Reason 10 announced!

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EnochLight
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25 Sep 2017

joeyluck wrote:
25 Sep 2017
There are some people here claiming the UI doesn't look real enough and others claiming they don't like the knobs because of the material they are made out of...
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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miscend
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25 Sep 2017

TritoneAddiction wrote:
25 Sep 2017
miscend wrote:
25 Sep 2017
A good comparison. Where do you guys think Europa gets it wrong and Thor gets it right?
Interesting. For me it's the other way around. Where does Europa get it right and Thor gets it wrong?

Thor has always looked like a mess to me with all the sections spread out randomly. And the only way to somewhat make sense of it all is to follow a bunch of arrows pointing everywhere.
It's a nice synth capable of many things but I've never liked working with it because of how it looks.

Europa to me looks clean and focused and pretty inviting. It looks like a dummy like me can understand the basics of it within the first few minutes of trying it, which I appreciate greatly in any device.
For me Europa is really barren and unpopulated, there is too much unused empty space between all the sections. Look at the panel with the OSC mixer it takes up a whole lot of space for what it does. Europa honestly should have been made smaller.

If you look at Thor there is no wasted space, every single pixel is put to good use. Thor has roughly the same amount of rack space (I'm guessing) but they have managed to also include a step sequencer and a mod matrix with more slots/destinations. You can also close the programmer to hide parts of the synth you don't need which is nice.

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MattiasHG
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25 Sep 2017

seqoi wrote:
25 Sep 2017
Mattias can Europa and Grain host/accept Audio IN on the backside and process incoming audio through their internal FX blocks?

And are these FX sections on Europe and Grain new algorithms or they are copies from older Reason FXes?
There's currently no audio in for the two synths (though Grain can sample and playback "normally").

In terms of FX, there's a bit of both if I'm not mistaken! Check them out during beta or at launch :)

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MattiasHG
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25 Sep 2017

dana wrote:
25 Sep 2017
Pretty excited about the new drums and loops.

I think that has always been missing from the factory bank, enough drum hits and loops.
Happy to hear that! It's something I've heard a lot from users, that the built-in drum samples felt lacking. This is one big injection of drum sounds and I've already made a bunch of sketches with them. :)

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pjeudy
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25 Sep 2017

The look of Europa is beginning to fade for me the more I look at it. It really simple. it just displays certain processes like Filter,wave forms etc...all thing we have seen in SERUM and Expanse .

And as for the sound I know that one needs to create there own sounds with it to notice it's uniqueness...but from the sample audio clip on the Props page...they sound like every day free synth you can get online. The thought of having new devices is a powerful thing but push past the blur...EUROPA seems more like a wave table type synth from today , meaning it must display the wav forms and it must display what happens when you use a filter. And of course those multi point envelopes...to get that Monster SERUM, Massive Growwwl...which is cool.

I think GRAIN will offer something a little more interesting then EUROPA.
Last edited by pjeudy on 25 Sep 2017, edited 1 time in total.
My opinion is that Propellerhead REASON needs a complete rewrite!
P.S: people should stop saying "No it won't happen" when referring to a complete rewrite of REASON. I have 3 letters for ya....VST
Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:53 pm

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plasticfractal
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25 Sep 2017

I agree with the comments about the drums. A nice broad selection of usable drum sounds will be a huge plus. I also think they should make a drum machine that takes the best of kong and redrum, and add some features similar to breaktweaker/nerve and they would have a huge hit. As it is there really isn't a "mother of all drum machine" plugin (geist kind of comes close, but is a lot more ambitious than just a drum sequencer).

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JiggeryPokery
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25 Sep 2017

MattiasHG wrote:
25 Sep 2017

It is strawman. I just meant that nobody questions the quality or design of Buchla modules, even though the knobs are cheap. :geek:

Can't wait for you guys to try Europa! :)
Ah, ok, that I'll grant you. And yes, I look forward to trying it too :p

All other issues being other issues —and I much prefer the oldskool natural Reason style— I actually think those large knobs themselves look pretty cool. But coincidentally I posted elsewhere about automation boxes just last week, before I knew about Europa and its use of red. I stand by those comments, though: Red, especially at or near pure RGB red is a very difficult colour, especially in fonts, where they are harsh, while darker red fades from a clearly readable contrast far too quickly, imho.

