Reason wheel-spin, my creative crisis

[Ropay]

Please allow me a bit of an introduction here.
I am in my mid 30s and have grown up in a musical family. Granny taught me piano from a young age.
I rebelled because, of course, piano was for sissies (one of my greatest regrets).
Dad taught me guitar when I was 10, been playing ever since but never took it seriously enough for lessons or in a band (you know the sob story..)
Played drums when I could get to a drum kit until I got my own kit and played in a band at university.
Now I play the banjo.

Musical genres I like are as follows:

Progressive Heavy metal (in parallel with Death Metal...but why they have to use the word "death" I dunno)
Hard House (a dead genre of dance music, the experience of which, I find, can only now be replicated by Psychedelic Trance)
Classical piano concertos
Bluegrass.

I bought Reason 7 when it came out because I wanted to 'create' music in an all-inclusive DAW. The only thing I used it for was to learn Clair De Lune on the ID8 piano instrument with my 61 key midi keyboard.
The release of Reason 10 has reignited my interest in creating music but I'm ultimately worried I'll be wasting my time again.
I 'think' I am creative because I come up with cool drum beats on my electronic drum kit and I also have a few songs/tunes/..riffs on guitar that just require lyrics.
However, every time I load up Reason with the intention of creating a song (I basically think I want to reinvent hard house see), I am met with a blank canvas of not even knowing where to start, or even having the inclination of wanting to start.
I ultimately load up ID8, see how much of Clair De Lune I can remember, then switch it off when I get irritated that I can't remember that much.

My question is this, how do you guys do it?
How do you make music; do you know what you want before you start or do you just mess around until something sounds good?
How do you know when the song is finished?
How do you know whether you want to use Thor or Malstrom for a song?
How do you know whether or not you should just use the included drum kits or spend money on drum Refills or Rack Extensions?
Do you buy the old Reason Drum Kits 2.0 or the new A-List Drummer kits? (I know one’s a Refill for the Combinator and the other is a Rack Extension...so what?)
I could go on but my quandary seems to be with the over whelming amount of variables, refills, rack extensions that could potentially go into a song (do I need Polar or is the song fine without it..I dunno?)

I do apologise if these are very innocent and naïve questions but I'm ultimately worried I am NOT creative (for anyone who's ever played Little Big Planet on PlayStation, I'm the guy who hasn't created a single level, not one. Minecraft! Give me a break! Why would you?)

I wanted Reason because it actually LIMITED the possibilities. Now we have VSTs!! I'm going to have a nervous breakdown when I upgrade! Should I dabble in VSTs, should I leave them alone (computer resources aside)?

The question to end this ridiculously lengthy post of someone clearly going through a musical midlife crisis is this:
Can I reinvent hard house by using just the components of stock Reason 10. No VSTs, no extra "bank balance breaking" Rack Extensions or Refills, no extra anything except the Instruments, Effects (don't even get me started on Effects, wtf?) etc. that come with a Reason 10?

Help a fellow (failed) musician out

[normen]

Just do, do, do, do, do, do, do. Eventually you‘ll have a handful of things that work

Believe me, not even One-Wonder-Hits only wrote that one song, they ALL played in bands, made other kinds of music, did projects that didn‘t work out and gained experience along the way. All hits sit between hundreds of songs that composer wrote that didn‘t become hits.

[6502]

I would recommend setting up your studio so that you can record an idea as quickly as possible.

So, for example, have a template in Reason where track one is hooked up to your audio interface with your favourite guitar plugins inserted (please note, the Line 6 stuff is gone in the most recent version of Reason so you might want to use other options if you are still in Reason 7, but don't worry other than Line 6, all of my songs from 10+ years ago open in the current version and sound the same! Just an FYI). Then, when you have a cool riff, load up Reason, tap up a tempo, then record it. Pick any drum loop from the Factory Sound Bank - don't worry about buying any quite yet. The FSB has a lot of content.

As well, any DAW is immensely complex. You can try viewing a few tutorials on the Propellerheads website for how to use Reason.

Don't pressure yourself. I've been using Reason since 1.0 but I've never publicly released any music or even fully completed many songs. But I'm having fun and my goal is to start finishing and releasing stuff. It's not my day job, it's what I do for fun...

