Is dual xeon the way to go

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scifunk
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17 Feb 2018

Seen some great benchmark results with people running older dual xeon machines. If Reason doesn't use hyperthreading is dual xeon hexcore the way to go instead of i7 8700? Does processor clock speed make a lot of difference as most of the cheaper dual xeons are around 2.6ghz? I'm way out my depth here so any help appreciated

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aeox
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17 Feb 2018

During the summer of 2016, I'd say they were a great deal @ 52 dollars a piece for a E5-2670. Now they aren't really a good deal anymore IMO.

Probably better to just go with the 8700K now.

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demt
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17 Feb 2018

No
Reason 12 ,gear4 music sdp3 stage piano .nektar gxp 88,behringer umc1800 .line6 spider4 30
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scifunk
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17 Feb 2018

I knows they arent the bargain they were a year or so ago but I can still build one for about £800 as opposed to a similar i7 8700k machine for £1200.

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syncanonymous
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17 Feb 2018

Which Xeon CPU(s) models are you considering?
E5-2690v2 ?
DDR3, then...
I personally wouldn't go lower than 2.9GHz
Which mobo you wanna use? Do you want USB3.0 or 3.1 or TBolt...USB-C? How about Display Port or HDMI? You need to consider those kinda things

My 8700K is pretty nice at stock 3.7GHz... Getting that clock speed on Xeon gonna be tough to match...2687v3?... Or thereabouts... Also, you will require a lot more RAM going dual, you don't want to leave any RAM slots empty... And u gonna use more electricity...2xCPU coolers :-) LOTS to consider

Are you doing PCPartpicker? Start there if not
Last edited by syncanonymous on 17 Feb 2018, edited 1 time in total.
RSN 10.4d4_9878_RME UFX+_Intel Core i7-8700K 3.7 GHz__Corsair Vengeance 64GB DDR4-3000
ASRock Fatal1ty Z370__Palit GeForce GTX 1050 Ti KalmX__Samsung 960 PRO/ M.2-2280 NVME SSD
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syncanonymous
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17 Feb 2018

scifunk wrote:
17 Feb 2018
Seen some great benchmark results with people running older dual xeon machines. If Reason doesn't use hyperthreading is dual xeon hexcore the way to go instead of i7 8700? Does processor clock speed make a lot of difference as most of the cheaper dual xeons are around 2.6ghz? I'm way out my depth here so any help appreciated
Hmmm I just reread your post, Reason 10 is using all CPU threads on my 8700K machine :-)
RSN 10.4d4_9878_RME UFX+_Intel Core i7-8700K 3.7 GHz__Corsair Vengeance 64GB DDR4-3000
ASRock Fatal1ty Z370__Palit GeForce GTX 1050 Ti KalmX__Samsung 960 PRO/ M.2-2280 NVME SSD
:reason: :re: :recycle: :PUF_figure: :rebirth: :refill:

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scifunk
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17 Feb 2018

So currently an i7 8700k offers 22.2ghz of processing power and a dual xeon hex core (say 2.6ghz) will offer 31.2ghz. I understood that R10 supports multithreading but not hyperthreading, so cores are king are they not????? I only need one FireWire connection and use a single monitor so nothing taxing outside of Reason.

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NaviRetlav
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17 Feb 2018

Here I have the DUAL XEON setup with 2x E5-2670 ( 16 cores / 32 threads total )
It runs at 2.9 Ghz at all cores on full load.

If you are rendering 3D stuff or do any CPU multi-core work - go for it, as long as you find cheap motherboard like I did ( Asus Z9pa series is nice)

If for some weird reason you need 64gb of RAM or more for your work - you can try it, used ECC DDR3 memory is super cheap on ebay.

If you are gaming and want to have more than 60 fps on any modern game - run away ! Even with my nvidia 1060, some of the games run terrible, some are fine, but it's a lottery and the slow clock speed means that you can'g get the high refresh rate even at 1080p, not even thinking about 4k. Any modern intel i5 CPU will be way better for gaming.

If you do video editing/rendering - don't try that. Most of the editing apps don't work well with xeon cpus, and you will not be able to edit 4k footage.

If you want to use it only for Reason - don't go for it, HT doesn't work here, you will get way better results with high clock speed AMD RYZEN CPU and the setup will be way more stable and modern.


Now the final conclusion:

Right now If I could build another PC, I would NOT CHOSE the Dual Xeon. Most of the apps and games are not optimized well for the high number of cores and they still prefer the higher clock speed. The best example are the video editing apps like adobe premiere, which works way better on 8core cpu, than anything with more cores. Xeon CPUs can't be overclocked. The biggest issue here is that the older motherboard for the LGA2011 chipset also have very old BIOS, no support, and may have some reliability issues. The I/O on those motherboards is also way worst than on modern ones since you don't have thunderbolt, FireWire, BT, Wi-FI and even if you have USB3.0 it's very old chipset and it crashes a lot ( at least on my motherboard ). Keep in mind that with the old hardware you are also balancing on the edge of driver compatibility. After all, even if you decide to go or it and you like the challenge of heaving the dual CPU at home for display, the main issue is to get the good motherboard in really good price which is very hard for dual xeon.

After all, I think that the AMD Ryzen 5 1600X, is the best option now especially if you overclock it, and you should get better performance in reason than in Dual Xeon that way.

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NaviRetlav
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17 Feb 2018

scifunk wrote:
17 Feb 2018
So currently an i7 8700k offers 22.2ghz of processing power and a dual xeon hex core (say 2.6ghz) will offer 31.2ghz. I understood that R10 supports multithreading but not hyperthreading, so cores are king are they not????? I only need one FireWire connection and use a single monitor so nothing taxing outside of Reason.

R10 already support both Multi Threading and Hyper Threading, and i7 8700k is a really good CPU , even better than the AMD Ryzen 5 1600X that I suggested in past post which was a budget option.

Dual Xeon is worth only if you want to go super low budget, your current CPU is better than that option.
In your case I would just wait and upgrade to another generation of i9 CPU or i7 when intel announce that.

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syncanonymous
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17 Feb 2018

scifunk wrote:
17 Feb 2018
So currently an i7 8700k offers 22.2ghz of processing power and a dual xeon hex core (say 2.6ghz) will offer 31.2ghz. I understood that R10 supports multithreading but not hyperthreading, so cores are king are they not????? I only need one FireWire connection and use a single monitor so nothing taxing outside of Reason.
I think it is a balance of CPU speed and core count; I am not adding it up in an excel spreadsheet ;-P Maybe have another read of the R9 benchmark thread. Spend 300 for 8700K or 1000-2000 for i9.

Navi's points about drivers falling into legacy and mobo connections were part of my reasoning to go "affordable cutting edge"...but I wanted a QUIET running machine...and it is quiet. I don't see a 300 currency unit priced CPU as the be all and end all for me...I look forward to experimenting when the next gen hits the market.

I am happy with my choice. Sadly, my main DAW, SawStudio is terrible on Win 10. I am considering dual boot with Win7 :-/....or just settling with Reaper to see if I can stomach it.

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Psuper
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17 Feb 2018

Every iteration of processor and chipsets there's technologies and improvements on how components interact to reduce bottlenecking and take full advantage of those new technologies. It goes go far beyond simple cores and speeds -- I never cycle back to old tech (I have about 20 PCs here of 'old tech' including Xeon setups, even a DX4-100, a couple of Amigas and a TI-994a!) - I just wait until new tech is a more obvious leap.
Reason needs to DAW.viewtopic.php?f=6&t=7504985

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