Just picked up an RME Babyface Pro - here's a Reason users perspective...

[EnochLight]

After careful consideration, much deliberation, and an evening of late night shopping in the company of my close friend Jamesons, I decided on an RME Babyface Pro to replace my aging Propellerhead Balance. I thought I'd share my perspective as a Reason user, just in case anyone else was looking at this interface.

While this might not be a comprehensive review, I'll share my thoughts as I spend more time with it (I've had it installed about 8 hours).. I won't spend much time on specs and hardware, as there is copious information already out there on this thing, and it's safe to say that the hardware that comes with it is the best in class for the price. That said, here's my thoughts so far:

• It's nice and solid - being cut from a single piece of aluminum makes it feel gig-worthy and built to last. Something that bothered me about Balance was the amount of plastic used in its construction (as in, all of it). This is common for audio interfaces that retail for $300 USD and less, but when Balance first appeared it sold for $499 USD.
• Aesthetically (and I realize I may get a few WTF's on this), the Babyface Pro is ugly as all fuck IMHO, and it will take a lot of getting used to. I know some people prefer this style of engineering, but it's going to take a while to grow on me. I loved Balance, I loved how it looked, and I loved it's quick simplicity. The Babyface Pro is none of those. Again, just IMHO.
• The single knob and a few buttons is neat and all, but I find myself using the TotalMix FX interface to control it instead. Speaking of which...
• TotalMix FX is practically worth the price of this interface by itself, and I don't feel like I'm exaggerating. It truly is a super powerful piece of software, and us Reason users will feel right at home with its virtual mixer interface. It's complex, but simple to use. I realize that other interfaces have mixer software that accompany their audio interfaces, but RME really knocked it out of the park with this. That said...
• TotalMix FX is complicated as fuck to wrap your head around. Thankfully, there's a metric shit ton of YouTube tutorials out there. That said, when testing my mic I accidentally triggered a feedback loop on more than one occasion and almost damaged my monitors! D'oh!!!
• It truly sounds sublime. I had to turn my monitors down slightly in comparison to my Balance.
• And the most important thing for me - the latency and performance is absolutely stellar for a USB interface. On Balance, I had to jump up to 512 samples (13 ms input/11 ms output) for most of my current projects, and sometimes even up to 1024 samples (24 ms input/23 ms output) to mix down for some of my "meatier" projects. Trying to sustain 256 samples (7 ms input/5 ms output) or less was simply not possible at times, and I would frequently experience audio drop out and click/pop.
  
  Not so with RME's Babyface Pro! Even on my heaviest projects, I can sustain 128 samples (4 ms input/3 ms output) without no audio drop out or pop/click!!! This is simply astounding. Better yet, on projects in the early stage I can easily sustain 64 samples (3 ms input/2 ms output) and as low as 48 samples (3 ms input/ 1 ms output)!!!! Again, this is truly astounding for a USB interface - no audio dropout or pop/click. Everyone was telling me that RME have the best drivers in the industry, and I don't doubt that (so far). I'm using the exact same USB port as my Balance was plugged into, and have done no other changes to my system. I work at 44.1 Khz sample rate.
• You cannot change buffer size in Reason's Preferences. You have to do it via RME's control panel. No big deal, but worth mentioning.

I struggled a long time thinking about picking this up. It's expensive as shit IMHO, especially for an interface that only gives you 4 inputs out of the box. But knowing that I can slap an ADAT on it and expand it up to a total of 12 inputs puts me at ease (Behringer makes the ULTRAGAIN ADA8200 that's perfect for this, and it's only another $199 USD on top of this thing). I look forward to experimenting with its AUDIO LOOPBACK features (oh, hello VST in Reason ) and getting more comfortable with the single knob approach to everything. Learning TotalMix FX will take some time, but I imagine that the payoff will be worth it in the long run.

More to follow...

Random musings:

• The TotalMix FX software is installed with the drivers, but until you restart your computer you wont be able to access it (it appears on your task bar and is always running in the background).
• The plastic gig box it comes with feels cheap as hell, but it will get the job accomplished if you need to bring this on the road.
• The retail packaging was downright embarrassing IMHO. I'm not sure if this was supposed to be a minimalist German thing, but for a product that sells for $749 USD retail, RME should look at making their presentation a little classier. Shit, even the box my iPhone came in looks classier LOL!
• This has a very low profile. I like how it sits on my desk (see the pic), as Balance used to obstruct the edge of my video monitors and my mic and guitar cables in the rear used to make it "pop a wheelie" because of how it hit my video monitors. Babyface Pro slips everything neatly underneath!

