Roland System 8 Help: Only keys work, no knobs, sliders etc

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MidiControllerNW
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31 Dec 2022

Hi

I downloaded Reason 12 yesterday. I usually use the Roland System 8 hardware-synth (lots of knobs and sliders) for controlling soft-synths and VST synths, and this works well in Cubase.

But in Reason, I can only play the keys on the keybed. If I move any slider or turn any knob on the system 8, there are no responses on any of synths in Reason. This applies to both Reasons's own synths, and VST synths.

I can map each slider and knob on the synths in Reason to specific sliders and knobs on the System 8, (so there is undoubtely MIDI signals coming through from my System 8), but this is an extremely time consuming process that has to be repeated for every synth/track I create in Reason and each time I open Reason or a new project.

Every driver and firmware is up to date.

Please help. Thank you.

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EnochLight
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31 Dec 2022

/Mod note: moved this topic to the correct subforum. To the OP: I've got a System 8 but I've never used it as a MIDI controller (it's 100% standalone in my studio). Sorry!

That said, have you checked this?

https://rolandus.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/a ... al-Control

I don't think that answers your original question, but regardless - for the most part the System-8 works like any other MIDI controller in Reason via MIDI-CC. You have to set it up with a single synth and it's locked to that synth, I'm afraid. Unless you grab something like a Nektar T-series or P-series, that's how it will work.
Win 10 | Ableton Live 11 Suite |  Reason 12 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | RME Babyface Pro | Akai MPC Live 2 & Akai Force | Roland System 8, MX1, TB3 | Dreadbox Typhon | Korg Minilogue XD

MidiControllerNW
Posts: 9
Joined: 31 Dec 2022

31 Dec 2022

EnochLight wrote:
31 Dec 2022
/Mod note: moved this topic to the correct subforum. To the OP: I've got a System 8 but I've never used it as a MIDI controller (it's 100% standalone in my studio). Sorry!
I'm trying to controll the knobs and sliders on the Roland Cloud VST synths when opened in Reason, but that's just not possible. No problem in Cubase, why doesnt this work in Reason?

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jam-s
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31 Dec 2022

You will have to create a Remote map (and Codec) with the correct entries for this, I'm afraid. Resources on how to do this can be found here: https://developer.reasonstudios.com/dow ... r-products

MidiControllerNW
Posts: 9
Joined: 31 Dec 2022

31 Dec 2022

jam-s wrote:
31 Dec 2022
You will have to create a Remote map (and Codec) with the correct entries for this, I'm afraid. Resources on how to do this can be found here: https://developer.reasonstudios.com/dow ... r-products
With the roland cloud vst synths in Reason, there are no midi responses at all when pressing anything besides the keybed. Also not possible to midi-map anything at all with the vst synths in Reason.

When opening the roland cloud vst synths in cubase, there are already perfect matches between the knobs and sliders on the System 8 and the vst plugin.

This makes me think that there is something wrong in Reason. Surely, Reason is a well known DAW and should have support for controlling the vst synths parameters with a hardware synthesizer....

MidiControllerNW
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Joined: 31 Dec 2022

31 Dec 2022

Here is some other guy describing the same problem, almost two years ago: viewtopic.php?t=7521615


I cannot believe that it is not possible by default to controll the knobs and sliders on vst synths in reason with an external midi controller? Anyone?

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EnochLight
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31 Dec 2022

MidiControllerNW wrote:
31 Dec 2022
Here is some other guy describing the same problem, almost two years ago: viewtopic.php?t=7521615


I cannot believe that it is not possible by default to controll the knobs and sliders on vst synths in reason with an external midi controller? Anyone?
Wait - you’re just controlling Roland Cloud plugins? Those work fine on my Reason setup - when I get back to the studio, I’ll have a look. I’m out right now.
Win 10 | Ableton Live 11 Suite |  Reason 12 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | RME Babyface Pro | Akai MPC Live 2 & Akai Force | Roland System 8, MX1, TB3 | Dreadbox Typhon | Korg Minilogue XD

MidiControllerNW
Posts: 9
Joined: 31 Dec 2022

31 Dec 2022

EnochLight wrote:
31 Dec 2022

Wait - you’re just controlling Roland Cloud plugins? Those work fine on my Reason setup - when I get back to the studio, I’ll have a look. I’m out right now.
Yes, Roland cloud VST synths in Reason: I'm able to play/trigger notes from the VST synths in Reason through my system 8 hardware synth, but movement of sliders and knobs on the system 8 are not giving any response on the vst synths in Reason. I have tried different settings, both audio and midi.

