Features in other DAWs [Comparison]

Want to talk about music hardware or software that doesn't include Reason?
aeox
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Post 11 Feb 2020

And lets be fair.. labels and notes aren't the same! But I'm still using the feature for notes

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Proboscis
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Post 11 Feb 2020

aeox wrote:
11 Feb 2020
Seems like Cubase has the features you want in a DAW, you can use Reason Rack in it and everything. What do you hope to accomplish by comparing these DAWS? You said you already know 90% of the features are lacking in Reason
But the list isn't about 'what I want in a DAW'. It's a feature comparison between DAWs, and a callout to the only online forum community I'm an active member of, to help complete this list, based on their own experiences with the DAWs they use.

And I have no idea of knowing whether any of the listed features are present in Cubase, because I have not installed Cubase. I'm only checking the list on what I do know (and 'as far as I know'). And I happen to know Reason over all else. Of which over 80% of those listed features are not possible, no matter how elegant or crass the implementation.

Custom color picker ? Custom metronome sounds ? Scoring ? Autosave ? And so on. There are 8 DAWs in my list, but only two that I can comfortably populate with check or uncheck marks. Could I register, download, install & configure all 8 DAWs to find out for myself ? Am I just being plain lazy by opening a thread such as this ? Sure maybe I could, but I'm not. Because I'm lazy.

My intention is NOT to find out about Reason not having features, because I know what it does & doesn't have, in reference to the list. Sure I stand corrected on the stereo/mono, and I'll give Reason its checkmark for the ability to have notes. Great for me - I discovered something that will help in future. Another person may read it and also say 'great, I didn't know that' either.

But instead, the idea I had was to see what other DAWs have, and shouting out with a new mid-week conversation among people whom I share a commonality with, albeit a virtual acquaintance. I honestly did not expect there to be so much pushback, and so little usable data to help populate this little project.

Maybe some others will tell me Reason has stuff that I checked with an X mark. So I'll change that when it happens, and thank them for showing me something I didn't know about

Or, I could rephrase the whole idea, and start new threads in this, the 'Hardware & other Software subforum with

"Hey guys & girls, does anyone know if Logic Pro has Markers"
"Hey guys & girls, does anyone know if Logic Pro has Autosave"
"Hey guys & girls, does anyone know if Logic Pro can clone MIDI clips"

And so on. There will be 120 (8 x 15) threads, just so as to avoid mentioning Reason and getting feedback from other DAW using Reasoners' .

Maybe it's more appropriate I leave Reason out of this. More appropriate for an 'other software section'. I guess I broke the rules. Oops. Can I change the title, to take Reason out of it, since it's an 'other software' topic ?

Will the thread change course from its current trajectory (which really.. started right out of the gate) if I just make Reason disappear for now ? If the consensus is that they don't like the results, or disagree with them, regarding Reason having/not having the listed features, then we can keep this to a general DAW feature discussion without any hurt feelings or need to find justification in the DAW of their choice ?

And so on.

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Proboscis
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Post 11 Feb 2020

aeox wrote:
11 Feb 2020
And lets be fair.. labels and notes aren't the same! But I'm still using the feature for notes
Go for it. I'm going to start using the mix channel 'tape strips' to add notes. Lucky Reason allows that flexibility !

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Proboscis
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Post 11 Feb 2020

Even better, we can create a Combinator with inactive utilities to keep notes.

Here's a 'one verse, six spiders' implementation I put together.

Definitely 'checking' Reason for note taking ability !


>
DAW_efficient_notes.jpg
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Proboscis
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Post 11 Feb 2020

UPDATE: Opening post has been amended @ 4:32AM GMT

This thread is no longer about Reason. It is about 'Other Software', specifically DAWs, and the features they have/don't have.

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Proboscis
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Post 12 Feb 2020

Next Forum Post: "Hey man, why haven't you included Reason on your DAW Feature Comparisons List ?!?!?!?"

