Reason 12 is coming!

[Creativemind]

There's 8 CV ins.

2 in the Sequencer Control section, the 4 rotary's and 1 each for the Mod Wheels and Pitch Bend. If it is a 25% increase, that's 8 to 10 lol!

it was a joke—no need for so much analysis.

Yes, I gathered after I'd posted it.

[joeyluck]

I'm only pointing out that nobody is buying R12 right now.

Those who bought R11 prior, have had it to use, up to nearly 2 years if they bought it when it was released. The same arguments are made when somebody waits months or years to buy plugins. Most everything will go on sale eventually, and if you decide if you want to wait, you go all that time without it. If the argument is about software collection rather than use, that would make more sense I guess.

If everybody really wants a similar deal, you can wait until maybe the summer of 2023 before you buy R12 so you can save $30 and get a free upgrade to R13.

But again, I'm certainly not arguing against them doing an offer for R11 users. But the point being is they aren't currently selling R12 directly to anybody right now. We'll have to wait until R12 is a product for sale and then hope for deals. For them to sell any of us R12 today at any price, merely on a teaser, would be wrong IMO.

People in this thread have literally said they are not even installing 11 , they are buying 12. The details are not confirmed but It's not a massive shot in the dark to presume being on the latest version is probably better than not.

The time I have spent using 11 already is time I have paid for! So I pay for the 11 update and then I have to pay for the 12 update full price. But If I didn't do that already I could pay less than one upgrade for 2 upgrades!

And to be clear , I don't even mind doing this but I can clearly point out that it is a poor deal. Don't know why you are twisting knots to make out it isn't.

I'm not though. It is what it is for now. Regardless of people's reasons for upgrading to R11 today, they are buying R11. On paper, if they aren't happy with R12 not having seen it, it doesn't matter, because they bought R11.

Here's how I would guess it went down. RS gears up for May Madness... They want to put R11 on sale, but they know R12 is months away. Who would buy R11 so late in the game regardless of price if they feel R12 is right around the corner? Very few or maybe nobody. So then they probably decided to tag on the upgrade to R12 later, to sell more R11 licenses today.

The waiting for a sale or not waiting and putting software to use is something people need to decide for themselves every time. I only landed in a grace period once when I upgraded to Reason 5/Record after Reason 6 was announced. And Reason 6 was pay what you will anyways lol. So from then on I decided that if I upgrade early, I won't find myself again waiting just in case of an announcement and grace period. I won't find myself worried about what deal I missed because I could've been putting the latest version to use for a couple years.

[Billy+]

I've always brought Reason version on release never worried about discounts and the last few versions have been purchased direct from RS as digital download, but things have definitely changed for me. I'm definitely not jumping into buying 12 and I'm definitely going to look for a 3rd party deal when I do but I'm going to watch and wait until I see features that interest me from now on.

I'm more than happy with V11 suite and having the ability to use it as RRP so I might just wait until the newer macs are natively supported and subscribe to + while leaving my current mac running V11.

[Popey]

People in this thread have literally said they are not even installing 11 , they are buying 12. The details are not confirmed but It's not a massive shot in the dark to presume being on the latest version is probably better than not.

The time I have spent using 11 already is time I have paid for! So I pay for the 11 update and then I have to pay for the 12 update full price. But If I didn't do that already I could pay less than one upgrade for 2 upgrades!

And to be clear , I don't even mind doing this but I can clearly point out that it is a poor deal. Don't know why you are twisting knots to make out it isn't.

I'm not though. It is what it is for now. Regardless of people's reasons for upgrading to R11 today, they are buying R11. On paper, if they aren't happy with R12 not having seen it, it doesn't matter, because they bought R11.

Here's how I would guess it went down. RS gears up for May Madness... They want to put R11 on sale, but they know R12 is months away. Who would buy R11 so late in the game regardless of price if they feel R12 is right around the corner? Very few or maybe nobody. So then they probably decided to tag on the upgrade to R12 later, to sell more R11 licenses today.

