Page 39 of 49
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by EnochLight
seqoi wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
mind2069 wrote: ↑02 Oct 2017
By the way, you can skip your feeling of intellectual superiority with your HO MAN... I asked cause others were also talking about this but did not see a clear response.
Man i am genuinely confused what is HO MAN (i really don't know meaning of it i am not native english) and why do you find my posting express feeling of intellectual superiority ? I just pointed this what you write about me to my wife and he laughed to both of us. To me because i am far from being intellectually superior and to you for believing i am superior. Anyway what is HO MAN? And i apologize if i am turning superior this must be some sort of cultural language thing because i am not even feeling that way. If anything i feel extremely shocked on people and all these RE vs "native" nonsense.
Btw i am pretty sure i am right ( is that it? but how can i express that i am right? ) because what you pointed out does not have anything to with what i said. SIMD,SSE and all that i get it but there when talking about devs which are refusing to port their VST because of RE SDK limits, we are talking about synths which started without and far before RE's was even introduced. So it's not fair thing.
I'm pretty sure this misunderstanding is just from a typo. mind2069 likely meant the "oh man" comment, which he interpreted as being condescending.
- HO MAN.JPG (184.01 KiB) Viewed 3742 times
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by mind2069
EnochLight wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
seqoi wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
Man i am genuinely confused what is HO MAN (i really don't know meaning of it i am not native english) and why do you find my posting express feeling of intellectual superiority ? I just pointed this what you write about me to my wife and he laughed to both of us. To me because i am far from being intellectually superior and to you for believing i am superior. Anyway what is HO MAN? And i apologize if i am turning superior this must be some sort of cultural language thing because i am not even feeling that way. If anything i feel extremely shocked on people and all these RE vs "native" nonsense.
Btw i am pretty sure i am right ( is that it? but how can i express that i am right? ) because what you pointed out does not have anything to with what i said. SIMD,SSE and all that i get it but there when talking about devs which are refusing to port their VST because of RE SDK limits, we are talking about synths which started without and far before RE's was even introduced. So it's not fair thing.
I'm pretty sure this misunderstanding is just from a typo. mind2069 likely meant the "oh man" comment, which he interpreted as being condescending.
HO MAN.JPG
Usually, when someone writes an explanation and ends it with Ho man.. I do feel there something condescending.
I know, it's not like it's the biggest insult ever. and maybe I'm wrong, no i'm not sensible and my feelings are not hurt, no hard feelings. Let's leave it at that.
Perhaps to you it's nonsense the RE vs native, other people brought it up and I was curious cause the GUI definitely seem's from the RE SDK, but someone showed the .repatch, so its an included RE, like the Echo, curiosity satisfied.
But there definitely a difference, perhaps not in performance, but those graphics displays don't seem to be a polished as some vst's (fabfilter for instance)
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by esselfortium
What about the GUI in particular "seems from the RE SDK"? Aside from folding up like RV7000, I'm hard-pressed to think of much that any native rack devices' GUIs have done that modern REs can't also do.
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by mind2069
esselfortium wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
What about the GUI in particular "seems from the RE SDK"? Aside from folding up like RV7000, I'm hard-pressed to think of much that any native rack devices' GUIs have done that modern REs can't also do.
Mainly the interactive display, the fonts, specially in the effects, also the flat knobs in the LFO, the interactive panels don't seem to offer a rich GUI possibilities, like lets say Fabfilter EQ.
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by EnochLight
mind2069 wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
esselfortium wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
What about the GUI in particular "seems from the RE SDK"? Aside from folding up like RV7000, I'm hard-pressed to think of much that any native rack devices' GUIs have done that modern REs can't also do.
Mainly the interactive display, the fonts, specially in the effects, also the flat knobs in the LFO, the interactive panels don't seem to offer a rich GUI possibilities, like lets say Fabfilter EQ.
FabFilter and all other VST out there run as separate programs, allowing them direct access to your operating system's graphics processing. For that reason alone, they will always have a more rich GUI/UX graphics experience compared to Reason's animated bitmaps and RE custom displays, which literally use
Reason itself as the operating system.
Until Reason itself has a fundamental change in how it handles graphics (and those changes are passed down to the RE SDK with an update), I'm afraid we'll never see the likes of Fab Filter-like animations or graphics in Reason.
On a side note, it seems Propellerhead took a baby step in this direction when they introduced the spectral display interface for the main mixer EQ, as this does have some access to your OS's graphics processing. There used to be a DirectX on/off switch in a config file at some point, but I can't remember the details.
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by mind2069
EnochLight wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
mind2069 wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
Mainly the interactive display, the fonts, specially in the effects, also the flat knobs in the LFO, the interactive panels don't seem to offer a rich GUI possibilities, like lets say Fabfilter EQ.
