VST's - Reason discussion

[EnochLight]

BUT! i have to use 2 programmes.. :/ =Bummer..

Actually, it's 3 programs if you count your OS...

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[Stranger.]

ΣΣΣ

[Ahornberg]

Using JACKAudio it's also possible to use VST FX. On my Win 8.1 using a Zoom H5 as audio interface I get 11ms delay from Reason out to Bitwig and in Reason back again.

[platzangst]

Can you move these REs to a new Reason installation on a new computer?

Yes, and it's very easy to do so.

I can confirm that, since I just got a new laptop for an upcoming trip, and I installed Reason on it and all my REs.

The REs, even the ones no longer being sold, are still on PH's servers, so all I did was go to my account page using a browser on my new laptop and click on the "sync all" button, and the Authorizer began to download every last RE I own.

This took quite a while, and I lost my connection about halfway through and had to re-start the process to get the remaining REs, but eventually they all got installed on my new computer.

[Ahornberg]

Can you move these REs to a new Reason installation on a new computer?

Yes, and it's very easy to do so.

I can confirm that, since I just got a new laptop for an upcoming trip, and I installed Reason on it and all my REs.

The REs, even the ones no longer being sold, are still on PH's servers, so all I did was go to my account page using a browser on my new laptop and click on the "sync all" button, and the Authorizer began to download every last RE I own.

This took quite a while, and I lost my connection about halfway through and had to re-start the process to get the remaining REs, but eventually they all got installed on my new computer.

that's fine

[Upright]

Anyone who wishes to seriously campaign for that should be taking it directly to the Props (good luck), and be prepared to make a really good case that shows how adding VSTs would benefit Props more (not only financially but aesthetically) than keeping on with their current plans (again, good luck).

Has anyone noticed that these threads on VST support in Reason tend to be very lengthy? That's because those who want VST support are passionate about it.....as well as those who don't. If you've been around for a while you'll know that we had the same intense debates about adding Midi out to Reason. Some argued against it, for some of the silliest reasons (I think mostly to acknowledge their loyalty to Props). Why did Props add Midi out? Why did they wait so long? These VST debates will continue on and on and on, so my advice is to enjoy them.


During the early industrial Revolution farmers disdained the idea of the use of iron tools and technology that would actually have made working their land many times more efficient. They preferred to continue using the wooden tools they were accustom to. Farmers were literally shown new tools working the land yielding higher productivity and efficiency and they still wouldn't use the new technology. Reason purist are exactly like the farmers of old, stubborn and ignorant to the wealth of productivity that awaits them if they would just embrace the future.

[joeyluck]

Anyone who wishes to seriously campaign for that should be taking it directly to the Props (good luck), and be prepared to make a really good case that shows how adding VSTs would benefit Props more (not only financially but aesthetically) than keeping on with their current plans (again, good luck).

Has anyone noticed that these threads on VST support in Reason tend to be very lengthy? That's because those who want VST support are passionate about it.....as well as those who don't. If you've been around for a while you'll know that we had the same intense debates about adding Midi out to Reason. Some argued against it, for some of the silliest reasons (I think mostly to acknowledge their loyalty to Props). Why did Props add Midi out? Why did they wait so long? These VST debates will continue on and on and on, so my advice is to enjoy them.


During the early industrial Revolution farmers disdained the idea of the use of iron tools and technology that would actually have made working their land many times more efficient. They preferred to continue using the wooden tools they were accustom to. Farmers were literally shown new tools working the land yielding higher productivity and efficiency and they still wouldn't use the new technology. Reason purist are exactly like the farmers of old, stubborn and ignorant to the wealth of productivity that awaits them if they would just embrace the future.

I was reading the second paragraph and thought you were going somewhere else with it, yet you went in the opposite direction I expected. Since you were saying'new technology.' I think VST's are those wooden, ineffient tools. Can't undo? What is this? Beta? Nope, it's 20 years old! REs are much better integegrated than any plugin could be. I thought trying to accommodate someone with an old format, no matter how sloppy and inefficient it is would be wasteful. Why can't folks embrace the new, more efficient technology?

I think this will make sense when you reread what you wrote with this in mind.

[gak]

I don't want it. (is that un-lengthly enough?

[Upright]

I was reading the second paragraph and thought you were going somewhere else with it, yet you went in the opposite direction I expected. Since you were saying'new technology.' I think VST's are those wooden, ineffient tools. Can't undo? What is this? Beta? Nope, it's 20 years old! REs are much better integegrated than any plugin could be. I thought trying to accommodate someone with an old format, no matter how sloppy and inefficient it is would be wasteful. Why can't folks embrace the new, more efficient technology?

