What is Propellerhead trying to say to us?

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bitley
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Post 19 Jan 2015

Well it did look very strange with all the really hateful threads in the forum, with endless complaints about Reason. That wasn't ever the 'overall feel' of the forums back in the happy and inspiring ReBirth days when the forums rather felt like an open and vibin' communication line between the company and the users. Perhaps it also matters that Propellerhead started to let the forum live its own life, with less communication from the company in there.

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Vesterager
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Post 19 Jan 2015

If they can get some youngsters with iPhones using Take and Figure, Reason+Re is not far away. They may be on to something?

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stratatonic
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Post 19 Jan 2015

Last Alternative wrote:...that Reason is now some party kid's app to cut a record doing vocals over someone's cheesy Figure loop?! It's sick how the Props don't even try to reassure us long-timers. Nope. They just do away with all tradition instead.. And I'm not saying old-timers. There are plenty of young long-timers and I don't even consider 33 old. WTF are they going for? REally?! And what is up with this whole Reason phone game vibe?
First of all, they are "mobile music makers". This is the future. this is Propellerhead future strategy -- to integrate their mobile apps with their flagship product. There is a Take tune uploaded recently that Ryan Harlin remixed. From the rough take, he made it sound much better. People are going to post their Take creations, and the Props remixers will work their magic on the tune to make the original uploader say "Holy Fuck! THAT sounds fucking great!! REASON did that???"
And the seed is planted to buy Reason to recreate that magic.

At least that's what Propellerhead is betting on...they'll start the remixes (they already have) and it will morph into a vibrant online sharing community. Will be interesting to see what they do to make it work. More will be revealed I'm sure with the new website.

I think various pieces of Reason will start to be unrolled as iOS apps. Malstrom could be next. Kong will be there as well. Each app will save patches like Thor and may also have the ability to wirelessly link with the desktop equivalent. They'll sell expansion iOS Kong drum packs for additional revenue. Eventually the pieces can be linked together by an iOS Reason Rack sequencer that will bring Reason to iOS. And Android eventually as well. REs may make it to mobile as well.

That original uploader that was so amazed could buy the desktop version or mobile version in the future.

What was the question again? I may have gone off on a tangent...




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Wook
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Post 19 Jan 2015

stratatonic wrote:First of all, they are "mobile music makers". This is the future. this is Propellerhead future strategy -- to integrate their mobile apps with their flagship product. There is a Take tune uploaded recently that Ryan Harlin remixed. From the rough take, he made it sound much better. People are going to post their Take creations, and the Props remixers will work their magic on the tune to make the original uploader say "Holy Fuck! THAT sounds fucking great!! REASON did that???" And the seed is planted to buy Reason to recreate that magic. At least that's what Propellerhead is betting on...they'll start the remixes (they already have) and it will morph into a vibrant online sharing community. Will be interesting to see what they do to make it work. More will be revealed I'm sure with the new website. I think various pieces of Reason will start to be unrolled as iOS apps. Malstrom could be next. Kong will be there as well. Each app will save patches like Thor and may also have the ability to wirelessly link with the desktop equivalent. They'll sell expansion iOS Kong drum packs for additional revenue. Eventually the pieces can be linked together by an iOS Reason Rack sequencer that will bring Reason to iOS. And Android eventually as well. REs may make it to mobile as well. That original uploader that was so amazed could buy the desktop version or mobile version in the future. What was the question again? I may have gone off on a tangent...
This fella gets it.
   

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EnochLight
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Why do people think that they would stop advancing Reason, their core product, just because they started adding mobile music production functionality and a sharing service in a point update?  I know that the forums closing shook things up, but from this "old timer" (been aboard since 2000) I'm excited to see what the future holds.  Shit's gonna' get better, RE SDK is going to get better, etc.

If you think using your smartphone as a production tool is a "game", you're missing out.  Sorry.  

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Ecopro
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Post 20 Jan 2015

It does feel weird talking about Reason's future from this underground fallout shelter. I got nothing valuable to add here.
Guts Electronic Mayhem

   


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liampatrickingram
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Post 20 Jan 2015

I dunno.  I don't really understand the point of this mobile music stuff.  It seems like the only application for it is recording rap battles at a high school house party.  I don't think that figure or take would be an entry point for new users into reason either.  It's a niche product for a certain kind of people - probably not the "hipster" crowd they seem to be marketing to these days.  Maybe I'm wrong.  Seems like wasted energy.

