it is here, go look at Props website now !!!!!!!!!

[dmcghee]

I mention Discover to some of my friends that use other Daw's, and now they are giving Reason a serious look.

Is this to guys who thought that a particular DAW would would give them an edge and practically the music would just fly out of their computers? 

But only to find out that they have only made 4 bar loops in all their years of using a multitude of DAWs.

And that if they upload all their unfinished symphonies (loops) that someone else will finish it off for them?

Yes, I think there might be a market for that...

First, Figure has 2, 4 and 8 bars to work with. Second, you can compose an entire song in Reason 8.1 load the song in Take. Take has a stereo track of the song plus three tracks to work with. You can import those tracks back into Reason 8.1. All that's needed is an iPhone or iPad and a set of earbuds or headphones to use Take. It is not a matter of having an edge over any particular DAW, it's a way to collaborate with others even if they don't own Reason.

Now to answer your question, the people I'm referring to are musicians that play real instruments.
They write songs not beats, and see the potential of Reason as a DAW and Propellerhead apps in a ecosystem just like OSX Yosemite and iOS.

[dboy18]

I used to think that the Propellerheads Website was one of the best i had ever seen: Beautifully designed with a lot of information occupying small space; guiding your eye; nice looking and very ergonomic for lack of a better word. This is more or less the opposite, I´m sad to say. I get that this is more modern and what a lot of sites are going for at the moment, but: It also contains everything I, personally, disagree with in modern sites (including apple) a lot of scrolling to get to the info you want; massive pictures and little info and little or no thought for how your eye should be guided: an example: Look at the "info on instruments in Reason"; When I open this page on my 13" macbook air, I can see a total of one (!) entry -synths and the picture of thor is truncated; to see more I have to scroll, and scroll and scroll. And now I see that every other device is placed on the right, every other on the left; nice as a picture, I guess, but totally ruining my reading experience. It´s very hard to really -at a glance- see what devices reason really includes. Their page used to be one of the webpages I checked most  of all; now I almost want to leave when I see it...strange

[zeebot]

As far as I'm concerned, the new site is fine, nothing to lose sleep over. I can see where they are trying to go with it and kudos to PH for trying. We all don't agree with it, but heck, I'm glad they are taking risk. And as far as the forum being shut down, that's been great for me, I've been able to get more production done which is good because I spent way too much time on the damn forum - which had become a freaking soap-opera (which was very entertaining for me), but this place so far is perfect for me. When I need my Reason community I peep in for a few and then back to work!

So godspeed to the new site PH!

I'm not so much angry with them more disappointed with the direction they have chosen and the way they have taken it. All I can see for Discover are lots and lots of issues with poorer and poorer content. I also don't like being treated like the lowest common denominator. 
It would take a significant groundbreaking upgrade, a RE that blows everything else out of the water or Reason on the iPad for me to buy back into the fold.
Like I said I'm fine with 7.1 and am thankful that props created it but I just cant continue blindly paying for stuff I don't need and would not use. 

[rvman]

This thread is like the official PH thread that just shut down.

[doinky]

Oh my goodness, you guys are still on about this.  In the time that you've done these 170 complaints, I wrote a new song, posted it on Discover and in the new Music Forum here, got two great critiques from eusti and selig, reworked the song, and posted it onto Discover:

http://phead.mu/s/6PRUlNeP

Any critiques greatly appreciated.  In the music Forum.

How many songs are playing in all this? It sounds like the radio when you can't tune into one station and you get multiple songs playing. And why post it on discover? What's that to any other sound posting site? I'm so confused by this post.

[doinky]

This thread is like the official PH thread that just shut down.

Yes you can run, but if you piss off enough 'friends' they will gather into a storm. I think we all know by now what upsets and what doesn't. Remember the prop forum was never ever this bad until the props stepped into Reason 8. From there it's been a storm of split discontent among members for and against prop moves of late.