On the other side of the coin, and to end on a positive note, I do love the balls to do near-white display backgrounds on Grain. Only PH could both do that and pull it off.

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TritoneAddiction
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25 Sep 2017

miscend wrote:
25 Sep 2017
TritoneAddiction wrote:
25 Sep 2017

Interesting. For me it's the other way around. Where does Europa get it right and Thor gets it wrong?

Thor has always looked like a mess to me with all the sections spread out randomly. And the only way to somewhat make sense of it all is to follow a bunch of arrows pointing everywhere.
It's a nice synth capable of many things but I've never liked working with it because of how it looks.

Europa to me looks clean and focused and pretty inviting. It looks like a dummy like me can understand the basics of it within the first few minutes of trying it, which I appreciate greatly in any device.
For me Europa is really barren and unpopulated, there is too much unused empty space between all the sections. Look at the panel with the OSC mixer it takes up a whole lot of space for what it does. Europa honestly should have been made smaller.

If you look at Thor there is no wasted space, every single pixel is put to good use. Thor has roughly the same amount of rack space (I'm guessing) but they have managed to also include a step sequencer and a mod matrix with more slots/destinations. You can also close the programmer to hide parts of the synth you don't need which is nice.
Alright, well we apparentlyhave very different tastes then. I don't mind some extra unused space here and there and I'm definitely more of a "less is more" kind of guy when it comes to REs/devices. I get overwhelmed when everything is crammed and there's to much going on on the screen. Perhaps it's no coincidence that I love the simple and big GUI of the Legend synth. That one could easily be turned into a half size rack but I'm very glad it's not. Meteora and Dyingstar are perfect examples of synth GUIs I could never work with because of how cluttered it looks.

I take it you must hate the GUIs of stuff like Saturation knob or the McDSP REs then. So much empty unused space :)

Anyway there's no right or wrong. It's all about taste.

EdGrip
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25 Sep 2017

TritoneAddiction wrote:
25 Sep 2017

I take it you must hate the GUIs of stuff like Saturation knob or the McDSP REs then. So much empty unused space :)
PMS-20 <3

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Loque
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25 Sep 2017

TritoneAddiction wrote:
25 Sep 2017
miscend wrote:
25 Sep 2017


For me Europa is really barren and unpopulated, there is too much unused empty space between all the sections. Look at the panel with the OSC mixer it takes up a whole lot of space for what it does. Europa honestly should have been made smaller.

If you look at Thor there is no wasted space, every single pixel is put to good use. Thor has roughly the same amount of rack space (I'm guessing) but they have managed to also include a step sequencer and a mod matrix with more slots/destinations. You can also close the programmer to hide parts of the synth you don't need which is nice.
Alright, well we apparentlyhave very different tastes then. I don't mind some extra unused space here and there and I'm definitely more of a "less is more" kind of guy when it comes to REs/devices. I get overwhelmed when everything is crammed and there's to much going on on the screen. Perhaps it's no coincidence that I love the simple and big GUI of the Legend synth. That one could easily be turned into a half size rack but I'm very glad it's not. Meteora and Dyingstar are perfect examples of synth GUIs I could never work with because of how cluttered it looks.

I take it you must hate the GUIs of stuff like Saturation knob or the McDSP REs then. So much empty unused space :)

Anyway there's no right or wrong. It's all about taste.
Whish the devs would hide "high pro nerd tweaking stuff" behind panels. Dont care, if they are hidden or expandable. Hidden seems to be lot of work or impossible in IDT, expandable is defently not possible. But sometimes i just dont want to see all the stuff keeping me off from what its important, but i WANT that nerdy tweaking stuff, when i am in the mood and than i am sad, that there is not enuf tweaky nery stuff i can do - i mean, why limit a mod matrix to 8 slots?
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MattiasHG
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25 Sep 2017

pjeudy wrote:
25 Sep 2017
And as for the sound I know that one needs to create there own sounds with it to notice it's uniqueness...but from the sample audio clip on the Props page...they sound like every day free synth you can get online.
I think you will be very pleasantly surprised. :)

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miscend
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25 Sep 2017

Saturation Knob annoys me. It should be a half rack device.