But at the same time I don't think they've let reason fall by the wayside either.  I bought reason when I was 18, six years ago (I think) and I've been happy from the start.  I think most people have been up until the last update - not including the classic midi out etc. complaining that was ongoing for years.  Reason 8 was pointless for a lot of people especially electronic users which seems to be the overwhelming majority.  Luckily for me, the amps were a huge addition as I wasn't even aware of Kuassa until recently and the Line 6 amps were awful.  It just seems like this whole apocolyptic vibe is over recent stuff.  But the fact is we still have Reason, it is still great, and we still make awesome music using software that inspires creativity instead of stifling it.

And please don't brush me off as being a naive fanboy - I can appreciate both viewpoints...But when I open Reason that magic and excitement from my first couple sessions in Reason is still there every day.
:s0221:
Cliche I know...

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liampatrickingram
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Post 20 Jan 2015

  • "To argue with a person who has renounced the use of Reason is like administering medicine to the dead."  Thomas Paine
Enoch...best signature haha
 

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Namahs Amrak
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Last Alternative, the frustration you express will only impact your own wellbeing. Propellerhead have shown time and time again that they are not big on listening to their customers, so we need to accept that this is unlikely to change. And all they communicate these days is marketing horseshit, don't even try to understand what the hell Ernst is carrying on about. I doubt their copywriter even knows.

Let it go, man. Enjoy the software for what it is, not what it could be, else you'll only be disappointed.

Take care.
My Words are my ART

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Wook
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Last Alternative wrote:And I'm still trying to figure out all this bullsh about the kitchen and streets Ernst was saying. LOL :s0238:
 
 
Yeah, that genre is totally underrated. Fellow Reason user too!

   

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Namahs Amrak
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Last Alternative wrote:
And I'm still trying to figure out all this bullsh about the kitchen and streets Ernst was saying. LOL :s0238:
 
 
He's takin' it to the people!

Here's a draft of their forthcoming promotional video:




My Words are my ART

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joeyluck
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Post 20 Jan 2015

stratatonic wrote:People are going to post their Take creations, and the Props remixers will work their magic on the tune to make the original uploader say "Holy Fuck! THAT sounds fucking great!! REASON did that???" And the seed is planted to buy Reason to recreate that magic.
Exactly!  The fact that Take is FREE should be a dead giveaway of this ;)

More so than just being a cool, well-engineered app...  Take is a marketing strategy in itself.  

And Discover was most likely already in the plans.  Very smart.

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Wook
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Last Alternative wrote:SO THAT'S IT! Fuck it! I'll make some kitchen music like that video and play that shit it in the streets on a boombox old school like! I finally understand Ernst! Why that silly goose!
Dude, buskers make good money. There is a gipsy on my way to the subway and for 2 years now he keeps playing Godfather theme and jingle bells. His sax case is always filled with cash. I've given him quite alot myself. He's a cool dude. Always offering a cigarette when i stop to talk to him.

Buy a laptop or an extra battery if you already have one, hook up your guitar to Reason and gipsy away. 

That's what Ernst meant.
   

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joeyluck
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Last Alternative wrote:SO THAT'S IT! Fuck it! I'll make some kitchen music like that video and play that shit it in the streets on a boombox old school like! I finally understand Ernst! Why that silly goose!
But you're already using Reason...  You've already made the move up.

Another point that can made is that music makers for the longest time have done things with the grimiest samples of captured audio and found sounds.
Then, they import it into their serious music making DAWs and pulverise it, mangle it, chop it up, etc.  And to be honest, mics on mobile phones nowadays paired with Propellerhead's engineering of Take are far better than what some people were using in the past...

I'll still record in the field with my H5 though =)  But the point is, I don't think it is a bad as you make it out to be.

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Namahs Amrak
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Wook wrote: Dude, buskers make good money.
A mate of mine works five days a week, four hours at a time, busking as a singer & guitarist and pulls $200 - $300/day. They guy doesn't even use a computer. Seriously. What's Ernst going to sell him ? A promise of a bright future?
My Words are my ART

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Jagwah
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Post 20 Jan 2015

EnochLight wrote:Why do people think that they would stop advancing Reason, their core product, just because they started adding mobile music production functionality and a sharing service in a point update
OK they probably aren't going to stop advancing Reason yet, it just really sucks that their focus / energy / resources seem devoted to other things. All that means for Reason users is that the platform will progress slowly, which SUCKS! :comp:
:reason: It's all about the plo, yo.

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Jagwah
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Nicola wrote:It's simply money. Therefore they have to expand, doesn't compute ? I don't share this concern at all. AND let's pretend they mess up totally with the future of Reason, ...well i don't have to keep uptodate, right ? i treat the Reason rack like a hardware studio. So i really don't worry "too" much.
It's true, while seeing Reason progress as a platform would make me super happy - Reason 7 is perfect just the way it is.
:reason: It's all about the plo, yo.

