Will Ryzen make AMD great again?

Want to talk about music hardware or software that doesn't include Reason?
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bxbrkrz
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06 Mar 2017

jukey23 wrote:I've read through this thread and I am glad to see actual music producers talking about this.
I am about to build a rig and my toughest decision has been the cpu. I bought an intel mobo yesterday (Asus prime z270-ar) and thought i had made up my mind to go 7700k.
I have just watched a lot of videos on the comparison between the 1700 and the 7700k...one guy said something will have me returning my mobo and going with Ryzen. Basically that I can do the 7700k for NOW...2017...for gaming especially. But if I want something that will just get better over time and will be for now AND 3-5 years from now, 1700 is the way to go. Also worth mentioning that this youtuber (Tech Deals) goes into the 1700 being the best bang for buck over the 1700x and 1800x. Basically said the percentage increase in performance is around 10%, so not really worth it.
Now I game...but the newest game I own is...uh...i don't even know! I got a ton of Steam games and the most demanding is probably civ 5 or the FIRST Dead Space lol
But I do want to get Fallout 4, Civ 6, and I play huge Minecraft modpacks (like over 100 mods). But my thing is, i have not played at 60 FPS...like ever. And these videos I'm seeing showing all these high FPS like 120 and such...you have the people who call 60 almost 'unplayable' or not good. For ME...60 is so much better than anything I've known and I will take it happily. I'll be buying the RX 480 for my gpu. Done deal.
So the small gain 7700k has with gaming, is not important to me anymore.

What I need is DAW comparisons.
So now with benchmarks out...and possibly some of you even having the Ryzens now...what do you think?
I'm upgrading to Reason 9 from 6.5 now because I can run it finally. I use lots of insert fx, but honestly I probably load about 10 combinators at most.
However, I want the ABILITY to use Reason for anything that may arise. If I get crazy, I want to be able to do it without Reason crapping out.
Anyone have any final arguments to do the $350 (amazon) 7700k over the $330 1700?
I mean Propellerhead's sys requirements even shouts with exclamation points MORE CORES THE BETTER!
Hold my hand and tell me what to do. Yes, I've asked this many times with many people...but never with fellow music producers and most importantly Reason users!
You could make a beat on Reason, render your youtube video, while playing your game, live on twitch with Ryzen. I am waiting for 2 things: have a maximum of bugs crushed before getting a motherboard and more choices, and the Radeon RX Vega. I may or may not buy it but I am sure the RX 480 will be cheaper the closer we get to Vega.

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EnochLight
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06 Mar 2017

jukey23 wrote:What I need is DAW comparisons.
So now with benchmarks out...and possibly some of you even having the Ryzens now...what do you think?
I'm upgrading to Reason 9 from 6.5 now because I can run it finally. I use lots of insert fx, but honestly I probably load about 10 combinators at most.
However, I want the ABILITY to use Reason for anything that may arise. If I get crazy, I want to be able to do it without Reason crapping out.
Anyone have any final arguments to do the $350 (amazon) 7700k over the $330 1700?
I mean Propellerhead's sys requirements even shouts with exclamation points MORE CORES THE BETTER!
Hold my hand and tell me what to do. Yes, I've asked this many times with many people...but never with fellow music producers and most importantly Reason users!
No one in this thread has built/bought with Ryzen yet, to my knowledge. We're entertaining the idea, though. I'd suggest you hold off for a bit and wait for the actual cpubenchmark.net scores to start flowing in from the field before making a decision. But so far, everything indicates that Ryzen's multithreaded performance is awesome, as for bang for buck, and a great choice when used in situations that require multiple cores, threads, Hyperthreading, etc (Reason is one of those situations).

But yeah, single-threaded gaming performance won't likely be much to write home about.
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gak
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07 Mar 2017

Ryzen will make AMD great again like stump will with murica.

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bxbrkrz
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07 Mar 2017

EnochLight wrote:
jukey23 wrote:What I need is DAW comparisons.
So now with benchmarks out...and possibly some of you even having the Ryzens now...what do you think?
I'm upgrading to Reason 9 from 6.5 now because I can run it finally. I use lots of insert fx, but honestly I probably load about 10 combinators at most.
However, I want the ABILITY to use Reason for anything that may arise. If I get crazy, I want to be able to do it without Reason crapping out.
Anyone have any final arguments to do the $350 (amazon) 7700k over the $330 1700?
I mean Propellerhead's sys requirements even shouts with exclamation points MORE CORES THE BETTER!
Hold my hand and tell me what to do. Yes, I've asked this many times with many people...but never with fellow music producers and most importantly Reason users!
No one in this thread has built/bought with Ryzen yet, to my knowledge. We're entertaining the idea, though. I'd suggest you hold off for a bit and wait for the actual cpubenchmark.net scores to start flowing in from the field before making a decision. But so far, everything indicates that Ryzen's multithreaded performance is awesome, as for bang for buck, and a great choice when used in situations that require multiple cores, threads, Hyperthreading, etc (Reason is one of those situations).

