Reason 1.0 vs 10.0 - visual comparison

This forum is for discussing Reason. Questions, answers, ideas, and opinions... all apply.
sdst
Posts: 839
Joined: 14 Jun 2015

Post 05 Dec 2017

mark999 wrote:
05 Dec 2017

3) start selling device skins in the prop shop
another good one would be start selling colored wires. :puf_bigsmile:

mark999
Posts: 67
Joined: 13 Jun 2017

Post 05 Dec 2017

Yes colored wires, or even striped ones would be so cool. Perhaps even trendy fabric type of cables that are popular with headphone manufacturers now.

antic604

Post 05 Dec 2017

EnochLight wrote:
05 Dec 2017
antic604 wrote:
05 Dec 2017
@EnochLight

I don't think you read my post - I was talking about DOUBLE-clicking and on very specific areas, to get specific results.
I read your post, and thought I explained my point with the help of the screen caps. I didn't know you were working with small 13" monitors - that wasn't mentioned in your original response to me. Sorry if this was lost in translation! :)

Anyway, I get what you're saying, but your suggestion still doesn't address the point I brought up: How is Reason to know which view you want pulled into focus? Mixer or rack? But yeah, if you're on a screen as small as you describe, your only real solution is going to be to stay full-screen, if working split-screen is too small anyway.

I hope people don't misunderstand - I agree the way it's handled now certainly isn't perfect. Perhaps it can be improved. But after 5 major version releases (6-10) and no change to how it's handled, I'm afraid this is how it will likely remain for the interim.
Yeah, sorry - maybe I wasn't clear :) Music is a hobby for me, so I've no proper studio or even desktop PC and I bought a dedicated laptop (Surface Pro 4 i7) for it, so that I can hide it in the closet when not in use :)

Anyway, regarding the "how is Reason to know", I'll re-iterate for the 3rd time:
- double-click on device thumbnail -> Rack
- double-click anywhere else on the track's header -> Mixer

Or better yet, as I suggested on page #3, allow putting Rack and Mixer side-by-side on single screen, which would make the above 'guessing' completely unnecessary :)

kefkekeyser
Posts: 36
Joined: 24 Feb 2015

Post 05 Dec 2017

stephensmattlee wrote:
25 Nov 2017
This! ...this! ...this!!!

Image

Whoever did this update/render of Subtractor should help Propellerheads do the whole of Reason. Or at least they should do something similar themselves to what this person did.

Would look amazing. Keeps the classic visual style and look but brings it up to the 21st century :)



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Oh, no, this looks like a shitty plastic toy synth. Am I really the only one who hates this 3D rendered plastic shit GUI?

Keep it 2D but make it scalable (vectors) and don't change the look of the old Reason devices.

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selig
RE Developer
Posts: 9121
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Location: The NorthWoods, CT, USA

Post 05 Dec 2017

kefkekeyser wrote:
05 Dec 2017
stephensmattlee wrote:
25 Nov 2017
This! ...this! ...this!!!

Image

Whoever did this update/render of Subtractor should help Propellerheads do the whole of Reason. Or at least they should do something similar themselves to what this person did.

Would look amazing. Keeps the classic visual style and look but brings it up to the 21st century :)



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Oh, no, this looks like a shitty plastic toy synth. Am I really the only one who hates this 3D rendered plastic shit GUI?

Keep it 2D but make it scalable (vectors) and don't change the look of the old Reason devices.
It's been pointed out before, but worth repeating, that changing to vectors now would require a HUGE amount of time from the Props and from each RE developer as well. The tools aren't in place, for one thing, plus the current assets will not translate to vectors - meaning, re-building every UI pretty much from the ground up. It would therefore be extremely difficult to "not change the look of the old Reason devices" when doing this, from what I understand.

There are about 1000 things I'd rather the Props work on before addressing this - just my personal opinion on this.

Also worth noting, the current assets for all REs ARE scalable, zoomable up to 4x their current size while remaining at full resolution.

IMO vectors are not the answer - too late for that with Reason. The answer is to implement the resources that are already in place, and who knows when/if that will happen!
:)
Selig Audio, LLC

antic604

Post 05 Dec 2017

selig wrote:
05 Dec 2017
Also worth noting, the current assets for all REs ARE scalable, zoomable up to 4x their current size while remaining at full resolution.
What does that really mean? Are you saying that e.g. your REs are actually in 4K or 8K resolution, but they're made to look pixelated by Reason, to fit with the aesthetic of the rest of the rack?

