Why actually reason is the worst DAW ever

This forum is for discussing Reason. Questions, answers, ideas, and opinions... all apply.
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Miss Controllerism
Posts: 59
Joined: 12 Jun 2015

18 Sep 2017

Ostermilk wrote:
18 Sep 2017
Miss Controllerism wrote:
18 Sep 2017

there are many video test on youtube that show how kontakt opened in one instance with more instirment inside save resources and ram instead of open different instances of kotnakt
Reason 9.5 is the first iteration of VST support. What you are talking about (multi-timbral control) is a known limitation currently, you can watch lots of videos or even learn about it here.

viewtopic.php?f=47&t=7500363

You'd have hated the previous version then, that one didn't even have VST support, imagine that.... :lol:

Reason users sure are some crazy cats ain't they? I'm sure most of them would like to see some kind of separate midi channel flow going on in the next version though.

i did a test this morning opening up to 40 Kontakt instances with different instruments each... and another test open 3 kontakt instance wher einside ive opene up to 40 instruments as well........Wanna see the results.? Basically the project with 40 kontakt Instances as soon i open it... the DSP level in reason skip up to 4 tag....this mean that i cant really work ont his projesct as soon i star to record some tracks the Ovelroad cpu alert will appear

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chimp_spanner
Posts: 2908
Joined: 06 Mar 2015

18 Sep 2017

Yeah I think a lot of this will be resolved when Kontakt can accept multiple MIDI channels, so you're not having to load 40 instances of the plugin when you could do the same with 2 or 3. Like I said there *are* some issues. Some plugins will eat CPU before any audio or MIDI even passes through them (the EQs in Komplete are particularly bad; you pretty much use a bar per instance or two). So obviously something needs to be sorted, and I'm sure PH are working on it. They kinda need to be, as there's more of a spotlight on Reason than there has been for a long time!

But I guess my point was that as a DAW that was never supposed to have VST, I'm not sure it's entirely fair to rate it "worst ever" because of its VST performance. If you take Reason as what it was pre 9.5, with the RE platform, all of its unique features, it's a very good piece of software IMO. Taking this one, new aspect of it and saying Reason is shit because of it...to me, is a little wrong. But, of course, PH are selling this as a VST host. So...I understand why it's an issue.

sdst
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18 Sep 2017

I still use reason 3

If you want you can give me your copy of the worst DAW ever, I sacrifice myself

my user is, sdst

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Miss Controllerism
Posts: 59
Joined: 12 Jun 2015

18 Sep 2017

Carly(Poohbear) wrote:
17 Sep 2017
Lets see how many other DAW's can play RE's..... Oh that's none, so in your book they most be worst, so there are no good DAW's..

Also you did not show your preferences so your performance issues you showed may not be totally valid...

Oh well, back to making music....

well re are cool in the reason ecosystem but really a paort some special like nostromo parsec and resonans you can find easily vst alternatives

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Miss Controllerism
Posts: 59
Joined: 12 Jun 2015

18 Sep 2017

sdst wrote:
18 Sep 2017
I still use reason 3

If you want you can give me your copy of the worst DAW ever, I sacrifice myself

my user is, sdst
if you interested im gonn asell the license ... write in pvt

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Loque
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Joined: 28 Dec 2015

18 Sep 2017

Miss Controllerism wrote:
18 Sep 2017
sdst wrote:
18 Sep 2017
I still use reason 3

If you want you can give me your copy of the worst DAW ever, I sacrifice myself

my user is, sdst
if you interested im gonn asell the license ... write in pvt
Two satisfied customers...
Reason12, Win10

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aeox
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Posts: 3222
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Location: Oregon

18 Sep 2017

Miss Controllerism wrote:
18 Sep 2017
sdst wrote:
18 Sep 2017
I still use reason 3

If you want you can give me your copy of the worst DAW ever, I sacrifice myself

my user is, sdst
if you interested im gonn asell the license ... write in pvt
I'm sure it was mentioned before, it's best to utilize the 30 day trial before committing to buying Reason.

mark999
Posts: 67
Joined: 13 Jun 2017

18 Sep 2017

To all the people who are upset about the original posters comments, and took it personally;

You will never move forward with anything in life if you just accept things the way they are. You have to recognize problems and see opportunities for improvement. She has just highlighted some problems that Propellerheads should be thankful for, because it also gives them an indication of the frustrations that their users encounter, and in terms of prioritizing what to improve on, it's invaluable information for them.

