Anyone using an i9-7980XE CPU? Im having issues

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mostlyhuman
Posts: 1
Joined: 19 Apr 2018

19 Apr 2018

I am getting "computer too slow to play song" on every song I try to load since I got this CPU. I am curious if anyone else is using this CPU with no issues in Reason 10. I have plenty of system resources available so its definitely not a resource issue.

Cheers.

User avatar
Kategra
Posts: 327
Joined: 18 Jan 2015

20 Apr 2018

mostlyhuman wrote:
19 Apr 2018
I am getting "computer too slow to play song" on every song I try to load since I got this CPU. I am curious if anyone else is using this CPU with no issues in Reason 10. I have plenty of system resources available so its definitely not a resource issue.

Cheers.
Have you tried with hyper threading off? You can find the option in the Audio settings. Also, what are the sample rate / latency values ?
hyper tre.JPG
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Galexia
Posts: 3
Joined: 23 Jul 2018

05 Sep 2018

Kategra wrote:
20 Apr 2018
mostlyhuman wrote:
19 Apr 2018
I am getting "computer too slow to play song" on every song I try to load since I got this CPU. I am curious if anyone else is using this CPU with no issues in Reason 10. I have plenty of system resources available so its definitely not a resource issue.

Cheers.
Have you tried with hyper threading off? You can find the option in the Audio settings. Also, what are the sample rate / latency values ?

hyper tre.JPG
you are a god. I built this rig cost over 7K just for audio and I couldn't use FN reason and this fixed it for me. YOU ARE A GOD. I disabled Hyperthreading and all the sudden no issues and it mixxed down a full song! - I bought this software called Synergy which allows you to use your mouse over to another computer on the network for the past month I was using that with my old rig and turning my head to a screen on the side of me... this seems to have fixed it!

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Kategra
Posts: 327
Joined: 18 Jan 2015

06 Sep 2018

Galexia wrote:
05 Sep 2018
Kategra wrote:
20 Apr 2018


Have you tried with hyper threading off? You can find the option in the Audio settings. Also, what are the sample rate / latency values ?

hyper tre.JPG
you are a god. I built this rig cost over 7K just for audio and I couldn't use FN reason and this fixed it for me. YOU ARE A GOD. I disabled Hyperthreading and all the sudden no issues and it mixxed down a full song! - I bought this software called Synergy which allows you to use your mouse over to another computer on the network for the past month I was using that with my old rig and turning my head to a screen on the side of me... this seems to have fixed it!
I'm not a god, Propellerheads developers may be, because they put that option there :)

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Theo.M
Posts: 1035
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

06 Sep 2018

Galexia wrote:
05 Sep 2018
Kategra wrote:
20 Apr 2018


Have you tried with hyper threading off? You can find the option in the Audio settings. Also, what are the sample rate / latency values ?

hyper tre.JPG
you are a god. I built this rig cost over 7K just for audio and I couldn't use FN reason and this fixed it for me. YOU ARE A GOD. I disabled Hyperthreading and all the sudden no issues and it mixxed down a full song! - I bought this software called Synergy which allows you to use your mouse over to another computer on the network for the past month I was using that with my old rig and turning my head to a screen on the side of me... this seems to have fixed it!
You should be able to make use of the unused hyperthreaded virtual cores to get more out of your BEAST of a machine (which makes my imac pro look like a toy LOL) by using vienna ensemble pro.. that *should* be able to tap into all the virtual threads.. I know on mac it uses hyperthreading perfectly.
You could even set your cpu affinity in windows to keep 2 cores entirely free from reason..so.. 16 cores for reason, 2 for something like VE Pro.. What this can do is actually improve performance for the main daw in windows (it helps so much with Pro tools, i know this for a fact, when 1 or 2 cores are disabled from pro tools) and run more stuff alongside it on the same machine. This seems to help with pro tools particularly at 64 buffer.. it might make a difference for you in Reason also.. In fact, the same issue with pro tools, people have to disable hyperthreading as there are spikes and performance issues all over the place.. but with the affinity fix, in most cases they can leave hyperthreading on.. if a DAW makes use of hyperthreading, you can literally get 35% more VI's and FX plugins from the same processor.. in other words, 16 cores with hyperthreading on, if reason works properly, will give you way more power than 18 cores with hyperthreading off.. So i really think it's worth trying the CPU affinity thing...

What about core parking? I don't know if it's an issue anymore with Windows 10, as I have never used windows 10 personally.. The pro tools fix i describe, is from reading MANY other users with cpu spike issues on Windows 10 at my regular forum hangouts.

have you overclocked at all?
Disabled power throttling? Have a good cooling system?

For best performance put windows into high power mode and actually, if you have a good cooling system, you *should* be able to get the 7980XE to just run at 3.8ghz permanently. If you are using all 18 cores, the all core turbo of your processor is 3.4ghz but it's usually higher than that as it's not like you are always going to be using all 18 cores.
What I would do, is literally just set it to 3.8ghz permanently across all cores, disable speedstep AND turbo..I know some people love turbo but I am a firm believer in a flat frequency at all times.. so at all stages, all 18 cores are simply running at the one clock speed of 3.8ghz.. This is very good for low latency buffers especially. I hear quite often that people run theirs permanently at 4ghz which will be possible if you have an excellent cooler.. which is a MONSTER of a machine.. 18 cores of 4ghz.. just.. WOW.. I have found a way to hack the imac pro to run at 3.9ghz at all times (it's all core turbo speed) and my performance at 32 and 64 buffer has improved a LOT.. I can play anything now, any VI i like.. before it would jump around from like 2.5, or 2.8 to 3.9/3.8 then down and up again..