The waiting for a sale or not waiting and putting software to use is something people need to decide for themselves every time. I only landed in a grace period once when I upgraded to Reason 5/Record after Reason 6 was announced. And Reason 6 was pay what you will anyways lol. So from then on I decided that if I upgrade early, I won't find myself again waiting just in case of an announcement and grace period. I won't find myself worried about what deal I missed because I could've been putting the latest version to use for a couple years.

Valid points on both sides however surely the crux of the matter is that if the upgrade is £129 in september from all versions then 11 users have not had opportunity to upgrade to 12 at the sale price when others have. Yes they would be buying into the unknown to a certain point but it is their choice. Right now it is not a choice they are being offered or available to them.

Imo it's a mute point until we find out in September what it costs. Reason may introduce tiered system or it may just be $90 anyway (or cheaper although unlikely). In September we can either go to the shed for our pitchforks or not as the case may be

[MrFigg]

Next pain in the arse is I'm now going to have to Authorize my PC because I can't put my license on Balance any more.

[BananaSkins]

Balance R.I.P

[joeyluck]

I'm not though. It is what it is for now. Regardless of people's reasons for upgrading to R11 today, they are buying R11. On paper, if they aren't happy with R12 not having seen it, it doesn't matter, because they bought R11.

Here's how I would guess it went down. RS gears up for May Madness... They want to put R11 on sale, but they know R12 is months away. Who would buy R11 so late in the game regardless of price if they feel R12 is right around the corner? Very few or maybe nobody. So then they probably decided to tag on the upgrade to R12 later, to sell more R11 licenses today.

The waiting for a sale or not waiting and putting software to use is something people need to decide for themselves every time. I only landed in a grace period once when I upgraded to Reason 5/Record after Reason 6 was announced. And Reason 6 was pay what you will anyways lol. So from then on I decided that if I upgrade early, I won't find myself again waiting just in case of an announcement and grace period. I won't find myself worried about what deal I missed because I could've been putting the latest version to use for a couple years.

Valid points on both sides however surely the crux of the matter is that if the upgrade is £129 in september from all versions then 11 users have not had opportunity to upgrade to 12 at the sale price when others have. Yes they would be buying into the unknown to a certain point but it is their choice. Right now it is not a choice they are being offered or available to them.

Imo it's a mute point until we find out in September what it costs. Reason may introduce tiered system or it may just be $90 anyway (or cheaper although unlikely). In September we can either go to the shed for our pitchforks or not as the case may be

Yeah it's one of those things that we have to wait and see. And again, it's not necessarily about a R12 sale price yet when they aren't selling anybody R12 today. People are buying R11 at a discount and it's within a grace period to get R12 later. It's a great deal for sure for those who didn't need R11 for the past couple years.

If they wanted to give people the opportunity to make rather blind purchases, we would have a R12 upgrade preorder available today for at least $129, but we don't even have that. Aside from them having to finish developing R12, there is perhaps more that needs to be finished on the business side with legal and sales, etc. before it's even ready to be sold as a product on its own.

[EdGrip]

It goes without saying, I think, that Reason is always backwards compatible - you can always open your old projects and your old patches. There's not going to be a new combinator that breaks all your old combinators if you upgrade.

[PhillipOrdonez]

Not gonna lie. I'm salty the upgrade discount isn't available for us on 11. Live 11 was announced like in November and then released in February I think, and the upgrade price was discounted. I was on 10 and jumped on it. I wish I could do the same right now. ‍♂️

Well the situation here is that those upgrading for $90 (or $80) are coming from earlier versions, so they are paying to get R11...They are only receiving an upgrade to R12 later, but ultimately their money is going towards buying R11. For RS to offer R12 for purchase to you now, you would be buying it pretty much in the dark. They gave us bullet points and a pretty vague teaser. And even at a discount, that puts the customer and RS in a tough situation because you may not like R12. The customer who upgrades today to R11, if they are disappointed in R12...well they bought R11, a product they could see and try.