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selig
RE Developer
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Location: The NorthWoods, CT, USA

Post 05 Dec 2017

antic604 wrote:
05 Dec 2017
selig wrote:
05 Dec 2017
Also worth noting, the current assets for all REs ARE scalable, zoomable up to 4x their current size while remaining at full resolution.
What does that really mean? Are you saying that e.g. your REs are actually in 4K or 8K resolution, but they're made to look pixelated by Reason, to fit with the aesthetic of the rest of the rack?
Yes, they are effectively 4k - they are not made to look pixelated, that's what you get with a 754 px wide device.
Selig Audio, LLC

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avasopht
Posts: 2232
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 05 Dec 2017

The only problem with a 4k raster is that you lose pixel definition at different resolutions.

When targeting a specific resolution you can align straight edges with pixel boundaries so that you get a hard edge.
---

EdGrip
Posts: 2107
Joined: 03 Jun 2016

Post 05 Dec 2017

I think it means that the UI images are/were made with dimensions 4x bigger, and then scaled down for Reason's current resolution.

scratchnsnifff
Posts: 1423
Joined: 21 Sep 2016

Post 05 Dec 2017

So this is for Selig, if the vector thing isn’t feasible, what could potentially be done to make Reason look more modern? I used FL as an example in an earlier post on this thread, and I believe that ableton has done the same method, would there be a way for all Reason devices to have the shiny and modern look and some REs have the standard look? Or would it have to be a scenario of ALL devices have the modern look, and in the preferences you’d have to change to the look of present times? Also why does the Re groove mixer look like different graphics is it just a trick of the eye? Haha music is my hobby and I know absolutely nothing about the world of graphics and how they can work/be implemented
Mayor of plucktown :evil:

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esselfortium
Posts: 1405
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Post 05 Dec 2017

Every RE already has high-resolution graphics made for it. That's arguably the biggest part of the job, and it's done, so it's not a question of how to get high-resolution graphics. It's mostly a matter of Propellerhead doing the same for the old stock devices, and then deciding how they want to actually implement scaling in Reason, and doing it.

EdGrip
Posts: 2107
Joined: 03 Jun 2016

Post 06 Dec 2017

Ableton's devices are comparatively small and 2D, and the UI itself is very blueprint-drawing simple. So it lends itself to vector drawing in a way that Reason doesn't.

stephensmattlee
Posts: 142
Joined: 05 Feb 2015

Post 06 Dec 2017

kefkekeyser wrote:
05 Dec 2017
stephensmattlee wrote:
25 Nov 2017
This! ...this! ...this!!!

Image

Whoever did this update/render of Subtractor should help Propellerheads do the whole of Reason. Or at least they should do something similar themselves to what this person did.

Would look amazing. Keeps the classic visual style and look but brings it up to the 21st century :)



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Oh, no, this looks like a shitty plastic toy synth. Am I really the only one who hates this 3D rendered plastic shit GUI?

Keep it 2D but make it scalable (vectors) and don't change the look of the old Reason devices.
Hahaha, you're joking right?
Don't get me wrong, even if Props didn't go as in-depth with a more realistic 3D look such as this, but maybe somewhere in between the original and this render, then I'm sure it would look amazing and wouldn't get many complaints.

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Oquasec
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Post 06 Dec 2017

Props need to make reason use the gpu if they go anywhere near that.

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EnochLight
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Post 06 Dec 2017

Oquasec wrote:
06 Dec 2017
Props need to make reason use the gpu if they go anywhere near that.
Not at all. If it remains bitmap based (which, in all likelihood it will), GPU isn't needed at all. And frankly, not many plugins or DAW that utilize vector even need the GPU.
Win 10 | Reason 11 Suite |  Studio 1 4.6 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | Reactor 1TB SSD | RME Babyface Pro | Panorama P-4 | Akai MPC Live 2 & Force | Roland System 8, TR-8 7x7 Expansion, MX1, JX8P, TB3 | Ensoniq SQ1 Plus | Korg Minilogue XD

antic604

Post 06 Dec 2017

EnochLight wrote:
06 Dec 2017
Oquasec wrote:
06 Dec 2017
Props need to make reason use the gpu if they go anywhere near that.
Not at all. If it remains bitmap based (which, in all likelihood it will), GPU isn't needed at all. And frankly, not many plugins or DAW that utilize vector even need the GPU.
I'm pretty sure he means for audio (when possible, of course which is not much).

No matter how bad the UI can be, it's still already using the GPU :D

mark999
Posts: 67
Joined: 13 Jun 2017

Post 06 Dec 2017

Why are people making excuses for Propellerhead for not upgrading the GUI?

