Poll: What would you like to see Props focus on going forward?

[josiah]

I did REs and Reason 11 Sequencer/Workflow. I like Propellerhead REs (I was reminded of this working with the PX7 last night) and it's nice if people can buy what they want and ignore what they don't, whereas stock devices you have no choice.

I like the "idea" of updating stock devices, but having to keep backwards compatibility makes it pretty tedious. New devices has to be the way to go. Probably eventually we'll need some features to hide devices we feel have been eclipsed....

[GRIFTY]

I voted for the top 2: I wanted to vote for all of the top 4..... Glad to see we're all on the same page

[Jagwah]

Results are in amigo, what's left to ponder?

[Undistraction]

I voted for the top 2: I wanted to vote for all of the top 4..... Glad to see we're all on the same page

We might be on the same page, but Propellerhead are on a different page, in a book written in a different language, on the shelf of a different library.

[altron]

blur the line between studio and Starbucks.

Ugh! I vomited slightly in my mouth reading this part.

[stratatonic]

But dispite of what polls show I suspect Mobile Integration and Reason Compact will be exactly where Propellerhead is going to put a lot of there focus. It's just where things are headed.

Chris Randall of AudioDamage was interviewed a couple days ago:
https://theaudioprogrammer.com/the-audi ... io-damage/

"...iOS...holds its weight...we make a fair chunk of our yearly income from that format alone...the numbers are huge...iOS outsells desktop 8:1"

AudioDamage sells their iOS plugins at 10% of what they sell their desktop products.

[stratatonic]

AudioDamage sells their iOS plugins at 10% of what they sell their desktop products.

If Propellerhead followed that pricing, then Reason Compact would be 300 dollars on desktop for Monotone, Rytmyk, Europa and 8 bar loop.

[Ermitage]

Cloud streaming so I can use 100x Expanse in a single project ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ

[chaosroyale]

Yikes, just came back to check on the poll, and the extreme gap between the results surprised me (pleasantly).

I'm firmly in the "advanced sound design and powerful tools" camp, so I was very happy to see that lots of people want upgrades to devices.

As for the Sequencer/Workflow - Maybe the taste of smoother workflow features in 10.2 got everyone excited for similar updates in R11?

Does the vision of Reason users match up with the vision of props in the future? Who knows.

I like Reason because I like the never ending modularity, power and flexibility. I think there are other applications that are much better for quick or generic results, but they suck for advanced sound design, and there is still nothing as inspiring as Reason for deep experimentation. *Well, Bitwig and Ableton are catching up fast, but I'd hate Reason to lose the edge (partly because I hate Ableton's GUI so much).

But maybe the market doesn't need users like me anymore. I think R11 will be a very interesting release.

[reddust]

But dispite of what polls show I suspect Mobile Integration and Reason Compact will be exactly where Propellerhead is going to put a lot of there focus. It's just where things are headed.

Chris Randall of AudioDamage was interviewed a couple days ago:
https://theaudioprogrammer.com/the-audi ... io-damage/

"...iOS...holds its weight...we make a fair chunk of our yearly income from that format alone...the numbers are huge...iOS outsells desktop 8:1"

AudioDamage sells their iOS plugins at 10% of what they sell their desktop products.

I hope PHs doesn't go that mobile path as intense as to leave other things kind of unattended, it would be actually one of the few reasons for me to think about moving to a different DAW.

I mean, I'm ok with them developing mobile apps for that part of the market, but if they save on development investment for desktop users in favor of mobile integration to a point it's too noticeable and we need to wait for basic improvements on pc while seeing how new PHs iOS apps appear in the market I would definitely consider going to another DAW, not because of hurt feelings but because it doesn't make sense for me to invest my money on a DAW that would concentrate too much in the mobile integration.

[Creativemind]

As I love polls I voted for 'Reason 11 Sequencer/Workflow' and 'Reason 11 Update stock devices (combinator, fx, etc)' with strong point on updating Combinator.

Same.

[two shoes]

I voted for hi-res gui (hopefully accompanied by modernized gui manipulation) and sequencer but you didn't even include the thing that's more important to me than everything on this list put together - full VST support. right now Reason kinda sorta works with some VSTs but only if they aren't the latest standard, or use midi, or have more than 16 outs, etc - and in my experience about 1 in 4 VST 2.4 plugins will just randomly fail to load or even be recognized by Reason (a problem that's new since the performance update). what we currently have is partial support for older VSTs and even this is broken in some respects. at a minimum there needs to be support for VST 3 and midi io before anyone can honestly say Reason "supports" VSTs.