FabFilter and all other VST out there run as separate programs, allowing them direct access to your operating system's graphics processing. For that reason alone, they will always have a more rich GUI/UX graphics experience compared to Reason's animated bitmaps and RE custom displays, which literally use
Reason itself as the operating system.
Until Reason itself has a fundamental change in how it handles graphics (and those changes are passed down to the RE SDK with an update), I'm afraid we'll never see the likes of Fab Filter-like animations or graphics in Reason.
On a side note, it seems Propellerhead took a baby step in this direction when they introduced the spectral display interface for the main mixer EQ, as this does have some access to your OS's graphics processing. There used to be a DirectX on/off switch in a config file at some point, but I can't remember the details.
Exactly, with the general layout like 3d buttons, backgrounds, slider ect, there is no difference, but in the interactive panels, its light and day. But I dont mind, was just curious when someone said Europa is native (as in not a RE) device, cause those panels are to me, obviously from there SDK, time to let the thread about Europe resume
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by esselfortium
I believe the use of interactive-panel controls for knobs and buttons on Europa and Grain was a design choice rather than a technical limitation. The RE SDK supports actual switchable panels with regular controls, and the FX sections on Europa and Grain make use of this.
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by mind2069
esselfortium wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
I believe the use of interactive-panel controls for knobs and buttons on Europa and Grain was a design choice rather than a technical limitation. The RE SDK supports actual switchable panels with regular controls, and the FX sections on Europa and Grain make use of this.
Just look at the visual quality of the interactive panels, all re's that have interactive panel show primitive quality in display, if works just as fine, but its always flat and sort of grainy for lack of better words,
You never see a 3d button in RE's interactive panels, it's flat, someone correct me if I am wrong
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by esselfortium
mind2069 wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
esselfortium wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
I believe the use of interactive-panel controls for knobs and buttons on Europa and Grain was a design choice rather than a technical limitation. The RE SDK supports actual switchable panels with regular controls, and the FX sections on Europa and Grain make use of this.
Just look at the visual quality of the interactive panels, all re's that have interactive panel show primitive quality in display, if works just as fine, but its always flat and sort of grainy for lack of better words,
You never see a 3d button in RE's interactive panels, it's flat, someone correct me if I am wrong
I'd think you would use a switchable panel for that and just put a regular 3D button there.
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by fieldframe
mind2069 wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
esselfortium wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
I believe the use of interactive-panel controls for knobs and buttons on Europa and Grain was a design choice rather than a technical limitation. The RE SDK supports actual switchable panels with regular controls, and the FX sections on Europa and Grain make use of this.
Just look at the visual quality of the interactive panels, all re's that have interactive panel show primitive quality in display, if works just as fine, but its always flat and sort of grainy for lack of better words,
You never see a 3d button in RE's interactive panels, it's flat, someone correct me if I am wrong
Look at the impulse response on RV7000. Look at the slice view on Dr. OctoRex. Look at the programmer on NN-XT. Look at the macros on Kong.
Do you see what these all have in common? They are all "screens" in the "virtual hardware" rack metaphor. Screens don't have 3D buttons because they are flat screens.
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 03 Oct 2017
by mind2069
fieldframe wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
mind2069 wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
Just look at the visual quality of the interactive panels, all re's that have interactive panel show primitive quality in display, if works just as fine, but its always flat and sort of grainy for lack of better words,
You never see a 3d button in RE's interactive panels, it's flat, someone correct me if I am wrong
Look at the impulse response on RV7000. Look at the slice view on Dr. OctoRex. Look at the programmer on NN-XT. Look at the macros on Kong.
Do you see what these all have in common? They are all "screens" in the "virtual hardware" rack metaphor. Screens don't have 3D buttons because they are flat screens.
- Untitled-1.jpg (155.97 KiB) Viewed 3476 times
I get it, I think that the interactive panels could not have this level of details, its not totally 3d, but just seems more polished/advanced, even the buttons at the bottom are not totally 3d but not flat either.
Anyway I have nothing againts Europa UI, its all fine, and I understand what EnochLight said
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by seqoi
mind2069 i can assure you it was not even tiny bit of intention to make myself superior. Enochight thanks for pointing that out. Guys it's a language thing. "Oh man" to me is same as "Hey man" or something like that. But glad we sorted it out i don't have any intention to make anyone feel bad.
Respect!
On topic: Anyone know someone mentioned Grain live feed on Wed? Am i wrong?
p.s. EnochLigh when looking at your screenshot of me - how do you make this forum to be so dark and colors different then what it is now? I am reading it white and it hurt my eyes. Your screenshot is so much easier to read. Is there some setup thing for this forum? Sorry for OT.
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by EnochLight
seqoi wrote: ↑04 Oct 2017
p.s. EnochLigh when looking at your screenshot of me - how do you make this forum to be so dark and colors different then what it is now? I am reading it white and it hurt my eyes. Your screenshot is so much easier to read. Is there some setup thing for this forum? Sorry for OT.