[/size]

babyface_pro.jpg (462.96 KiB) Viewed 7641 times

[groggy1]

Congrats!

Yeah, I was waiting to see how you'd review it on latency, since we had another email thread discussion where you were considering a few cards. That's pretty amazing for latency for USB, if you ask me...

[EnochLight]

Congrats!

Yeah, I was waiting to see how you'd review it on latency, since we had another email thread discussion where you were considering a few cards. That's pretty amazing for latency for USB, if you ask me...

Thanks man. Yeah, I am utterly astounded at how low I can go with the buffer and the resulted rock solid latency. Hell, even when I push it with a heavy project at a low sample buffer and it starts to pop/click, it's.... tolerable! I mean, there's literally no audio dropping out. RME did a fantastic job with their drivers and the performance of this thing. Legendary.

[Aquila]

I see what you mean about how ugly it is.

[willowman]

Good old friendly Mr jameson has facilitated many of my late night purchases , I'm also in the market for a new audio interface, balance has served me well but ever since the windows ten upgrade I've had annoying pops and glitches etc.

unfortunately I don't have anywhere near the budget for the babyface pro, however I noticed that propellerhead are bundling the focusrite scarlett 2i2 with reason, would this count as a props endorsement ? or perhaps something that's close to balance ?

I don't think the babyface looks that ugly...I'd liken her to a partner that's not much to look at but treats and serves you well (if she/he does) <<< this sounds terrible..but I stand by my analogy

[EnochLight]

I mulled over picking up a Focusrite as well. I would feel comfortable going with them if I wasn't committed to the Babyface Pro, that's for sure, but I would be surprised if their drivers could match the performance/latency of what RME has accomplished.

I've decided - after sleeping on it - that it doesn't look as bad as I originally made it out to be. It just reminds me of something Apple might have done 10 years ago. It's more... dated... than fugly, I guess.

[mcatalao]

Not a surprise completely having a Rme Raydat myself.
I'm on the market for a gig card and one of the options is RME. Simply glitch free, my current only problem is it's price!

[Theo.M]

excellent overview mate. Very good to read the drivers hold up under scrutiny with Reason. Total Mix is indeed though what reaper is to daw's, TM is to interface mixers. That's their only flaw really.

What do you think of the dsp eq/comp and monitoring verb mate?

[EnochLight]

excellent overview mate. Very good to read the drivers hold up under scrutiny with Reason. Total Mix is indeed though what reaper is to daw's, TM is to interface mixers. That's their only flaw really.

What do you think of the dsp eq/comp and monitoring verb mate?

I've just spent the better part of 2 hours watching tutorials on TotalMix FX, and it's slowly starting to sink in. I've found that the Snapshot feature is absolutely brilliant - it allows me to save my favorite level settings and kick the phantom power on effortlessly. That's pretty cool. The routing is still a bear to understand, though.

The built-in DSP eq/reverb/echo for monitoring is pretty brilliant. Being able to add an effects bed at zero latency that has absolutely no effect on your recorded signal can come in handy. It's always nice to have a bit of shimmer on your voice when you record, and not having that affect your session is pretty brilliant. That said, it should be noted that the Babyface Pro only comes with eq, reverb, and echo on the built-in DSP. They left out all of the dynamics/compression as apparently it was going to increase the price since they'd need a faster chip.

[groggy1]

excellent overview mate. Very good to read the drivers hold up under scrutiny with Reason. Total Mix is indeed though what reaper is to daw's, TM is to interface mixers. That's their only flaw really.

What do you think of the dsp eq/comp and monitoring verb mate?

I've just spent the better part of 2 hours watching tutorials on TotalMix FX, and it's slowly starting to sink in. I've found that the Snapshot feature is absolutely brilliant - it allows me to save my favorite level settings and kick the phantom power on effortlessly. That's pretty cool. The routing is still a bear to understand, though.
(

My previous card was an M-Audio Audiophile 2496, and the mixer on that thing was also very confusing. I was using SPDIF channel to do internal audio-loopback between daws purely through the mixer, and it wasn't easy to keep straight.