As well, this site helped me:

https://www.recordingrevolution.com

It might seem like a slick site where he is trying to get you to spend lot's of $$$ on his courses, but I haven't spent a penny and have received a lot of inspiration from his free content.

Finally, I enjoy browsing the Music section of this forum to hear what others are doing with Reason.

[CaliforniaBurrito]

[CaliforniaBurrito]

Just do, do...

do-do.png (6.09 KiB) Viewed 1747 times

[aburazaru]

Ok... let me settle into my 'vigerous typing position'....
Now... in order!

The release of Reason 10 has reignited my interest in creating music but I'm ultimately worried I'll be wasting my time again.

Do you enjoy making music on any instrument (at all, drums, banjo, guitar, saxophone, clarinet, banging a beat on a desk)??? If you answered yes to any of these, it's not a waste of time. You're just getting frustrated about learning a new instrument (in this case, reason) that is likely to be the most complex instrument you've ever attempted to learn. Shit runs deeeeeeep, son. Settle in, this shit doesn't happen over night.

Bottom line, if you like music and enjoy trying to make it, it's not time wasted to hone your skills and learn new tools. You might just need help with the tactics, and we're here for you on that.

However, every time I load up Reason with the intention of creating a song (I basically think I want to reinvent hard house see), I am met with a blank canvas of not even knowing where to start, or even having the inclination of wanting to start.

This is pure preference and changes dramatically with each producer/artist. Hell, the execution pattern changes in MY setup nearly every day. Try this. Put "how to make 'x' in reason" into youtube. Here's an example that I didn't watch, but there were MANY more.

Now, don't knock it till you've tried it... I'm not saying to replicate every move and knob twist the tutorials do, but it will help you learn the application and some of it's instruments faster than fumbling through the manual and getting lost in some of the concepts covered if you're anything like me. I've taken plenty of youtube tutorials worth of knowledge and dump it into random tracks all over the place.

I ultimately load up ID8, see how much of Clair De Lune I can remember, then switch it off when I get irritated that I can't remember that much.

LOL, stop that! The sequencer window is your friend. You can lay down a dirty misplayed recording and flip and flop the midi notes all day long. Stop getting hung up and move on to something new. Stop playing the same damn song and make something cool!

My question is this, how do you guys do it?
How do you make music; do you know what you want before you start or do you just mess around until something sounds good?
How do you know when the song is finished?
How do you know whether you want to use Thor or Malstrom for a song?
How do you know whether or not you should just use the included drum kits or spend money on drum Refills or Rack Extensions?
Do you buy the old Reason Drum Kits 2.0 or the new A-List Drummer kits? (I know one’s a Refill for the Combinator and the other is a Rack Extension...so what?)
I could go on but my quandary seems to be with the over whelming amount of variables, refills, rack extensions that could potentially go into a song (do I need Polar or is the song fine without it..I dunno?)

In order.
We do it... a lot, as stated above. Some of us have had paid work, while some do it purely for fun/learning. Pick your reason (lol, yes I did) and start doing it. Time spent doing something you love is never time wasted, especially if it makes you more efficient at it for next time.

I don't always know what sound I want, or even what genre I'm making until I fire up reason and start tinkering with sounds. My personal goal is to be able to take action as quickly as possible *if/when* an idea hits me. If I can whistle/hum/play or otherwise 'jot' the idea down, I can typically frame up a very rough draft of it in reason within an hour (at least the main hook section), but that's after doing this shit since Reason 2.

I have delivered tracks to paying clients, released stuff for remix contests, posted to soundcloud/clyp.it and have ditched nearly all fear of sharing my music. Most of it is right here...
https://soundcloud.com/sys-crash-media/tracks
All that and, to this day, I don't think I've ever finished a track. Every listen reveals little mistakes in my playing that I missed, a missed mix point, an overbearing snare... underwhelming kick etc.... If I waited for my OCD to allow a track to be actually "finished" I wouldn't have a soundcloud account or paid for the gear I have today with actual music work. Bottom line... just release it. It's the internet, nobody cares if your last soundcloud track sucked.

Thor vs Malstrom is tough. Knowledge of each instrument's features is what dictates where it fits best, but that doesn't always matter. I started more tracks with Thor because I thought it looked cooler, LOL. If it gets to the sound you want or like, it's the right tool for the job.

