Pro Tools vs Reaper

[Jackjackdaw]

My next project is going to be all recorded audio and I want to employ some tape recording techniques such as half speed recording of guitars etc. So I need a DAW that can do this easily, Reaper or Pro tools.
I’m pretty familiar with Reaper as it was my main DAW for a few years before I got Reason but I have never used Pro Tools. The current free version is tempting me to give it a try, but my time for learning new stuff is limited, I’m wondering if it is worth it?

[huggermugger]

ProTools Intro is limited to eight audio tracks. Seems pretty meagre for a project that is to be all recorded audio.

[Jackjackdaw]

I could obviously upgrade if track count became an issue. That’s not really what I’m getting at. I mean to ascertain if Pro tools has some special sauce mojo that is worth getting on board with, from someone who has experience with it.

[BonsaiMacKay]

My best advice is: do not adopt a new DAW if you are starting a project and have limited time. By all means, download and experiment with PT in your spare time, it is always good to learn other platforms, but not so to change DAWs just as you start a new project. It might be more interesting to work on the DAW you know inside out and then try do do the same audio manipulation on PT after a session to learn how it works.

By the way, I know what half-speed mastering is, but half-speed recording? You mean play the guitar at slow tempos as you record it?

[DaveyG]

You've just named my two least favourite DAWs ever!
Most DAWs will let you record audio at a slower speed then speed it up. I've rocked more than a few guitar solos that way (cough, cough).

If you are familiar with Reaper, why would you use anything else?
ProTools is not "the industry standard" because it is particularly great at anything. It's the standard because they got in first and supplied a hardware/software hybrid at a time when hard disk recording was in its infancy. Modern ProTools is an odd mishmash of things and they have recently introduced clip launching and a free app, which is somewhat at odds with their "take it seriously" image.

BTW, never make another post on this forum. You'll ruin your post count ("Posts: 1337").

[selig]

You've just named my two least favourite DAWs ever!
Most DAWs will let you record audio at a slower speed then speed it up. I've rocked more than a few guitar solos that way (cough, cough).

If you are familiar with Reaper, why would you use anything else?
ProTools is not "the industry standard" because it is particularly great at anything. It's the standard because they got in first and supplied a hardware/software hybrid at a time when hard disk recording was in its infancy. Modern ProTools is an odd mishmash of things and they have recently introduced clip launching and a free app, which is somewhat at odds with their "take it seriously" image.

BTW, never make another post on this forum. You'll ruin your post count ("Posts: 1337").

It is particularly great at some things, likely none of the things the average home user cares about. Pro Tools is good at film mixing, high track count sessions, hardware integration, advanced automation and hardware integration, etc.
Pro Tools is also stupid simple for doing half speed playback and recording, just by adding a modifier key. Used it ALL the time back in the day…
That said, Reaper probably has a similar function. Like DaveyG I’d prefer to stick with what I know works than chase the “greener grass”.

[Jackjackdaw]

I’m not looking for greener grass. I know I can slow down audio in Cubase for instance but it will cleverly keep the pitch constant. I need it to behave like tape and pitch down so when I overdub and speed it up my recording is at a higher pitch at regular speed. My Reaper license is so old It timed out at version 5.99 , I haven’t used it for so long that I will have to relearn it on the current version so it’s an opportunity to find the best tool for the job.

[QVprod]

I’m not looking for greener grass. I know I can slow down audio in Cubase for instance but it will cleverly keep the pitch constant. I need it to behave like tape and pitch down so when I overdub and speed it up my recording is at a higher pitch at regular speed. My Reaper license is so old It timed out at version 5.99 , I haven’t used it for so long that I will have to relearn it on the current version so it’s an opportunity to find the best tool for the job.

Sorry if I’m missing something… but why go through recording at half speed to get a higher pitch when you can just change the pitch at a regular speed. I believe all DAWs at this point have time stretching where you can change the pitch and maintain the same speed. That technique existed before time stretching was a thing.