My new audiocard is FocusRite, and one positive thing is that the mixer is 100x more intuitive than my previous card. It almost feels like Reason, in a way (with its layout and simplicity).

[gak]

excellent overview mate. Very good to read the drivers hold up under scrutiny with Reason. Total Mix is indeed though what reaper is to daw's, TM is to interface mixers. That's their only flaw really.

What do you think of the dsp eq/comp and monitoring verb mate?

The BFP doesn't have the comp.

[gak]

Not so with RME's Babyface Pro! Even on my heaviest projects, I can sustain 128 samples (4 ms input/3 ms output) without no audio drop out or pop/click!!! This is simply astounding. Better yet, on projects in the early stage I can easily sustain 64 samples (3 ms input/2 ms output) and as low as 48 samples (3 ms input/ 1 ms output)!!!! Again, this is truly astounding for a USB interface - no audio dropout or pop/click. Everyone was telling me that RME have the best drivers in the industry, and I don't doubt that (so far). I'm using the exact same USB port as my Balance was plugged into, and have done no other changes to my system. I work at 44.1 Khz sample rate.

Told you so

I don't think it's ugly though.

[sentient.minority]

Not so with RME's Babyface Pro! Even on my heaviest projects, I can sustain 128 samples (4 ms input/3 ms output) without no audio drop out or pop/click!!! This is simply astounding. Better yet, on projects in the early stage I can easily sustain 64 samples (3 ms input/2 ms output) and as low as 48 samples (3 ms input/ 1 ms output)!!!! Again, this is truly astounding for a USB interface - no audio dropout or pop/click. Everyone was telling me that RME have the best drivers in the industry, and I don't doubt that (so far). I'm using the exact same USB port as my Balance was plugged into, and have done no other changes to my system. I work at 44.1 Khz sample rate.

Told you so

I don't think it's ugly though.

Agreed, told you so too.

And I don't think it's ugly, they're just industrious!

[EnochLight]

It looks like something Apple crapped out 10 years ago to me. Just feels "dated" IMHO. Anyway, it's growing on me. It's built like a tank, that's for sure!

[EnochLight]

I just discovered that the Babyface Pro's mic preamp gain goes up to 70 db! I might be able to get rid of my Cloudlifter that I got for Balance, as Balance mic pre's only went to 40 db and wouldn't push my ribbon mic. Will have to test this later.

Nice!

[kitekrazy]

excellent overview mate. Very good to read the drivers hold up under scrutiny with Reason. Total Mix is indeed though what reaper is to daw's, TM is to interface mixers. That's their only flaw really.

What do you think of the dsp eq/comp and monitoring verb mate?

I've just spent the better part of 2 hours watching tutorials on TotalMix FX, and it's slowly starting to sink in. I've found that the Snapshot feature is absolutely brilliant - it allows me to save my favorite level settings and kick the phantom power on effortlessly. That's pretty cool. The routing is still a bear to understand, though.
(

My previous card was an M-Audio Audiophile 2496, and the mixer on that thing was also very confusing. I was using SPDIF channel to do internal audio-loopback between daws purely through the mixer, and it wasn't easy to keep straight.

My new audiocard is FocusRite, and one positive thing is that the mixer is 100x more intuitive than my previous card. It almost feels like Reason, in a way (with its layout and simplicity).

I still use the M-Audio APs. Those are still great cards.

[kitekrazy]

The Babyface would not look ugly at all sitting on my DAW. Even though RME gear is out of my price range. The amount you spend on various interfaces you might as well get one. They don't make many doorstops compered to other vendors.
My first interface was a Yamaha SW1000XG. For the price I could have gotten a Hammerfall 9632. The XG would eventually not be able to run on an AMD rig with nVidia chipset. It also would not work on my Intel P4 rig.
Even with PCI slots going away some are still using the 9632 with PCIe to PCI adapter.

Usually when MF or Guitar Center has a 15% off you can get a Babyface. RME will probably still support it 10 years from now.

[EnochLight]

My first interface was a Yamaha SW1000XG.