She picked a good place to write about her problems, this is a Reason forum and her problems are with Reason. Why would she go to the pro tools forums to report a Reason issue???

Perhaps there should be a permanent sticky section on the forum called "Frustrations" where people could put in anything about Reason that's pissing them off. It could be connected to a word cloud where the most mentioned words in that thread would appear the largest, so when Propellerheads would come to look in there, they would see the most frequently mentioned words / frustrations that people are having.

To all the people that are currently happy with Reason, good for you, stick to your current version and make music and don't click on posts like this. Everyone has a right to complain, it's passion for the product and they are trying to make it better than it currently is.
Unfortunately most people completely misunderstand this and take it personally.

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Loque
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18 Sep 2017

mark999 wrote:
18 Sep 2017
To all the people who are upset about the original posters comments, and took it personally;

You will never move forward with anything in life if you just accept things the way they are. You have to recognize problems and see opportunities for improvement. She has just highlighted some problems that Propellerheads should be thankful for, because it also gives them an indication of the frustrations that their users encounter, and in terms of prioritizing what to improve on, it's invaluable information for them.

She picked a good place to write about her problems, this is a Reason forum and her problems are with Reason. Why would she go to the pro tools forums to report a Reason issue???

Perhaps there should be a permanent sticky section on the forum called "Frustrations" where people could put in anything about Reason that's pissing them off. It could be connected to a word cloud where the most mentioned words in that thread would appear the largest, so when Propellerheads would come to look in there, they would see the most frequently mentioned words / frustrations that people are having.

To all the people that are currently happy with Reason, good for you, stick to your current version and make music and don't click on posts like this. Everyone has a right to complain, it's passion for the product and they are trying to make it better than it currently is.
Unfortunately most people completely misunderstand this and take it personally.
We already have the feature suggestion thread. Lot of frustrated ppl posted there. And IMO i always want more features...but sometimes i notice, how i get lost in all my features and gears and stuff. Someone here mention, there is always room for improvement in every DAW. Years back i tried Ableton Live i really liked it, but the lack of good buildin synths and a creativity boost when just "playing" and "fiddling" around was missing, so went to Reason. Cubase was just a LOL, several free DAWs i tried crashed after max 10mins. FL is so...my friend calls it "Dreck" (could be translated as "junk"?). Before Reason introduced VSTs i was thinking to add Live as a 3nd DAW, but Reason was faster :-D

As you said, you need to go YOUR way...
Reason12, Win10

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plasticfractal
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18 Sep 2017

You have some valid points, though I don't agree with the conclusion of "worst daw ever". I am sure that vst support will improve in the next version (we really need more than 8 stereo outs while we're at it). The sequencer desperately needs some attention, some basic features really need to be there. My worst fear is that propellerheads will waste valuable dev resources making mobile apps instead of improving their core product. Hopefully my fears will not come true. I also think they need to make platform-specific versions of Reason (Windows and Mac). I suspect a lot of the performance issues stem from the platform agnostic architecture. Rack extensions and Reason can't be specially optimized for Mac or Windows.

Andy
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Posts: 93
Joined: 03 May 2017

18 Sep 2017

If Reason CPU performance falls short compared to other DAWs, It needs to be address without making excuses for Propellerhead.

Half the other crap you mention is personal preferences which most probably don't give a shit about. Its probably best to get DAW that does what you need.

Bitwig doesnt support Rewire. Worst fucking DAW ever. :shock:

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DinoJ
Posts: 72
Joined: 22 Jan 2015
Location: UK

18 Sep 2017

@Mark999

I agree, no reason anyone can't have a place to talk about the issues and sure here is the perfect place, am sure we all got one or two. Personally though I see no need to create a thread with a Click-bait title and then a YouTube video with one, claiming it is the worst DAW ever, to me it always comes across as someone wanting to be edgy and raise there online profile/viewcount even if there points raised are valid, purely because of the dramatic title. Ultimately it is there opinion as the product does not live up to their own expectations but does it really need such a dramatic title? Ironically I would not have such an issue with the title had it been worded; 'Why Reason is the worst DAW ever for me'

As for the topic discussed here, this is obviously subjective, sure the OP has issues and they pretty much a deal breaker and frustrating for him/her and I totally understand that but all a thread title like this, on a forum dedicated to Reason serves to do, is cause yet another potentially heated debate and polarize some of the more passionate people. Which is what is obviously happening, hence your post, some of the previous posts and now sadly my post too!