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TritoneAddiction
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25 Sep 2017

Loque wrote:
25 Sep 2017
Whish the devs would hide "high pro nerd tweaking stuff" behind panels. Dont care, if they are hidden or expandable. Hidden seems to be lot of work or impossible in IDT, expandable is defently not possible. But sometimes i just dont want to see all the stuff keeping me off from what its important, but i WANT that nerdy tweaking stuff, when i am in the mood and than i am sad, that there is not enuf tweaky nery stuff i can do - i mean, why limit a mod matrix to 8 slots?
I think Expanse does a great job at allowing lots of options while still being pretty easy to work with and look at. It allows you to go into nerdy tweak mode if you want but you can also get a lot of cool sounds with it very easily without much knowledge.

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Loque
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25 Sep 2017

TritoneAddiction wrote:
25 Sep 2017
Loque wrote:
25 Sep 2017
Whish the devs would hide "high pro nerd tweaking stuff" behind panels. Dont care, if they are hidden or expandable. Hidden seems to be lot of work or impossible in IDT, expandable is defently not possible. But sometimes i just dont want to see all the stuff keeping me off from what its important, but i WANT that nerdy tweaking stuff, when i am in the mood and than i am sad, that there is not enuf tweaky nery stuff i can do - i mean, why limit a mod matrix to 8 slots?
I think Expanse does a great job at allowing lots of options while still being pretty easy to work with and look at. It allows you to go into nerdy tweak mode if you want but you can also get a lot of cool sounds with it very easily without much knowledge.
Yea great sounds within a few seconds, but not enuf nerdy tweaky stuff for me (mod matrix slots, selectable modifiers, routings) :lol:
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davidvilla
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25 Sep 2017

MattiasHG wrote:
25 Sep 2017

I think you will be very pleasantly surprised. :)
Hope so, but your track record isn't exactly inspiring.

So Subtractor didn't exactly set the world afire sonically.

Malstrom was ok, but again - meh. Yeah it has loads of stuff you can tweak onboard, but again, sonically??? No.

Then Thor comes out and is immediately better than any Reason synth. But outside of the Reason bubble so many here seem to be at home in, Thor was mediocre (compared to some high profile VST plugins). And again, I am speaking sonically....sure Thor has loads of "stuff" onboard. But the sound...it's all about the sound.

Then I don't even remember - PX7? Which again , didn't do much for elevating FM synthesis to the next level, functionally or sonically.

And then....Parsec? The "king of thin", as I like to call it. Again, yes it is feature rich, but sonically?? No. Unless you are limited to the Reason bubble, then you'd probably think it's amazing. Those of us not limited to the Reason bubble - it's mediocre.

So now these 2 new synths which you are about to release, you say we're going to be surprised. But what are you comparing them to? Reason's internal synths??? What about compared to Omnisphere or Alchemy?? I really don't care if it has a bunch of options, and modules, and parameters, and CV this CV that. I just want it to sound as hi-fi, as expensive, as glossy, rich, thick , wide, as a really high quality synth plugin.

So we'll see, but I doubt it.
Last edited by davidvilla on 25 Sep 2017, edited 2 times in total.

EdGrip
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25 Sep 2017

No pressure, Mattias, but Europa better be good - purely to prove David wrong! ^_^

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davidvilla
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25 Sep 2017

Believe me, I REALLY want to be wrong. And I'd have no problem admitting I was wrong.

Waiting for beta....

avasopht
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25 Sep 2017

So we all just going to casually insult the hard work of their graphics designer are we?* :(

Sometimes things are not necessarily better or worse, just different.

*: I am being a little tongue in cheek
Last edited by avasopht on 25 Sep 2017, edited 1 time in total.

EdGrip
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25 Sep 2017

The more I look at Europa the more I like the design. The red's not so bad (I mean, I still think it's a bit much, especially the LCD displays) and overall the layout is pleasing and uncluttered but with lots to get stuck into. And it looks unmistakably like a Propellerhead device. I hope it sounds good!

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TritoneAddiction
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25 Sep 2017

davidvilla wrote:
25 Sep 2017
MattiasHG wrote:
25 Sep 2017

I think you will be very pleasantly surprised. :)
Hope so, but your track record isn't exactly inspiring.