I haven't paid attention to how Ableton does it, but perhaps they give you a little more to go on when preordering instead of just bullet points? I'm sure RS wouldn't be against the idea of selling R12 ahead of time, but my guess is they want the customer to see more of it before making that decision. Otherwise aside from a sale price, they'd be selling you R12 upgrade today for $129.

Live announced the new version like 3 or 4 months before release? and us in 10 (no clue those in previous versions too) were able to pre purchase the upgrade with a discount. They didn't even charge our cards until release day. That's how they did it, and it was fine, although I wanted them to charge my card on the spot but they wouldn't

[plaamook]

Cross fades are great. Smooth implementation. Had to wait ages for em too.
Sweeper is interesting as well.

If you've got it you may as well install it. It wasn't worth the price of an upgrade without any interesting point upgrades in the mix but what's there isn't shit.

Think that was all I got out of it in the end. Automation curves, x-fades, Sweeper. A half assed zoom tweak, or was that in 10? I can't remember.

Half assed automation curves and crossfades too imo. Only 1 curve, Reaper has 5 + linear and I bet most of the other daw's do and only 1 crossfade fype and no vertical allignment.

It’s Reason. Everything in its sequencer, even if just implemented, could be better. It’s infuriating.
But I do a lot of audio editing and for me the x fades just kinda do their thing.
If I want more nuance I just do em the old fashioned way.
We’re all masters of the work around here after all, right?

[strange_scenery]

It goes without saying, I think, that Reason is always backwards compatible - you can always open your old projects and your old patches. There's not going to be a new combinator that breaks all your old combinators if you upgrade.

I think the worry is not that upgrading will break anything, but that if you are a refill or patch designer and you create a patch in Reason 12 with a combinator, people using Reason 11 or below won't be able to open it.

[joeyluck]

Well the situation here is that those upgrading for $90 (or $80) are coming from earlier versions, so they are paying to get R11...They are only receiving an upgrade to R12 later, but ultimately their money is going towards buying R11. For RS to offer R12 for purchase to you now, you would be buying it pretty much in the dark. They gave us bullet points and a pretty vague teaser. And even at a discount, that puts the customer and RS in a tough situation because you may not like R12. The customer who upgrades today to R11, if they are disappointed in R12...well they bought R11, a product they could see and try.

I haven't paid attention to how Ableton does it, but perhaps they give you a little more to go on when preordering instead of just bullet points? I'm sure RS wouldn't be against the idea of selling R12 ahead of time, but my guess is they want the customer to see more of it before making that decision. Otherwise aside from a sale price, they'd be selling you R12 upgrade today for $129.

Live announced the new version like 3 or 4 months before release? and us in 10 (no clue those in previous versions too) were able to pre purchase the upgrade with a discount. They didn't even charge our cards until release day. That's how they did it, and it was fine, although I wanted them to charge my card on the spot but they wouldn't

Gotcha. Ok I see now.

So in November they released a handful of videos showing the new features. And then it was released in February. But all of these videos were ready to go in November:

That's quite a bit more than a blog entry for R12 and a short video showing animated representations of new features.

But maybe there could be a preorder later before September? If R+ users are getting their hands on some features as they become available, then that means the Reason community gets to see those features in use either by trialing R+ or checking out YouTube videos.

For now though, there isn't much shown of R12 aside from the graphics teaser and that still doesn't show us very much.

[strange_scenery]

If RS offered preorders for Reason 12 I can just imagine the doom and gloom around this forum. Comparisons to Cyberpunk 2077, proof that Reason 12 will be terrible and RS are evil capitalists trying to milk the rubes before the bad reviews roll in.

[plaamook]

It goes without saying, I think, that Reason is always backwards compatible - you can always open your old projects and your old patches. There's not going to be a new combinator that breaks all your old combinators if you upgrade.

I think the worry is not that upgrading will break anything, but that if you are a refill or patch designer and you create a patch in Reason 12 with a combinator, people using Reason 11 or below won't be able to open it.

