Biggest changes to your workflow when switching to Reason 8?

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Last Alternative
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Post 22 Jan 2015

Get used to right clicking and then shifting from that box into another box into another box into another box. Every single time because it's all "organized". Workflow man. It's a lot of work now. Oh and get used to finding a sample you like (take Kong for example) but curious to find maybe a better sample or any preset really in Thor or whatev. So you go thru auditioning different drum hits or synths or whatev but then you decide you wanna keep what you already had. Too late, my friend. Have fun clicking undo a million times. You'll be lucky if there are enough undos to get back to it.
Now I just duplicate the track, mute the original and then audition. Work flow, baby!
Get used to the sequencer and transport bar looking 1D and flat and oddly out of place but the rest of Reason is 3D. And get used to the grey on grey meters. I could go on.
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rvman
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Post 22 Jan 2015

I only started with Reason last year with 7 and now on 8. So I don't have years of Reason experience.

But what I CAN tell you is that 8 is great. The work flow truly helped me and everything is just faster. Sure, there are quirks. But every daw has them. Over the years I've used Cubase, Sonar, Saw Studio, Logic, Traction, etc. They all have issues.

Now I use Reason and Reaper and love it. Reason is my main daw and it's just FUN.
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EnochLight
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Post 22 Jan 2015

The only adjustment I had to do (or perhaps "relearn" is a better description) was browsing patches in a non-modal browser. It's strange to think that one of pre-8.0's handicaps ended up being one of its features that I ended up using regularly. Other than that, smooth sailing all the way for me in 8.1.

I tried going back to 7.1 a few weeks ago for shits and giggles and almost pulled my hair out. The browser just felt like something from 1998 to me.
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Goan
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Post 22 Jan 2015

The Browser Focus and Patch loading behaviour can be confusing sometimes but i got used to it. Everything else was just fine for me. Also i have to add that after a few sessions i didn't feel ripped off anymore because Drag'n'Drop really gives reason a new dimension. Everythings faster and more accessible
Goan doesn't do Goa, he likes samples, weirdness, beats
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illone
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Post 23 Jan 2015

So to those of you having adjusted to the new R8 auditioning 'improvements': 
  1. are you at a point where you are satisfied/comfortable with the changes
  2. prefer Props bringing back the Modal browser,
  3. prefer Props make a Modal browser a new option (i.e. keep whats there, but have a key that can pop up a Modal browser also)
  4. prefer (at a high level, without going into details) consecutive sample/patch auditions collapsing down to one Undo/ctrl+z action.
  5. Something completely different?  (you can describe if you like.)

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Olivier
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Post 23 Jan 2015

illone wrote:So to those of you having adjusted to the new R8 auditioning 'improvements': 
  1. are you at a point where you are satisfied/comfortable with the changes
  2. prefer Props bringing back the Modal browser,
  3. prefer Props make a Modal browser a new option (i.e. keep whats there, but have a key that can pop up a Modal browser also)
  4. prefer (at a high level, without going into details) consecutive sample/patch auditions collapsing down to one Undo/ctrl+z action.
  5. Something completely different?  (you can describe if you like.)
Comfortable with the changes. Took a week to get used to.
Drag and drop is a timesaver for me.
I'd like to be able to undo all changes made during 1 browser focus period in one go. If thats 4 then 4; else 5.
:reason: V9 | i7 5930 | Motu 828 MK3 | Win 10

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jfrichards
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Post 23 Jan 2015

A point about browser focus I made to Heng earlier:

After using R8 for a while, I realized I have to pay a lot of attention to the browser focus, which is active when the orange highlighting is on top of the patch window icons for the device.  If you double click on a patch when the device patch window is not orange, R8 will create a whole new track and device and load that patch in it.  One time I did that numerous times and then saw six other devices with tracks had been created below the one I was trying to change!  Now I always look at the device patch window to make sure it's orange, and if it's not, I click on the device patch window folder icon or hit the little folder icon above the browser list when the device itself is highlighted.  If you just highlight the device (it will be bordered in blue) that will not change the browser focus.  Even dragging a patch onto a device will not change the focus (even though it changes the patch!).  Weird idiosyncracies that hopefully will be changed in 8.2.  For me, the new browser is worth it for the drag and drop stuff, although being a long-time Reason user, I still right click and scroll through the list about 5% of the time for patches.  One nice thing about the browser is being able to click the browser back arrow and see the previous lists in the browser history where you were a minute or two ago.  There's no real preview/cancel any more, you load and listen, then go back.  It doesn't bother me any more, and all the other stuff is very cool. 