So Subtractor didn't exactly set the world afire sonically.

Malstrom was ok, but again - meh. Yeah it had loads of stuff you can tweak onboard, but again, sonically??? No.

Then Thor comes out and is immediately better than any Reason synth. But outside of the Reason bubble so many here seem to be at home in, Thor was mediocre (compared to some high profile VST plugins). And again, I am speaking sonically....sure Thor has loads of "stuff" onboard. But the sound...it's all about the sound.

Then I don't even remember - PX7? Which again , didn't do much for elevating FM synthesis to the next level, functionally or sonically.

And then....Parsec? The king of "thin", as I like to call it. Again, yes it is feature rich, but sonically?? No. Unless you are limited to the Reason bubble, then you'd probably think it's amazing. Those of us not limited to the Reason bubble - it's mediocre.

So now these 2 new synths which you are about to release, you say we're going to be surprised. But what are you comparing them to? Reason's internal synths??? What about compared to Omnisphere or Alchemy?? I really don't care if it has a bunch of options, and modules, and parameters, and CV this CV that. I just want it to sound as hi-fi, as expensive, as glossy, rich, thick , wide, as a really high quality synth plugin.

So we'll see, but I doubt it.
I agree with you to some extent, but imo Parsec is a pretty cool synth. I made this tune a while ago using only Parsec 1 for everything except the bass drum and snare. It may not be perfect mixing wise but I think I was able to create a pretty unique soundscape with it.


Besides beef it up with some some added distortion and it becomes a whole new synth, far from thin sounding. That's what most modern synth do anyway to get their sounds. So who cares if the distortion comes from the synth itself or if you add a distortion plugin afterwards.

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stratatonic
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25 Sep 2017

kitekrazy wrote:
23 Sep 2017
stratatonic wrote:
23 Sep 2017


.
Klang and Pang and Sang
Sample Players split in three
Should have been just one.


.

klang.jpg
pang.jpg
sang.jpg
Since these are REs I wonder how much bloat it will add to my C drive. I would still love the option to move the included Reason samples to another drive as an option and not a work around. Outside of the Venus one I'm not sure I'd use the others. Sound Iron stuff is unique but I'd rather have then make refills.
Yes, maybe there will be an option to have content on another drive. All REs and all samples. I don't mind Refills, but I think you'll see a lot more of these mini players in the future, both from indy devs and Propellerhead.

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QVprod
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25 Sep 2017

Seems quite a few here are more interested in graphic design than the synths themselves....

Nick Pa
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25 Sep 2017

So, Reason 10 has been announced to release late October !! But who cares ?? Not me...since they didn't listen to anything the Reason User community has asked for.

All they did was add 3GBs of new sounds, 2 new instruments and the Grain sampler... and they call it the biggest content upgrade ever ! Sure it is...but that's not what we asked for, at all !!!

Where is the new easier Work Flow ? Zoom capability ? Real SSL Mixer or upgrade ? Compressor ? EQ ? Scream update ? Recycle integration ? Any Parameter tweekability, any ? Did they fix the VST bugs/compatibility issues ?

Now I have to wait another 14 to 18 months for Reason 11, in hopes they add at least one of the things I have been waiting for. $129 isn't worth some sounds and smoke and mirrors.
Great job Propellerhead! WAY TO LISTEN TO THE PEOPLE THAT KEEP YOU WORKING AND HELP GIVE YOU A PAY CHECK... SMH maybe next release...maybe?

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TritoneAddiction
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25 Sep 2017

QVprod wrote:
25 Sep 2017
Seems quite a few here are more interested in graphic design than the synths themselves....
Well GUI and workflow matter after all.

Besides it's harder to discuss the synth themselves at this point since we haven't tried them yet.

Many times the demos aren't enough to judge whether you'll like a synth or not, at least in my experience.

stp2015
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25 Sep 2017

QVprod wrote:
25 Sep 2017
Seems quite a few here are more interested in graphic design than the synths themselves....
The reason for this is that working with the outdated resolution is becoming less and less pleasant, especially on laptops with high res displays. So, while I like the Synths more than graphics, I do want to see them clearly... :D

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