So I have been using Reason as my live rig for 6 years or so now, and it has been really solid for me.
I've only had two major problems. One time my midi controller just died on me in the middle of a set.
And another time, during setup, I couldn't get audio out but I was using a new interface and as it turned out I didn't know it as well as I thought.
But neither of those problems could be blamed on Reason.
So it has been very solid, and I love how I can really custom build sounds, and the interface to do so on a large monitor is so much nicer than working on a small LCD of most workstations.
However, sometimes I think I might want to try using a workstation, just because it would be less stuff to set up, and it would "just work" as opposed to having to do so much routing and whatnot to get sounds.
Also I invested in a slightly used MacBookPro with killer specs, and I have noticed some lagging, and glitching occasionally on stage, and in practice.
And since I don't know OSX all that well, I don't even know where to start looking to solve that problem.
And I had really hoped buying a powerhouse laptop like this, that it would just work without having to futz with it too much.
And I'm pretty disappointed that it didn't.
I like Korg stuff, and always have.
I don't have a huge budget for this, and I think a Kronos is really the only board that can accomplish what I am able to do with my current Reason-based setup. And that is to sustain a pad in the background and change patches, and start playing the new patch and then the pad would sustain until I release the pedal. It's a little complicated how I do this in REason, but it works really well.
The Kronos has smooth transitions between patches, and no other keyboard does, that I know of.
Well, I can't afford a Kronos unfortunately.
So I was looking at either a new Krome or a used M3.
So maybe someone who has experience with those can answer this for me please.
Can either of those boards do this?
Have a combi which contains 4 (or more) timbres.
1. Piano
2. Pad
3. Strings
4. Lead synth
Assign a slider or knob to the volume level of each timbre.
I will need #1 to always be piano, and #2 to always be pad, but I can make different combis with other sounds on 3 and 4.
How quickly can I go between different combis?
If I'm sustaining a pad sound at the end of a song, and I need to switch combis for the next song, will the slow release of the pad still keep going while I change pads, so I can come right back in with it after the new combi is loaded, so it's not too noticeable?
How happy am I gonna be with the sounds of either of these boards, versus the Reason FSB and the few RE's I own, like RadPi and Parsec?
Should I forget this notion and look more into solving my glitch problems with my MacBookPro?
I know I am the only one who knows what would be best for me, but I am just curious what some of you would do.
Thanks!
Software versus Hardware for live keyboarding
If your laptop is generally reliable, I would suggest finding out what those glitches are. But I understand the usefulness of a workstation in a live context.
As far as workstations go just about any of them worth mentioning is capable of layering sounds and creating combinations just like Reason, just make sure the polyphony is high enough, 120 notes is recommendable. Krome has this. I'd recommend reading through the manuals of the boards you're interested in to get a feel of their capabilities. Aside from polyphony limits many of them are actually almost as capable as Reason if you're willing to dive in and design patches.
The sustain thing is pretty unique to the Kronos though afaik. In Reason it's more like a bug to me having to switch back to that particular track to stop it from sustaining. Mainstage 3 is capable to achieving that though the same way Kronos does it if you're willing to put up the $30 to give it a try. I've rewired Reason to it a few times and it works well. Only thing is Mainstage works it's best when your laptop isn't also your main computer, but dedicated for your rig only in my experience.
Also you may want to check out some Keyboard specific forums like http://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthread ... ard_Corner. You're more likely to find what you're looking for or get answers related to workstations and keyboard live performance than you are here.
As far as workstations go just about any of them worth mentioning is capable of layering sounds and creating combinations just like Reason, just make sure the polyphony is high enough, 120 notes is recommendable. Krome has this. I'd recommend reading through the manuals of the boards you're interested in to get a feel of their capabilities. Aside from polyphony limits many of them are actually almost as capable as Reason if you're willing to dive in and design patches.
The sustain thing is pretty unique to the Kronos though afaik. In Reason it's more like a bug to me having to switch back to that particular track to stop it from sustaining. Mainstage 3 is capable to achieving that though the same way Kronos does it if you're willing to put up the $30 to give it a try. I've rewired Reason to it a few times and it works well. Only thing is Mainstage works it's best when your laptop isn't also your main computer, but dedicated for your rig only in my experience.
Also you may want to check out some Keyboard specific forums like http://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthread ... ard_Corner. You're more likely to find what you're looking for or get answers related to workstations and keyboard live performance than you are here.
Thanks for the info!
I usually have 2 controllers a 61 key Axiom on bottom locked to a Piano/Pad combinator.
And a 49 Key Oxygen controller on top set as the master.
Since I use the same piano and pad for most songs, I can just leave that on the bottom controller. Any song-specific patches I will have in order by track in the sequencer and just hit next or previous track to select one of the sounds on the top controller and I can do that while sustaining on the bottom keyboard. And I don't usually sustain any of the lead sounds on the top board so it locking when I change tracks isn't really an issue for me.
It works pretty well.
I bought MainStage 3 a while back. I had heard it could do the sustained patch changes. I didn't care for the sounds versus what I have in Reason.
But Rewiring might be an option.
It's just complicated versus a workstation.
And I think if I plug a second controller into a workstation even a Krome I could probably do what I do in Reason. But I'm not sure.
I usually have 2 controllers a 61 key Axiom on bottom locked to a Piano/Pad combinator.
And a 49 Key Oxygen controller on top set as the master.