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Karim
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18 Sep 2017

Miss Controllerism wrote:really upset to say but everything its explained here in my video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LySCF-s ... e=youtu.be
So worst that it makes me a living. Pay my bills and finish to buy my house [emoji16].



Inviato dal mio SM-G935F utilizzando Tapatalk

Karim Le Mec : Dj/Producer/Label Owner ( :reason: 11.3+ R12  IMac 2016 21")
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Karim
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18 Sep 2017

Carly(Poohbear) wrote:Lets see how many other DAW's can play RE's..... Oh that's none, so in your book they most be worst, so there are no good DAW's..

Also you did not show your preferences so your performance issues you showed may not be totally valid...

Oh well, back to making music....
THIS!! [emoji6]

Inviato dal mio SM-G935F utilizzando Tapatalk

Karim Le Mec : Dj/Producer/Label Owner ( :reason: 11.3+ R12  IMac 2016 21")
FOLLOW Karim Le Mec
https://www.youtube.com/user/lemecdj
https://karimlemec.weebly.com/
https://soundcloud.com/karimlemec
https://t.me/reasonstudiosworld

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Miss Controllerism
Posts: 59
Joined: 12 Jun 2015

18 Sep 2017

chimp_spanner wrote:
18 Sep 2017
Yeah I think a lot of this will be resolved when Kontakt can accept multiple MIDI channels, so you're not having to load 40 instances of the plugin when you could do the same with 2 or 3. Like I said there *are* some issues. Some plugins will eat CPU before any audio or MIDI even passes through them (the EQs in Komplete are particularly bad; you pretty much use a bar per instance or two). So obviously something needs to be sorted, and I'm sure PH are working on it. They kinda need to be, as there's more of a spotlight on Reason than there has been for a long time!

But I guess my point was that as a DAW that was never supposed to have VST, I'm not sure it's entirely fair to rate it "worst ever" because of its VST performance. If you take Reason as what it was pre 9.5, with the RE platform, all of its unique features, it's a very good piece of software IMO. Taking this one, new aspect of it and saying Reason is shit because of it...to me, is a little wrong. But, of course, PH are selling this as a VST host. So...I understand why it's an issue.

there is no point to implement VST just because they were loosing clients so as a desperate marketing strategy they accepted to open to vst... but they did it without looking at the optimization seriously in my opinoin.. at this point i prefer reason just with rack extension if i have to use a daw that become slow and really cpu hungry with using VST whats the point to use them.. they will slower your workflow... even stability is now gone... Reason never crashed one time before VST .. now its become a daw like the others... One time it was the most stable daw..

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Miss Controllerism
Posts: 59
Joined: 12 Jun 2015

18 Sep 2017

Loque wrote:
18 Sep 2017
mark999 wrote:
18 Sep 2017
To all the people who are upset about the original posters comments, and took it personally;

You will never move forward with anything in life if you just accept things the way they are. You have to recognize problems and see opportunities for improvement. She has just highlighted some problems that Propellerheads should be thankful for, because it also gives them an indication of the frustrations that their users encounter, and in terms of prioritizing what to improve on, it's invaluable information for them.

She picked a good place to write about her problems, this is a Reason forum and her problems are with Reason. Why would she go to the pro tools forums to report a Reason issue???

Perhaps there should be a permanent sticky section on the forum called "Frustrations" where people could put in anything about Reason that's pissing them off. It could be connected to a word cloud where the most mentioned words in that thread would appear the largest, so when Propellerheads would come to look in there, they would see the most frequently mentioned words / frustrations that people are having.

