are we going to see more perpetual versions ?

[crimsonwarlock]

Well we all have our own opinions.

Opinions indeed.

You seem to want to shoot me down for everything I say so I'll just STFU.

So why is giving my opinion somehow "shoot you down"

I'll stay out of your way from now on

[Jagwah]

Well we all have our own opinions.

Opinions indeed.

You seem to want to shoot me down for everything I say so I'll just STFU.

So why is giving my opinion somehow "shoot you down"

I'll stay out of your way from now on

Felt like you were going out of your way to constantly disagree which can become annoying then I say something in anger which I regret hence the modified comment.

[EnochLight]

Mod note: EASY PEOPLE - everyone take a breath - it's all good!

That out of the way, we all know the current DAW is being worked on right now as this thread progresses - Reason Studios very publicly stated that VST3 is being actively worked on (and we'll very likely see it before the end of 2022). As for perpetual vs. sub, all I can say is:



Which, we do. And whether $20 USD/month is worth it is absolutely relative. To some, that's an insane amount of money. To others, it's absolutely spare change. I'm willing to wager that Reason Studios will never go 100% sub only, but it's always fun to see this subject pop up again now and then.

[kitekrazy]

Music, on the other hand, is one of the most expensive hobbies. Maybe the most expensive of all for the average person.

Music can be an expensive hobby, if you think you need expensive stuff. I've used only free plugins together with a Reaper license that cost me about 50 euros back then (and it still works fine). I would say that's pretty cheap. Of course, you need a computer, but you can use that for more than just making music. Even a one-time purchase of a Reason perpetual license is doable in the scenario that I gave (year-end bonus, etc.). I still won't call that expensive.

It gets expensive when you start paying monthly recurring sums of money, no matter how little it seems at a time.

With R+, however, I'm still on the fence. $20/mo is a bit too committal and makes me start considering the alternatives (EWQL, Presonus Sphere).

To put this into perspective, $20 was about a week of groceries to me, only a few years back.

If I had any DAW type subscription I would probably cancel them because of the current economy.

There seems to be no end to the "sub only" pandemic. There are way too many alternate choices out there. The sub model has been out there for a long time. Sure it works for Adobe since people like to take pictures but DAW users are a minority.

[avasopht]

If I had any DAW type subscription I would probably cancel them because of the current economy.

There seems to be no end to the "sub only" pandemic. There are way too many alternate choices out there. The sub model has been out there for a long time. Sure it works for Adobe since people like to take pictures but DAW users are a minority.

Adobe works because for £50/mo you get access to the software you will use to earn more than that each day. And that's if you choose to go for the all-packages subscription. When you're freelancing, it's a no-brainer to pay for your tools, because not paying for them will pretty much guarantee you won't be able to pay for them

There are cheaper ones that give you a bundle that will cover a particular use case (e.g. video editing/compositing, photo manipulation/illustration).

Music making, however, is largely unrewarded. It's only a tiny minority of music makers who are able to make a living from it. And once you've got a good enough set of instruments and effects, there is no immediate need to stay up to date. With the right toolset, you could easily go 10-20 years without another purchase and still be pretty current. Obviously trends will change, but you should be able to tweak your sounds and construct your own effects stacks (especially with modular environments).

[crimsonwarlock]

With the right toolset, you could easily go 10-20 years without another purchase and still be pretty current.

^^^ This

[EnochLight]

To put this into perspective, $20 was about a week of groceries to me, only a few years back.

To put this further into perspective, $20 hasn't been a week's worth of groceries in the US for most people since the 1970's. I mean, unless you're super fond of living off of instant-Ramen.

[Termigator]

To put this into perspective, $20 was about a week of groceries to me, only a few years back.

To put this further into perspective, $20 hasn't been a week's worth of groceries in the US for most people since the 1970's. I mean, unless you're super fond of living off of instant-Ramen.

in england it’s £20 which is 22 and a half dollars

you could actually get a week of groceries
if you got a bag of chips ( fries )
70p
reduced bread 10p a loaf
cheap pizzas 80p
bag of sausages £1

trouble is it’s all crap food but u can live cheap if you need

problem here in uk atm is everything is going up

power ( electric is so bad more than double

and everyone is putting up everything

and they blame the russia ukraine war which is a load of shit because these companies make billions each year

so yeah £20 doesn’t get you a lot these days

but with how expensive everything is lately

it’s goes towards a better bigger shop ( grocery )

why don’t they offer reason rent to own ?

how are bitwig and ableton surviving and cubase and logic ( no forget logic there mega rich )
but how they all surviving without subs

reason is silly really they could have ironed out all the problems with the daw added some extra sounds like orchestral and stuff some good effects
made it up to par with logic and it could be top now

sounds wise it comes with the most stuff
could
just do with a few more professinal effects and some
of these reason devices should have been added in

i always come
back to reason i’ve tried to leave but it’s just a cool program

[kitekrazy]

To put this into perspective, $20 was about a week of groceries to me, only a few years back.

To put this further into perspective, $20 hasn't been a week's worth of groceries in the US for most people since the 1970's. I mean, unless you're super fond of living off of instant-Ramen.

I've done it with $25 just a couple years ago and on a diabetic diet. This was when 18 eggs were under $3. When you buy meats they are spread out over weeks. I live where produce is not expensive.

