Anyone tracking with EQ + Compression?

[dconana]

Title says it all. Anyone here track with EQ & compression? If so, on what type of material and when is it useful, and when not?

[selig]

I learned how to engineer back when you HAD to EQ and compress when recording for a number of reasons. When recording analog, you often compressed to avoid over saturation, and EQ'ed to compensate for any frequency response changes upon playback (head bump on the low end, HF loss over time on the highs).

Also, since you often only had a few "great" EQs/Comps, you used those when tracking, when overdubbing, and finally on any tracks left over during mixing. 

I learned from the older engineers what a "tracking EQ" and what "tracking compression" setting sounded like, which was basically to get your sound in the ball park but STILL leave room for mix consideration (ESPECIALLY if you were not going to be the person mixing the track). This typically means EQ'ing and compressing less - starting with how you "think" it should sound and work in the mix, then dialing it back a little just to be sure you're not overdoing it. Less really is more in this case, as "more" can leave you stuck with tracks that are difficult to mix and may require extensive "fixing" or at worst, replacing.

The basic goal was to get your tracks closer to how they would be processed during the mix, but not try to get them perfect so as not to risk over-doing things. But these days you don't have the same considerations - digital recording doesn't alter the sound like analog, you have practically unlimited "favorite" EQ/Comps in the mix, and with 24 bit recording clipping is (or should be) a thing of the past.

About 15 years ago for projects on a budget I starting trying just renting or borrowing the best microphones and preamps possible and skipping the EQ and compressors, recording "direct" from the output of the preamp. First surprise - you don't always NEED to EQ and compress "going in". Second surprise - working this way can make mixing take longer since none of the sounds have been "prepped" for the mix. And that's when I began to mix as I tracked, adding the EQ and compression as plugins as I recorded new parts, forever blurring the formerly distinct lines between tracking, overdubbing, and mixing. 

These days @ Annex Recording we've just combined forces with another local engineer and added two more racks of outboard pre/EQ/compression, and I'm getting back into more tracking with EQ/compression (as previously described). And it's FUN! Getting the sounds ROCKING from the start makes everyone in the room more inspired, and makes me look forward to the mix because I know things are already sounding much closer than they would normally be.

But consider that you WILL eventually make a "mistake" and record something with too much EQ or too much compression and have to deal with it one way or another. Along the way you'll hopefully learn what works in the best possible environment IMO - by doing.

BTW, another trick I'd use on an analog console is to record instruments flat, then play them back and EQ everything as if it was a mix down. After getting happy with the EQs, I'd switch them all from the monitor to the record path, then begin all my tracking with the settings I derived from the "mix", and like magic - instant EQ that worked great on everything. Why not just EQ as the band played? I wanted to avoid having them play things over and over, so had them play the song once for a "warm up" (recording it), then give them a 15 minute break while I worked things out. Then we could get back to tracking the record with confidence the EQ settings all worked well together in a mix setting. 

Why do you ask?

[dconana]

Wow, awesome response, I think you touched on some of the reasons why I was interested.

Having just a limited selection of outboard gear is one reason for me, it wouldn't be realistic to bounce everything into and out of my single channel strip.

I'm basically a one man band at the moment, I sometimes use the compressor on guitar and bass when I record. But not for vocals, as I can't see the compressor when I am singing/testing levels and so I can't set it up! (I'm probably going to address this by making things more portable). Lately though I've just been using the pre-amp, partly out of fear of getting it wrong, and partly due to inexperience in setting things up quickly. Having said that - not being in a band situation and seeing how things play together would probably lead me to be even more cautious on the way in.

And there is that great feeling, like you say of having recorded just a few tracks, and it already sounds like a song!

I'm finding the "tracking EQ" and "tracking compression" concept very interesting. I think this is really a position I'd like to be in, not going too far with any of it, but just getting things a little closer.

I just want to mix and record with more confidence, which means practice. I'm inspired by the older recording techniques where multiple tracks would have to be bounced to a single track (which I presume means committing fully to a sound) and then moving on to record the rest. Of course it was out of necessity, but that would breed the requirement that it is learned. I sometimes feel a little lost in the age of unlimited tracks.