Use the included drum kits and learn to use reason's effects to perfect the sound. Eventually, you'll start to see how simple effects are making that drum kit you want to buy sound the way it does. The super heavy kick in that sample pack you want to buy is just an 808 kick run through a set of FX that make it sound all gnarly, with an acoustic kick stacked on top of it (example but you get the idea).

I do apologise if these are very innocent and naïve questions but I'm ultimately worried I am NOT creative (for anyone who's ever played Little Big Planet on PlayStation, I'm the guy who hasn't created a single level, not one. Minecraft! Give me a break! Why would you?)

I wanted Reason because it actually LIMITED the possibilities. Now we have VSTs!! I'm going to have a nervous breakdown when I upgrade! Should I dabble in VSTs, should I leave them alone (computer resources aside)?

I've played all the little big planets and never created a level. I don't paint pictures. I don't write poems. I make music. The difference is knowing where your creativity will come out to play. Mine started after a couple of rum and cokes and an empty reason rack. I still get stuck frequently with 'writer's block'. The trick there is to make SOMETHING. Anything really. You might be half way through a four hour delve into how to make custom patches in Thor and find your next big inspirational sound, spawning an entire track in one drunken night of ridiculousness.

Can I reinvent hard house by using just the components of stock Reason 10. No VSTs, no extra "bank balance breaking" Rack Extensions or Refills, no extra anything except the Instruments, Effects (don't even get me started on Effects, wtf?) etc. that come with a Reason 10?

Don't buy anything extra yet. Learn the basics of the tools within reason and how to mix them properly. The in-built instruments and effects are PLENTY to make a good track. Furthermore, learning the basics of these instruments will give you knowledge you can take over to VST town when you're ready.

If you want further assistance/encouragement/ass kicking/shit talking/education or some dickhead to say "have you googled it", come to the slack channel. I'll be the one talking shit and sharing my half cocked sound ideas.

[aeox]

In the beginning I found that reverse engineering/recreating favorite tracks of mine was a really good way to learn how certain sounds were accomplished. It's not that you're going to just copy a track and release it, it's just a learning experience. Seriously, try it!

Find a track you want to recreate and start off getting the bpm and matching your project bpm to it. Line up the track so it's in sync with the tempo in your project and try to recreate the exact same drum pattern down to each element.

Once you've got the drum pattern, move on to the bass elements, then move up in the frequency spectrum. Higher frequency synths, vocals, etc. (I find it easiest to recreate tracks in this way, you could also start with melody or chord progression.) Eventually you will be able to distinguish each element along the frequency spectrum of the reference track and know whats going on.
If you don't understand how something is made or how a artist gets a particular sound, go on youtube or google and start doing some research to figure it out.

Once you have successfully recreated the track, you have gained a lot of knowledge already. Now delete the project and move onto a more complex track to recreate. Eventually some of the production techniques will just be second nature. Letting you to break away from recreating tracks, and allowing you to create your own. Everyone has influences when it comes to music.

Creativity is hardwired into everyone's DNA, it's the essence of the human race. It's something that is developed through experimentation. We experiment, we learn, we build upon, and we progress.

Experimentation can often be uninspiring if you don't have other fundamental techniques down in the first place. Such as frequency balance, EQ, compression, etc. It took me 3 years to learn a lot of fundamentals before I could finally get into the experimental stage and actually produce favorable results.

From a guitarist point of view, many are always trying to find a nice tone via amps, pedals, etc. I take a similar approach with each instrument/element of a song. If I want my drums to sound good, I'm going to need to learn how to make them sound good and give them the sonic characteristics that sound good to me. Same goes with bass synths, lead synths, etc. Obviously the guitarists technique is going to be a huge part of that "tone" as well, but you get the idea.

[Ixus]

Overthinking is never a good idea imo, thinking more about the tools rather than using them. I often drool over gear and guitars but when inspiration strikes it doesnt matter if im using my $200 guitar or the $1200 one. Many times I just start a project without finishing it, try a new idea or a riff or whatever. I Dont see that as a faliure, you are still creating even if you dont find enough to make a song out of it. Most important is to have fun. If you dont, then why bother doing it?
Thats my approach. Music is about having fun. Dont feel like you have to do this or that just create whatever pops into your mind with whatever tool you feel like using.

[Ropay]

Incredible, thank you guys, especially aburazaru for such a detailed address of my cryptic, dare I say, rhetorical, questions.