Yeah. Combi2.0 should have been parallel not replacement.
Only loss is a more cluttered drop down.

[joeyluck]

If RS offered preorders for Reason 12 I can just imagine the doom and gloom around this forum. Comparisons to Cyberpunk 2077, proof that Reason 12 will be terrible and RS are evil capitalists trying to milk the rubes before the bad reviews roll in.

Lol yep I could see that happening too. There will always be some negativity no matter what.

Start a presale before showing anything hands-on = claims made that they are evil capitalists being sneaky.
Put R11 on sale without including R12 = claims made they are taking advantage of people because R12 will be released soon.
Don't put R11 on sale = claims they don't care about selling perpetual licenses anymore and want everybody to subscribe to R+.

This is all just based on timing of the May Madness sale and when R12 will be released. I feel like they've made the best decision on what to do given the timeline. They announced a new version's release date earlier than usual to accommodate all of this. Here's hoping there's a discount offer for R11 users later, but we can also be happy for our community members who are getting a good deal and finally getting up to date

[QVprod]

I think the worry is not that upgrading will break anything, but that if you are a refill or patch designer and you create a patch in Reason 12 with a combinator, people using Reason 11 or below won't be able to open it.

Yeah. Combi2.0 should have been parallel not replacement.
Only loss is a more cluttered drop down.

Did anyone have any issues with the RV7000 update? I realize the concern, but I think it's a smaller issue than what's thought. New users will be on the new version, and old users who care about combinators will likely upgrade for the new features they've wanted since forever. It's to be seen but from the looks of it, the new combinator looks to be game changing.

[kitekrazy]

I still wish you could store RE data on a different drive like all of the other DAWs. Reason takes up the most OS space and no I don't want to mess with makelink. Still can't audition midi in the browser.

Will the new sampler be added on or replace the current ones? It would be interesting if it loaded SFZ formats.

[Heigen5]

It goes without saying, I think, that Reason is always backwards compatible - you can always open your old projects and your old patches. There's not going to be a new combinator that breaks all your old combinators if you upgrade.

I think the worry is not that upgrading will break anything, but that if you are a refill or patch designer and you create a patch in Reason 12 with a combinator, people using Reason 11 or below won't be able to open it.

That's why the people should upgrade then imo. I'm gonna start making new era sound-design from now on and if I'd want to sell stuff to R11 owners, I could always parallely use R11 to do so.

[Stamatz]

Will R12 includes such instruments as Friktion and Alogrithm?

[arnigretar]

have they ever removed any "stock" devices before? maybe those effects pedals from R6 if I remember correctly... then yes. but it will be kinda weird not to be able to open old combinations in R12.

You WILL be able to open old combi patches on the new Combinator. It will just be a Combinator with the old features but with loads of new functionality as well.

You obviously won't be able to open newly created combi patches created on the new version 12 Combinator in an older version of Reason as that Combinator won't exist.

Ah yeah, of course. then everything is all right back to the waiting game.

[Emian]

$80? I am seeing $90.

JRR Shop put the code FORUM in

Wow, thx for the tip. i was already on the fence, but the extra discount convinced me entirely, upgraded from Reason 10

Can we see anywhere on our Reason account the Reason 12 upgrade is included or is it going to go automatically ??

[MrFigg]

JRR Shop put the code FORUM in

Wow, thx for the tip. i was already on the fence, but the extra discount convinced me entirely, upgraded from Reason 10

Can we see anywhere on our Reason account the Reason 12 upgrade is included or is it going to go automatically ??

It’ll go automatically.

[Heigen5]

Yeah, sorry I misunderstood the question, but indeed, all the old combis open in the new one. Here's my mock-up that also had a backwards compatibility in mind:

https://reasonheads.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=170

[avasopht]

Should we start a sweepstake on whether we get an overhaul of the editor and timeline in Reason 12?

[EdGrip]

Will R12 includes such instruments as Friktion and Alogrithm?

Not unless you're a subscriber.