Will there not be a Reason 12? Time for subscription?

[joeyluck]

What more can they add to make the plugin centric? Anything that I can imagine being added to the plugin (the rack and browser), I would imagine we would see in the DAW, so I say—bring it on! Lol

- Improved graphics with rack zoom? Yes—gotta have it.
- Improved browser search with tags? Yes please!
- Continually improved RE SDK? Don't mind if I do have some of that.
- MPE support for REs? Will we ever see that? I'm guessing if we do, it won't just be in the RRP.
- Double click to make cable connections in the rack (like the Moog Model 15 app)? Oh hell yeah! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vy_-Kt4 ... u.be&t=390
- When making cable connections, highlight the possible connections (also like the Model 15 app)? Would be very helpful.

What else is there? What would help improve the RRP (browser, rack, and REs) and what would you like to see? I hope we see it all. I would think those things above would make the RRP even more user friendly. I hope these RRP users help push for some of these things.

[guitfnky]

if we take Mattias’ comments at face value—then they’re planning to continue heavily supporting the DAW for the foreseeable future. but we can’t know that for sure until we see something concrete.

Well, concretely - new features were added to the core DAW in Reason 11. So I guess we'll have to see what appears in Reason 12 to really tell if there's a major course correction. But i'd imagine we're looking at early 2021 before that's a possibility...

totally agree. they certainly haven’t *abandoned* the DAW, so it’s also way too early to assume they’re going to stop development of the Reason DAW altogether. the part you said about having to wait until the next release to see what happens is pretty much what I was trying to get at.

[NDKay]

I hope these RRP users help push for some of these things.

hey, lets get back to the point before "nobody" got "serious"

They do not need our opinion, if they are silently closed tickets without solving anything.

[guitfnky]

if we take Mattias’ comments at face value

We really shouldn't.

you’re free to take his words any way you like. I’m more cynical than I used to be, but not to the point where I think it would make sense to have knowingly made a false statement—at least a year (probably) before the next major release would prove him untrustworthy.

he would more likely just not say anything at all. lying and waiting for people on the internet to forget about it is a losing proposition.

[DaveyG]

We really shouldn't.

you’re free to take his words any way you like. I’m more cynical than I used to be, but not to the point where I think it would make sense to have knowingly made a false statement—at least a year (probably) before the next major release would prove him untrustworthy.

he would more likely just not say anything at all. lying and waiting for people on the internet to forget about it is a losing proposition.

Woah there, boy! I never said he was lying. I said that you'll never get a balanced view from him. In public he will always, always, always highlight the positives and brush the negatives under the carpet. That's his job.

[Michaellos]

Subscription model..... No, no, no, I hope that will never happen to reason Studios. Am I right that it means I would have to pay all the time and what I'm paying for will never ever become mine ? This model is total crap and fraud.

[ljekio]

And... just jump on Kilohearts (the guys behind PhasePlant) Discord channel. Those guys talk and talk and talk... and never seem phased about chatting with their users. They properly discuss old, new and in-the-future feature ideas... and seriously... it works. Bugs are fixed as a joint effort. Their products have the right level of cool features because they listen to the people that have to use them. Their users are happily feeding back all the time and the devs are feeding back all the time. It's a happy and productive environment.

Someone remembers a time when propellers had similar behavior. The first bell rang when the PUF was closed. Regarding the subscription model, I will support anyone who opposes it.

[MattiasHG]

you’re free to take his words any way you like. I’m more cynical than I used to be, but not to the point where I think it would make sense to have knowingly made a false statement—at least a year (probably) before the next major release would prove him untrustworthy.

he would more likely just not say anything at all. lying and waiting for people on the internet to forget about it is a losing proposition.

Woah there, boy! I never said he was lying. I said that you'll never get a balanced view from him. In public he will always, always, always highlight the positives and brush the negatives under the carpet. That's his job.

* a wild Mattias appears *

Nah, that's not my job. My job is to try to make Reason as awesome as possible for music makers and the company (they tend to be the same thing) with the resources we have. Like most product managers in other words.

I am definitely being completely honest when I say that we have no plans to abandon the DAW. We're definitely focusing a lot on the plugin now, as you've no doubt noticed, but it's also new to the market so we need to drum up awareness for it. That doesn't mean we don't care about the DAW, we're developing that too and it often isn't an "either/or" situation. For example I've already mentioned the big work we're doing on graphics, that affects all of Reason and has been one of the top requests for a while.