You've all provided great techniques and positive mind-sets to help me start from scratch. However, it is obvious that I am only my own worst enemy as it ultimately boils down to whether or not I actually want to CREATE music. I've just now had a rather heated discussion with my other half where I've stated that I really want to WANT to create music (that is not a typo). Maybe I'm just content to mess around on guitar, drums and banjo for the rest of my musical life? She's trying to convince me to give it another go because I haven't tried it properly but surely I would've put in the effort if I wanted to create my New Hard House??

I think it's all about a means to an end and I want to release music from which I can make a living perhaps. I don't even think I can class it as a hobby. I play music because I'm musical and it's in my family and everyone keeps telling me "I wish you could've done more with your music". I have the fingers of brick layer and can't for the life of me play an Am on the banjo let alone chords on my effing midi keyboard! (You should've seen me learning Clare De Lune!). You would expect this type of ranting from a budding teenager yet here I am carrying on as such.

In fact, I think I'm actually more into computer games as a hobby. I love computer games but feel guilty when I play them because of the 'waste of life' stigma attached to them.

Anyway, I digress; thank you again for the inspirational words. Alas, I still feel as if I might just upgrade to Reason 10 just to have it there, in the background, waiting, for one day when I might want to create some computer music, whenever that day may come...and then upgrade to Reason 16, when I feel I'm getting closer but still not really that bothered.
I think there's possibly a bigger problem here more suited to the Dr. Phil forums than ReasonTalk.

Is it really that easy to just create something and be happy with it? (That IS a rhetorical question)

[aburazaru]

To answer your rhetorical question, because I can... no. It's not that easy, but it can be! Just have to practice. If you've ever thought about making music a career, you really SHOULD be firing up reason and making music. Playing your drums? Record the set into a reason session and start learning how to quantize those couple of out of beat hits. Playing the banjo? Record that shit and send me the files to use, lol! You could also learn to manipulate pitch/tempo or sample chop, but I want more banjo samples... so send them.

If making music for release and, eventually, a living is the goal, you shouldn't be asking about whether or not to start using reason... you should be digging in with both fucking hands. As a fellow 'in their 30s' dude, get fuckin' crackin, before we're dead.

Open reason up, join the slack channel, and let's party!

[ahuimanu]

I stopped associating my sessions with Reason with performance - requiring that I am a musician executing for recorded capture - and shifted to taking the perspective of composition.

I set a tempo, audition patches, plan for the following parts (lanes or channels): melody, counterpoint, effects, bassline, drums.

Also, try composing using the Blocks feature.

I rarely bother with any connected midi controller and adjust parts by looping bars until I have something satisfactory.

This approach may not be amenable to all genres, but it is methodical.

This yields 30 to 90 second parts that I can then revisit days/weeks/months/years later and see if it still resonates.

This way, you don't commit to a song at all, you commit to composing pieces.

Just a perspective for something to try. It also has you lessen the degree to which you tie your "worth" as a performer to your ability to canvas and experiment with ideas.

OR, try to follow videos (I like it when reasonexperts posts a new video on YouTube), and see if you can follow along with what they create.

[Ropay]

Haha aburazaru, I would be more than happy to send over some banjo samples if it weren't for the fact that I have an old school Skype microphone plugged into my X-Fi soundcard! I was actually on the verge of buying some paired mics and an audio interface but wanted to "limit my distractions" and stick to purely digital composition. (Ridiculous I know, almost like I'm trying to fight it right?)

Speaking of composition, ahuimanu, it is indeed pertinent to acknowledge the separation between 'performance' from 'composition'. That's obviously not to say they can't compliment each other and/or work together but I think I have always focused too much on the performance. In this scenario, performance is 'easy' as I can just pick up my guitar I've been playing for 25 years and get my musical quick fix. Or the banjo and play the intro to "Dueling Banjos" again ..and again. And again.

I've watched some videos this evening and, even though I have no idea about some of the controls they're using and effects and mixing techniques, it is actually easy to start something and roll with it. I'm looking forward to the Radical Piano addition to Reason 10 as well as the new synthesisers even though I don't really know how to use them. The extra sounds and samples since my Reason 7 will also be welcome I'm sure.

Once again, thank you all for the inspiration and tips. It's about focus and dedication for me now.