But yeah, single-threaded gaming performance won't likely be much to write home about.
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JiggeryPokery
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07 Mar 2017

Even if single-threaded performance isn't up to the Intel levels, in practice these kinds of results may end up like a "massive" 120fps compared to a "pathetic" 115fps. In the real world it might not be that noticeable.

What's giving me pause in considering an 1800x is the meagre 20 lanes of PCIe. That's worse than Skylake. One GPU and one NVMe and that's yer lot, son.

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EnochLight
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07 Mar 2017

JiggeryPokery wrote: What's giving me pause in considering an 1800x is the meagre 20 lanes of PCIe. That's worse than Skylake. One GPU and one NVMe and that's yer lot, son.
Yeah, that's troubling. Big time. My next build is going to be NVMe based, so that doesn't leave much for... Well - ANYTHING.
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ScuzzyEye
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08 Mar 2017

I usually use server hardware to assemble a "workstation" class machine. On that front there appears to be good news with the Zen "Naples" server platform. Eight channel DDR4 with base clocks up to 2.4 GHz. 128 lanes of PCIe. Oh and, 64 cores / 128 threads. Dual CPU support too. Available Q2 this year. 128 audio rendering cores here I come!

http://hothardware.com/reviews/amd-pois ... s-platform

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EnochLight
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08 Mar 2017

ScuzzyEye wrote:I usually use server hardware to assemble a "workstation" class machine. On that front there appears to be good news with the Zen "Naples" server platform. Eight channel DDR4 with base clocks up to 2.4 GHz. 128 lanes of PCIe. Oh and, 64 cores / 128 threads. Dual CPU support too. Available Q2 this year. 128 audio rendering cores here I come!

http://hothardware.com/reviews/amd-pois ... s-platform
I'm curious as what the cost would be over building a standard Ryzen desktop solution though? I can imagine that doing what you propose above will be substantially more expensive?
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ScuzzyEye
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08 Mar 2017

EnochLight wrote:I'm curious as what the cost would be over building a standard Ryzen desktop solution though? I can imagine that doing what you propose above will be substantially more expensive?
It'll definitely be more expensive than a desktop. But I a built a dual 6-Core Opteron for about $2400 (motherboard and CPUs anyway). The equivalent Xeon would have been in the $5000 range at the time. So I'm expecting this to be about the same.

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EnochLight
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08 Mar 2017

ScuzzyEye wrote:
EnochLight wrote:I'm curious as what the cost would be over building a standard Ryzen desktop solution though? I can imagine that doing what you propose above will be substantially more expensive?
It'll definitely be more expensive than a desktop. But I a built a dual 6-Core Opteron for about $2400 (motherboard and CPUs anyway). The equivalent Xeon would have been in the $5000 range at the time. So I'm expecting this to be about the same.
Wow - holy crap. Well, if a $2400 build gets you server-class performance and rockstar multithreaded performance, I might start saving my dollars too! ;) :D
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bxbrkrz
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09 Mar 2017

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EnochLight
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09 Mar 2017

Stopped watching when I realized this is a test on Linux. :(
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Ostermilk
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09 Mar 2017

Scan (3xs) have their first Ryzen based Studio PC up for grabs.

https://www.scan.co.uk/3xs/configurator ... -studio-pc

Conspicuously absent are any overclocked options which are normally available on their Intel offerings.

I'm not one of those early adopter types, all will become clear in a few months, the prices will reduce and the caveats will become known. I'm just glad AMD are creating a buzz and are sounding like competition again.

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10 Mar 2017

jukey23 wrote:I've read through this thread and I am glad to see actual music producers talking about this.


What I need is DAW comparisons.
An interesting thread over at the Cakewalk forum with Jim from StudioCat chiming in.

http://forum.cakewalk.com/AMD39s-Ryzen- ... 64710.aspx

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bxbrkrz
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10 Mar 2017

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bxbrkrz
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11 Mar 2017

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Lizard
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11 Mar 2017

I have owned an AMD for the past few builds and have been happy. So I've been in the market to build a new PC and put my order in for the parts to build a Ryzen PC. I have a 1700x CPU with an ASUS Prime x370 motherboard ordered. 16GB of DDR4 2666 memory. Going to run os on a 1TB Mushkin SSD. Problem is delay in parts at the moment so it won't be until next week late until I get it together. Hopefully I can have something to discuss with regards to The unification of Ryzen and Reason. :)

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EnochLight
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11 Mar 2017

The thread reporting issues at low buffer sample rates on Ryzen really worries me. I think I'll sit this out until this platform matures.