lowpryo
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Post 23 Jan 2015

thanks for the responses! I made the jump last night, and after everyone emphasized browser focus, it was at the forefront of my mind the whole time and I felt that I was "understanding" R8 a lot more than I was during the beta. the bright orange color also helps as a nice trigger so you actually "feel" when you're in patch/sample browsing mode for a particular device.
the one complaint is DEFINITELY having to "load" each preset instead of having the quick preview that past versions had. it's a very obvious step backwards. I don't understand who thought that was a good idea, but hopefully they realize it and get it fixed up in a later patch or something. until then i'll probably do the trick mentioned where you duplicate a device and browse new patches on that guy so you don't lose your old one.
Last edited by lowpryo on 19 Dec 2016, edited 1 time in total.

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LudvigC
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Post 23 Jan 2015

the one complaint is DEFINITELY having to "load" each preset instead of having the quick preview that past versions had. it's a very obvious step backwards.


I've said this before - there was no "quick preview" in previous versions. Patches/devices were loaded exactly like in R8, in the background, while the browser was open. The only thing quicker about that was single click vs double click, which was changed to not mess up drag and drop.

However, what *did* change was the Cancel button in the Reason 7 browser dialog. What this did was undo all changes made while the browser was open, a simple thing with a modal browser dialog (where you cannot do much else during browsing). In a non-modal browser panel though, you cannot use regular undo for such a Cancel function (you might have done lots of other stuff during browse focus, things you don't expect to have undone). A Cancel function then becomes a brand new feature that needs to work in a totally different manner. It's in the feature wish list.

/ LudvigC

PS One thing about the new browsing that I think gets too little spotlight is replacing devices with drag and drop. I've started using that a lot, for trying out different compressors etc, including devices without patch support. Changes my way of working quite a bit. That and the automatic coloring.

illone
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Post 23 Jan 2015

Comfortable with the changes. Took a week to get used to.
Drag and drop is a timesaver for me.
I'd like to be able to undo all changes made during 1 browser focus period in one go. If thats 4 then 4; else 5.
 
At the birds eye view, that is exactly 4. 

I guess as LudvigC has indicated, making that work at the low level is challenging; but, hey its in the feature wishlist =) - hopefully it is in the designer/programmer's task queue with a drop-dead-you're-fired-or-else priority.  Well, maybe not that hot.

--illone

lowpryo
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Post 23 Jan 2015

the one complaint is DEFINITELY having to "load" each preset instead of having the quick preview that past versions had. it's a very obvious step backwards.
LudvigC wrote:
I've said this before - there was no "quick preview" in previous versions. Patches/devices were loaded exactly like in R8, in the background, while the browser was open. The only thing quicker about that was single click vs double click, which was changed to not mess up drag and drop.

However, what *did* change was the Cancel button in the Reason 7 browser dialog. What this did was undo all changes made while the browser was open, a simple thing with a modal browser dialog (where you cannot do much else during browsing). In a non-modal browser panel though, you cannot use regular undo for such a Cancel function (you might have done lots of other stuff during browse focus, things you don't expect to have undone). A Cancel function then becomes a brand new feature that needs to work in a totally different manner. It's in the feature wish list.

/ LudvigC

PS One thing about the new browsing that I think gets too little spotlight is replacing devices with drag and drop. I've started using that a lot, for trying out different compressors etc, including devices without patch support. Changes my way of working quite a bit. That and the automatic coloring.
[/color]
I understand what you're trying to explain - how it wasn't a matter of a "preview" feature being removed, but an unfortunate consequence of how the two browsers were differently coded. But honestly those semantics don't matter to the end user. All I know is, in R7, when I was single-clicking patches in the browser, it felt like I was listening to a "preview" because I could hear it before it felt concrete in my project file (even if it WAS technically loaded, exactly like in R8). With R8, that preview "feeling" is gone. But you already know this, and as long as it's on the wish list I can't complain!