I think this will make sense when you reread what you wrote with this in mind.

hehe...

The analogy was angled towards VST's being new to Reason users but that was very well played the way you twisted that back on me. Touché my friend, touché.

[mrj1nx]

Lots of opinions already, here's mine: I tried using Logic as a master and Reason as slave, but after trying it out for a week or two I just tended to not bother anymore. TBH if you have good plugins for your daw, then Reason is not worth the hassle for the individual instruments, even though some of them are really good. But I am very intolerant towards time sinks. Using rewire is more work, keeping stuff in your head, routing things via soundflower and so forth. In the end, I left Reason pretty quickly after trying a rewire setup now I use Logic and will give a few other DAW's a go during 2016.

[Gulale]

Here is the thing that I don't understand about Reason users, Most of the time I see undo implementation as a way of indication of superior plugin format. It depends person to person the way we see things everything is relative. For me Ctrl + z is inferior to the one that I have on top of the plugin. if I'm tweaking the plugin and something go wrong or I don't like, why bother undo on my keyboard while I can click on my plugin? I just don't understand you guys when you prefer two press two keyboard keys rather than click on the plugin. The faster the better for me.

Reason way also have its own advantages, If I replace an instrument by mistake that undo can save me. Which makes it the best also in this way.

[EnochLight]

Anyone who wishes to seriously campaign for that should be taking it directly to the Props (good luck), and be prepared to make a really good case that shows how adding VSTs would benefit Props more (not only financially but aesthetically) than keeping on with their current plans (again, good luck).

Has anyone noticed that these threads on VST support in Reason tend to be very lengthy? That's because those who want VST support are passionate about it.....as well as those who don't. If you've been around for a while you'll know that we had the same intense debates about adding Midi out to Reason. Some argued against it, for some of the silliest reasons (I think mostly to acknowledge their loyalty to Props). Why did Props add Midi out? Why did they wait so long? These VST debates will continue on and on and on, so my advice is to enjoy them.

During the early industrial Revolution farmers disdained the idea of the use of iron tools and technology that would actually have made working their land many times more efficient. They preferred to continue using the wooden tools they were accustom to. Farmers were literally shown new tools working the land yielding higher productivity and efficiency and they still wouldn't use the new technology. Reason purist are exactly like the farmers of old, stubborn and ignorant to the wealth of productivity that awaits them if they would just embrace the future.

MIDI out took so long because there was very little point to have it until Reason became a DAW at 6.0 with Record integration. As far as VST, well - we have Props response to that already... (Hits "Sync All" in account)..

[avasopht]

Here is the thing that I don't understand about Reason users, Most of the time I see undo implementation as a way of indication of superior plugin format. It depends person to person the way we see things everything is relative. For me Ctrl + z is inferior to the one that I have on top of the plugin. if I'm tweaking the plugin and something go wrong or I don't like, why bother undo on my keyboard while I can click on my plugin? I just don't understand you guys when you prefer two press two keyboard keys rather than click on the plugin. The faster the better for me.

Reason way also have its own advantages, If I replace an instrument by mistake that undo can save me. Which makes it the best also in this way.

So you're just working casually as you do and realize you need to undo a few changes you've just made with recordings; "shit," you exclaim, you forgot you also made parameter changes to one of your plugins.

It gets worse when you consider a chain of effects or a set of mixer channels where you've changes number of settings across devices that would require you to mentally recall not only which devices you changed but in what order and exactly how many 'changes' you made according to how the device decides to record undo.

[EnochLight]

Here is the thing that I don't understand about Reason users, Most of the time I see undo implementation as a way of indication of superior plugin format. It depends person to person the way we see things everything is relative. For me Ctrl + z is inferior to the one that I have on top of the plugin.

Reason's way of handling "undo" is in alignment with how your OS handles it, hence - for most people - it's the "better" way. When I'm working in Studio One, sometimes it drives me crazy how I have to go into each plugin just to do such a simple thing. So, it makes perfect sense to me that the undo feature of RE's is sold as a legitimate UPS (or, superior format feature, or however you want to categorize it) and in alignment with how Reason handles it.

[platzangst]

Lots of opinions already, here's mine: I tried using Logic as a master and Reason as slave, but after trying it out for a week or two I just tended to not bother anymore. TBH if you have good plugins for your daw, then Reason is not worth the hassle for the individual instruments, even though some of them are really good. But I am very intolerant towards time sinks. Using rewire is more work, keeping stuff in your head, routing things via soundflower and so forth. In the end, I left Reason pretty quickly after trying a rewire setup now I use Logic and will give a few other DAW's a go during 2016.

