I want to use Massive - should I use EMI or another DAW?

[Jagwah]

I find the EMI process clunky and I have been putting off using Massive but I really want to be using it.

I have Live and FL Studio which I never touch, maybe I should make a start on getting familiar with one of them? Would it be much better than using the EMI in Reason?


Cheers for any suggestions!

[joeyluck]

I'm comfortable with using the EMI as I am used to working with sequencing external gear before EMI. It's simply MIDI and audio patching.

I guess it can be a pain if the virtual routing is acting up...or you can't see it and it's not immediately apparent what an issue might be when it isn't behaving the way you'd expect.

Some other users make use a couple interfaces to sync to another computer (dedicated to running plugins) or use a single interface to simply loop the MIDI and audio back so they can see it and patch it just like hardware (MIDI Out to MIDI In and an audio output into an input). I'd actually rather do that than deal with ReWire and having to use another DAW as the ReWire master...

[Jagwah]

Thanks for the input Joey, I use loopmidi and that side of things isn't a problem, cheers.

[joeyluck]

Thanks for the input Joey, I use loopmidi and that side of things isn't a problem, cheers.

Gotcha. So what is it that you find to be clunky?
Is it because you can't save it as a project and when you open the file, it doesn't automatically open the plugin and the relevant patch?
I get that. That's one thing I don't like, but if there's a way to do something like that, I'd really like to know how!

But in the meantime, I try to tell myself external plugins are like hardware. Hardware, which I would have to turn on and load my patch independently...

[Jagwah]

With native devices and REs I can right click and automate something - quick and easy, with the EMI I need to create an instance and map it to that parameter and label it, just seems excessive when possibly I could right click in another DAW and be on my way. I would really like to be using Reason's CV to control things.

Just wondering if anyone has suggestions about me being better off just using Fruity Loops (which I would have to become familiar with to begin with), rather than using the EMI, and maybe there are other benefits I'm not aware of.

I'll try and look at it like you say, I might set up a Hamu Mod Panel specifically for Massive and see if that makes things better.

[Raveshaper]

Learn as much as you can. Use other packages outside of Reason. Embrace any opportunity to learn something new within your craft. Or just use EMI.

[Jagwah]

Thanks guys and cheers Qwaizan for the wise words, I'm going to give a few VSTs a go.

[KEVMOVE02]

Know what I find clunky? Making one computer do the work of three computers. Solved that problem by repurposing my older systems when I get a new one. I figured it was a waste of resources to leave old systems in the corner just to collect dust, when I could just as easily use them as dedicated drum synth, keyboard or any other type of standalone instrument. Things get real interesting when I can get actual musicians to sit at these workstations and join a session.

[dana]

There is nothing stopping you from exporting midi files from reason and importing them into ableton live (or whatever) and vice versa, then you can print audio to wav then use it in whatever daw you want.

There are many synths in reason that can create the same sounds as massive, and you can modulate any parameter in the same way as massive can with synchronous (just saying!)

[Jagwah]

There are many synths in reason that can create the same sounds as massive...

My sound design skills are in no way up to scratch, but I still (perhaps ignorantly) disagree with this statement.

[avasopht]

I would say that the best thing you can do is COMMIT to workflows for at least a dozen small projects so that you have time to get used to it. For all you know, you may have stumbled over an ideal workflow because you hadn't gotten used to it.

[joeyluck]

A little off topic, but perhaps related...

I have been making great use of the Peff Spacre for notes when using the EMI with hardware (particularly analog hardware that doesn't save presets). I am able to list important settings on the Spacre above the audio track. So I know if I want to go back and do another take or simply recreate it, I have the notes there. But I also am able to note just about anything else.

[Ostermilk]

I would say that the best thing you can do is COMMIT to workflows for at least a dozen small projects so that you have time to get used to it. For all you know, you may have stumbled over an ideal workflow because you hadn't gotten used to it.

Exactly this, I personally find Rewire much more practical than looping back single instances of whatever it is I'm trying to use extenally to Reason, but as you will have noted some prefer the loopback methods so the only thing that's going to inform you of what way to go with that is to try them yourself and decide between the pros and cons of each approach.

Bear in mind though that if I've decided Rewire is the best way to go then it probably is best for everyone else also...

[Raveshaper]

With ReWire toy can nest reason itself inside more advanced work spaces. So, yes I agree ReWire is great.

The thing about Massive and others compared to Reason devices is, I think Massive calculates and renders waveforms at a very fine resolution all the time. While it may be true that Reason devices sound very close or even identical when exported at 48k/24+, what I suspect is happening during sequencing is only parts of the waveforms are being calculated at lower resolution to favor best performance and higher device counts. Either that or some sort of wave table is in use rather than rendered on the fly waveforms.

What I'm getting at is I agree with you there is something different there. Massive sounds more like a mathematically precise audio rendering in comparison to a somewhat fuzzier sound from the rack. Plus, everything you need to make the sounds that Massive can produce is all self contained in one app, as opposed to having to cherry pick the right combination of devices to build the same sounds in the rack. Whatever gets it done quicker with satisfying results is the winning ticket. Efficiency is key to meeting today's demands of prolific output from producers and engineers.

[Theo.M]

One thing that is nice about massive is that it has an incredible array of on board sounds, and even more so, the 3rd party support is huge. There are sounds for it from everything to one key ambient atmospheres to fat bass to soaring leads and rich pads.. it's very versatile.

To Jagwah, I am a huge fan of EMI, but I *am* primarily on mac where everything is ultra simple to use it with. How do you have it set up on windows? Have you tried it with image line mini host free?