Multi-timbral VST workarounds in Reason

[Boombastix]

I did a few more tests.

if you delete the device it crashes your whole session

Mostly, for me, only the VST crashed - so if you put it in don't remove it, or expect a VST crash that may or may not crash Reason. Not 100% reliable, 95% maybe?

crashes on load quite frequently from a saved project.

I was not able to get it to crash upon opening (Win 10). I had EzKeys sending midi to FM8.
But I can't figure out how to set up the preferences for midi channel setup in the standalone version (and if/how it translates to the VST or not). Hmmm...

[adfielding]

Bit off-topic, how is the switch to Windows going and any luck getting your streaming stuff set back up? Last live streams were great! Gettin' itchin' for another.

Hey thanks! I still plan on getting back into it, life has just had a habit of getting in the way - I managed to get a solid set-up working in Windows on my old iMac before I fully made the switch, it was convoluted but worked perfectly. I need to get off my butt and get it set up again!

[Boombastix]

Blue Cat's rule too! Since the IL Minihost is now "unstable" in Reason (Reason crashes if you delete the VST) I tried the Blue Cat's PatchWork VST host. It comes in two versions FX and Instrument.
The instrument version is recommended for midi routing. They have a free demo version that has a short 1s silence once a minute.

For Midi work it is very flexible with its routing (but non-graphical - so RTFM ).
I can let it receive Midi from Reasons sequencer as usual by assigning a Midi lane to it.

But then any VST Midi can be routed anywhere. So you can set it up like this:
Midi ARP/Player VST - routed to VST Synth : VST Synth to Audio out (demo cuts out audio 1s per min)
Midi ARP/Player VST - routed to EzKeys (volume =0 if you don't want to hear EzKeys) : Once I have what I want in the Midi Player I just record that snipped into EzKeys and Drag-n-Drop it into Reasons sequencer.

This way I can hear the synth sound that I want (any VST synth) - and I get Midi into Reason.
Some VST Midi devices let you drag-n-drop directly, so then you obviously do not need EzKeys or any other VST Midi recording device. But just a few do that.
This worked so well that it doesn't even feel like a work around. Now all VST Midi players/arps/sequencers etc are available (I'm gonna test more VST players, but the first time this setup was tested, it just WORKED!)

[adfielding]

Blue Cat's rule too! Since the IL Minihost is now "unstable" in Reason (Reason crashes if you delete the VST) I tried the Blue Cat's PatchWork VST host. It comes in two versions FX and Instrument.
The instrument version is recommended for midi routing. They have a free demo version that has a short 1s silence once a minute.

Oh nice! I was tempted to try it out myself, but figured Element would serve me a bit better as a multi-purpose tool for my needs. PatchWork sounds really cool, glad to hear it's working out so well for you!

[Lempface]

Blue Cat's rule too! Since the IL Minihost is now "unstable" in Reason (Reason crashes if you delete the VST) I tried the Blue Cat's PatchWork VST host. It comes in two versions FX and Instrument.
The instrument version is recommended for midi routing. They have a free demo version that has a short 1s silence once a minute.

Oh nice! I was tempted to try it out myself, but figured Element would serve me a bit better as a multi-purpose tool for my needs. PatchWork sounds really cool, glad to hear it's working out so well for you!

The only two I know of that let you access midi ports directly though are Element and Bidule, which is a big thing if you're wanting to use multitimbral VSTs. The other hosts are just good for letting you insert midi effects.

[Boombastix]

The only two I know of that let you access midi ports directly though are Element and Bidule, which is a big thing if you're wanting to use multitimbral VSTs. The other hosts are just good for letting you insert midi effects.

Yes, so it seems, Blue Cat's won't do multitimbrality in Reason. I didn't expect Reson to change all incoming midi-channel numbers to channel 1. Why did they do that? The programmer must have been high on something...

[JonJ]

Gents. Haven't read through all of thread so this might have already been suggested but using Loopbe1, Midi-OX and Mystery Islands Virus Editor I am able to access Virus in full multitimbral mode. Place Editor in a Combinator and I can automate on any of 16 channels.
I would post a screenshot but can't figure out how to do it

[XysteR]

Gents. Haven't read through all of thread so this might have already been suggested but using Loopbe1, Midi-OX and Mystery Islands Virus Editor I am able to access Virus in full multitimbral mode. Place Editor in a Combinator and I can automate on any of 16 channels.
I would post a screenshot but can't figure out how to do it

Hi I'm really curious how you done this.