[reggie1979]

@pricing and income:

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I don't care. IOS is NOT what Reason is and Reason is my main host. Does that mean I think they should cease and desist? Of course not. It's just that there are a ton of people who care about workflow and such and not really that large a market share of itoys.

I say go for both.

[gullum]

Reason is great just make it great, so I voted for the sequencer and new devices. My personal opinion is Reason should never have gotten VST on build the RE platform more.

[stratatonic]

Chris Randall of AudioDamage was interviewed a couple days ago:
https://theaudioprogrammer.com/the-audi ... io-damage/

"...iOS...holds its weight...we make a fair chunk of our yearly income from that format alone...the numbers are huge...iOS outsells desktop 8:1"

AudioDamage sells their iOS plugins at 10% of what they sell their desktop products.

I hope PHs doesn't go that mobile path as intense as to leave other things kind of unattended, it would be actually one of the few reasons for me to think about moving to a different DAW.

I mean, I'm ok with them developing mobile apps for that part of the market, but if they save on development investment for desktop users in favor of mobile integration to a point it's too noticeable and we need to wait for basic improvements on pc while seeing how new PHs iOS apps appear in the market I would definitely consider going to another DAW, not because of hurt feelings but because it doesn't make sense for me to invest my money on a DAW that would concentrate too much in the mobile integration.

Propellerhead is already slightly past the point where they would introduce another version, so it would be a fair question to ask if that's because they were concentrating on Compact/mobile, or because the 10.3 optimization took extra time away from Reason11 development.

The iOS GarageBand app integration with desktop Logic/GarageBand is amazing, and opens up a ton of existing plugs and instruments already in the desktop program. In Reason? Coders at Propellerhead had to make new devices for Reason to ensure compatibility with the mobile app. So I think it has stalled the next Reason release.

Hopefully, the next devices that the coders make for Compact will integrate with existing desktop devices and Reason 11 development can move forward.

[2chris]

My thoughts are that Reason 10 was the biggest and best update ever. I mean seriously, it convinced me as primarily an Ableton Live user to finally come back and purchase a license for 10 when it was my first DAW (Reason 1!). Then they added all these great performance updates, a workflow update, and it's stable as can be. While I prefer Live, there is so much to like about Reason, and I'm so happy I'm back using it again. I've got a license for Logic and Cubase 10. I tried Studio One, FL Studio, and Bitwig. Logic was the best value (just so great overall, but I prefer PC), Reason is the most fun (though sometimes frustrating too), Cubase has the most features especially for a professional, and Live is lacking a bunch of stuff that the others have but it does have the very best workflow (IMO), UI, and included FX.

What would bring Reason to the next level? I think that depends on how you work and what you want out of a DAW. For me, I don't record a ton of live audio, and I use a lot of midi stuff. For midi, Reason's sequencer is easily the worst of everything I've named above, and it's primitive in comparison. It's not a diss, they just haven't focused on that side of things at all. Some stuff they sell as RE's (bummer) is amazing - like Umpf (bought it, it's great!), Polystep, Quad Note etc and those would really elevate things if they were stock or included in the sequencer section. Complex1 is an instrument, but OMG it's brilliant.

My concern is that they are so focused on the rack (where they've done amazing things!), they ignore 3/4 of the software's UI - the browser, the sequencer and the mixer. I voted for the UI and sequencer/workflow.

1. Ideally, update the UI entirely. Realistically, update the mixer to hide stuff easier and to fit on a wide screen or dual screen setup better. Update the rack to section things out where it's less cluttered. For example, I love how Live and Cubase chain things in one lane. There has to be a way to do something similarly with grouping in the rack where it's easier to jump between modes and see how things are group together without having to hit tab or click a sequencer lane. The shuffle tool looks pretty dated but works mostly fine.

2. The sequencer could really benefit from being able to show named chords (S1 and Cubase have this), recognize a chord upon play that shows up top like Logic, have note length modes and easier lane snapping like Cubase (drum map might be cool but probably overkill), ghost notes are nice now but something more like FL Studio would be awesome, being able to select midi and transpose multiple lanes at once, automation curves, REX features builtin (like Cubase where it can send to the drum pads easy too), upgrading combinator to be more like loadable preset chains in live where the chain is self contained and loads quicker/cleaner than combinator, better search in the browser, machine learning on sample recognition, and I could go on and it would sound like I'm complaining but it's a dream list in a perfect world type thing.