Maybe instead of something that acts like the "cancel" button, it could be activating a special "preview mode" button within the browser that allows for single clicks, and it loads the patch in some hidden memory as to not replace anything in the project? Probably easier said than done, just talking out my butt here.
And TBH, the automatic coloring is the #1 reason I caved in to the update! So needed.
Last edited by lowpryo on 19 Dec 2016, edited 1 time in total.

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esselfortium
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Post 23 Jan 2015

LudvigC wrote:A Cancel function then becomes a brand new feature that needs to work in a totally different manner. It's in the feature wish list.
This is great to hear. Just knowing that things like this are being given consideration is reassuring, speaking as a user who's planning on waiting things out before taking the next upgrade plunge.

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Olivier
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Post 23 Jan 2015

LudvigC wrote:
PS One thing about the new browsing that I think gets too little spotlight is replacing devices with drag and drop. I've started using that a lot, for trying out different compressors etc, including devices without patch support. Changes my way of working quite a bit. That and the automatic coloring.
I've noticed that i'm using that a lot with synths.
Even with (fx) devices that allready have automation. Drop in another device. Create the automation lanes you need, throw the automation clips on 'm and you're done.



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dvdrtldg
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Post 23 Jan 2015

LudvigC wrote:A Cancel function then becomes a brand new feature that needs to work in a totally different manner. It's in the feature wish list.
esselfortium wrote: This is great to hear. Just knowing that things like this are being given consideration is reassuring, speaking as a user who's planning on waiting things out before taking the next upgrade plunge.
Yep, very glad to hear this. I finally upgraded to R8 this week. Found a cheap license on eBay and went ahead, mostly becasue I really wanted the Softube amps. After 24 hours I'd gone back to 7, and will stay there until the patch browsing issue is fixed. It's just a massive hassle in 8.

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jfrichards
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Post 23 Jan 2015

I agree with the R8 crowd, Drag and Drop is a big deal for me.  I use it in a dozen ways.  It makes me try out alternatives more, so I either get where I want quicker, or find something more exciting.  The little browser lists on the far left are good, like most recent patches, or new favorites.

PS dvdrtldg, 24 hours is not enough, it took me two weeks, with numerous annoyances, then I was hooked.  After a month, I had no more annoyances and things fell into place.  Not to the "greatest thing since well, reason" place, but a solid 5% improvement.  That with the Softubes and Marco's new patches and I'm very pleased.

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Olivier
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Post 23 Jan 2015

[slightly off topic.. but also about drag 'n drop]

I would still like to have much quicker searches though. Preferably something indexed. I've amassed quite a load of samples in 20 years but its not very organized.
Although with drag 'n drop available now i might as well go find a good external sample librarian. (Any tips on that for windows ?)

I'm not really prepared to go pack everything in refills, though i understand they may speed up searches...
:reason: V9 | i7 5930 | Motu 828 MK3 | Win 10

elizzle
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Post 23 Jan 2015


Hey buddy you just wait for the Reason 8.2 upgrade.   35 dollar upgrade fee.
 
REASON UPGRADES FROM REASON 8.1 to 8.2:
 
*we fixed some bugs and shit*
*new shop layout for website*
*Discover is now taking Credit cards and paypal (.69 cents a sample)*
*TAKE is now on android* (free.99)*

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rvman
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Post 24 Jan 2015

I drag and drop the patches onto the device instead of clicking them which can create a duplicate device.
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jfrichards
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Post 24 Jan 2015

LudvigC wrote:... One thing about the new browsing that I think gets too little spotlight is replacing devices with drag and drop. I've started using that a lot, for trying out different compressors etc, including devices without patch support. Changes my way of working quite a bit. That and the automatic coloring.
Very true that it gets too little spotlight, but that's entirely your fault.  Everyone would love to see someone who has mastered it create a song from scratch using the drag and drop/browser improvements, not just a 400 kph sales video.  A real tutorial on the new features in a real setting would be very valuable. (including devices, effects, patches, ordering, samples into audio tracks, into kong, redrum, nnxt, rex loops, octorex patches, from the desktop, previewing, using the lists on the left, creating efficient folders and lists for the browser, etc, etc)  And zooming the screen regularly during the video would help too.