Since I use the same piano and pad for most songs, I can just leave that on the bottom controller. Any song-specific patches I will have in order by track in the sequencer and just hit next or previous track to select one of the sounds on the top controller and I can do that while sustaining on the bottom keyboard. And I don't usually sustain any of the lead sounds on the top board so it locking when I change tracks isn't really an issue for me.
It works pretty well.
I bought MainStage 3 a while back. I had heard it could do the sustained patch changes. I didn't care for the sounds versus what I have in Reason.
But Rewiring might be an option.
It's just complicated versus a workstation.
And I think if I plug a second controller into a workstation even a Krome I could probably do what I do in Reason. But I'm not sure.
I was at the front of a New Order concert when Gillian Gilbert's synth froze up. I think it was a Roland JV. The tech guy scooted out from side stage and worked on it (eventually with success) while Gillian tried to look composed. What I liked was that her synth lines were missing so it was nice to know she was playing live rather than miming to a recorded track!
Jean-Michel Jarre has a great concert - Oxygene Live In Your Living Room - where the heat from the stage lighting was badly affecting the tuning of his synths through the concert. He discusses it in the DVD extras.
So there's always room for issues even where you're not using a computer rig on stage.
Most digital synths are really computers these days and even my analog DSI synth has occasional operating system bug fixes available. What makes the dedicated synths generally more stable is (1) you're not running other stuff on it and (2) you don't change it.
If I was going to use a computer on stage, I'd be doing a clean install of operating system and the minimal additions required for music. And nothing else, not even email unless it was required. Then turn off any autoupdates and don't even install bug fix releases unless (1) they were needed and (2) you had plenty of time to test/bed it in before the main event.
Of course if you're just looking for an excuse to get another bit of gear, then please ignore the above
Jean-Michel Jarre has a great concert - Oxygene Live In Your Living Room - where the heat from the stage lighting was badly affecting the tuning of his synths through the concert. He discusses it in the DVD extras.
So there's always room for issues even where you're not using a computer rig on stage.
Most digital synths are really computers these days and even my analog DSI synth has occasional operating system bug fixes available. What makes the dedicated synths generally more stable is (1) you're not running other stuff on it and (2) you don't change it.
If I was going to use a computer on stage, I'd be doing a clean install of operating system and the minimal additions required for music. And nothing else, not even email unless it was required. Then turn off any autoupdates and don't even install bug fix releases unless (1) they were needed and (2) you had plenty of time to test/bed it in before the main event.
Of course if you're just looking for an excuse to get another bit of gear, then please ignore the above
raymondh wrote:I was at the front of a New Order concert when Gillian Gilbert's synth froze up. I think it was a Roland JV. The tech guy scooted out from side stage and worked on it (eventually with success) while Gillian tried to look composed. What I liked was that her synth lines were missing so it was nice to know she was playing live rather than miming to a recorded track!
Jean-Michel Jarre has a great concert - Oxygene Live In Your Living Room - where the heat from the stage lighting was badly affecting the tuning of his synths through the concert. He discusses it in the DVD extras.
So there's always room for issues even where you're not using a computer rig on stage.
Most digital synths are really computers these days and even my analog DSI synth has occasional operating system bug fixes available. What makes the dedicated synths generally more stable is (1) you're not running other stuff on it and (2) you don't change it.
If I was going to use a computer on stage, I'd be doing a clean install of operating system and the minimal additions required for music. And nothing else, not even email unless it was required. Then turn off any autoupdates and don't even install bug fix releases unless (1) they were needed and (2) you had plenty of time to test/bed it in before the main event.
Of course if you're just looking for an excuse to get another bit of gear, then please ignore the above
Good points, and well taken.
I'm just frustrated. I thought going to a Mac, let alone a really fast Mac with an SSD and tons of Ram would just solve all my problems that I had on my older Windows machine. And while it certainly seems to have improved, it hasn't improved as much as I anticipated.
In my mind, I know a Korg Krome is a computer as well. But it's a computer specifically designed for running as a keyboard. And to me, that would mean less likely to have difficulty doing that task. But you are right, even those are not immune to problems.
I rarely surf the net on my MacBookPro. The only apps I have installed are Reason, Motu drivers, Reaper, Mainstage, Audacity. And that's pretty much it.
Maybe I do just need to do a complete re-install of the OS, and Reason and all of that.
I really can't imagine how even a Kronos could sound better than Reason, honestly. I know the sampled instruments might have higher sample rates, etc. But I'm so pleased with the sounds I get from Reason, and how easy it is to create sounds, that I think trying to do all of that on a small LCD would be really frustrating for me.
So getting my laptop working well is a much better solution. I'm just not sure how.
A clean install might be what you need. Because it's used there may still be some remnants of programs the previous owner used.
Also you'd have to treat Mainstage or a workstation the same way do Reason and custom make layers/program synths to really get the most out of it. Thing is coming from the PUF we there are just so many people have done the work for us already
Also you'd have to treat Mainstage or a workstation the same way do Reason and custom make layers/program synths to really get the most out of it. Thing is coming from the PUF we there are just so many people have done the work for us already
I was still downloading Reason 8.3 when I went to bed last night.keeverw wrote:Just finished clean install of OSX Yosemite!
Downloading Reason 8.3 now.
More to come...
Tonight I will install and run the test song again, and see how things go.
I am hoping they will be better. They couldn't really be any worse.
Glad it's working out
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