[Namahs Amrak]

How many songs are playing in all this? It sounds like the radio when you can't tune into one station and you get multiple songs playing. And why post it on discover? What's that to any other sound posting site? I'm so confused by this post.

There's an idea. Download every discover clip on the server and stick them all together.

It's bad form to criticize another man's music, though. We all have varying skills, and the main thing is that we love what we do. It isn't a quest for a #1 song for most of us.

[Exowildebeest]

How many songs are playing in all this? It sounds like the radio when you can't tune into one station and you get multiple songs playing. And why post it on discover? What's that to any other sound posting site? I'm so confused by this post.

There's an idea. Download every discover clip on the server and stick them all together.

Better yet, layer them all on top of each other. Disregard clipping.

[jfrichards]

... I'm so confused by this post.

When you are in 8.1, there is a little button next to the CPU use bars.  When you press the button, it asks if you want to upload your song or loop onto the Discover site, and if you want it public or private.  When you hit upload, it sends an mp3 type file into the Discover server.  You can then copy the song link to use as you please.  This is similar to the SoundClick site.  When you go onto the Discover site and song, you can listen to it, or download it into Reason 8.1, or download it into Take on an iPhone or iPad for listening or adding to or editing.  The ease and speed of it makes it more useful than Soundcloud for having someone just listen to it, and SoundCloud costs money, while Discover and Take are free.  For people just on the iPhone, you can upload a Figure thing onto Discover, download it into Take, and add vocals and live instruments.  Discover is in beta and taking suggestions on how to subdivide the posted songs, and what formats it will accept, etc.  It's not going to replace DropBox unless it allows quick wav stem exchange.  I could see them adding that as a paid service.

[Raveshaper]

I believe that they blew it big time and that they can only flail and look uncertain about their direction from here until they inexorably falter completely. But, it's up to each of us to decide whether to beat a dead horse or to accept the mistake and get on with making music with our preferred platform while we still can. My last contribution on the topic is the following:

N-I have been running an artist feature on Carl Cox since the start of the year, and now Ableton is running its own version of an artist feature about Afrikan Sciences. Steinberg has a section of their site dedicated to artists that is visible in the header and an artist interview with Gibson Kagni in the bottom center of the front page. Cakewalk Sonar has a subsection for "artists using Cakewalk products" in its header and this is book ended by "Cakewalk Artists" in the footer. Apple has chosen to focus on the software rather than the users in their presentation of Logic.

My point is that even if current events are stacking up like a random jackpot on a slot machine and this situation in which we find ourselves was not planned in response to the outcry over the PUF (and I believe it was not), it makes PH look pretty bad IMHO. As I said on the PUF, this was a huge mistake. If they go forward without addressing it, they look callous toward their loyal customers (too late). If they capitulate and go back on the decision, they look disorganized and out of touch with where their bread and butter comes from. Ultimately, if they are pushing mobile apps to the front and giving lip service to R8 in the background, they risk imploding their flagship product and alienating their user base. Oops...

The prevailing angle in the marketing campaigns of the competition clearly, confidently, and quietly demonstrate that there is blood in the water. What the other big names are doing goes far beyond still having their user forums intact -- in addition to all the social channels that PH is pushing -- and ascends into the rarefied atmosphere of showcasing working artists who swear by their products as a way of showing gratitude for loyalty, among other things. I often wonder if Reason actually is a platform that "amplifies creativity" as PH claims it does. If that claim is true, we should be seeing an enormous artist showcase of pro level die-hard Reason users that rivals the pantheons displayed by other DAW companies. Instead, we're a rare breed. Is that a fundamental flaw in the software or is that due to marketing blunders? I'm getting off track here, but I'm simply curious: what is the root source of Reason's vestigial market share? I have used Reason ever since R3 and I can't answer that question. To me, that's a whole new dimension to the problem in itself, but let's get back to my point.

