ReasonTalk.com

Typical VC move...it is all about the $$$....

Something is rotten in the state of Denmark...

I'd be upset as a subscriber if the monthly price went up. Those who are subscribing have to pay that monthly price to keep going. Those of us buying perpetual licenses can upgrade when we want and continue using whatever version we have and wait to upgrade. At the end of the day, we still have to figure out the value of the next version for ourselves before we buy it regardless of the price being $129, $199, or even just $50. I feel like many of the reactions here are as if users are expecting a bill in the mail

cursors wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

Something is rotten in the state of Denmark...

and they smell it in Sweden ?

gullum wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

cursors wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

Something is rotten in the state of Denmark...

and they smell it in Sweden ?

Obviously not

joeyluck wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

... I feel like many of the reactions here are as if users are expecting a bill in the mail

Some people are just looking for someone to yell at and express their negative emotion.

I'm not keen on the price hike, I don't think they've got a strong enough value offering to back it up, and I doubt this will go down well with most regular upgraders.

But I could be wrong.

But I am willing to spend that much each year on any products that can back it up.

RobBarnett wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

Being a long term Reason user is like being on a roller coaster.

- we're getting VST support - Yey
- but only vst 2.4 and not midi - oh
- we're getting HD graphics - Yey
- but many elements are still SD - oh
- we're getting zoom - yey
- but its the whole application - oh
- we're getting a new Sampler - yey
- but it can't load Rex files or do tempo detection or other slice points other than transient - oh
- Reason 12 is out - yey
- but there are loads of bugs - oh
- combinator 2 - yey
- no sequencer improvements- oh
- roadmap is communicated and they're gonna fix loads of the above - yey
- price is going up - oh

Seriously considering switching to Logic now (one £200 payment, once) as the constant ups and downs from RS just creates so much negative energy

Ooooh, just checked the apple store and Logic is at £174.99 at the moment - dilemma

RobBarnett wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

Seriously considering switching to Logic now (one £200 payment, once) as the constant ups and downs from RS just creates so much negative energy

Before Vst's in Reason I was running Logic 9 to process a few things with VST's.
When Logic 10 came out I didn't really need anything in it and figured I'd stick with 9 but when I tried to open it I was told that it was no longer supported etc. and that I needed to pay 200 to upgrade it.
Bye bye Logic.

avasopht wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

joeyluck wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

... I feel like many of the reactions here are as if users are expecting a bill in the mail

Some people are just looking for someone to yell at and express their negative emotion.

I'm not keen on the price hike, I don't think they've got a strong enough value offering to back it up, and I doubt this will go down well with most regular upgraders.

But I could be wrong.

But I am willing to spend that much each year on any products that can back it up.

I agree. What I see today I wouldn't value at $199. But what I see today is still $129.

There are fixes due out soon and a "smart browser" due in October. I'm looking forward to seeing what that is and hopefully some sneak peeks. VST3 support will add value in January.

helmutson wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

Exactly what I'm thinking. Since Propellerheads became Reasonstudios I was very suspicious about that.
There is much more behind the courtain than we will ever learn. Reason is no longer in good hands since then.
Very sad story , esp. for a guy who worked with that wonderful software since the very first days.
I should finally let go ...

It's undoubtable that they would be some changes since the new leadership. I think there was some real magic when original founders Marcus Zetterquist, Ernst Nathorst-Boos and Peter Jubel were running the company. It's probable that after doing the same thing everyday for twenty years they lost interest and moved onto other ventures. I believe Ernst is still on the board but has no say in day-to-day operations.

RobBarnett wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

Being a long term Reason user is like being on a roller coaster.

- we're getting VST support - Yey
- but only vst 2.4 and not midi - oh
- we're getting HD graphics - Yey
- but many elements are still SD - oh
- we're getting zoom - yey
- but its the whole application - oh
- we're getting a new Sampler - yey
- but it can't load Rex files or do tempo detection or other slice points other than transient - oh
- Reason 12 is out - yey
- but there are loads of bugs - oh
- combinator 2 - yey
- no sequencer improvements- oh
- roadmap is communicated and they're gonna fix loads of the above - yey
- price is going up - oh

Seriously considering switching to Logic now (one £200 payment, once) as the constant ups and downs from RS just creates so much negative energy

That's what happens when you follow developments religiously like its your local football team. If we all didn't follow forums/social media and simply used Reason as a tool to make music we'd all be much happier.

miscend wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

RobBarnett wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

Being a long term Reason user is like being on a roller coaster.

- we're getting VST support - Yey
- but only vst 2.4 and not midi - oh
- we're getting HD graphics - Yey
- but many elements are still SD - oh
- we're getting zoom - yey
- but its the whole application - oh
- we're getting a new Sampler - yey
- but it can't load Rex files or do tempo detection or other slice points other than transient - oh
- Reason 12 is out - yey
- but there are loads of bugs - oh
- combinator 2 - yey
- no sequencer improvements- oh
- roadmap is communicated and they're gonna fix loads of the above - yey
- price is going up - oh

Seriously considering switching to Logic now (one £200 payment, once) as the constant ups and downs from RS just creates so much negative energy

That's what happens when you follow developments religiously like its your local football team. If we all didn't follow forums/social media and simply used Reason as a tool to make music we'd all be much happier.

This list is not something we witnessed from afar, while watching Netflix, or football. We all were in that rollercoaster, while using and supporting Reason.
I'll still support my favorite daw, in due -rock solid bullet-proof stability- time. No pressure. No fomo

Reason Studios next business model after the subscription thing fails:


WATCH 4 ADS to get 20 minutes more music making time! Watch this AD to access the filter on Subtractor. Spend 5 dollars to get a new skin for Thor!