Proboscis: Ummmmmm

Yonatan
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Post 12 Feb 2020

I think video-sync is a core function indeed, as composing to video clips (even if very basic) is so standard these days.
And Punch in/out recording?

I don´t really understand the reactions against this initiative. Tons of more shallow threads in here. Now with the Rack Plugin, RS have more or less themselves acknowledged that there are more crucial functions in other DAWs, and so momentarily taken a step back in that regard. The list of DAWs even without showing Reason, can be handy when discussing implementation and what is really good workflow etc. This is so much better approach than "Reason sucks" statements without any clarifications. Reason does some things, no other DAW does, and some things are implemented way better than any other DAW. But then Reason also has its fallbacks and blind spots that makes it a bit too "dated". If one can live with it, one will not bother, but if having worked in other DAWs and tested some useful and quite basic functions or options that enhance a basic good workflow (as of 2020), the will to push for implementations in Reason is just purely sane. Why stay in 2002 when we are at 2020?

Good to structure this out instead of all the cluttered points here and there about features in x amount of threads. Here is something that can be useful in the process of choosing a main DAW or to get to know and sort out what features are really crucial and essential for a good workflow.

Reason is all about intuitive workflow as they many times states and that we came to love with it, so then they could survive to be compared. That does not say anything about the quality and joy of flow that can come out of working with the virtual Rack and SSL mixer and a stripped down sequencer. I mean I love the idea of what Reason is about, but I want also that experience to be a bit more mature in some cases. I started in 2009 with Reason/Record combi. What a lovely thing. But in honesty, little have been done to many core functions in Sequencer etc. What has been added has been nice, but not always what has been most needed. And I love that we got VST support and that you now can use the Rack as a plugin. I do not want to go back. But I want the Reason DAW to move forward also in the useful smaller functions that we have learnt to live without but are getting a bit tired of not having, that could be seen as standard. And if there are things that Reason already does and does it good, then good for all to get that clear.

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Proboscis
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Post 12 Feb 2020

Yonatan wrote:
12 Feb 2020
I think video-sync is a core function indeed, as composing to video clips (even if very basic) is so standard these days.
For a DAW feature, I'm more of the 'not necessarily' camp. Painting a broad brush, I would go for "a DAW for making music, and an NLE for making video" in the context of purpose-designed software. I'm not going to use 7zip to do my taxes. But there is crossover, and amateur musicians should be throwing their works up on YouTube, it's such a part of the way people interact with content in 2020. I heard recently that YouTube is the second largest 'search engine' on the internet.

So I will add video support to the feature list template. Thanks. Can you help out by telling me which DAW/DAWs have video support, so I can add a checkmark ?

Yonatan wrote:
12 Feb 2020
And Punch in/out recording?
Not something I care for, so it didn't make it. But it's a feature I've heard many people lament the absence of, in relation to the DAW that is the focal point for this forum. SO I will add that to the list as well. Again, can you provide a yes/no on which DAWs, in your experience, have this ?
Yonatan wrote:
12 Feb 2020
I don´t really understand the reactions against this initiative. Tons of more shallow threads in here.
Me neither. I'm trying really hard not to get upset, and add a little humor along with my response, as well as redacting the OP in sections, so as not to make this about people's favourite DAWs on this forum. On reflection, I am at fault here, it was poorly planned out to make it "Reason vs X" and I hope my amendments may bring some data that I can add to.
Yonatan wrote:
12 Feb 2020
The list of DAWs even without showing Reason, can be handy when discussing implementation and what is really good workflow etc. This is so much better approach than "Reason sucks" statements without any clarifications.
Yep. Thread is now more neutral. I made a mistake in my approach to this topic. :oops:

Yonatan wrote:
12 Feb 2020
Reason does some things, no other DAW does, and some things are implemented way better than any other DAW. But then Reason also has its fallbacks and blind spots that makes it a bit too "dated".
The first Rule of the 4:20 GMT amended OP is " You do not talk about Reason"
The second Rule of the 4:20 GMT amended OP is " You do not talk about Reason"

haha, not really. I can 'unhide' and amend my spreadsheet for Reason at any time :) It's only gone because folks don't want to see all those " 'x's in my eyes " and it seems to have derailed from my intentions right from the beginning.