[Timmy Crowne]

blur the line between studio and Starbucks.

Ugh! I vomited slightly in my mouth reading this part.

Typing it was no easier; it took all I had to suppress the bile rising from the pit of my stomach. But the reality is music consumption has already shifted into fast-food territory. So it’s only a matter of time until composition follows suit. I don’t begrudge anyone who likes to compose on the go (I’m actually curious about it), nor do I begrudge Props for wanting to enter a lucrative market space. But I would hate to see my favorite platform stagnate until what is essentially a cafeteria version is done playing catch-up. If one REALLY doesn’t impact the other, then fine.

Bring on McReason, I guess.

[Luxuria]

Great job putting together the poll chaosroyale!
You split up the categories very professionally. With 2 picks allowed and currently sitting at 262 votes, that's a nice 130 unit sample size.

Workflow, High-Res, and updated devices(Combi2) all the way!

Would love to hear from the Propellerhead team about their opinions on the findings or any sort of acknowledgement for the Reasontalk community.

[O1B]

In my case imitating classical instrument accentuations or hit positions for strings and percussive instruments is not just something I work on when arranging or doing fine work in a song, they are part of my song writing process, and I think that makes a big difference on which tools I choose when making music in general

... I dont see how this has anything to do with Mobile or Compact as a GOOD focus for Propellerhead.
I can agree that our workflow may be different. But... to assume I'm not "imitating classical instrument accentuations or hit positions" is a mistake. Like you said... "Workflow. "

Edit: as a similar example to the gear you named, the gear I've chosen to work with are things like the ROLI Seaboard Rise, because of how it gives a keyboard properties that might be more common to other kind of instruments, or the Maschine Mk3 which helps me work with samples and drums but still has a pretty decent velocity response when working with drum dynamics. In my case I'm always moving between organic and electronic so the hardware and software I need is mostly chosen under that premise.

'I have a Seaboard Rise, as well. Does the 49 keys make it NOT Mobile and Compact?
I'm just trying to understand why an iPad or 5inx7in device is No Bueno/TOYish, but an iOS Keyboard is ...
"accentuations or hit positions for strings and percussive instruments " and sheeeeit!

I sold my MK3. Another iOS controller - if it wasn't so proprietary.
I do have Drum machines, but here are some 5"x5" Bass and Percussion Modules - for my "accentuations or hit positions"

image1.jpeg (771.3 KiB) Viewed 1815 times

The myriad of ways there are to PLAY these little things makes all the difference. I'm pretty up to speed.

Gear matters. Workflow matters. Performance Control of that Gear matters. Don't you agree?

I think we agree - except maybe on how "BIG!" - "Small, Compact and Mobile" can be.

I have no dog in this. I'm just trying to make the best music I can. Sometimes: tricycle. Sometimes: CBR.

[reddust]

... I dont see how this has anything to do with Mobile or Compact as a GOOD focus for Propellerhead.
I can agree that our workflow may be different. But... to assume I'm not "imitating classical instrument accentuations or hit positions" is a mistake. Like you said... "Workflow. "

just compare the possibilities you have with a library like LA Scoring Strings to the strings that are included in the mobile version of garage band or any other mobile app for that matter and you'll see. I wasn't assuming anything about you, I was talking about my own workflow and why I prefer VST libraries to mobile apps.

'I have a Seaboard Rise, as well. Does the 49 keys make it NOT Mobile and Compact?
I'm just trying to understand why an iPad or 5inx7in device is No Bueno/TOYish, but an iOS Keyboard is ...
"accentuations or hit positions for strings and percussive instruments " and sheeeeit!

since when is a ROLI Seaboard an iOS keyboard? Have I missed something here? Because I'm using my ROLI in windows and I know I could use it in Mac OS as well, the ROLI is a keyboard that is by no means subjected to iOS.

I sold my MK3. Another iOS controller - if it wasn't so proprietary.
I do have Drum machines, but here are some 5"x5" Bass and Percussion Modules - for my "accentuations or hit positions"

The Mk3 isn't either an iOS controller, you can use it with iOS but it's capable of much more than that. But I wasn't talking just about the MK3, I was talking about the MK3 combined with the power of a library like BFD3 just to name one of multiple libraries. Those libraries are the ones that give the precision when working with accentuations and hit positions, not the mk3, the mk3 is just a controller like there are many more in the market.

