I didn't know what a chord or key was).

Anyways, I had messed around with Figure on my iPhone and played around with a few music-making apps on the iPad, but up until that point, that was the extent of my music-making experience.

After reading and trying everything, I was going to decide between Reason 8, Studio One and FL Studio. I really liked FL Studio and the fact that it had free updates and a bigger community. Studio One seemed interesting but I couldn't figure out how to get it working, and the same thing for Bit Wig. So it came down to Reason and FL Studio for me and the main deciding factor ended up being the modular nature of Reason. The routing, the ability to experiment and create seemed limitless. It felt like a great place to create while being simple enough to pick up and actually make something with. Also, the videos on the Reason website were very helpful for a beginner like me.

I've since invested more money in Rack Extensions than I'd like to admit, picked up a new DAW - Reaper - because I liked the price and how it works with audio better than Reason (also, it's nice to be able to export mp3s), and done every update in Reason which I still consider my main DAW. In the future, I might pick up FL Studio because I like the piano roll and the beat making system, but it still wouldn't be my main DAW because Reason is a powerhouse for creativity and it is clearly one of the most innovative DAWs on the market. I see people on here complaining about what it can't do, but it seems to me the opposite is true also and that Reason is the most unique DAW on the market.

I've been lucky in that through my short time with Reason, a lot of important updates have been made, such as VST support, the addition of wavetable synthesizers, the addition of Player Devices, and now the Reason rack as a VST. I think this is incredible and I don't see it as Reason throwing in the towel at all.

I often see people online who seem envious of certain Reason instruments and wish that they could buy them as VSTs and use them in their DAW of choice. Now they can. Also, another thing that people aren't talking about which I think is really brilliant. Reason has effectively found a way to decouple the Reason rack from the DAW which was probably a big barrier to making improvements on the DAW portion of the application. By virtue of separating the DAW and the Rack, they are now free to make a modern DAW that can compete with the others on the market. I'm not saying this will in fact happen, but all indications seem to point to that being the case. And worst-case scenario, if they don't you can use Reason's instruments in another DAW of your choice. For me, Reason and Reaper complement each other perfectly.

I have a history of using non-standard digital tools to do my work because I care a lot about the workflow. For that reason, I chose 3D Coat instead of Zbrush, TVPaint instead of Photoshop, Blender instead of Maya and more recently, Reason instead of Studio One/Live/FL Studio/Cubase/etc. Sure, the tools I use sometimes lack some of the bells and whistles of their more popular competitors, but they're often far more innovative and offer superior productivity in many situations. I definitely count Reason among that group and I would be hard-pressed to switch to something else permanently at this point.

So I for one and excited about the direction of Reason. I might investigate other DAWS in the future, but only because I think it's completely natural to use the appropriate tool for certain jobs. I do that with art software and I see no issue doing that with music software either. I think Reason just clicks with some people more than others, and for others, another DAW might fit better for them too, but at least now they can bring some of what they like in Reason with them.
Welcome matey. I'm a bit worried that you might be a bit too rational and balanced for this forum but stick around and we'll see if we can assimilate you into one of the two groups of RT users.

The first group think that Propellerhead can do no wrong, are positive about anything new and will gladly hand over the cash for it. The second group have actually, literally and actually-literally been slapped in the face, have been betrayed and are absolutely disgusted by a software update that is not even released yet.

As far as I can tell that's it. That's your choice. There is no middle ground, although I suppose you could be the first of a new breed. I suppose.... :D

RobBarnett
Posts: 26
Joined: 15 Jul 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

Loque wrote:
09 Sep 2019
Uhh... Nice comment. Yes, we often forget what Reason CAN do...

And very interesting statement about decoupling of the rack and the "DAW"...
I'm predicting this too. See my posts from the 'Predicting 4 future moves of Reason Studios' thread;


1. Rebuild all native devices as REs
2. Introduce VST3 support into the Reason DAW
3. Remove the Reason Rack from the Reason DAW completely
4. Sell the Reason Rack VST and Reason DAW as 2 separate products


I think the base code for Reason is too old and difficult to maintain/update (Hence, the slow progress with updates and only small improvements). They've already mastered porting 'plugin' code to multiple platforms (as seen with Europa as a RE and now RACK as VST).
So i could see that if they split the Rack off as VST only, they could rewrite the Reason DAW as a stand alone product altogether (with all of the bells and whistles).