The thing that gets me (and not to single this one guy out, because there's been plenty of others at various times) is how some folks will go on about how they gave up on Reason and yet are still posting on what is probably the most Reason-oriented forum around. Why? Do people hang around long after they abandon Reason just in order to try to, I dunno, convince others to leave? Is it that important that they make their defection away known? What are they expecting? "Oh, gosh, this guy has given up Reason! Obviously I must also give it up as soon as possible!" It's like hanging outside a McDonalds and telling the people going inside "yeah, I ditched these guys ages ago and now I'm totally a Burger King man..." I just can't see the point.

[Upright]

The thing that gets me (and not to single this one guy out, because there's been plenty of others at various times) is how some folks will go on about how they gave up on Reason and yet are still posting on what is probably the most Reason-oriented forum around. Why? Do people hang around long after they abandon Reason just in order to try to, I dunno, convince others to leave?

I can't speak for everyone but for me personally the reason I stick around is - I like Reason. I'd love to see it really give the competing DAW's a good run for their money. I wait with baited breath hoping that the next update will be the one that lures me creatively to purchase the upgrade. I haven't used Reason in probably a year and a half...but I'm hopeful the right upgrade will come along eventually and excite my creative juices.

[submonsterz]

Here is the thing that I don't understand about Reason users, Most of the time I see undo implementation as a way of indication of superior plugin format. It depends person to person the way we see things everything is relative. For me Ctrl + z is inferior to the one that I have on top of the plugin.

Reason's way of handling "undo" is in alignment with how your OS handles it, hence - for most people - it's the "better" way. When I'm working in Studio One, sometimes it drives me crazy how I have to go into each plugin just to do such a simple thing. So, it makes perfect sense to me that the undo feature of RE's is sold as a legitimate UPS (or, superior format feature, or however you want to categorize it) and in alignment with how Reason handles it.

Just to ask the obvious so the biggest downfall to reasons undo feature is aired fairly .
What happens to your undo's on saving ???.
This complete let down in its system for undo is allways kept quiet.
Ohh and can you look through ya undo list and change something on a device from say 157 undos back without it deleting all your changes after the fact ohh and after you have saved project ?.
Hmmm the reson undo is neanderthal still.

[avasopht]

Just to ask the obvious so the biggest downfall to reasons undo feature is aired fairly .
What happens to your undo's on saving ???.
This complete let down in its system for undo is allways kept quiet.
Ohh and can you look through ya undo list and change something on a device from say 157 undos back without it deleting all your changes after the fact ohh and after you have saved project ?.
Hmmm the reson undo is neanderthal still.

I think it's interesting how attention bias plays in discussions among other shortcomings of our little minds (read more ).

[Ahornberg]

Here is the thing that I don't understand about Reason users, Most of the time I see undo implementation as a way of indication of superior plugin format. It depends person to person the way we see things everything is relative. For me Ctrl + z is inferior to the one that I have on top of the plugin.

Reason's way of handling "undo" is in alignment with how your OS handles it, hence - for most people - it's the "better" way. When I'm working in Studio One, sometimes it drives me crazy how I have to go into each plugin just to do such a simple thing. So, it makes perfect sense to me that the undo feature of RE's is sold as a legitimate UPS (or, superior format feature, or however you want to categorize it) and in alignment with how Reason handles it.

Just to ask the obvious so the biggest downfall to reasons undo feature is aired fairly .
What happens to your undo's on saving ???.
This complete let down in its system for undo is allways kept quiet.
Ohh and can you look through ya undo list and change something on a device from say 157 undos back without it deleting all your changes after the fact ohh and after you have saved project ?.
Hmmm the reson undo is neanderthal still.

interesting ... I didn't ever discover that ... just used undo for quick steps back

[Gulale]

Here is the thing that I don't understand about Reason users, Most of the time I see undo implementation as a way of indication of superior plugin format. It depends person to person the way we see things everything is relative. For me Ctrl + z is inferior to the one that I have on top of the plugin. if I'm tweaking the plugin and something go wrong or I don't like, why bother undo on my keyboard while I can click on my plugin? I just don't understand you guys when you prefer two press two keyboard keys rather than click on the plugin. The faster the better for me.

Reason way also have its own advantages, If I replace an instrument by mistake that undo can save me. Which makes it the best also in this way.