Anyway, I guess my point is: I care deeply about making Reason awesome in all kinds of ways, the DAW's not going away anytime soon and sorry for not chiming in more often. It's both because I've got tons of product work (back in the day, social media and forums was part of my job—it's not anymore) and because things can always change as we learn more so we try not to talk about features or plans until they're more or less certain.

[moneykube]

nice... but what about tickets disappearing?... it seems the company does not want any feedback about bugs... first your forum... now blanket deletion of tickets???? I am sure you have more time after removing our voices
I have invested heavily in your products... yet at every turn it seems those that support RS are getting slapped in the face... I am not a masochist thank you... I need no more insults from support... and I do not want white washed blanket happy statements... answer why you seem to have abandoned PAYING customers... check out what I have paid to you... it is quite a bit as you will see... so this answer is far from anything that explains this tendency to ignore those who pay you... do you get that? I am far from the only one that thinks this... user since 2.5.... GET IT TOGETHER

[DaveyG]

* a wild Mattias appears *

Dammit! I'm all out of Pokeballs. We could have had him captive on here permanently.

FWIW I'm not calling you dishonest or saying that you don't care. Just that you absolutely have to publicly talk-up the new stuff regardless of what you might think of it in private. You're not telling me you agree with every change made to every version of Reason ever?

To take an example. You can't tell me you are happy with the current "Lite" situation, where iOS customers get 10 Lite, Plugin Boutique customers get 11.3 Lite including the Plugin but few instruments yet between the two is 11.2 Lite with no plugin but more instruments? That's bizarre versioning, that is.

And, yeah, the support ticket thing.

[aeox]

* a wild Mattias appears *

[moneykube]

[MattiasHG]

nice... but what about tickets disappearing?... it seems the company does not want any feedback about bugs... first your forum... now blanket deletion of tickets???? I am sure you have more time after removing our voices

I saw that thread and passed it on to the head of support. In short, communication wasn't great but there will be many times where fixing a bug is not as highly prioritized as fixing another bug or developing something else. They're still in our backlog, but I think the support ticket is resolved because there's no action on the ticket now. "Resolved" is a tricky word there.

Dammit! I'm all out of Pokeballs. We could have had him captive on here permanently.

FWIW I'm not calling you dishonest of saying that you don't care. Just that you absolutely have to publicly talk-up the new stuff regardless of what you might think of it in private. You're not telling me you agree with every change made to every version of Reason ever?

To take an example. You can't tell me you are happy with the current "Lite" situation, where iOS customers get 10 Lite, Plugin Boutique customers get 11.3 Lite including the Plugin but few instruments yet between the two is 11.2 Lite with no plugin but more instruments? That's bizarre versioning, that is.

And, yeah, the support ticket thing.

Oh yeah, the Lite situation is frankly confusing and it's my fault too! When we originally designed Reason Lite, the plugin was not planned so we had a track limitation but a lot of devices. Come Reason 11, Lite would've been insanely good for a free product if we simply made it a plugin too since there's no track limitation. It'd be like giving away Reason Intro for free. So we decided not to make Lite a plugin. In hindsight, there never should've been another Reason 11 Lite

Now we've heard from other companies (like Plugin Boutique!) that the plugin is really interesting as an OEM product so we updated Lite. To keep it sane for a free offer, we reduced the number of devices. This is a transition period and every new Reason Lite we make or distribute will be the new version. If you're already on the older Reason 11 Lite, it won't auto-update because of the change in devices—we didn't want to be mean.

Regarding Compact, that was a dropped ball. We'll likely make some changes there too so you won't get Reason 10 Lite in the future.

It's a bit messy right now, but the intention is that Reason Lite 11.3.1 is the latest version and all older versions are essentially discontinued (but won't stop working).