Well that's a helluva lot better than my first interface. Mine was a Creative Audigy! And that was technically a step up from the Creative Soundblaster that I started out with.. Hard to believe that my first experience with ASIO was on an Audigy.

[raymondh]

My first interface was a Yamaha SW1000XG.

Well that's a helluva lot better than my first interface. Mine was a Creative Audigy! And that was technically a step up from the Creative Soundblaster that I started out with.. Hard to believe that my first experience with ASIO was on an Audigy.

That was my first interface too! The Audigy wasn't too bad - certainly you knew it would always be compatible without driver issues.
But when you listen to a pro interface for the first time, it's like someone took your hands off your ears!!

[skie]

I always said if I needed a Balance replacement I would get a Motu, most likely http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/8preUSB. Anybody had any experience with this? Same number of inputs as Balance but you can record 8 channels at once (unlike Balance). But the RME's have an impeccable reputation.

[EnochLight]

I always said if I needed a Balance replacement I would get a Motu, most likely http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/8preUSB. Anybody had any experience with this? Same number of inputs as Balance but you can record 8 channels at once (unlike Balance). But the RME's have an impeccable reputation.

It's funny you should post that, as I was considering the 8Pre as well at one time. My issue with it is that I'm on Windows, and MOTU's driver reputation has been less than stellar (although I understand they've improved over the years). I have a bad taste in my mouth leftover from my experience with owning a MOTU Ultralite (first gen, Firewire; nothing but driver issues, pop/click/audio dropped).

So RME it was. And frankly, judging from the performance and stability I'm getting with RME's drivers, I'm glad I made the choice. As I said above, even at the lowest latency settings at 64 samples (3 ms input/2 ms output) or 48 samples (3 ms input/ 1 ms output), if my project is too heavy and it starts to pop/click, it's literally tolerable - meaning there is no audio dropped and the pop/click is barely audible. That says volumes about RME's engineering and drivers.

[skie]

That's awesome about the latency, I could definitely stand to do better than the 256 samples buffer I'm on. Gonna keep my eye on RME.

[SunSetCity]

Hi Enochlight, I've bought a Babyface Pro, too and I'm totally in love with its sound quality and latency but I find the routing in Total Mix FX a little bit confusing and couldn't get used to it so far..

I am on W10 and tried set everything up in Reason 8, TMFX and e. g. Renoise to send MIDI notes with "LoopMIDI" (from Tobias Erichsen) from Reason to the other DAW and record the played sound of the VST back into Reason via the internal software loopback function!

If you figured out, how to get that right, would you mind posting a video, how to achieve that? Would be looking forward to it. Never mind, if that's too much effort for you. I'm just asking. However, thanks in advance and good to see, that you've decided to buy a BF Pro, too!!

Cheers!

[EnochLight]

Hi Enochlight, I've bought a Babyface Pro, too and I'm totally in love with its sound quality and latency but I find the routing in Total Mix FX a little bit confusing and couldn't get used to it so far..

I am on W10 and tried set everything up in Reason 8, TMFX and e. g. Renoise to send MIDI notes with "LoopMIDI" (from Tobias Erichsen) from Reason to the other DAW and record the played sound of the VST back into Reason via the internal software loopback function!

If you figured out, how to get that right, would you mind posting a video, how to achieve that? Would be looking forward to it. Never mind, if that's too much effort for you. I'm just asking. However, thanks in advance and good to see, that you've decided to buy a BF Pro, too!!

Cheers!

Sure, I can lend a hand. It took me about 15 minutes of fiddling around with it, but I finally figured it out. I'll post a video when I get a chance. Audio loopback works fantastic on the Babyface Pro.

Currently in the middle of a blizzard though, so I have to get things cleaned up before I can do it.

Cheers

[SunSetCity]

Sure, I can lend a hand. It took me about 15 minutes of fiddling around with it, but I finally figured it out. I'll post a video when I get a chance. Audio loopback works fantastic on the Babyface Pro.

Currently in the middle of a blizzard though, so I have to get things cleaned up before I can do it.

Cheers

That sounds fantastic, can't wait to try it out but no need to rush. Take your time! I'm looking forward to the video and thank you very much for your help!! I hope, the blizzard's gone and everything is okay!!

Cheers!