Click on your profile in the upper right, user control panel. It's under board preferences:
- image.png (471 KiB) Viewed 3223 times
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by FLVZ
mind2069 wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
fieldframe wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
Look at the impulse response on RV7000. Look at the slice view on Dr. OctoRex. Look at the programmer on NN-XT. Look at the macros on Kong.
Do you see what these all have in common? They are all "screens" in the "virtual hardware" rack metaphor. Screens don't have 3D buttons because they are flat screens.
Untitled-1.jpg
I get it, I think that the interactive panels could not have this level of details, its not totally 3d, but just seems more polished/advanced, even the buttons at the bottom are not totally 3d but not flat either.
Anyway I have nothing againts Europa UI, its all fine, and I understand what EnochLight said
Buttons in the the screen cannot be automated, no way would this be a good move, it would mean any buttons in custom display screen would have to be automated using a combinator or the mod matrix, which limits flexibility. Going against the core principle behind the birth of the instrument. Thus most buttons are outside of the displays, I kind of like the simplified car radio LED button look and it doesn't occupy as much dsp performance as 3D if I'm correct in my assumption...
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by etyrnal
Flavolous wrote:mind2069 wrote: ↑03 Oct 2017
Untitled-1.jpg
I get it, I think that the interactive panels could not have this level of details, its not totally 3d, but just seems more polished/advanced, even the buttons at the bottom are not totally 3d but not flat either.
Anyway I have nothing againts Europa UI, its all fine, and I understand what EnochLight said
Buttons in the the screen cannot be automated, no way would this be a good move, it would mean any buttons in custom display screen would have to be automated using a combinator or the mod matrix, which limits flexibility. Going against the core principle behind the birth of the instrument. Thus most buttons are outside of the displays, I kind of like the simplified car radio LED button look and it doesn't occupy as much dsp performance as 3D if I'm correct in my assumption...
If someone is desperate for 3d looks, get a Playstation
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by EnochLight
etyrnal wrote: ↑04 Oct 2017
If someone is desperate for 3d looks, get a Playstation
I'd much prefer the Xbox One X, instead.
In all seriousness, this seems rather dismissive, though. Much of the GUI/UX criticism is valid, as far as modernized interfaces are concerned. I mean, I love Reason and the RE platform, but
come on now...
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by etyrnal
EnochLight wrote:etyrnal wrote: ↑04 Oct 2017
If someone is desperate for 3d looks, get a Playstation
I'd much prefer the Xbox One X, instead. [emoji38]
In all seriousness, this seems rather dismissive, though. Much of the GUI/UX criticism is valid, as far as modernized interfaces are concerned. I mean, I love Reason and the RE platform, but
come on now...
I'm not giving up dsp power for making pretty knobs. I'm here to make music, not to run ultra realistic virtual reality knob twiddling simulations.
Sorry the dsp couldn't calculate that last voice of polyphony you wanted, the CPU cycles were needed to calculate the specularity, and reflection mapping of the mod-wheel... so you won't be hearing the effects of mod-wheel, but you'll get to see it. Isn't it purdy.
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by AttenuationHz
Grain stream this Friday same time!
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by Exowildebeest
When I saw that e-mail I thought "Yes! Beta time!"
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by avasopht
etyrnal wrote: ↑04 Oct 2017
Sorry the dsp couldn't calculate that last voice of polyphony you wanted, the CPU cycles were needed to calculate the specularity, and reflection mapping of the mod-wheel... so you won't be hearing the effects of mod-wheel, but you'll get to see it. Isn't it purdy.
Relax, that's not happening at all, they're all 2d renderings, which requires no additional CPU cycles.
And even it was rendered in realtime, 3d rendering uses GPU power
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by Creativemind
AttenuationHz wrote: ↑02 Oct 2017
EnochLight wrote: ↑02 Oct 2017
Virtually all main Roman deities were just Romanized versions of the original Greek deities. The Empire of Rome was good at appropriating other cultures stuff.
Jupiter is a Roman god though! Europa orbits Jupiter
It's spelt uropa though I think.
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by Biolumin3sc3nt
I had to double check for myself - Hell's to the YaY - Super Pumped
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by EnochLight
Creativemind wrote: ↑04 Oct 2017
It's spelt uropa though I think.
You're not talking out of Uranus, are you?
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by seqoi
EnochLight THANK YOU - much appreciated - my eyes love you
Re: Reason 10 announced!
Posted: 04 Oct 2017
by AttenuationHz
EnochLight wrote: ↑04 Oct 2017
Creativemind wrote: ↑04 Oct 2017
It's spelt uropa though I think.
You're not talking out of Uranus, are you?
God damn beat me to it
@Creativemind its Europa