Sitting here like uninvited company
Wallowing in my own obscenities
I share a cigarette with negativity
Sitting here like wet ashes
With x's in my eyes and drawing flies

Soundgarden: Drawing Flies (Badmotorfinger - 1991)


Yonatan wrote:
12 Feb 2020
Reason is all about intuitive workflow as they many times states and that we came to love with it, so then they could survive to be compared. That does not say anything about the quality and joy of flow that can come out of working with the virtual Rack and SSL mixer and a stripped down sequencer. I mean I love the idea of what Reason is about, but I want also that experience to be a bit more mature in some cases.
Since you've broken the first two rules of this thread already, I will say this about the DAW you're referencing. The best music I have ever created in a digital workspace was with Reason 4. The huge amount of features that have been added since R4 are quite mindblowing. But I'm not necessarily creating better songs. Imagine a feature list of Reason 4 vs Reason 11. As such, I'm all for Reason, and to this day I can get more done in Reason than in any other DAW (even Cakewalk, to which I've just started exploring. For a CW newbie, workflow is a PITA!). But... but.... but.... if I were to learn how to use Cakewalk where functions became second nature to me, as they are in Reason, then Cakewalk offers a lot more simple, non technical features that would aid me without a doubt.

Note that I'm getting into the 'opinion' zone here, none of the last paragraph has any bearing on the checklist. It can't, because Reason is no longer included. :lol:

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Proboscis
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Post 12 Feb 2020

PS waiting on your response as to DAWs that have punch-in & video support, and I'll update the screenshot of the features list

Yonatan
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Post 12 Feb 2020

Proboscis wrote:
12 Feb 2020
PS waiting on your response as to DAWs that have punch-in & video support, and I'll update the screenshot of the features list
Video support as a basic function (playback):
Logic, Ableton Live, Reaper, FL Studio, Cubase, ProTools, Studio One.
(those I know of having it)

(A small remark, often such a thing as a video player is often not included on basic intro level in those DAWs that has such options.)

Auto Punch in/out (connected with setting markers):
Logic, Ableton Live, Reaper, FL Studio, Cubase, ProTools, Studio One.

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Proboscis
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Post 12 Feb 2020

Thanks Yonotan, updates made, based on your input

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Proboscis
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Post 12 Feb 2020

DAW_Uber.PNG
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zoidkirb
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Post 12 Feb 2020

"track visibility" and folders, two features i specifically miss from Cubase when I'm in Reason.

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guitfnky
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Post 12 Feb 2020

one important feature which seems like should be added to the options is native pitch editing/correction. obviously Reason has this, and a few others. I know Cakewalk doesn’t, and I think maybe Ableton is in the same boat, but not sure.

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orthodox
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Post 12 Feb 2020

guitfnky wrote:
12 Feb 2020
one important feature which seems like should be added to the options is native pitch editing/correction. obviously Reason has this, and a few others. I know Cakewalk doesn’t, and I think maybe Ableton is in the same boat, but not sure.
Cakewalk perfectly integrates with Melodyne. Ableton doesn't.
Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise. -- L.Carroll

Yonatan
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Post 12 Feb 2020

guitfnky wrote:
12 Feb 2020
one important feature which seems like should be added to the options is native pitch editing/correction. obviously Reason has this, and a few others. I know Cakewalk doesn’t, and I think maybe Ableton is in the same boat, but not sure.
I searched and first video shows how to do it with "warp mode" and "tuner". Maybe a workaround but seem to be working good. It is from 2018 and have not bothered to see if ABL added a dedicated pitch corrector since.