(thanks Ostermilk: http://forum.cakewalk.com/AMD39s-Ryzen- ... 64710.aspx )
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Lizard
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11 Mar 2017

EnochLight wrote:The thread reporting issues at low buffer sample rates on Ryzen really worries me. I think I'll sit this out until this platform matures.

(thanks Ostermilk: http://forum.cakewalk.com/AMD39s-Ryzen- ... 64710.aspx )
I've seen the article and wasn't too worried about it. The main reason as the article suggests is testing at ultra low buffers of 64 or so with performance being on par at buffers of 192 and higher. Currently I run on my Saffire 24 at 256 I believe and that's probably the same I'll run here but at 192 that's an improvement for me. And... well this is Cakewalk. I could have better results with Reason. Testing will only prove that. Someone has to be the lab monkey (raises hand). Yes Intel did better but things are still optimized for Intel at the moment. I suspect it won't be long before AMD optimization will be issued.

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EnochLight
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12 Mar 2017

Lizard wrote:
EnochLight wrote:The thread reporting issues at low buffer sample rates on Ryzen really worries me. I think I'll sit this out until this platform matures.

(thanks Ostermilk: http://forum.cakewalk.com/AMD39s-Ryzen- ... 64710.aspx )
I've seen the article and wasn't too worried about it. The main reason as the article suggests is testing at ultra low buffers of 64 or so with performance being on par at buffers of 192 and higher. Currently I run on my Saffire 24 at 256 I believe and that's probably the same I'll run here but at 192 that's an improvement for me. And... well this is Cakewalk. I could have better results with Reason. Testing will only prove that. Someone has to be the lab monkey (raises hand). Yes Intel did better but things are still optimized for Intel at the moment. I suspect it won't be long before AMD optimization will be issued.
Fair point. I usually run at 128 samples to 256 samples.
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Lizard
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12 Mar 2017

I guess it's like hedging bets. I'm in the need for a new PC. I can wait for the platform to improve or I can go with an I7 Kaby lake. It's in the similar price point. If Ryzen gets optimized the comparison will make the Ryzen the clear choice. I'm sure with AMD's previous track they improved on all platforms of new tech they have released so I feel comfortable about Ryzen. But by that time will there be the "new" Intel processor? Probably. Again.... place your bets! The choice always comes down to.... what's going on right now and what effect will it have on your future.

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bxbrkrz
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12 Mar 2017

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EnochLight
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12 Mar 2017

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Lizard
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12 Mar 2017

There is a couple things to consider about this comparison that I think should be pointed out is that it first compares the highest Kaby Lake (Flagship as it is referred to) to the lowest end R7 processor (1700). The only level playing field is the price point where Kaby is about $20 cheaper. As you move toward the 1700x and the 1800 the differences narrow and even more so if you choose the 7700 over the 7700k. There are over 9000 user builds submitted on Intel 7700k compared to roughly 200-300 AMD builds at time of comparrision. Intel is running overclocked where it is known the AMD is currently not well utilized there. The 7700k is a few months older at this point but credit to Intel for having their shit together at launch. AMD always seems to be a diamond in the rough.

It does look that single core performance of Kaby Lake does outperform but I am hoping that gap may narrow as time passes. In every case the multi-core performance is significantly higher with Ryzen which makes me believe that this will benefit my music production. I'll just have to settle for my games to run at 150FPS at 1080P compared to the 170-180 the 7700k can do. ;)

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JiggeryPokery
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12 Mar 2017

Yeah, that is an odd combination to compare. Against the 6900 is where it gets very interesting, as it's neck and neck, trading victories in different benchmarks.

Since I don't game as much as i did, and don't really need sli/xfire, so perhaps I should be less worried about lack of pcie3 lanes. (Zen actually supports up to 32 lanes via chipset, I've since I learned, but, grrr, none if the first tranche of mobos do that). If i just get a powerful enough single gfx card, i doubt the drop in single threaded performance will be so significant it hurts, and any slight drop will certainly be outweighed by the multi-threaded benefits and cost/performance ratios.

I'm putting a component list together. Going for an 1800x over the 6900 makes going for the 1tb 960 evo a viable option instead of just a 500gb, with change left over.

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