The Tone Ranger
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Last Alternative wrote:The bottom line is I know Reason isn't going anywhere- it's their base product and cash cow. BUT only time will tell if it gets better or worse. I'll stop talking about it now. We won't really be sure until 9 comes out. Then I think that'll be a good point to walk away if we get a repeat of 8 and everything else leading up to now. Once a real pattern like that is shown I'm out. I mean.. it really seems a lot of you haven't even noticed the shift in focus.

And I'm still trying to figure out all this bullsh about the kitchen and streets Ernst was saying. LOL :s0238:
 
 
What shift in focus is that? As far as the development of Reason goes, they have had a philosophy of having themed updates from at least Reason 2.5. They were;

R 2.5 effects
R 3.0 mastering
R 4.0 synthesis
R 5.0 beats
R 6.0 creative effects and bring Record into Reason
R 6.5 Rack Extentions
R 7.0 Reason the DAW
R 8.0 workflow

They have also grown the company over that time and now have more support products. Refills, REs, apps etc... But they all link with Reason in one way or another. Just because you don't find some of them useful doesn't mean Propellerhead are changing direction.

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Namahs Amrak
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Nicola wrote:It's simply money. Therefore they have to expand, doesn't compute ?
That's it in a nutshell. No matter how short-sighted we might think Reason's developments are, Propellerheads are a business, and a business's intention is to make profit. It's no secret that I despise their way of conducting themselves, there have been some very clever initiatives for protecting profit. Rack Extensions are pure genius. Excluding developers, thus giving them a 30% profit on third partie's work. Locking in existing users to an EULA (which is actually ripe for legal examination) thus enslaving users to the Software, let they take a serious financial loss on their licence purchases. A 'locked in' user means great potential for ongoing RE sales to them. Whether it actually pays off for them in the long term is something we may never know, but on paper, these concepts are smart business.

All these phone app gizmo's are unlikely to be of any direct profit, but they act as a gateway drug. We are living in an age where the smartphone and tablet are the primary go-to device for the younger generation. If someone wants to try their hand at music, they will most likely see what apps are avilable. And if they are interested enough to pursue this more seriously, and happen to enjoy Take & Figure, the first place they are likely to investigate is the developer of thos products. Lo & Behold, the Reason marketing strategy enters the picture. Soon enough...well refer back to my earlier paragraph. New Reason users brings more people into the big scheme.

Then there's the cross-marketing. Letting the app users know about deals on Reason for new subscribers to the platform. They isolate a most likely target market, and pitch to them through the free or cheap phone apps that there's a whole world of music awaiting them for a few hundred dollars.

In reality, the phone apps are not the new direction as such, but they are part of a much bigger campaign.
My Words are my ART

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EnochLight
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Post 20 Jan 2015

Last Alternative wrote:The bottom line is I know Reason isn't going anywhere- it's their base product and cash cow. BUT only time will tell if it gets better or worse. I'll stop talking about it now. We won't really be sure until 9 comes out. Then I think that'll be a good point to walk away if we get a repeat of 8 and everything else leading up to now. Once a real pattern like that is shown I'm out. I mean.. it really seems a lot of you haven't even noticed the shift in focus.

And I'm still trying to figure out all this bullsh about the kitchen and streets Ernst was saying. LOL :s0238:
 
 
The Tone Ranger wrote:
What shift in focus is that? As far as the development of Reason goes, they have had a philosophy of having themed updates from at least Reason 2.5. They were;

R 2.5 effects
R 3.0 mastering
R 4.0 synthesis
R 5.0 beats
R 6.0 creative effects and bring Record into Reason (audio recording)
R 6.5 Rack Extentions
R 7.0 Reason the DAW
R 8.0 workflow

They have also grown the company over that time and now have more support products. Refills, REs, apps etc... But they all link with Reason in one way or another. Just because you don't find some of them useful doesn't mean Propellerhead are changing direction.
Agreed, and also:

R 8.1 mobile app integration

While Figure has been a mobile app I never use, Take is an app I use regularly. One of the biggest complaints about the two was that they didn't cross-integrate with Reason.

Now they do.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and state that Propellerhead do, in fact, still listen to their customer's feature requests and act on them. They also don't seem adverse to taking risks and trying something new. Balance was cool, but ultimately not a product they could sustain. Discover is the next new risk - whether it pans out or not remains to be seen. But ignoring the integration of their mobile OS apps would have been asinine. Most of the other DAW have companion apps that cross integrate; now Props do as well.

:)

Win 10 | Enabling the Abelton ABLERS Live 11 Suite-Ably |  Reason 12 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | RME Babyface Pro | Akai MPC Live 2 & Force | Roland System 8, TR-8 7x7, MX1, TB3 | Dreadbox Typhon | Korg Minilogue XD

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