So you're just working casually as you do and realize you need to undo a few changes you've just made with recordings; "shit," you exclaim, you forgot you also made parameter changes to one of your plugins.

It gets worse when you consider a chain of effects or a set of mixer channels where you've changes number of settings across devices that would require you to mentally recall not only which devices you changed but in what order and exactly how many 'changes' you made according to how the device decides to record undo.

I'm not ignoring the possibility that you have with Reason undo but for tweaking compressor setting and to come back and undo that I prefer the VST plugin version. It doesn't touch another stuff that I have created just the compressor. If I have a habit of going back like 100 or 200 undos, for that I will tell the DAW to make a time interval back up and I recall it from there.

[EnochLight]

What happens to your undo's on saving ???.

I'm not saying the way Reason handles it is perfect by any stretch, but you're going to have to try harder to convince me of the clusterfuck I just experienced in Studio One while trying to undo a simple DAW setting is somehow better.

[Ostermilk]

Lots of opinions already, here's mine: I tried using Logic as a master and Reason as slave, but after trying it out for a week or two I just tended to not bother anymore. TBH if you have good plugins for your daw, then Reason is not worth the hassle for the individual instruments, even though some of them are really good. But I am very intolerant towards time sinks. Using rewire is more work, keeping stuff in your head, routing things via soundflower and so forth. In the end, I left Reason pretty quickly after trying a rewire setup now I use Logic and will give a few other DAW's a go during 2016.

The thing that gets me (and not to single this one guy out, because there's been plenty of others at various times) is how some folks will go on about how they gave up on Reason and yet are still posting on what is probably the most Reason-oriented forum around. Why? Do people hang around long after they abandon Reason just in order to try to, I dunno, convince others to leave? Is it that important that they make their defection away known? What are they expecting? "Oh, gosh, this guy has given up Reason! Obviously I must also give it up as soon as possible!" It's like hanging outside a McDonalds and telling the people going inside "yeah, I ditched these guys ages ago and now I'm totally a Burger King man..." I just can't see the point.

It sure baffles me that one too, especially the regularity of it.

It's like saying "this bar sucks, the one down the road is much better but someone has got to hang around here to tell ya!".

[raymondh]

Lots of opinions already, here's mine: I tried using Logic as a master and Reason as slave, but after trying it out for a week or two I just tended to not bother anymore. TBH if you have good plugins for your daw, then Reason is not worth the hassle for the individual instruments, even though some of them are really good. But I am very intolerant towards time sinks. Using rewire is more work, keeping stuff in your head, routing things via soundflower and so forth. In the end, I left Reason pretty quickly after trying a rewire setup now I use Logic and will give a few other DAW's a go during 2016.

The thing that gets me (and not to single this one guy out, because there's been plenty of others at various times) is how some folks will go on about how they gave up on Reason and yet are still posting on what is probably the most Reason-oriented forum around. Why? Do people hang around long after they abandon Reason just in order to try to, I dunno, convince others to leave? Is it that important that they make their defection away known? What are they expecting? "Oh, gosh, this guy has given up Reason! Obviously I must also give it up as soon as possible!" It's like hanging outside a McDonalds and telling the people going inside "yeah, I ditched these guys ages ago and now I'm totally a Burger King man..." I just can't see the point.

It sure baffles me that one too, especially the regularity of it.

It's like saying "this bar sucks, the one down the road is much better but someone has got to hang around here to tell ya!".

I don't think people are being trolls here for the most part. I think it reflects the people that would love to come back to Reason and be part of the Reason community.
The arguments about features and shortcomings are part of the process of working out what the best (or least worst) option is for them to support their requirements and preferences - knowing that as each product advances in versions, some of their gripes may well have been addressed.

[The_G]

I don't get why people think rewire is so much work. You just set it up once, save it as a template, and load it up anytime you want to use Reason as a slave to another DAW. I do that whenever I want to use more audio (in which case I use Live as the master).

...and even migrating a Reason-only track to rewire isn't difficult--takes maybe 5 minutes. But again, if you always use an external DAW as a master, then just make a template and--POOF--there you go, just like magic.

[The_G]

I don't think people are being trolls here for the most part. I think it reflects the people that would love to come back to Reason and be part of the Reason community.
The arguments about features and shortcomings are part of the process of working out what the best (or least worst) option is for them to support their requirements and preferences - knowing that as each product advances in versions, some of their gripes may well have been addressed.

Some people on the internet also seem to enjoy telling other people their choices/tastes are not "correct."