Proboscis
Posts: 92
Joined: 28 Aug 2019

Post 09 Sep 2019

boingy wrote:
09 Sep 2019
The first group think that Propellerhead can do no wrong, are positive about anything new and will gladly hand over the cash for it. The second group have actually, literally and actually-literally been slapped in the face, have been betrayed and are absolutely disgusted by a software update that is not even released yet.
That's a little too black & white. I am on Reason 10, and do not subscribe to the notion of upgrading simply because it's on offer. But I don't feel disgusted or betrayed. I'm just not upgrading until there's a compelling enough feature set to justify it, or a need to exchange projects with Reason 11 users.

No amount of stamping my feet or having a moan on public forums is going to change how they roll out upgrades. Make no mistake, I too have my small and very reasonable wishlist, but it hasn't happened yet, so be it. Nobody is forcing us to upgrade. Nothing will change the way we work at present. And no money is changing hands. The world keeps turning.

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gullum
Posts: 473
Joined: 15 Jan 2015
Location: Faroe Islands

Post 09 Sep 2019

Proboscis wrote:
09 Sep 2019
And no money is changing hands. The world keeps turning.
Maybe that's it :D they need an excuse to spend money but Reason is not a big enough reason this update so they get frustrated that they have money to burn

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Kalm
Posts: 245
Joined: 03 Jun 2016
Location: Austin

Post 09 Sep 2019

QVprod wrote:
08 Sep 2019
Kalm wrote:
08 Sep 2019
people weren't severely upset from 8 upwards cause they were tackling major issues with each release. People were unhappy with the lack of feedback implemented in the DAWs as competition rose, seeing an example of S1 completely start from the ground up and being where it is.
You may not have been around during the PUF days before ReasonTalk. Trust me people were equally as upset about 8 then as they seem about 11 here.

Again though, I think there’s too much personal connection people have with Reason. I can understand wanting to see where software goes. I held off on buying VSTs for a bit when RE was announced. And then I decided to buy things I needed after I saw the pace it was developing at; because why limit myself? Waiting through multiple versions hoping what you want gets added is clearly a frustrating experience, but seems that’s a common thread here.
I've been browsing these forums actually since before you became moderator :shock: I just never really spoke until around Reason 9 came out. A real stalker :geek:

Anywho that consensus is correct and I remember being disappointed of Reason 8 but simply wanted the new look. That jump for ME personally was beneficial. Like an old/new version of Acid Studio. But for each upgrade, I still understood everyones complaints. They took the PT path which is one reason why I don't deal with Avid anymore. But if you say there's too much "personal connection" . . . what connection should they have? Should a violinist not have a deep love for their violin? A singer and their voice?
Courtesy of The Brew | Mac Mini Intel i7 Quad-Core | 8 GB RAM | Apple 1 TB & Samsung 850 EVO 250 GB | Reason 10 | Studio One 3 Professional | Ozone 7 | Pro Tools 12 | Adobe CC | Presonus FireStudio Project | M-Audio Axiom | And many plugs

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Kalm
Posts: 245
Joined: 03 Jun 2016
Location: Austin

Post 09 Sep 2019

RobBarnett wrote:
09 Sep 2019
Loque wrote:
09 Sep 2019
Uhh... Nice comment. Yes, we often forget what Reason CAN do...