[Jackjackdaw]

Ok context. I’m listening to the album Tango in the night by Fleetwood Mac and I’m thinking, those guitars sound really unique. How is Lindsey Buckingham getting that tone? So I learn that he spent a long time slowing down all the tracks and recording the guitar parts at half speed. When sped up it creates a very particular quality to the high end. I would like to experiment with the technique. I’m pretty sure I need to emulate the analog tape process to get that particular sound rather than digital pitch shifting which has it’s own particular sound.

[DaveyG]

Can't believe you spoiled your post count ;p

Weirdly, that was the album I first thought about when I read your OP. Forget DAWs. You'll need a year or more of your life, a real analogue tape recorder, some drugs and, most important of all, an engineer with infinite patience.

If you are going to do it you should do it properly. Then it's art.

[QVprod]

I think him using actual tape is the reason for the added harmonics and and not so much the technique by itself. Doing this digitally would still be digital pitch shifting. But it doesn’t hurt to try I guess.

[Jackjackdaw]

I think him using actual tape is the reason for the added harmonics and and not so much the technique by itself. Doing this digitally would still be digital pitch shifting. But it doesn’t hurt to try I guess.

Yeah it’s all digital but the speed thing is a different process to the melodyne time stretchy stuff. You can get the sound I’m talking about just by putting a sample in nn19 and playing it above the root. The magic is in getting a whole track synced up with the different speeds
happening and playing it all back in tune.

[Jackjackdaw]

Can't believe you spoiled your post count ;p

Weirdly, that was the album I first thought about when I read your OP. Forget DAWs. You'll need a year or more of your life, a real analogue tape recorder, some drugs and, most important of all, an engineer with infinite patience.

If you are going to do it you should do it properly. Then it's art.

I’d be happy with that. If only I if had a triple platinum album in the bag to buy me some creative freedom

[jam-s]

I think you can do this pretty nicely with reason:
1. set the tempo to half your wanted BPM, so everything gets stretched
2. Record your guitar parts
3. disable stretch for those clips
4. up the tempo back to the original BPM

I think this should work. If not you could export your recorded guitar parts and use audacity to pitch them up to 200% and then reimport them into reason.

[Jackjackdaw]

Like Cubase, Reason loves to slow things down and speed them up while maintaining a constant pitch.

[Mataya]

Just use play rate slider in reaper. It used to be a slider, think now it's a circular button. Lower it down and see how much you want to go, record, put it back to default. Can't be easier than that. We use it for recording Alvin voices in a show. Sounds much nicer then using pitchshifters with timetstretch. Pitch shifting is not a problem. It becomes when you're using it and want to stay in time, or timestretching...this is when almost all algorithms fail.
tx
M

[Jackjackdaw]

Yeah I’m going with Reaper, it does the thing I want and comes without the corporate baggage.

[selig]

Just use play rate slider in reaper. It used to be a slider, think now it's a circular button. Lower it down and see how much you want to go, record, put it back to default. Can't be easier than that. We use it for recording Alvin voices in a show. Sounds much nicer then using pitchshifters with timetstretch. Pitch shifting is not a problem. It becomes when you're using it and want to stay in time, or timestretching...this is when almost all algorithms fail.
tx
M

Sounds like it’s a bit easier in Reaper, I do it in Reason with no issues just a few additional steps.

FWIW, i can’t hear a difference between “vari-speed” in DAW like Pro Tools and doing a time stretch/pitch change in Reason. They are the same thing, just one step in other DAWs, vs two steps in Reason. You can’t digitally change “tape speed” without changing timing (stretch) and pitch (tuning), that’s how it’s done in both cases!
Remember, it’s ALL “algorithms”…

[Jackjackdaw]

I think another aspect of physically playing at a lower pitch and very slow is that you are going to get a difference in how the articulation sounds when it is sped up that you wouldn’t get with a pitch shifter.

Also. If you play something slow and speed it up you have more sound data over time than if you recorded at normal speed then pitched it up, which would then need stretching to stay at the normal speed, so the audio is stretched rather than compressed. This is pickling my brain a bit thinking about though!