Ideally, they should be several steps AHEAD of their users with regards to enhancing the program, yet here we are at the end of 2017 with version 10, and stuck with the same graphics that we had in version 1.0.

Yes, fixing it would require a lot of work, yes, it would take a lot of effort, yes it’s not going to be easy.... so what? It shouldn’t mean that it shouldn’t be done.

Reason is not cheap and updates cost money, it should be part of Propellerhead’s budget to keep the Reason GUI up to date along with other parts of the program.

Most of the VSTs and hosts today are resizable. Whether it’s vector, or whatever, the competition (other DAWs) found a way to enlarge the user interface. In Logic for example, all instruments scale up beautifully. FL Studio has also improved so much over the years with regards to graphics, and many VSTs have an option to enlarge the interface. Reason’s graphics are super outdated, pixelated and bordering on unusably tiny on larger monitors.

I like Propellerhead and I love Reason, but I’m also honest with myself and don’t make excuses for them for not having updated the GUI.

The user interface of a program is like a shopfront, you can’t neglect it for over a decade and still expect people to walk in.

Personally, I think the outdated graphics of Reason (along with many amateur looking rack extensions) is doing serious damage to the program’s reputation and is turning potential users/customers off. It should be updated as soon as possible.

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EnochLight
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Post 06 Dec 2017

Who is making excuses for Propellerhead, and how?
Win 10 | Reason 11 Suite |  Studio 1 4.6 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | Reactor 1TB SSD | RME Babyface Pro | Panorama P-4 | Akai MPC Live 2 & Force | Roland System 8, TR-8 7x7 Expansion, MX1, JX8P, TB3 | Ensoniq SQ1 Plus | Korg Minilogue XD

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kuhliloach
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Post 06 Dec 2017

Image

WongoTheSane
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Location: Paris, France

Post 07 Dec 2017

A 1967 Ferrari 275 GTB/4...
1967 ferrari 275 GTB 4.jpg

...updated to modern standards.
fiat_panda.jpg
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full-of-life
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Post 07 Dec 2017

It all sounds good if you know what you are doing - a lefty play a right handed guitar just "upside-down"
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syncanonymous
Posts: 437
Joined: 16 Mar 2015
Location: UK and France

Post 07 Dec 2017

kefkekeyser wrote:
05 Dec 2017
stephensmattlee wrote:
25 Nov 2017
This! ...this! ...this!!!

Image

Whoever did this update/render of Subtractor should help Propellerheads do the whole of Reason. Or at least they should do something similar themselves to what this person did.

Would look amazing. Keeps the classic visual style and look but brings it up to the 21st century :)



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Oh, no, this looks like a shitty plastic toy synth. Am I really the only one who hates this 3D rendered plastic shit GUI?

Keep it 2D but make it scalable (vectors) and don't change the look of the old Reason devices.
Yeah, I don't care for the 3D lighting and drop shadows it either
Vintage is vintage for a reason
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EnochLight
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Post 07 Dec 2017

WongoTheSane wrote:
07 Dec 2017
A 1967 Ferrari 275 GTB/4...


1967 ferrari 275 GTB 4.jpg
...updated to modern standards.


tesla_model_s.jpg
Fixed that for you. :D :lol:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Win 10 | Reason 11 Suite |  Studio 1 4.6 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | Reactor 1TB SSD | RME Babyface Pro | Panorama P-4 | Akai MPC Live 2 & Force | Roland System 8, TR-8 7x7 Expansion, MX1, JX8P, TB3 | Ensoniq SQ1 Plus | Korg Minilogue XD

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esselfortium
Posts: 1405
Joined: 15 Jan 2015

Post 07 Dec 2017

Updating the devices to hi-res and upgrading the art style of the older devices would be appreciated, though I don't think a major redesign is necessary for anything.

Also, that Subtractor render is seriously hard on the eyes and a major downgrade from the original's usability: blurry glowing LED displays, bad fonts, overdone shadows, and significantly reduced contrast between the backdrop and the controls (originally white, now mid-gray on a mid-blue background) make it gaudier and less functional than the original design. I wouldn't want to use that at all. (Apologies to its creator!)

The original design is small and not very flashy, but everything on it is clearly-defined. That can be preserved in a hi-res version even while modernizing the appearance a bit. There are plenty of VST designs (and, probably, rack extension designs) that are designed for higher resolutions without looking like mush.

sdst
Posts: 839
Joined: 14 Jun 2015

Post 07 Dec 2017

yeah, most users don't care about new visual

see the dark skin

everybody switched

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