And very interesting statement about decoupling of the rack and the "DAW"...
I'm predicting this too. See my posts from the 'Predicting 4 future moves of Reason Studios' thread;


1. Rebuild all native devices as REs
2. Introduce VST3 support into the Reason DAW
3. Remove the Reason Rack from the Reason DAW completely
4. Sell the Reason Rack VST and Reason DAW as 2 separate products


I think the base code for Reason is too old and difficult to maintain/update (Hence, the slow progress with updates and only small improvements). They've already mastered porting 'plugin' code to multiple platforms (as seen with Europa as a RE and now RACK as VST).
So i could see that if they split the Rack off as VST only, they could rewrite the Reason DAW as a stand alone product altogether (with all of the bells and whistles).
If they do this I'm all in
Courtesy of The Brew | Mac Mini Intel i7 Quad-Core | 8 GB RAM | Apple 1 TB & Samsung 850 EVO 250 GB | Reason 10 | Studio One 3 Professional | Ozone 7 | Pro Tools 12 | Adobe CC | Presonus FireStudio Project | M-Audio Axiom | And many plugs

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antic604
Posts: 2265
Joined: 23 Oct 2017
Location: Warsaw, Poland

Post 09 Sep 2019

RobBarnett wrote:
09 Sep 2019
I think the base code for Reason is too old and difficult to maintain/update (Hence, the slow progress with updates and only small improvements). They've already mastered porting 'plugin' code to multiple platforms (as seen with Europa as a RE and now RACK as VST).So i could see that if they split the Rack off as VST only, they could rewrite the Reason DAW as a stand alone product altogether (with all of the bells and whistles).
That sounds reasonable, although the main problem for me would be getting rid of what's unique about Reason's BUILT-IN rack - that you can patch audio & CV (and MIDI to some extent) between devices from different tracks, which you won't be able to do if rack was decoupled from the sequencer, the same way you can't hook up Serum's LFO to Echoboy's wet/dry knob.
Bitwig 3 // Reason 10 // Studio One 4 Pro @ Lenovo Y730 15'' i7-8750h
my music - https://soundcloud.com/antic604
other stuff - "Psytrance in Bitwig Studio" tutorial

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artotaku
Posts: 462
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Location: Munich, Germany

Post 09 Sep 2019

RobBarnett wrote:
09 Sep 2019


I'm predicting this too. See my posts from the 'Predicting 4 future moves of Reason Studios' thread;


1. Rebuild all native devices as REs
2. Introduce VST3 support into the Reason DAW
3. Remove the Reason Rack from the Reason DAW completely
4. Sell the Reason Rack VST and Reason DAW as 2 separate products


I think the base code for Reason is too old and difficult to maintain/update (Hence, the slow progress with updates and only small improvements). They've already mastered porting 'plugin' code to multiple platforms (as seen with Europa as a RE and now RACK as VST).
So i could see that if they split the Rack off as VST only, they could rewrite the Reason DAW as a stand alone product altogether (with all of the bells and whistles).
Since the rack has been there before the main sequencer existed I assume that the code base is already quite separated and abstracted by a "facade" or layer if they did it properly from a software engineering perspective. I assume the same for the main mixer code-wise btw.

Regarding your first point: I think by moving code from the (native) main mixer channel strips to RE devices (EQ, compressor) there is a now a precedence for what you predict. So it is not unlikely that this could happen for other native devices as well, especially when the graphics layer has to be redone as soon as 4K resolution will be supported (I´m very convinced this will come for the rack). There may be some risk introducing bugs ofc, since e. g. refactoring Thor as a RE may be quite daunting technically.

To me it sounds quite sensible way to go what you predict. Let´s see what they will come up with :-)

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guitfnky
Posts: 1266
Joined: 19 Jan 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

Loque wrote:
09 Sep 2019
Yes, we often forget what Reason CAN do...
couldn’t disagree more. the reason people complain about the things Reason can’t do is precisely because of what they love about it—what it CAN do.

otherwise they’d just stop using it altogether.

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QVprod
Posts: 2316
Joined: 15 Jan 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

Kalm wrote:
09 Sep 2019
QVprod wrote:
08 Sep 2019


You may not have been around during the PUF days before ReasonTalk. Trust me people were equally as upset about 8 then as they seem about 11 here.