I've gained so much DAW stuff over the years and have plugins, synths, Kontakt libraries hardly touched. I have DAWs that I rarely open. Most DAW purchases are now luxury items. I don't even buy the under $10 items anymore.

With a DAW like Reason which is one of those DAWs I don't really use, with VSTs and getting the 10 Studio with all of those REs, it's an overwhelming piece of software.

Maybe now I may reach contentment. I doubt it.

[Propellerhands]

After this recent debacle with Bitwig and Spectral Suite, I think Reason Studios should merge with Bitwig Studios get it?

Oh man I missed Reason for so long, stopped following their updates around 2010 or something when they released Record. My only thought was "why?". And then I just closed my bedroom's door and continued on making music. This sense of entitlement of people only quadrupled over a decade and now people demand everything for free and here and right now.

A bit of a rant, but I am just happy Reason is still alive and kicking. Having secondary DAW which I can easily switch to if something bad happened to perpetual licenses is also a good thing. But being an optimistic person, I do not think it will happen any time soon, which I said before in this forum.

[EnochLight]

TL;DR

i always come
back to reason i’ve tried to leave but it’s just a cool program

I've done it with $25 just a couple years ago and on a diabetic diet.

No clue where you live, but where I live there is no way - not even a couple of years ago - that I could buy 7 days worth of groceries and support a diabetic's diet on $25 USD. But glad you were able to make it work!

But I guess this just all illustrates my point - some people feel the (regular priced) $20 USD/month subscription cost is way too high. Others look at $20 as disposable income and a mere drop in the wallet. It's all relative. I'm not here to debate whether subscriptions are bad (or "greedy"? ); I see a use for a choice, and subs is merely one avenue. Myself, I prefer perpetual licenses, but I also pay for plenty of subscriptions. The market decides, and I roll with the choices.

[Termigator]

TL;DR

i always come
back to reason i’ve tried to leave but it’s just a cool program

I've done it with $25 just a couple years ago and on a diabetic diet.

No clue where you live, but where I live there is no way - not even a couple of years ago - that I could buy 7 days worth of groceries and support a diabetic's diet on $25 USD. But glad you were able to make it work!

But I guess this just all illustrates my point - some people feel the (regular priced) $20 USD/month subscription cost is way too high. Others look at $20 as disposable income and a mere drop in the wallet. It's all relative. I'm not here to debate whether subscriptions are bad (or "greedy"? ); I see a use for a choice, and subs is merely one avenue. Myself, I prefer perpetual licenses, but I also pay for plenty of subscriptions. The market decides, and I roll with the choices.

i dont mind subs as long as theres a choice but i think there should also be a choice to rent to own perpetual versions and upgrades
loads of different ways of income to suit
noy just try force one way the most if you get what i mean

[pushedbutton]

The company I work for will not entertain any subscription models, no matter how beneficial the product is.
We're on Suite 11 at the moment because I couldn't justify the upgrade to 12 to them.
Personally I live like this too. I reluctantly got a decent car on finance but I will eventually own that outright, I have an Amazon prime subscription because it's cheaper than paying the postage every time I order something and a £10 a month rolling phone contract because I'm constantly using data. I'd rather save for stuff I get to keep, not have to keep paying.

[avasopht]

in england it’s £20 which is 22 and a half dollars

you could actually get a week of groceries
if you got a bag of chips ( fries )
70p
reduced bread 10p a loaf
cheap pizzas 80p
bag of sausages £1

Challenge accepted.

A healthy diet for £20/week (including 4x days of whole-avocado and an apple a day)

Base carbohydrates, fibre + nutrients (£4.70)

£2 - 2x tin of baked beans 2x other tin = 1 week of fibre and stuff (you can throw in the odd can of something like chic peas, butter beans, etc).
£2.70 - 2x boil in the bag rice.

Meat/core vitamins, etc. (£8.70)
£4.10 - 3x supermarket brand mackerel, 1x King Oscar's Oscar in Olive Oil (gotta have quality at least once a week).
£0.60 - 1x Tinned sardines
£4 - 6x British lamb mint kebabs

Veg (£6.55)
£1.50 - Frozen veg medley
£2.55 - 4x Ripe & Ready avocados
£2.50 - 6x Pink lady apples

Grand Total: £19.95

You can mix things up quite a bit for variety, but this diet will have you vastly healthier than most.

Sometimes try things like broccoli (including lots of the stem) or red cabbage (and a lot of it). They are uber brilliant. Dark mushrooms are also brilliant, and a good source of vitamin D (as are the fish).

[ltbrunt00]

having reason as a plugin has been great but I want the capability to easily output information natively into my other DAW software than the current method.

I also want Reason to become a DAW with all the pro features found in Nuendo, Cubase and now Studio One. As much as I use other DAW software I can never match the speed at making new music from scratch as I do in Reason. If Reason were to go plugin only I hope their players and ARP8 allow easy drag and drop midi from the rack plugin.

Could there be some consolidation in the DAW market? Could we see different DAW software merging into other products? I would love to have Studio One merged with reason using reasons SSL mixer as a option.

[Termigator]

i think
they should separate them into seperate products
ie daw £149 and rrp £199 with all instruments

and £80 for an upgrade

and carry on doing £19.99 a month

or £19.99 a month rent to own

i think the daws should that much

and id sell loads of extra instruments and more updates

but man they could have really got that daw up to scratch

even the quail geezer is doing a daw himself and it has vst3 lol

[EnochLight]

My eyes hurt.