The new site is up and the comparison is clear. User forum deletion, teenager-friendly mobile apps, and a site that buries the flagship DAW product at PH; artist articles, free patches full of requested features for existing customers, and innovative features in their flagship DAW products front and center at nearly every other DAW manufacturer.

Take that as you will, I've said my peace when it comes to beating the dead horse.

[Buddaka]

The PH site now looks soulless and spiritless, if that makes sense. 

[Noplan]

It is really a bit scary to think that people will be making mediocre recordings on their tiny phone microphones as part of this process, and I wonder what is the point of sharing this stuff if people just take it probably without crediting everyone along the way...

Apple Fan Boy Argument #1

Propellerhead Software Actually, the iPhone mic is surprisingly good! Way better than many mics used on older recordings. Here's an example from Discover: http://phead.mu/s/ulSn7bhh

[jappe]

...Ryan, Mattias, Ludvig and the rest of those guys are just doing their jobs and they might feel exactly the same way that we do about all of this.

It's very possible PH employees are just going along with it hesitantly, maybe even more worried than us- knowing future plans and all. One thing's for sure-
Ernst has gone MAD! :t1465:

It's not uncommon for people working with technique looking at the marketing department and their sometimes insane ideas as an enemy and threat to any company.
Technique companies should be technique driven.

OnT: The site is very good for visually disabled.  For me though, it's scrolling galore, ugly and anonymous first impression.
I'm fine with "Mobile First" - as long as I can can change to the desktop version (like in this great forum).

[ryanharlin]

Hey guys... I'm confused because I see my name throughout this thread but I can't figure out the original comment. Is the Ryan you're talking about me? What did I do that was spineless?

And are we talking about my previous career as a fluffer or something? What's all this fluffernutter spineless chatter?

Also, yes I'm on this forum...

Also, you don't have to be extra polite to me but I would hope you're as polite to EVERYONE as can be. It's just basic human decency. Then again, anonymous internet forums ≠ basic human decency.

[Namahs Amrak]

Hey guys... I'm confused because I see my name throughout this thread but I can't figure out the original comment. Is the Ryan you're talking about me? What did I do that was spineless?

And are we talking about my previous career as a fluffer or something? What's all this fluffernutter spineless chatter?

Also, yes I'm on this forum...

Also, you don't have to be extra polite to me but I would hope you're as polite to EVERYONE as can be. It's just basic human decency. Then again, anonymous internet forums ≠ basic human decency.

Your first mistake is being too handsome.

[avasopht]

When people are saying they're doing lip service to reason they're forgetting many things.

Maybe their homepage will target reason on the next reason upgrade. Maybe enough users have upgraded indicating there will be little need for reason to appear on the main page. Maybe discover will develop into something indispensable for reason users.

There are issues with r8 that need addressing, I'm waiting to see what they do with that.

[Flandersh]

I have a tough time sleeping now because I worry when I wake up everybody is going to be at each other's throats and this place will have fallen into chaos due to differences in opinion. I have never run a forum before but I am determined to succeed where Propellerheads threw in the towel, and I would love it if you guys would be willing to work with me on that. I know that people are going to get into tiffs here and there because I have gotten into plenty of my own on the PUF

As an old moderator of reasonstation I think it has much to do with what standards one set on moderating. We allowed flame wars on reasonstation and was so in control of it too. Our task was more about hunting trolls than stopping polemics and discussions with a factual main content that could sometimes be a bit emotional.

what I don't want is people here fighting each other because of the decisions that Propellerheads have made.

So what is wrong with discussing such decisions? Is it not more the possible immature responses than the content whom is at stake and may turn a bit wild? Had Theodor Adorno lived and been a Reason user I find it possible that he would have engaged in this topic as well, so.

[Flandersh]

Serious question: if one calls themself a "Reason Expert" and hosts an entire website promoting themself, shouldn't one be on the latest version of said software and learn all aspects of it?