Thanks for replying though, I'm really pleased I got this kind of response, It's inspired me to have a go and learn 

[selig]

Wow, awesome response, I think you touched on some of the reasons why I was interested.

Having just a limited selection of outboard gear is one reason for me, it wouldn't be realistic to bounce everything into and out of my single channel strip.

I'm basically a one man band at the moment, I sometimes use the compressor on guitar and bass when I record. But not for vocals, as I can't see the compressor when I am singing/testing levels and so I can't set it up! (I'm probably going to address this by making things more portable). Lately though I've just been using the pre-amp, partly out of fear of getting it wrong, and partly due to inexperience in setting things up quickly. Having said that - not being in a band situation and seeing how things play together would probably lead me to be even more cautious on the way in.

You can use a variation on the trick I described earlier to setup your vocal compression, but you'll need to set things up (and have a few spare I/O on your sound card). First, record your vocal "raw" (no compression) and with plenty of headroom - don't even try to hit above peaks of -12 dBFS. Then route this "raw" vocal out to your compressor and back in, and find a setting that gives a few dB of mild compression AT THE MOST. Then re-patch the compressor into the record path, and you should be good to go! Again, if you go for less you won't risk ruining a take - but experiment on non-critical projects to get comfortable with the process. It's also great to have devices that are fairly transparent at this stage, one reason I still love the LA-2a on vocals (the compression is fairly transparent and definitely forgiving, but the device DOES add some tasteful color of it's own).

And there is that great feeling, like you say of having recorded just a few tracks, and it already sounds like a song!

I'm finding the "tracking EQ" and "tracking compression" concept very interesting. I think this is really a position I'd like to be in, not going too far with any of it, but just getting things a little closer.

I just want to mix and record with more confidence, which means practice. I'm inspired by the older recording techniques where multiple tracks would have to be bounced to a single track (which I presume means committing fully to a sound) and then moving on to record the rest. Of course it was out of necessity, but that would breed the requirement that it is learned. I sometimes feel a little lost in the age of unlimited tracks.

Thanks for replying though, I'm really pleased I got this kind of response, It's inspired me to have a go and learn 

"Commit, commit, commit" was the common battle cry of the time. You DO get really good at it because you are forced to do so.

I remember a session in the mid 80s where a student from Belmont University (that taught recording in a 24 track studio) came to a 16 track studio I was sharing with a friend. The look on his face when he realized we only had 16 tracks was priceless, but his next question was even better (and often repeated since): "But where will I put the drums?". This guy HONESTLY didn't know how to deal with ONLY having 16 tracks. If he had some 4 track experience instead of 24 track experience, he'd be jumping up and down with 4x the tracks available. It's all relative…

[dconana]

Cheers, thats an excellent idea! I'll see if I can set that up with my current rig.

Thats a funny story, I always find it interesting how different people work. I'm actually at my happiest when I have drums, bass, guitar and vocal... four tracks. The song always sounds better at this stage, but I'm not sure if it is because of the minimal approach, or because I am imagining the rest of the pieces coming together in my head, like theres always potential in the track at this stage.

Actually there is something else, I think it's not the just the ability to commit to a sound, record it and move on. It's also about being able to get to that point quickly, although I have a funny feeling it will take years to get to there.

[selig]

Cheers, thats an excellent idea! I'll see if I can set that up with my current rig.

Thats a funny story, I always find it interesting how different people work. I'm actually at my happiest when I have drums, bass, guitar and vocal... four tracks. The song always sounds better at this stage, but I'm not sure if it is because of the minimal approach, or because I am imagining the rest of the pieces coming together in my head, like theres always potential in the track at this stage.

Actually there is something else, I think it's not the just the ability to commit to a sound, record it and move on. It's also about being able to get to that point quickly, although I have a funny feeling it will take years to get to there.

When you REALLY don't have any other option but to do so, you get good at things surprisingly fast.

[mbfrancis]

I love recording with processing when I can - for bass I go direct into my Focusrite ISA One looping an FMR RNLA into the inserts.  I had great results using a cheap JoeMeek ThreeQ for guitars, using the EQ to bump 3k going in...big difference.  A pro friend swears by his ART VLA on vox.  So you don;t need crazy stuff.