Again though, I think there’s too much personal connection people have with Reason. I can understand wanting to see where software goes. I held off on buying VSTs for a bit when RE was announced. And then I decided to buy things I needed after I saw the pace it was developing at; because why limit myself? Waiting through multiple versions hoping what you want gets added is clearly a frustrating experience, but seems that’s a common thread here.
I've been browsing these forums actually since before you became moderator :shock: I just never really spoke until around Reason 9 came out. A real stalker :geek:

Anywho that consensus is correct and I remember being disappointed of Reason 8 but simply wanted the new look. That jump for ME personally was beneficial. Like an old/new version of Acid Studio. But for each upgrade, I still understood everyones complaints. They took the PT path which is one reason why I don't deal with Avid anymore. But if you say there's too much "personal connection" . . . what connection should they have? Should a violinist not have a deep love for their violin? A singer and their voice?
Ah ok, by the time ReasonTalk got started, the Reason 8 hate had died down a bit, or rather was redirected at Props for shutting down the PUF (their forum). But you do remember a fairly negative consensus.

I think the connection you have with a violin or even more so with your own voice is different than with software. Software is a tool. That's not to say you can't love Reason, but not to the point that you refuse to 'cheat on it' with a another DAW that may offer functionality that Reason doesn't. Not speaking of you specifically, but when people are willing to go without features they not just want, but really need and wait versions hoping that it gets added to be frustrated when those features aren't, I think that connection is too personal. The feeling of betrayal, and dissertations written here about the doom of Reason are reflective of that. The response from users that may not care for the upgrade but don't have that same level of personal connection , is not nearly as intense. On the other hand, as I too don't care for AVID, what AVID did to ProTools HD users in putting PT11 HD behind a $3000 or more pay wall to upgrade would feel far more like a betrayal than anything Propellerhead has done.

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guitfnky
Posts: 1266
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Post 09 Sep 2019

QVprod wrote:
09 Sep 2019
Software is a tool.
so is any physical instrument.

having a personal connection to a tool is something that inevitably will develop with consistent use. it’s not just with musical tools either. the more you use your tennis racket, the more it acts as an extension of your body. just because the connection is abstracted a bit with software doesn’t make it feel less like an extension of us, if we’re practiced in its use.

I couldn’t tell you off the top of my head the different key bindings I use regularly, but when I need them, my fingers just do them. that kind of familiarity is bound to give us a sense of connection to our tools, be they software, instrument, or any other kind.

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Oquasec
Posts: 2412
Joined: 05 Mar 2017

Post 09 Sep 2019

Tbh I'm liking Cubase more and more as time goes on.
altho I think wit for midi missing is crazy
Producer/Sound Designer.
Since Reason loses it's sequencer I don't see the point in skipping.

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Kalm
Posts: 245
Joined: 03 Jun 2016
Location: Austin

Post 09 Sep 2019

QVprod wrote:
09 Sep 2019
Kalm wrote:
09 Sep 2019


I've been browsing these forums actually since before you became moderator :shock: I just never really spoke until around Reason 9 came out. A real stalker :geek:

Anywho that consensus is correct and I remember being disappointed of Reason 8 but simply wanted the new look. That jump for ME personally was beneficial. Like an old/new version of Acid Studio. But for each upgrade, I still understood everyones complaints. They took the PT path which is one reason why I don't deal with Avid anymore. But if you say there's too much "personal connection" . . . what connection should they have? Should a violinist not have a deep love for their violin? A singer and their voice?
Ah ok, by the time ReasonTalk got started, the Reason 8 hate had died down a bit, or rather was redirected at Props for shutting down the PUF (their forum). But you do remember a fairly negative consensus.

I think the connection you have with a violin or even more so with your own voice is different than with software. Software is a tool. That's not to say you can't love Reason, but not to the point that you refuse to 'cheat on it' with a another DAW that may offer functionality that Reason doesn't. Not speaking of you specifically, but when people are willing to go without features they not just want, but really need and wait versions hoping that it gets added to be frustrated when those features aren't, I think that connection is too personal. The feeling of betrayal, and dissertations written here about the doom of Reason are reflective of that. The response from users that may not care for the upgrade but don't have that same level of personal connection , is not nearly as intense. On the other hand, as I too don't care for AVID, what AVID did to ProTools HD users in putting PT11 HD behind a $3000 or more pay wall to upgrade would feel far more like a betrayal than anything Propellerhead has done.
I agree. I can live with Reason as it is right now and I'm sure people can who are lavishly upset. It's just a matter of Reason is not just RS software. It's our software and I think that's what its coming down to. As upset as I am I'll be upgrading but not to suite and that's a first for me not using it as a primary DAW. I don't believe Reason is 'doomed' but if they don't think of something, I feel as though the body of users they're gaining now will simply repeat the process when their new car isn't as shiny anymore.