Did you install Loopbe1 and use MIDI OX to pass the MIDI to your MIDI interfaces IN and OUT? Do you have all 6 (3 Stereo) virus audio outs connected to an audio interface? I have, but I can only seem to get audio out of the first stereo audio channel.

I just bought the VIRUS HC Editor. The instructions on getting VIRUS HC working correctly in Reason are vague. I have the plugin installed and registered, I've also set the options in VIRUS HC to Virus Ti Series and set my hardware MIDI IN and MIDI OUT ports. I can then sync data from the Ti2 to the Editor no problem. But when I double click a patch in the editor it doesn't change in the Virus hardware so the sound doesn't change, it just stays on the existing patch in the hardware Virus.

I'm also curious how you have your combinator with the VIRUS HC plugin inside setup. Is there a way you could upload a project file somewhere for me to have a look?

[mcatalao]

@Adfielding,

Is the multipart that important? I mean, if you what the various parts to make the same, can you set them up in omni and they all play the same? If the idea is to have different lines, what is the benefit in having 4 instances, against 1 insance with 4 parts? Do you have a mixer with effects, or modulation between the parts?

@Spryx,

You can have sort of a real time export if needed, just tap in the master channel and print that to a new audio track. Just use the rec source button on the master and then create a stereo audio track, and use that as the source. Then just export that track with the master effects bypassed (because you already applied them in the real time pass).

Good Luck.

[adfielding]

@Adfielding,

Is the multipart that important? I mean, if you what the various parts to make the same, can you set them up in omni and they all play the same? If the idea is to have different lines, what is the benefit in having 4 instances, against 1 insance with 4 parts? Do you have a mixer with effects, or modulation between the parts?

Yep, the multipart aspect is pretty darn important - you can't have more than one instance of the actual Virus Ti VST running at once in a project, it just doesn't work. The only way to have access to (in my case) all four parts in one project is to use VST MIDI channels, a feature which is pretty standard in more or less every single other DAW out there. If I didn't have a workaround, I'd effectively be limited to only using one Virus part per track as opposed to 4. One of the things that appealed to me about picking up a Virus Ti was the software integration, so not having it work as expected would have been a pretty big deal for me.

[Oper-8]

Hey folks,
So sadly, I see there's still no easy and/or free solution for this feature...
I'm really upset with Reason Studios' attitude that leave us without so many features available in all other DAWs since day one... I guess multi-timbrality will still be misising in version 12. They announced workflow improvements, but of course, they didn't give any other details - as usual, as with every "announcement"...

Anyway, I really don't want to change my workflow and learn another DAW, and I especially won't purchase any other VST or whatever software element just to get a basic (for a DAW worthy of that name) MIDI feature.

The programmer must have been high on something...

I'm seriously thinking they're all high 24/7 in that company.

[adfielding]

Anyway, I really don't want to change my workflow and learn another DAW, and I especially won't purchase any other VST or whatever software element just to get a basic (for a DAW worthy of that name) MIDI feature

Element is free now, if you wanted to try it out. I'm not even salty about paying for it because it's actually been incredibly useful to have as a sort-of plug-in Swiss Army Knife

[Oper-8]

Well, it says $2 on the website. Anyway, thanks, but I don't want to spend one dime for a workaround that both Reason Studios and EastWest are aware of since years but consciously hide and avoid talking about or even admitting.

[XysteR]

Anyway, I really don't want to change my workflow and learn another DAW, and I especially won't purchase any other VST or whatever software element just to get a basic (for a DAW worthy of that name) MIDI feature

Element is free now, if you wanted to try it out. I'm not even salty about paying for it because it's actually been incredibly useful to have as a sort-of plug-in Swiss Army Knife

Hey Adam. For the Element workaround do you have to have the virus set as the main audio interface in Reason Prefs?

[adfielding]

Element is free now, if you wanted to try it out. I'm not even salty about paying for it because it's actually been incredibly useful to have as a sort-of plug-in Swiss Army Knife

Hey Adam. For the Element workaround do you have to have the virus set as the main audio interface in Reason Prefs?

It's been a while since I did this but no, I never used the Virus as my audio interface. In fact I don't think I've ever used the Virus as an audio interface!

[XysteR]

Hey Adam. For the Element workaround do you have to have the virus set as the main audio interface in Reason Prefs?