[moneykube]

what can I say?... I guess time will tell... don't want to be a thorn here... but stuff is not adding up in multiple ways these days... no need to respond as I doubt there is a response that will satisfy long time users... rant over

[moneykube]

lets be happy lol... got reason 11 suite(even though I owned nine racks included already... double your money... lucky u)... and I also bought live suite because the writing on the wall is in greek... needed>>>> translation ! If tickets are closed ... you still know about the problems but refuse to advice users... very professional ... purchasing from your shop has now stopped for sure... that just does not cut the mustard in this case,,, same crap happened in reason 4.... I could bring that demon forth but what is the point if you do not take paying customers seriously... wow... see you around some day... this is all really quite unbelievable on all points... how about solutions... not the we are in flux bs???? really !!!!! WE HAVE BEEN PATIENT BEYOND WHAT SHOULD BE ACCEPTABLE>.. I will not bow to a dishonest , conniving company .... RS currently fits that bill ... Time to get real with the facts and the truth ... or do we wait another 10 years for that?

[DaveyG]

lets be happy lol... got reason 11 suite(even though I owned nine racks included already... double your money... lucky u)... and I also bought live suite because the writing on the wall is in greek... needed>>>> translation ! If tickets are closed ... you still know about the problems but refuse to advice users... very professional ... purchasing from your shop has now stopped for sure... that just does not cut the mustard in this case,,, same crap happened in reason 4.... I could bring that demon forth but what is the point if you do not take paying customers seriously... wow... see you around some day... this is all really quite unbelievable on all points... how about solutions not we are in flux bs???? really !!!!!

Mate, chill a bit. Ranting at the fella is not the way to get more communication from him!

[moneykube]

[quote=DaveyG post_id=509220 time=1593768865 user_id=19075Mate, chill a bit. Ranting at the fella is not the way to get more communication from him!
[/quote]
then a proper answer might help ... been waiting for years bro... can''t send to support because apparently it gets deleted... can't discuss it on their own forum cause they burned it like the nazis ... so tell me... where should grievances be stated... they have removed all avenues... ????????????????
tell me where ? you must know since you spoke up... tell me( I did tell him there was no need to respond) I have seen enough to know what side the salt is on... THIS IS A TERRIBLE WAY TO RUN ANY COMPANY PERIOD

[NDKay]

* a wild Mattias appears *

..........and sorry for not chiming in more often. It's both because I've got tons of product work (back in the day, social media and forums was part of my job—it's not anymore) .........

Why is that not a part of your job anymore ? (thinking of "social media" getting even more relevant than less in the last years )

Does anyone else now have "this" part ?

------------------------

This "Lite Version" chaos is no good marketing, for example : someone sees the PB-offer and looks up some videos on youtube about "lite". Then they get it and after opening they look at the devices and "WTF!". (Yeah, like everybody is reading all the "terms of Service" before using it )
They get back to PB and look at the product-page and see that everything is "right".... but none the less, there is a "bad feeling".

------------------------

and fwiw, i would back up moneykube with the points he made about the paying customers.
(It is like it is...... "new" customers will always be more important than old ones. Because you already got the money from the old ones. )
------------------------

i spread some more speculation :
Now if the PB-offer brings many "reason as a VST" users, RS needs to get to "their" money. So i will predict the "Rig-Bundles" will hit a new "lowest price ever" point somewhere in the near future..........and the "upgrades", too.

[MattiasHG]

* a wild Mattias appears *

..........and sorry for not chiming in more often. It's both because I've got tons of product work (back in the day, social media and forums was part of my job—it's not anymore) .........

Why is that not a part of your job anymore ? (thinking of "social media" getting even more relevant than less in the last years )

Does anyone else now have "this" part ?

I got a promotion to Product Manager in 2016, a very different role with a different job description than what I had, and thet keeps me increasingly busy. Stefan (supersplaron) and Ryan do have that role—that's why you see them in a livestream every tuesday for example!

This "Lite Version" chaos is no good marketing, for example : someone sees the PB-offer and looks up some videos on youtube about "lite". Then they get it and after opening they look at the devices and "WTF!". (Yeah, like everybody is reading all the "terms of Service" before using it )
They get back to PB and look at the product-page and see that everything is "right".... but none the less, there is a "bad feeling".

Right, I completely agree, it's not ideal and in time we'll phase the old versions out. We also tried to be super clear on what's included both on Plugin Boutique's page and /reason-lite/ on our website. Hard to control what's on youtube though, if you search for "Reason" you can of course still get Reason 5 or pre-VST support. The internet is what it is

[NDKay]

Does anyone else now have "this" part ?