And that Browser masquerade kinda had me kinda uneasy as well. I didn't think it was the doom though.
Courtesy of The Brew | Mac Mini Intel i7 Quad-Core | 8 GB RAM | Apple 1 TB & Samsung 850 EVO 250 GB | Reason 10 | Studio One 3 Professional | Ozone 7 | Pro Tools 12 | Adobe CC | Presonus FireStudio Project | M-Audio Axiom | And many plugs

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QVprod
Posts: 2316
Joined: 15 Jan 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

guitfnky wrote:
09 Sep 2019
QVprod wrote:
09 Sep 2019
Software is a tool.
so is any physical instrument.

having a personal connection to a tool is something that inevitably will develop with consistent use. it’s not just with musical tools either. the more you use your tennis racket, the more it acts as an extension of your body. just because the connection is abstracted a bit with software doesn’t make it feel less like an extension of us, if we’re practiced in its use.

I couldn’t tell you off the top of my head the different key bindings I use regularly, but when I need them, my fingers just do them. that kind of familiarity is bound to give us a sense of connection to our tools, be they software, instrument, or any other kind.
The connection people have with stringed instruments in particular is a bit different. Guitar players name their guitars. I didn’t say that you can’t have a personal connection at all. Connection is how you choose to use something in the first place. I mentioned some are probably a bit too connected.

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hurricane
Posts: 830
Joined: 14 Oct 2017

Post 09 Sep 2019

QVprod wrote:
09 Sep 2019

The connection people have with stringed instruments in particular is a bit different. Guitar players name their guitars. I didn’t say that you can’t have a personal connection at all. Connection is how you choose to use something in the first place. I mentioned some are probably a bit too connected.
Sometimes when i wipe down my DX7, the lines get crossed between a simple cleaning and a seductive massage. 😶
https://soundcloud.com/hurricane-music
Mac mini (Late 2012) | macOS Mojave | Logic Pro X | Pro Tools | Reason | DX7 | DX7s | TX7 | CZ-1 | Steinberg UR22mkII | Emagic AMT 8 | Mackie SR24x4 | StudioLogic SL 990 PRO

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Crumbfort
Posts: 116
Joined: 20 May 2018

Post 09 Sep 2019

Ufda... It's childish I know, but I'll admit that I'm dying to get into the beta to test out the Rack VST in Reaper. Got my beta sign-up confirmation email on Aug 26 @ 7:26 AM Central time... hoping it's soon! :puf_bigsmile:

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miscend
Posts: 1312
Joined: 09 Feb 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

Can beta testers mention that Monotone and Rytmik are not included the user manual.

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miscend
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Joined: 09 Feb 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

Looks like I'll get the box version

Image

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QVprod
Posts: 2316
Joined: 15 Jan 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

hurricane wrote:
09 Sep 2019
QVprod wrote:
09 Sep 2019

The connection people have with stringed instruments in particular is a bit different. Guitar players name their guitars. I didn’t say that you can’t have a personal connection at all. Connection is how you choose to use something in the first place. I mentioned some are probably a bit too connected.
Sometimes when i wipe down my DX7, the lines get crossed between a simple cleaning and a seductive massage. 😶
Perfect example! :lol:

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MattiasHG
Posts: 282
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 09 Sep 2019

miscend wrote:
09 Sep 2019
Can beta testers mention that Monotone and Rytmik are not included the user manual.
They will be, the manual is not quite done yet.

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boingy
Posts: 708
Joined: 01 Feb 2019

Post 09 Sep 2019

hurricane wrote:
09 Sep 2019

Sometimes when i wipe down my DX7, the lines get crossed between a simple cleaning and a seductive massage. 😶
That might be why it needs wiping down so often. :shock:

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