The myriad of ways there are to PLAY these little things makes all the difference. I'm pretty up to speed.

Gear matters. Workflow matters. Performance Control of that Gear matters. Don't you agree?

I think we agree - except maybe on how "BIG!" - "Small, Compact and Mobile" can be.

I have no dog in this. I'm just trying to make the best music I can. Sometimes: tricycle. Sometimes: CBR.

Yes, we agree about that, but not sure that we agree about how capable current mobile libraries and instruments are compared to pc libraries and instruments (by pc I mean computers in general, windows, mac os, linux...). It's not just about the physical tool, but about the contents, controls, effects... that pc libraries offer compared to mobile ones at this moment. For me mobile apps are still far from being able to do what VST instruments are capable of.

[Loque]

I am curious, how ppl had voted about front cabling and more modular aspects. Since the sequencer is obviously the weak point, maybe it didnt had changed much...

[O1B]

I apologize for what is said to make you respond the following.

since when is a ROLI Seaboard an iOS keyboard? Have I missed something here? Because I'm using my ROLI in windows and I know I could use it in Mac OS as well, the ROLI is a keyboard that is by no means subjected to iOS.

I didn't mean to imply that it's ONLY iOS. I think I put OS/OSX and iOS is the same class, based on my experiments.
I think you believe them to be entirely different, and I can understand that.

For me mobile apps are still far from being able to do what VST instruments are capable of.

About this, we may just be using different APPS, but ... CYCLOPS....

I wish you well on your road, RedDust.. Big or Small.
Thanks for the thoughts.

[selig]

just compare the possibilities you have with a library like LA Scoring Strings to the strings that are included in the mobile version of garage band or any other mobile app for that matter and you'll see. I wasn't assuming anything about you, I was talking about my own workflow and why I prefer VST libraries to mobile apps.

I feel you may be comparing apples to oranges…
Who expects an iPad to run Logic, or Pro Tools, or edit 8k video etc?

iPads are "idea machines" for me. I use them to take notes, record song/melody ideas, take quick pictures/movies, etc. Then when I get home I take those ideas into a bigger app and develop them (if they are worthy of development!).

Anyone remember the old camera question/answer "which camera is the best?" - "the one you have with you"? It fits perfectly when you substitute "which DAW is the best - the one you have with you". If you're at home, you use your desktop. If you're traveling, on a plane, in a car, or don't otherwise have access to your string library, do you let a great idea get away from you because you don't have your VST library with you?
Being somewhat cheeky here, but I hope you get the idea. Horses for courses.

[reddust]

I didn't mean to imply that it's ONLY iOS. I think I put OS/OSX and iOS is the same class, based on my experiments.
I think you believe them to be entirely different, and I can understand that.

I know OS/OS X and iOS quite well, don't worry, as a software developer I must know about every OS, and yes, they're different in many aspects, not talking just about experiments but about how is it to develope apps for iOS or Mac OS, or windows, or a web app...

Again, try to do what LA Scoring strings or BFD3 do on a mobile app and when you find one that can do as much as these please let me know. I'm starting to think mobile apps are really doing some harm to music right now, but I hope they aren't...

[reddust]

just compare the possibilities you have with a library like LA Scoring Strings to the strings that are included in the mobile version of garage band or any other mobile app for that matter and you'll see. I wasn't assuming anything about you, I was talking about my own workflow and why I prefer VST libraries to mobile apps.

I feel you may be comparing apples to oranges…
Who expects an iPad to run Logic, or Pro Tools, or edit 8k video etc?

iPads are "idea machines" for me. I use them to take notes, record song/melody ideas, take quick pictures/movies, etc. Then when I get home I take those ideas into a bigger app and develop them (if they are worthy of development!).

Anyone remember the old camera question/answer "which camera is the best?" - "the one you have with you"? It fits perfectly when you substitute "which DAW is the best - the one you have with you". If you're at home, you use your desktop. If you're traveling, on a plane, in a car, or don't otherwise have access to your string library, do you let a great idea get away from you because you don't have your VST library with you?
Being somewhat cheeky here, but I hope you get the idea. Horses for courses.

Sure, that's what I think too, and that's why I say people can't compare them, at least not yet, mobile apps are more for sketching ideas or adding some tools to your current gear, and so on... but they are (unfortunately) still not at the level a DAW with VST instruments can do in a computer, generally, maybe some pure electronic synths are already there, but not when it comes to emulate traditional instruments, there is still some work to do to achieve that point.