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guitfnky
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Post 12 Feb 2020

orthodox wrote:
12 Feb 2020
guitfnky wrote:
12 Feb 2020
one important feature which seems like should be added to the options is native pitch editing/correction. obviously Reason has this, and a few others. I know Cakewalk doesn’t, and I think maybe Ableton is in the same boat, but not sure.
Cakewalk perfectly integrates with Melodyne. Ableton doesn't.
it does work well, but integration with a paid VST isn’t the same as having it natively available in the DAW. I’m assuming the thread is focused on features that are in the DAW without any additional expense.

aeox
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Post 12 Feb 2020

Proboscis wrote:
11 Feb 2020
Even better, we can create a Combinator with inactive utilities to keep notes.

Here's a 'one verse, six spiders' implementation I put together.

Definitely 'checking' Reason for note taking ability !


>
DAW_efficient_notes.jpg
Really getting your money's worth! :lol:

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reddust
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Post 12 Feb 2020

I'm seeing a lot of praise on Bitwig lately, I don't know if you can also add that one to the list. Interesting thread btw and thanks for sharing this work

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selig
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Post 12 Feb 2020

Proboscis wrote:
12 Feb 2020
Yonatan wrote:
12 Feb 2020
I don´t really understand the reactions against this initiative. Tons of more shallow threads in here.
Me neither. I'm trying really hard not to get upset, and add a little humor along with my response, as well as redacting the OP in sections, so as not to make this about people's favourite DAWs on this forum. On reflection, I am at fault here, it was poorly planned out to make it "Reason vs X" and I hope my amendments may bring some data that I can add to.
Yonatan wrote:
12 Feb 2020
The list of DAWs even without showing Reason, can be handy when discussing implementation and what is really good workflow etc. This is so much better approach than "Reason sucks" statements without any clarifications.
Yep. Thread is now more neutral. I made a mistake in my approach to this topic. :oops:
I'm not sure why you removed Reason from a post comparing features between Reason and other DAWs. IMO there was nothing wrong with the initial post in any way, and reading back through the thread I seen no one asking to remove Reason from the list.
Hope it wasn't because of what I said - I made a point to emphasize the limited usefulness of a list of features not representing the actual user experience, but in no way intended that to change the direction of the thread. Just a reminder there is more to an experience than a feature list, and to take it with a grain of salt - nothing more!

But this is your thread, do with it as you wish, I just want to make sure my grain of salt "reminder" was not taken the wrong way. :)
Selig Audio, LLC

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Timmy Crowne
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Post 12 Feb 2020

For what it’s worth, I thought the original post was perfectly useful the way it was initially formulated. A comparison chart that simply shows what features are present or lacking across DAWs is fair. This kind of work helps to cut through the marketing hype companies create pretending they’ve reinvented the wheel every year.

And I love Reason and use it daily. That’s why I hope it reaches its potential.

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Proboscis
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Post 12 Feb 2020

selig wrote:
12 Feb 2020
I made a point to emphasize the limited usefulness of a list of features not representing the actual user experience, but in no way intended that to change the direction of the thread. Just a reminder there is more to an experience than a feature list, and to take it with a grain of salt - nothing more!
The way I see it is that yourself & Orthodox went to a great effort to invalidate the idea from the start. In multiple posts. And by all means, if the idea is that it's not very accurate, then this is true not of my list, but of all products features lists.

Anyway I'm not going to start bickering, because I know only too well how that unfolds in a forum setting. You'll want to keep driving your point home, I'll keep wanting to drive my point home, and it will never end until one feels they've last the last word, or that the thread gets locked. I have no interest in that, and I particularly have no interest in doing that with you, since I have long appreciated some plugins you've made for the Reason platform.

Instead, how about contributing something to the spirit of the topic. I'm going to pick you as being a .... Pro Tools guy. How about letting us know what feature PT does, regardless of how fluidly & elegantly ? Or if I'm not correct, I'll bet you do have a familiarity with another DAW

Auto Save ? seems like a pretty straightfoward feature for a yes/no. And of course some do it better than others. Cakewalk, for example goes beyond simply Autosave, because it offers 'save every 'x' minutes or 'every x' changes, and it offers 'x' amount of version controlled saves (which I'm guessing would save files as _01, _02 etc or something similar. But auto save is autosave.

