Who's Got a Reel to Reel Recorder?

[Steedus]

I know the Hardware section is more about instruments etc, but I plan on using this for music creation so I think this still fits the category.

I'm thinking about getting a (relatively) cheap reel to reel for individual tracks/full mix-downs/effects and just to mess around with. Specifically the Akai 4000DB which has Dolby and a SOS (sound on sound) function.

I've never had any experience with these machines (or anything "vintage"), although I grew up with cassette players, so if there are more experienced folks here ... am I getting myself into a money hole? Obviously my biggest fear is getting the machine and it breaking early on and either not be able to repair it, or it costing a fortune to do so.

Seems like it could be fun though. Anyone have thoughts on owning/using a reel to reel machine?

[Dabbler]

I have an old Sony real to real about 52 years ago. It still amazes me every time I turn it on the fact that it does not have to boot up.

[EnochLight]

I'm thinking about getting a (relatively) cheap reel to reel for individual tracks/full mix-downs/effects and just to mess around with. Specifically the Akai 4000DB which has Dolby and a SOS (sound on sound) function.

Man, I wish I could find an Akai 4000DB for relatively cheap. The lowest I can find is still north of $500 USD on Reverb, and that's without shipping. I used to have one back in the day but sold it (begrudgingly) about 15 years ago - only because I didn't have the room to store it. I regret that choice almost every day.

I'll note that the Akai 4000 series are all "entry level" reel-to-reels. Although they have 3 separate heads, they're all permalloy and not particularly known to last very long. If you can inspect/test that deck, I'd do so thoroughly before buying.

[littlejam]

hello,

getting sentimental here

my dad owned one
i think a sony
never let me or my brother touch it
our dad had a huge library of tapes

he never really would listen to the reel to reel machine
always slow jazz from the radio on a sunday

i think the tapes came from grandpa

listening to phill collins 'i don't care anymore'

i do miss cassette tapes and having a boombox with 2 decks and fucking shit up
and giving them to friends the next day

jcheers

[Steedus]

I'm thinking about getting a (relatively) cheap reel to reel for individual tracks/full mix-downs/effects and just to mess around with. Specifically the Akai 4000DB which has Dolby and a SOS (sound on sound) function.

Man, I wish I could find an Akai 4000DB for relatively cheap. The lowest I can find is still north of $500 USD on Reverb, and that's without shipping. I used to have one back in the day but sold it (begrudgingly) about 15 years ago - only because I didn't have the room to store it. I regret that choice almost every day.

I'll note that the Akai 4000 series are all "entry level" reel-to-reels. Although they have 3 separate heads, they're all permalloy and not particularly known to last very long. If you can inspect/test that deck, I'd do so thoroughly before buying.

Well yes, I mean in a market of machines costing $900+, this is relatively cheap. There’s not much I’ve found in Australia beyond still pretty expensive machines marked as “it turns on, but otherwise untested” … but I’ve found one from a guy in Italy which has been fully cleaned inside and out, greased/lubricated and tested. With shipping it will work out to be around $600 (USD $400).

So yeah it’s still just about in my budget range for a “once in a while expensive thing to play around with”, but still a significant amount to risk on a 50-60 year old piece of gear.

Still I’ll probably take the risk.

I’ve also found a very nice looking GX-630 with the glass heads, but it’sa much bigger machine, can run 10” reels and would cost around AUD $1500. Quite a bit more!

[motuscott]

Tee hee, I've spliced tape once or twice. Not missing it.

[Steedus]

Tee hee, I've spliced tape once or twice. Not missing it.

Ha I know right? I had to do it once as a project when studying sound .. I don't intend on going that deep, but rather use it like an outboard effect - record a part to tape, then record back into Reason just to (maybe) get some 'flavour'. The beauty is in that sense - as long as it's still functional - I wouldn't mind if it's a little more on the dirty/noisy/wobbly side of old tape players

[MuttReason]

Grew up with this stuff. I worked in radio from the late 80s to late 90s and everything was on analog tape (although we were beginning to transition to SaDIE and Soundscape digital workstations by 1997). I have spent thousands of hours in front of Studers, Uhers etc with chinagraph, razor and sticky. Got pretty good at it! The move to digital was such a blessing back then, it was liberating.

Personally I’d never touch one of these things again. Too many memories of tape jams, oxide build up on the heads, squeaky capstans and so much else that used to break on a regular basis. Also fun fact, in the old days the only part of the BBC where wearing a tie was strongly discouraged was in the studio control room… getting your tie caught up in a fast rewinding reel on one of the big machines could cause serious injury.

I get the pleasure of owning something that’s got history and I also get the benefits of tape warmth and compression. But for me I’ll stick with plugins or Reason devices like Audiomatic. Way less maintenance and take up zero space!

That said, hey if it gives people pleasure to use this stuff, then rock on. All good, I’m just a grumpy old guy with too many memories of missed broadcast deadlines because the f**ing tape jammed or the machine broke with 2 minutes to go….

[DaveyG]

I only ever had a passing association with 'em but they fall very much into the same category as owning a vintage car. Great to look at and full of nostalgia but they take up lots of space, need more maintenance than you expect and you'll use them less than you think!

But apart from that, go for it!

[motuscott]

Fun story,
Once transferred multi track tape (which should have been baked, back when baking tape was still some kinda unknown gris gris) to another tape. Engineer was offloading the gunk from the original tape with a putty knife.
What a trooper, Kramer of Noise New York.