In Cubase I can open a Roland cloud VST synth and start playing, and any movement on the system 8's sliders or knobs will imidieately give response, and everything corresponds perfectly. Why isnt this in Reason?

Yes, please check if you can control the Roland cloud vst synth's knobs/sliders in Reason through the system 8. Maybe it's some setting here I need to fix, hopefully...

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Pepin
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31 Dec 2022

From my testing in the past, I've found Reason only sends note and performance data (mod wheel, etc.) to VSTs. It doesn't send other CC data. This means features on some plugins like built-in MIDI learn don't work. You have to use Remote instead.

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EnochLight
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31 Dec 2022

MidiControllerNW wrote:
31 Dec 2022
Why isnt this in Reason?

Yes, please check if you can control the Roland cloud vst synth's knobs/sliders in Reason through the system 8. Maybe it's some setting here I need to fix, hopefully...
It works in Reason. But it’s New Years Eve and I’m out, so I’ll have to catch you up another day.
Win 10 | Ableton Live 11 Suite |  Reason 12 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | RME Babyface Pro | Akai MPC Live 2 & Akai Force | Roland System 8, MX1, TB3 | Dreadbox Typhon | Korg Minilogue XD

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dioxide
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01 Jan 2023

You will probably need to make a Remote codec for it unfortunately. I made one for the System 1. It might work a little for the System 8 as there is some crossover between the two, it's worth a try.

viewtopic.php?t=7502172

MidiControllerNW
Posts: 9
Joined: 31 Dec 2022

03 Jan 2023

Did you have time to test with your system 8 and the roland cloud vts synth in reason?
EnochLight wrote:
31 Dec 2022
MidiControllerNW wrote:
31 Dec 2022
Why isnt this in Reason?

Yes, please check if you can control the Roland cloud vst synth's knobs/sliders in Reason through the system 8. Maybe it's some setting here I need to fix, hopefully...
It works in Reason. But it’s New Years Eve and I’m out, so I’ll have to catch you up another day.

MidiControllerNW
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Joined: 31 Dec 2022

03 Jan 2023

Thank you, but I have no idea how this works...

The midi works perfect in Cubase, why not in Reason?

Can something be copied from Cubase to Reason?

dioxide wrote:
01 Jan 2023
You will probably need to make a Remote codec for it unfortunately. I made one for the System 1. It might work a little for the System 8 as there is some crossover between the two, it's worth a try.

viewtopic.php?t=7502172

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EnochLight
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03 Jan 2023

MidiControllerNW wrote:
03 Jan 2023
Did you have time to test with your system 8 and the roland cloud vts synth in reason?
Sorry - I'm still out of town for the holidays. But I think jam-s and dioxide are right - might have to create a Remote map for the System-8 instead. It's been a long time since I used my System-8 with Reason (I use a Nektar Panorama P4 instead).
MidiControllerNW wrote:
03 Jan 2023
The midi works perfect in Cubase, why not in Reason?
Because Reason has never treated MIDI the same as any other DAW (it uses a proprietary protocol called Remote for communication between hardware control surfaces and Reason). Has for almost 2 decades. I'm not saying this is optimal - clearly this creates its own set of issues like the one you're having. But if you create a Remote map for your controller, it works. Otherwise it just works as a generic MIDI controller with limited functions. Read more here:

https://reasonstudios.com/blog/tutorial ... ol-remote/

Originally Remote was created because Reason Studios (at the time called Propellerhead) expected hardware MIDI controller companies would release the Remote Maps for their controllers instead, so the consumer could just plug it in and everything would work. But these days really no manufacturers do Remote Maps anymore. Not unless they're working with Reason Studios on a promo, like with the new Akai controllers. And honestly for those, I'm not sure if Reason Studios or Akai created those Remote Maps.
Win 10 | Ableton Live 11 Suite |  Reason 12 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | RME Babyface Pro | Akai MPC Live 2 & Akai Force | Roland System 8, MX1, TB3 | Dreadbox Typhon | Korg Minilogue XD

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dioxide
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03 Jan 2023

Perhaps it will work with the Advanced MIDI inputs?

MidiControllerNW
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05 Jan 2023

Thank you EnochLight for explaining.

I dont know about Remote. Can I pay someone to map the system 8 with Reason synths and VST synths?

MidiControllerNW
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Joined: 31 Dec 2022

05 Jan 2023

dioxide wrote:
03 Jan 2023
Perhaps it will work with the Advanced MIDI inputs?
Interesting idea, do you know how it might work?

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dioxide
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05 Jan 2023

There's a section in the manual about it.

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