I do not think so. An expert in the academic sense does not need to be about all the aspects of the field the person is expert in so. But for clarity it would be better if one denote oneself as in example "Reason 4 Expert" or "Reason 8 Expert".

[avasopht]

There's a big difference between discussing and juvenile fighting.

[tiker01]

What's next? A record label? Propellerhead Records? LOL whilst Reason is long forgotten by then.

ProTools and Blend did it. Why not?

Oh they already did it just has to be Discovered. 

[Flandersh]

There's a big difference between discussing and juvenile fighting.

At what point is the difference? When does a discussion become a juvenile fighting? And when does a polemic become juvenile? 

From a scientifical perspective, a disposition could have been started with the problem "What lies behind the decisions of Propellerhead?" And then a naturally discussion of this problem would be the way of pro et contra. In a most formal way this discussion would be very rhetorical, but there is nothing to prevent it from consisting of phrases like Schopenhauer used against Goethe when he called Goethe a dilettante (Schopenhauer, 1997). So it is both important, and very interesting from the stance of methodology, to reflect and question the border between discussion and juvenile fighting.

Bibliography:
Schopenhauer, A. (1997). Om det gode og det slette: Fra Parerga og paralipomena. Oslo: Pax Forlag A/S.

[CharlyCharlzz]

There is no point in droping our anger here , I loved the forum and it's gone ..... end of the story !

there new website is great to promote there apps so yhea maybe they will only promo there apps for some time because they are going to take some masrket and they need it !

are they are going to drop Reason .... NO !

do they just made themself space to get some fresh Air.... Yes !

if you want a great Reason then you dont want a upgrade every 6 months , you want them to be prosper and to make money with there products , this way you know they will have more resources to work on what you want them to work on wich in Reason .

I am in a total wild guess here but I think they made the right choice to do apps that can hook up with Reason , also it is now this must be done and not in 5 years when Reason will work on full mod into a poor phone (yhea I know graphic work needed to see )

insted of reading 200 post 's of just disslikes I rather read 3 or 4 on what users expect insted so things can be constructive rather then emotional

[EnochLight]

Serious question: if one calls themself a "Reason Expert" and hosts an entire website promoting themself, shouldn't one be on the latest version of said software and learn all aspects of it?

I do not think so. An expert in the academic sense does not need to be about all the aspects of the field the person is expert in so. But for clarity it would be better if one denote oneself as in example "Reason 4 Expert" or "Reason 8 Expert".

That's a great idea, and I totally agree.  Someone should pass that along to Hydlide.  

[Janvier]

The smallest feature you add on something cost money, right now they probably have a lot of cash going to website, discover, RE SDK, maybe new RE,
Reason itself, maybe recycle and/or apps. 
1.If you want to improve your product you need to increase your revenue.
2.If you want to increase your revenue you need to get new customers and keep those you already have.
3.If you want new customer you need to offer new product and/or new service.
4.If you want these, you need more employees.
5.To get more employees you need more revenue
6.And go back to 1.

So what does it means???
Probably that props is growing... Faster than before.

Ok, and ???
I think they are finding ways (discover, REs, mobile apps, website revamp) to increase their revenue (which is obvious)...

Ok, then what ???
Thus maybe we should expect big improvement about Reason and the RE SDK. 

Like most of the comment in here, I don't feel really comfortable with the new website... But it is clear that actually it has been rushed. So, will
see how Props is planning their future.

[jfrichards]

Serious question: if one calls themself a "Reason Expert" and hosts an entire website promoting themself, shouldn't one be on the latest version of said software and learn all aspects of it?

I do not think so. An expert in the academic sense does not need to be about all the aspects of the field the person is expert in so. But for clarity it would be better if one denote oneself as in example "Reason 4 Expert" or "Reason 8 Expert".

That's a great idea, and I totally agree.  Someone should pass that along to Hydlide.  

Ed is on 8.  He tries to do things that all version users can use.