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Orion
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Post 24 Jan 2015

lowprio wrote:the one complaint is DEFINITELY having to "load" each preset instead of having the quick preview that past versions had. it's a very obvious step backwards. I don't understand who thought that was a good idea, but hopefully they realize it and get it fixed up in a later patch or something. until then i'll probably do the trick mentioned where you duplicate a device and browse new patches on that guy so you don't lose your old one.
Having to do that kind of workaround is really maddening though after having the Props beat the word "WORKFLOW" to death in their advertisements. Issues with the browser were the main reason I decided not to get R8. I'm glad you are finding it to your liking in general, though.

kitekrazy
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Post 24 Jan 2015

 I was hoping Reason would be better at importing audio and midi loops but it doesn't. 

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rvman
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Post 24 Jan 2015

LudvigC wrote:... One thing about the new browsing that I think gets too little spotlight is replacing devices with drag and drop. I've started using that a lot, for trying out different compressors etc, including devices without patch support. Changes my way of working quite a bit. That and the automatic coloring.
jfrichards wrote:
Very true that it gets too little spotlight, but that's entirely your fault.  Everyone would love to see someone who has mastered it create a song from scratch using the drag and drop/browser improvements, not just a 400 kph sales video.  A real tutorial on the new features in a real setting would be very valuable. (including devices, effects, patches, ordering, samples into audio tracks, into kong, redrum, nnxt, rex loops, octorex patches, from the desktop, previewing, using the lists on the left, creating efficient folders and lists for the browser, etc, etc)  And zooming the screen regularly during the video would help too.
The R8 Video available at Groove3 does a pretty good job at describing and showing the new features and using drag and drop relating to workflow. It's helped me get up to speed very quickly. I regularly go back and watch them at least once a week still.
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selig
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Post 24 Jan 2015

LudvigC wrote:... One thing about the new browsing that I think gets too little spotlight is replacing devices with drag and drop. I've started using that a lot, for trying out different compressors etc, including devices without patch support. Changes my way of working quite a bit. That and the automatic coloring.
jfrichards wrote:
Very true that it gets too little spotlight, but that's entirely your fault.  Everyone would love to see someone who has mastered it create a song from scratch using the drag and drop/browser improvements, not just a 400 kph sales video.  A real tutorial on the new features in a real setting would be very valuable. (including devices, effects, patches, ordering, samples into audio tracks, into kong, redrum, nnxt, rex loops, octorex patches, from the desktop, previewing, using the lists on the left, creating efficient folders and lists for the browser, etc, etc)  And zooming the screen regularly during the video would help too.
Don't know if you meant this literally, but I don't agree that it's entirely Ludvig's fault!
:)
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jfrichards
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Post 24 Jan 2015

selig wrote: Don't know if you meant this literally, but I don't agree that it's entirely Ludvig's fault!
:)
Ludvig seemed to be admonishing that the collective "you" forum members are neglecting the drag and drop stuff, and I was admonishing the collective "you" guys at Propellerhead.  It may be far from Ludvig's personal fault, in which case it seems he is admonishing his own boss for neglecting it as well as us.  However he meant it, it is a valid point that the outstanding features of drag and drop are woefully under-explored.  He seems good at hard-to-understand technical explanations of browser modalities, but that is not what is needed at this point in the growth of Reason 8.  They should host a "Reason 8 is Freakin Great" series.  And this forum, or at least the 40% who are on 8, would be a good resource for testing the waters on how to present it.  Or even, god forbid, get some advice.

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Theo.M
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Post 25 Jan 2015

Last Alternative wrote:Get used to right clicking and then shifting from that box into another box into another box into another box. Every single time because it's all "organized". Workflow man. It's a lot of work now. Oh and get used to finding a sample you like (take Kong for example) but curious to find maybe a better sample or any preset really in Thor or whatev. So you go thru auditioning different drum hits or synths or whatev but then you decide you wanna keep what you already had. Too late, my friend. Have fun clicking undo a million times. You'll be lucky if there are enough undos to get back to it.
Now I just duplicate the track, mute the original and then audition. Work flow, baby!
Get used to the sequencer and transport bar looking 1D and flat and oddly out of place but the rest of Reason is 3D. And get used to the grey on grey meters. I could go on.
i reckon the browsing is defo quicker, that's one improvement. About the go back to patch that were using gripe, really, ok, it's a point, but to just drag the patch to the list on the left screen and if you back to it just drag and drop it, takes about 5 seconds more than the old method even for slow hands. Delete it if you don't go back to it. Simple. 

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