Custom Metronome sounds ? Again, it can be as simple as a yes/no. Does your other DAW of choice allow it or not ? Cakewalk allows not only custom sounds, but the ability to set one of 30 on the first beat, and one of 30 on the following beats, so one could have 'KICK, clap, clap clap- KICK, clap, clap clap', or hats, shakers, rimshots, there's plenty. To outline all of these options in a comparison list for every DAW that has something similar is far too cumbersome, and not the purpose of of a feature comparison between products.

Of my other suggested features, I would say that yes/no is rather sufficient for time rule markers, export formats, custom colors, custom icons, cloning clips, grouping clips. These seem to be fairly black or white as to being inclusions or not.

So tell us, does your other DAW do any of this stuff, however badly or well they are implemented ? You're welcome to spend even a fraction of the time you spend on devaluing my thread, and explain that 'Daw x does create scoring but it doesn't do it very well'. That's one feature that I might expect to be buggy in DAWs actually. Perhaps even to the point that it's more trouble than it's worth if so many corrections need to be made manually.

Jokes on you of course, since Pro Tools isn't on the list :lol: :lol: :lol: I could add it of course, but I was keeping it down to what may be the most used DAWs by the most people. Pro Tools may be 'industry standard (and from my own experience & exposure I tend to agree), but it's likely not the most widely used DAW.

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Proboscis
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Post 12 Feb 2020

guitfnky wrote:
12 Feb 2020
one important feature which seems like should be added to the options is native pitch editing/correction.
reddust wrote:
12 Feb 2020
I'm seeing a lot of praise on Bitwig lately, I don't know if you can also add that one to the list.
I'm most happy to keep expanding the features and the DAWs, but is there any point, when nobody has helped contribute towards populating the list by completing even a single DAW features summary with a yes/no? Yonotan was kind enough to advise on video support for several DAWs, plus a correction was made early on from some feedback, but it's going nowhere.
Timmy Crowne wrote:
12 Feb 2020
For what it’s worth, I thought the original post was perfectly useful the way it was initially formulated. A comparison chart that simply shows what features are present or lacking across DAWs is fair. This kind of work helps to cut through the marketing hype companies create pretending they’ve reinvented the wheel every year.
That was my thoughts too, but it seem to be criticized repeatedly from the start, so........

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Creativemind
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Post 12 Feb 2020

Proboscis wrote:
11 Feb 2020
This is a feature suggested by Creativemind in the other thread. And I don't use the stereo width in Reason - does this allow the same outcome ? I'll do a quick test in Reason. But if you think it's unfair to have this on the list I've made, I'm happy to remove it. Your call, guys & girls :thumbs_up:
It may very well work if you turn the width knob all the way down but the difference being, a mono / stereo interleave button like Cakewalk By Bandlab has allows you to A / B it kind of thing whereas the width knob / parameter / control doesn't. You may have the stereo width a certain way up (as that's where you want it) and you can't automatically bypass it.
:reason:

Propellerhead Reason 10.4 / Cockus Reaper 5.982 / Cakewalk By Bandlab / Pro Tools First / Steinberg Cubase LE 5
http://soundcloud.com/creativemind75/iv ... soul-mix-3

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Creativemind
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Post 12 Feb 2020

Proboscis wrote:
11 Feb 2020
Even better, we can create a Combinator with inactive utilities to keep notes.

Here's a 'one verse, six spiders' implementation I put together.

Definitely 'checking' Reason for note taking ability !


>
DAW_efficient_notes.jpg
Sorry but Reason doesn't have note taking abilities. That combi thing isn't it lol!

The closest thing we have is a vst called CodeFN42 VST Notepad but then that isn't a Reason feature is it and it's Windows only as well.
:reason:

Propellerhead Reason 10.4 / Cockus Reaper 5.982 / Cakewalk By Bandlab / Pro Tools First / Steinberg Cubase LE 5
http://soundcloud.com/creativemind75/iv ... soul-mix-3

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