Yes, hyperthreading caused the problems in your case, and now you say you are ok (which is great!).. But maybe it's worth investigating further to see if you can get even *more* from your machine? You have an ANIMAL.. but clock speed is really important in a DAW also.. cause DAWs process cores on a signal path basis.. track by track.. So if you have a massive VI like Diva in divine mode and a bunch of high quality FX, it can actually overload a single core.. general rule is higher clock speed is *never* a negative thing. For example, if i had a choice, Personally I would choose say 16 cores at 5ghz, instead of 28 cores at 3ghz.

Have you run latency mon to see if you have any DPC spikes which would affect reason's performance at low buffer?

PS are you sure even synergy isn't causing DPC spikes?

antic604

07 Sep 2018

Theo.M wrote:
06 Sep 2018
You should be able to make use of the unused hyperthreaded virtual cores to get more out of your BEAST of a machine (which makes my imac pro look like a toy LOL) by using vienna ensemble pro.. that *should* be able to tap into all the virtual threads...
Theo.M wrote:
06 Sep 2018
if a DAW makes use of hyperthreading, you can literally get 35% more VI's and FX plugins from the same processor.. in other words, 16 cores with hyperthreading on, if reason works properly, will give you way more power than 18 cores with hyperthreading off.. So i really think it's worth trying the CPU affinity thing...
WTF did I just read?! :o :shock: :lol:

1) There's no such thing as "unused virtual cores" that you can "tap into". Hyperthreading "splits" the existing physical cores for the operating system into 2 logical (virtual) cores - each half of the power of physical core - so that SOME tasks could be run in parallel and for example stalls happening when doing one task (say, waiting for sample data to arrive from RAM to the cache to be processed by FX on one track) wouldn't delay performing other task (say, filtering a oscillator sound on another track), which would be the case if they were happening in serial

2) Latest generation of Intel's processors introduces a new inter-core communication paradigm based on a mesh (instead of typical ring bus), which can have an impact here - seeing how Reason has hyperthreading on/off switch exposed in the preferences (I've never seen this in other DAWs) suggests they have their custom code for that, which simply might need updating for the new architecture

Technostica
Posts: 2
Joined: 07 Sep 2018

07 Sep 2018

antic604 wrote:
07 Sep 2018
2) Latest generation of Intel's processors introduces a new inter-core communication paradigm based on a mesh (instead of typical ring bus), which can have an impact here - seeing how Reason has hyperthreading on/off switch exposed in the preferences (I've never seen this in other DAWs) suggests they have their custom code for that, which simply might need updating for the new architecture.
Does Hyper-threading have anything to do with the mesh v ring differences?
HT is within a single core whereas the interconnect methodology is between cores.

antic604

07 Sep 2018

Technostica wrote:
07 Sep 2018
Does Hyper-threading have anything to do with the mesh v ring differences?
HT is within a single core whereas the interconnect methodology is between cores.
This I don't know. What I meant is that this was quite a significant change to the architecture, one that might've impacted many areas for example the schedulers that distribute jobs between cores (physical and virtual). If Propellerhead have their own 'smarter' scheduler (because why would they expose the on/off switch otherwise?) then perhaps this code requires updating as well.

User avatar
Theo.M
Posts: 1035
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

08 Sep 2018

antic604 wrote:
07 Sep 2018
Theo.M wrote:
06 Sep 2018
You should be able to make use of the unused hyperthreaded virtual cores to get more out of your BEAST of a machine (which makes my imac pro look like a toy LOL) by using vienna ensemble pro.. that *should* be able to tap into all the virtual threads...
Theo.M wrote:
06 Sep 2018
if a DAW makes use of hyperthreading, you can literally get 35% more VI's and FX plugins from the same processor.. in other words, 16 cores with hyperthreading on, if reason works properly, will give you way more power than 18 cores with hyperthreading off.. So i really think it's worth trying the CPU affinity thing...
WTF did I just read?! :o :shock: :lol:

1) There's no such thing as "unused virtual cores" that you can "tap into". Hyperthreading "splits" the existing physical cores for the operating system into 2 logical (virtual) cores - each half of the power of physical core - so that SOME tasks could be run in parallel and for example stalls happening when doing one task (say, waiting for sample data to arrive from RAM to the cache to be processed by FX on one track) wouldn't delay performing other task (say, filtering a oscillator sound on another track), which would be the case if they were happening in serial

2) Latest generation of Intel's processors introduces a new inter-core communication paradigm based on a mesh (instead of typical ring bus), which can have an impact here - seeing how Reason has hyperthreading on/off switch exposed in the preferences (I've never seen this in other DAWs) suggests they have their custom code for that, which simply might need updating for the new architecture
by disabling HT in reason does not mean that if another app is set to use 4 threads that it can't use the hyperthreaded ones. See for yourself, run VE Pro when reason HT is disabled, and see it access the virtual cores and make use of them. Also, your half theory doesn't make sense.. that would mean that if hyperthread was disabled at the bios level that one could get the same power out of the machine, as in plugin instances, in a DAW that is properly multi threaded.. This is not the case at any time in Cubase, Pro Tools or Logic when i disable hyperthreading completely or on my win 7 laptop where i can do it at the bios level. In all cases, i get WAY, and i mean WAY more plugin instances with hyperthreading on, rather than just use say the 4 physical cores on that particular laptop which is a quad core. So that means that without hyperthreading, a DAW can't really make anywhere near maximum use of a processor's power.

I am not saying you are not right in general and that what i said sort of didn't make sense, I get what you mean, but I am telling you that other apps can make use of virtual cores that reason doesn't when running at the same time. Maybe I worded it wrong.

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