It's been a while since I did this but no, I never used the Virus as my audio interface. In fact I don't think I've ever used the Virus as an audio interface!

Yeah I've not used it as an audio interface either. I seem to have everything connected correctly within Element (as per your screenshots) LoopBe1 is installed and working. I have 3 external midi devices set to Loopbe and MIDI 1 2 and 3, but I can only get the Virus to respond on midi1, even If I drag the midi clip down to midi 2 or 3 the virus only responds to midi 1. It's got me scratching my head to say the least. Did I miss something in Reason prefs? The virus is only connected via USB. Maybe I have an incorrect setting in the virus.

[adfielding]

It's been a while since I did this but no, I never used the Virus as my audio interface. In fact I don't think I've ever used the Virus as an audio interface!

Yeah I've not used it as an audio interface either. I seem to have everything connected correctly within Element (as per your screenshots) LoopBe1 is installed and working. I have 3 external midi devices set to Loopbe and MIDI 1 2 and 3, but I can only get the Virus to respond on midi1, even If I drag the midi clip down to midi 2 or 3 the virus only responds to midi 1. It's got me scratching my head to say the least. Did I miss something in Reason prefs? The virus is only connected via USB. Maybe I have an incorrect setting in the virus.

I actually gave up on this solution a little while ago as, for me, LoopBe - and other virtual MIDI devices- just stopped working properly in Element. The frustration of trying to get the Virus working in Reason again (I spent about a day on it) encouraged me to try using it in Cubase instead, where it worked flawlessly straight away.

I realise that's probably not a huge help to you if you want to keep using Reason, but that's where I ended up!

[XysteR]

Yeah I've not used it as an audio interface either. I seem to have everything connected correctly within Element (as per your screenshots) LoopBe1 is installed and working. I have 3 external midi devices set to Loopbe and MIDI 1 2 and 3, but I can only get the Virus to respond on midi1, even If I drag the midi clip down to midi 2 or 3 the virus only responds to midi 1. It's got me scratching my head to say the least. Did I miss something in Reason prefs? The virus is only connected via USB. Maybe I have an incorrect setting in the virus.

I actually gave up on this solution a little while ago as, for me, LoopBe - and other virtual MIDI devices- just stopped working properly in Element. The frustration of trying to get the Virus working in Reason again (I spent about a day on it) encouraged me to try using it in Cubase instead, where it worked flawlessly straight away.

I realise that's probably not a huge help to you if you want to keep using Reason, but that's where I ended up!

I've just gave it this afternoon. I tried Loopbe1, MidiOX and loopmidi. Same result. Yet if i enable the virtual keyboard in Element and switch through channels 1/3 it works. The only conclusion i can come up with is Reason 'Midi Out Device' is only allowing 1 midi channel when using any system-wide virtual midi loopback devices.

Epic pain in the pants. I'm really pretty tempted to buy Ableton or Cubase and just use the Reason VST for the players etc, but we shouldn't be jumping through these hoops in the first place. Along with yourself and a lot of others, I've been asking for years for multi-timbral midi. I guess for them to code the sequencer to cope with real midi is just too much for them to pull it up with all other DAWs. Sighs....

[XysteR]

Yeah I've not used it as an audio interface either. I seem to have everything connected correctly within Element (as per your screenshots) LoopBe1 is installed and working. I have 3 external midi devices set to Loopbe and MIDI 1 2 and 3, but I can only get the Virus to respond on midi1, even If I drag the midi clip down to midi 2 or 3 the virus only responds to midi 1. It's got me scratching my head to say the least. Did I miss something in Reason prefs? The virus is only connected via USB. Maybe I have an incorrect setting in the virus.

I actually gave up on this solution a little while ago as, for me, LoopBe - and other virtual MIDI devices- just stopped working properly in Element. The frustration of trying to get the Virus working in Reason again (I spent about a day on it) encouraged me to try using it in Cubase instead, where it worked flawlessly straight away.

I realise that's probably not a huge help to you if you want to keep using Reason, but that's where I ended up!

Guys I've managed to get my Virus Ti2 working in Reason Suite so i made a Youtube video to explain the process. It can also be found in the Tutorial section in this forum too. Please note: When you click 'Save' shortly after 3:40 in the video, click 'Scan' in the top left.

Here you go: https://youtu.be/myRibw44knY