To all the people that are currently happy with Reason, good for you, stick to your current version and make music and don't click on posts like this. Everyone has a right to complain, it's passion for the product and they are trying to make it better than it currently is.
Unfortunately most people completely misunderstand this and take it personally.
We already have the feature suggestion thread. Lot of frustrated ppl posted there. And IMO i always want more features...but sometimes i notice, how i get lost in all my features and gears and stuff. Someone here mention, there is always room for improvement in every DAW. Years back i tried Ableton Live i really liked it, but the lack of good buildin synths and a creativity boost when just "playing" and "fiddling" around was missing, so went to Reason. Cubase was just a LOL, several free DAWs i tried crashed after max 10mins. FL is so...my friend calls it "Dreck" (could be translated as "junk"?). Before Reason introduced VSTs i was thinking to add Live as a 3nd DAW, but Reason was faster :-D

As you said, you need to go YOUR way...

lack of builidn synth?

well ableto has very powerfull synth inside al most are coming from AAS a really good company that makes synthesys model instruments... like loounge lizard... have a look at tension or Operator they re relaly good but ableton its the opposit of reason.. its minimalistic while reason its more graphically enjoable but also more gimmick

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FlowerSoldier
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18 Sep 2017

We could rename this thread "1st World Problems"

Marc64
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18 Sep 2017

What is the CPU usage limit in reason on the vid?

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QVprod
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18 Sep 2017

I know we're going off of personal opinions here, but I'd have to agree to label Reason as the "worse DAW ever" for the reasons listed in the video is a bit of a stretch....

I get the annoyance of the VST optimization. Because of that I choose not to do heavy VST work in Reason. I use Studio One for that, as well as all audio engineer related tasks. Everything else works as it did before though and it's not like it was impossible to make quality music before 9.5. In the meantime you find the balance of what you can do with VST in Reason. Unless you're a brand new Reason user, I find the idea of wanting to use VSTs exclusively in Reason pretty odd if you are aware of the quality of the stock content and whatever REs and Refills you've acquired over the years.

As far as folder tracks... The feature is in Studio One and I barely ever use it. It's useful but probably not a deal breaking feature. I don't think Pro Tools has folder tracks either. How useful that is too you will rely highly on what you're creating.

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plasticfractal
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18 Sep 2017

I love Reason and will defend it until the bitter end, but the one thing that could legitimately kill it would be vst performance. Vsts are getting bigger and more complex every year. Serious musicians will want to be able to drop in multiple instances of omnisphere, avenger, falcon, neutron, etc. I hope vst performance is way high up on their priority list (way ahead of mobile nonsense), because the successful DAWs of the near future will be those which can handle all the gigantic monster VSTs which will surely arrive.

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fieldframe
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18 Sep 2017

So really, the non-clickbait title of this would be "Why Reason is the worst DAW for Kontakt"

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bxbrkrz
Posts: 3812
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

18 Sep 2017

Just using an Analog Four, an Octatrack and a Rytm is a very liberating creative process for a lot of producers. Away from computer screens and the bottomless pit of VST acquisition. Maybe this is what you need?
757365206C6F67696320746F207365656B20616E73776572732075736520726561736F6E20746F2066696E6420776973646F6D20676574206F7574206F6620796F757220636F6D666F7274207A6F6E65206F7220796F757220696E737069726174696F6E2077696C6C206372797374616C6C697A6520666F7265766572

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Creativemind
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18 Sep 2017

fieldframe wrote:
18 Sep 2017
So really, the non-clickbait title of this would be "Why Reason is the worst DAW for Kontakt"
I think the title of this thread should be, "4 Things I Think Need Addressing in Reason"
:reason:

Reason Studio's 11.3 / Cockos Reaper 6.82 / Cakewalk By Bandlab / Orion 8.6
http://soundcloud.com/creativemind75/iv ... soul-mix-3

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decoder
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Joined: 04 Nov 2016

18 Sep 2017

A quick comment to the OP... I was looking at your Youtube channel and on August 9th, 2017 you posted a video titled "The best DAW charts of 2017" and you had placed Propellerheads Reason as number 3.
Now you are saying that reason is the worst DAW ever. :?
That is a politician's level flip-flop if I've ever seen one!

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Iapetus 9
Posts: 199
Joined: 18 Jan 2015

18 Sep 2017

Got no probs running Kontakt, but then I never need 40 instances of it. If you need 40 instances of anything, then you're doing it wrong. I never expected to use my VST's inside Reason, and while I'm sure things will get smoother with updates, Reason has made Studio One gather a ton of dust. It's only saving grace right now is the ability to run the 32bit plugs I love so much without a stupid bridge. Reason is hardly the worst DAW evar.
38L > 51D every time.

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