The free to play model is definitely the next trend they will hop on.

flexluthor wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

Reason Studios next business model after the subscription thing fails:


WATCH 4 ADS to get 20 minutes more music making time! Watch this AD to access the filter on Subtractor. Spend 5 dollars to get a new skin for Thor!

The free to play model is definitely the next trend they will hop on.

joeyluck wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

avasopht wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

Some people are just looking for someone to yell at and express their negative emotion.

I'm not keen on the price hike, I don't think they've got a strong enough value offering to back it up, and I doubt this will go down well with most regular upgraders.

But I could be wrong.

But I am willing to spend that much each year on any products that can back it up.

I agree. What I see today I wouldn't value at $199. But what I see today is still $129.

There are fixes due out soon and a "smart browser" due in October. I'm looking forward to seeing what that is and hopefully some sneak peeks. VST3 support will add value in January.

When would you value what you see in an update at that price, the price increase is 1st of October - in case you haven't read that part, that is well before the addition of features that should be in a Release.

What will be happening now is more people won't blindly upgrade without knowing what is in a new version. So any features added will have to be justifiable. That means if they don't like what they see they will skip that version, so in essence RS are going to be making less money due to the ~55% increase, possibly skipping more than 1 upgrade. €70 more means RS will potentially be making €199 less per user / upgrade. Given that the overwhelming majority of votes for the poll think the price increase is way too much that statement and situation is likely to be apparent.

Maybe they'll also announce a pausable rent-to-own for Reason Standalone, where the $199 can be paid over 12 or 18 months.

As they are already selling the upgrade for 129 it would make much more sense to say the next version will be going up in price.

Either way I do think they get a hard time and must be very demoralising putting all that work in and then dealing with so much negativity. By all means let them know what they need to improve, but no need to make it personal.

At the end of the day they will need to justify the the cost of upgrading with the improvements they make. So why not give them some encouragement to do that? A happy worker is a productive worker.

I would gladly pay $200 for an upgrade if it had a ton of new features and usable devices. A much bigger upgrade than usual. However we can already see what R12 is going to bring once the features have been more developed. It does not excite me and does not look very promising for the future if that's about the size of a $200 upgrade.

Why all the bugs in R12 and new features “coming soon”? Didn’t they test it first and plan it out? I’m confused and getting more disappointed with every version since 10. They used to give us so much. Now they charge us so much with little to give besides finally catching up with the times. Upgrades used to be a long exciting list of features & devices. Now it’s a few things with more bugs, long time bugs unfixed and mostly devices in the shop. I will never pay $200 for that.

And don’t get me started on the bugs that went on for years with Apple compatibility.

plaamook wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

When Logic 10 came out I didn't really need anything in it and figured I'd stick with 9 but when I tried to open it I was told that it was no longer supported etc. and that I needed to pay 200 to upgrade it.
Bye bye Logic.

So you were on Logic 9 and then expected to get a free full version upgrade to Logic 10????? That wasn't very....logical.

I paid $199 for my L10 upgrade like everyone else in the world, have seen a billion awesome updates, and haven't paid anything since 2013.

Soon to be $200 for an upgrade when you can buy Logic for $200. Strange times we live in. Definitely made up my mind I won’t be upgrading anytime soon.

The problem w/ the Logic @ $200 thingy is that I no longer want to feed the beast. Apple, a long time ago dropped the ball as far as being the artists' computer.
Yeah I use their machine, but I'm tryin' to learn Reaper ova here, 4 cryin' out loud, head is exploding...

motuscott wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

The problem w/ the Logic @ $200 thingy is that I no longer want to feed the beast. Apple, a long time ago dropped the ball as far as being the artists' computer.
Yeah I use their machine, but I'm tryin' to learn Reaper ova here, 4 cryin' out loud, head is exploding...

That’s a better example. Reaper is more bang for the buck feature wise than this diminutive R12 release with a price hike. RS acts like they deserve to receive premium pricing for their products but they don’t.

Lancaster wrote: ↑

16 Sep 2021

As they are already selling the upgrade for 129 it would make much more sense to say the next version will be going up in price.

Either way I do think they get a hard time and must be very demoralising putting all that work in and then dealing with so much negativity. By all means let them know what they need to improve, but no need to make it personal.

At the end of the day they will need to justify the the cost of upgrading with the improvements they make. So why not give them some encouragement to do that? A happy worker is a productive worker.

I see you're new so I'll try to go easy. The same could be said for users, it is demoralising putting all that hard earned money into a upgrade were your expectations are for a more superior product than the last one and then having to deal with so many issues with the software.

At the end of the day it is night time. Users shouldn't need to be still reporting bugs after a release nor should they be distracted from using that release with the multiple issues that are present in it or any amount of controversial changes post release. Especially a price increase at the beginning of the update life-cycle, which happens to be before issues in that release will be sorted out and before many users have made the choice to upgrade. A happy user keeps coming back, their expectations of a product are constantly surpassed; they are engaged and that will translate to constantly looking to improve the product. Users are not responsible for the happiness of any RS staff, however as they are human and adults they should expect and be able to deal with any amount of negativity; the company they work for has a duty of care for their employees.

Just a note on the Apple thing. Apple primarily makes their money off hardware: phones, computers...etc... Actually so do many of the big DAW makers. Avid and Presonus are hardware companies, Cubase is owned by a hardware company (Yamaha). Even still Logic is the only one with the $200 one time price aside from FL studio's mysterious way of making that happen.

I'll say right now the new price sounds crazy considering the current stat of R12. That may very much change in the coming months though. It's to be seen. James' post is fairly inspiring.