[MuttReason]

Fun story,
Once transferred multi track tape (which should have been baked, back when baking tape was still some kinda unknown gris gris) to another tape. Engineer was offloading the gunk from the original tape with a putty knife.
What a trooper, Kramer of Noise New York.

Gah…. tape baking!!! Yes, forgot about that too. Back in the day, when we wanted something from the radio archives if it was more than a few years old we had to allow at least 48 hours for the reel to be put into an oven. Sometimes the archive material would arrive and it would still be warm. And if you played an old tape that hadn’t been baked, the mess was extraordinary.

[Heater]

My mate had a 4 track reel to reel which we used extensively back in 90s. It sounded superb.

[motuscott]

Usually I'm a hands on kinda fella,
You know, play an instrument, hang a door, pick that cotton
But after you're done recording it,
I lurves me some In The Pandora's Box
It is there that my teenage LSD damaged imagination takes flight

Sir, this is a Wendy's

[BRIGGS]

Tee hee, I've spliced tape once or twice. Not missing it.

lol

[WOO]

Speaking of using reel to reels. This came across my inbox yesterday.

[Steedus]

I'm just about to close the deal. Google Translate actually works haha. Found one on an Italian local website and luckily the seller also included a WhatsApp number. Not speaking any Italian I ran a quick message through Translate and sent through the message not knowing if I'd even get a reply.

But I got a reply! The seller also, couldn't speak any English, but we were able to have an extensive chat over a week both using Translate. Turns out he's a retired guy who fixes up old reel to reels and sells them on. What a lovely experience.

Now, postal system .. don't let me down!

[platzangst]

(back when baking tape was still some kinda unknown gris gris)

Gah…. tape baking!!! Yes, forgot about that too.

In '86 I took an electronic music course at college and wound up with several quarter-inch reels of weirdness. At some point in the 90s I wanted to transfer the stuff to digital so I could at least listen to a better copy than the one cassette dub I made, and so I managed to rent the very decks from the University where I recorded the tapes. Got them home, hooked up a DAT, threaded a reel, and was rewarded with a distorted squealing, the physical noise of the tape rubbing on the heads. After a panicked call to the tech dude who'd let me have the decks, I was introduced to the concept of baking my own tapes. I had never wanted more to kick Steve Albini in the balls.

[motuscott]

Gah…. tape baking!!! Yes, forgot about that too.

I had never wanted more to kick Steve Albini in the balls.

Take a number

[MuttReason]

Gah…. tape baking!!! Yes, forgot about that too.

In '86 I took an electronic music course at college and wound up with several quarter-inch reels of weirdness. At some point in the 90s I wanted to transfer the stuff to digital so I could at least listen to a better copy than the one cassette dub I made, and so I managed to rent the very decks from the University where I recorded the tapes. Got them home, hooked up a DAT, threaded a reel, and was rewarded with a distorted squealing, the physical noise of the tape rubbing on the heads. After a panicked call to the tech dude who'd let me have the decks, I was introduced to the concept of baking my own tapes. I had never wanted more to kick Steve Albini in the balls.

Oh yes been there too. Learned the hard way. What a mess.

[selig]

I only ever had a passing association with 'em but they fall very much into the same category as owning a vintage car. Great to look at and full of nostalgia but they take up lots of space, need more maintenance than you expect and you'll use them less than you think!

But apart from that, go for it!

This sums it up nicely. Borrowed reel to reels in HS in the 1970s for ‘home recording’, learned to edit on them in Nashville studios in the early 1980s. Was SO happy to totally ditch them by the 1990s.
Side note - there is not much more thrilling than slicing through a 2” master for an important artist with everyone watching over your shoulder…much more pressure than doing the same edit on a DAW!!!

[stratatonic]

Side note - there is not much more thrilling than slicing through a 2” master for an important artist with everyone watching over your shoulder…much more pressure than doing the same edit on a DAW!!!

Sounds like fun!

[motuscott]

"Just relax, you're doing fine"
Heard while destroying master multitrack

Name withheld, just because...

[selig]

"Just relax, you're doing fine"
Heard while destroying master multitrack

Name withheld, just because...

You think hard drive failures are bad...
I've seen it done on both analog and digital tape, for both small and big clients too, and certainly more than once.
Digital tapes mis-threaded at the start of the day, tech hit rewind, tragedy ensued - no backup.
Analog tape layers parted from each other and carefully laid out across the room/crime scene (that's the part I witnessed). Bad breaks were blamed for the 'accident' – seriously.
Digital tape breaking (for no explained reason) on a master, with a backup on hand but breaking on the part of the song being overdubbed and therefore no backup of that part yet.
Sometimes folks even get fired, especially if it's not a first offense…

During a single week in Nashville I witnessed personally or second hand (not my projects but was at the studio) analog failure (above), digital tape failure on 32 track, digital tape failure on ADAT (more common), and a hard drive crash. It was at that point I realized there was no 'safe' format, and to ALWAYS BACK UP YOUR VALUABLES!

[motuscott]

Most of my stuff is backed up to TDK Type II.
There's a small problem rewinding...

[selig]

Most of my stuff is backed up to TDK Type II.
There's a small problem rewinding...

You got a pencil handy?!?