Stefan (supersplaron) and Ryan do have that role—that's why you see them in a livestream every tuesday for example!

Who ?
( just joking and btw trying to make reach a point )
(( adding : i dont think that Supersplaron is the one to blame ))

This "Lite Version" chaos is no good marketing, for example : someone sees the PB-offer and looks up some videos on youtube about "lite". Then they get it and after opening they look at the devices and "WTF!". (Yeah, like everybody is reading all the "terms of Service" before using it )
They get back to PB and look at the product-page and see that everything is "right".... but none the less, there is a "bad feeling".

Right, I completely agree, it's not ideal and in time we'll phase the old versions out. We also tried to be super clear on what's included both on Plugin Boutique's page and /reason-lite/ on our website. Hard to control what's on youtube though, if you search for "Reason" you can of course still get Reason 5 or pre-VST support. The internet is what it is

Yeah, sure you find Videos of even older videos, but thanks for getting "my point".

[guitfnky]

you’re free to take his words any way you like. I’m more cynical than I used to be, but not to the point where I think it would make sense to have knowingly made a false statement—at least a year (probably) before the next major release would prove him untrustworthy.

he would more likely just not say anything at all. lying and waiting for people on the internet to forget about it is a losing proposition.

Woah there, boy! I never said he was lying. I said that you'll never get a balanced view from him. In public he will always, always, always highlight the positives and brush the negatives under the carpet. That's his job.

of course. but he works for a company that’s famously tight-lipped. the way I see it, if he’s a good employee, he has two options; 1—keep quiet, or 2—tell the truth. he didn’t do #1, so it stands to reason he did #2.

[EnochLight]

Assorted musings: it’s nice to see the Product Manager himself chime in and affirm that Reason standalone DAW development isn’t going away anytime soon. Also, I’d never had thought this thread would hit Godwins Law, but I guess there’s always gotta’ be that one person.

[danc]

Why is that not a part of your job anymore ? (thinking of "social media" getting even more relevant than less in the last years )

Does anyone else now have "this" part ?

I got a promotion to Product Manager in 2016, a very different role with a different job description than what I had, and thet keeps me increasingly busy. Stefan (supersplaron) and Ryan do have that role—that's why you see them in a livestream every tuesday for example!

Reason users socially hang out online on ReasonTalk, yet Reason Studio's 'social media' team ignore the ReasonTalk platform. Mattias, can you pass on a message to Stefan and Ryan asking them to talk direct with their Reason fan base. This will build trust and respect between Reason users and RS.

Yes, making videos is one good way to communicate - but it is a very protected environment. They should take 'social media' for what it is and realise it is a 2-way communication.

[EnochLight]

Reason users socially hang out online on ReasonTalk, yet Reason Studio's 'social media' team ignore the ReasonTalk platform. Mattias, can you pass on a message to Stefan and Ryan asking them to talk direct with their Reason fan base. This will build trust and respect between Reason users and RS.

Actually, I’d wager the Reasontalk forums have less than 50 frequently active posters, and less than 200 who seem to lurk and chime in on occasion. @Mods: am I wrong? I’m not talking about total members registered here - I’m talking about active forum members.

Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and YouTube instantly reach thousands upon thousands of users - all at once. Internet forums are a bygone era, I’m afraid. We tend to forget that here (and at other forums) as they tend to be an echo chamber.

[moneykube]

for f##ks sake... answers are needed not this stupid run around... I guess I am one of the 50... hmmm... perhaps now 49 as many probably wish....
question... why even bother... just entice me to give u more money... good job
shall I start the list of 1000's of user questions unanswered?
lol... come on now... this is a company not a arcade game building... where does one ask these questions?... all avenues get removed or put down because people dare to question ... WE AS USERS PAYING MONEY have this right believe it or not ... wow... directions to a place that can answer these questions please.... !!!!!!!!!
EMAIL... social media... anywhere???????????... should not even be a question needed to be asked !!!!!~ COME on... pathetic... no company exists that does not respond to user issues and bugs I know of... but RS is exempt?.... wow... that is indeed insane... and highly illegal in every country I have dealt with

perhaps a multiple joint law suit needs to be created ... or... options?... and no I will not take shut up as an option
RS law is not world law !... how about multiple countries banding together to get the answers that deflect ????