The UFO Thread

[bxbrkrz]

Simple rules to follow.
Don't forget:
1- If you ever see a video of a UFO from a smartphone or military hardware, anywhere, from 1st, 2nd, or 3rd World, it's obviously fake. 100%
2 - No one is a valid witness.

[EnochLight]

Simple rules to follow.
Don't forget:
1- If you ever see a video of a UFO from a smartphone or military hardware, anywhere, from 1st, 2nd, or 3rd World, it's obviously fake. 100%
2 - No one is a valid witness.

Counterpoint: if you had a commercial airliner with several unrelated passengers recording video of the same phenomena, then that could absolutely be valid. And out of the 6+ billion smartphone owners out there, many with 4K HDR capable recording, you'd think you'd have multiple recordings of the same phenomena by unrelated people all over the world.

But.. we don't.

[bxbrkrz]

Simple rules to follow.
Don't forget:
1- If you ever see a video of a UFO from a smartphone or military hardware, anywhere, from 1st, 2nd, or 3rd World, it's obviously fake. 100%
2 - No one is a valid witness.

Counterpoint: if you had a commercial airliner with several unrelated passengers recording video of the same phenomena, then that could absolutely be valid. And out of the 6+ billion smartphone owners out there, many with 4K HDR capable recording, you'd think you'd have multiple recordings of the same phenomena by unrelated people all over the world.

But.. we don't.

Should any data from a variety of military hardware observing the phenomenon for weeks, across multiple platforms from sea level to air or space be trusted? Not a counterpoint. Just a general question.

Do you even watch any of the videos posted along this thread? I could be wrong, but it feels like your Left/Right locators are still looping on page one. Many events happened since then, beyond the simple explanation of swamp gas. It would be nice to feel like you are counterpointing what you saw in a video.

One don't need to travel 1st class using an iPhone Ultra Max Big Pro+, nor know how to read and write to be a legitimate witness.
By that measure only people from LA with tiny pocket dog with a TikTok account would to be trusted

[EnochLight]

Should any data from a variety of military hardware observing the phenomenon for weeks, across multiple platforms from sea level to air or space be trusted? Not a counterpoint. Just a general question. Do you even watch any of the videos posted along this thread?

Just so we're clear - I'm not denying that the military has grainy black and white footage of unidentified flying objects (or aerial phenomena if that's what you want to call them). Obviously we've all seen the footage and watched talking heads give their various takes on what they think.

I could be wrong, but it feels like your Left/Right locators are still looping on page one. Many events happened since then, beyond the simple explanation of swamp gas. It would be nice to feel like you are counterpointing what you saw in a video.

One don't need to travel 1st class using an iPhone Ultra Max Big Pro+, nor know how to read and write to be a legitimate witness.
By that measure only people from LA with tiny pocket dog with a TikTok account would to be trusted

So you're saying - you absolutely trust the military and the talking heads claiming "I know someone that has seen blah blah blah" or "I actually saw blah blah blah"... but not evidence from the common people? You feel that the literal dearth of similar footage from the billions - BILLIONS - of smartphones across the world - doesn't raise any alarm bells?



Still waiting for that undeniable evidence that we have:

1. Alien technology
2. Alien bodies/remains
3. Alien spacecraft

If you've seen something I haven't, please let me know.

[Aosta]

Still waiting for that undeniable evidence that we have:

1. Alien technology
2. Alien bodies/remains
3. Alien spacecraft

If you've seen something I haven't, please let me know.

Having watched the congressional hearing what I can't wrap my head around is that Mr Grusch says that a craft retrieval program was started in the 1930s and the government have multiple craft from multiple species. Surely spacecraft must have crashed before the 1930s, the 1900s, the 1800s back to dot. So why wasn't there random craft discovered then? They must have been lying around all over the place and most certainly would have been recovered by horse and cart and paraded through the streets with great fanfare, news reports, etchings, oil paintings, watercolours and writings from members of the public about 'the great day the giant silver orb was brought through the town'.
If the aliens only started visiting the earth in the 1930s and as they say they have recovered multiple craft then they are shit space pilots and should have most certainly slammed into a highly populated area of the earth with a mass of people to see the object debris.
The whole thing doesn't make logical sense and as Enoch says, where is the actual stuff?

[bxbrkrz]

Should any data from a variety of military hardware observing the phenomenon for weeks, across multiple platforms from sea level to air or space be trusted? Not a counterpoint. Just a general question. Do you even watch any of the videos posted along this thread?

Just so we're clear - I'm not denying that the military has grainy black and white footage of unidentified flying objects (or aerial phenomena if that's what you want to call them). Obviously we've all seen the footage and watched talking heads give their various takes on what they think.

I could be wrong, but it feels like your Left/Right locators are still looping on page one. Many events happened since then, beyond the simple explanation of swamp gas. It would be nice to feel like you are counterpointing what you saw in a video.

One don't need to travel 1st class using an iPhone Ultra Max Big Pro+, nor know how to read and write to be a legitimate witness.
By that measure only people from LA with tiny pocket dog with a TikTok account would to be trusted

So you're saying - you absolutely trust the military and the talking heads claiming "I know someone that has seen blah blah blah" or "I actually saw blah blah blah"... but not evidence from the common people? You feel that the literal dearth of similar footage from the billions - BILLIONS - of smartphones across the world - doesn't raise any alarm bells?



Still waiting for that undeniable evidence that we have:

1. Alien technology
2. Alien bodies/remains
3. Alien spacecraft

If you've seen something I haven't, please let me know.

No one should trust their government. Ideally the government should trust its citizenry. I know, it is unrealistic. Tyranny always finds a way. Human Nature.
Do you know how easy it is to find thousands of videos on yt? You type something like, I don't know, "real ufo videos". Do you think that would be enough to convince you the phenomenon is real? I think 99.9% of them are fake. It is not difficult to find what you seek, if you are willing to have open mind. Materialism is the illusion. Don't be afraid to watch the videos in the thread.

Through the Looking-Glass...

Is difficult for someone to explain how it is, when you go through that looking-glass, especially when it wasn't your intention. After that, all you have are questions, and a void without answers.

I wish I was still like you, still on the other side of the mirror. Hmm. Not really no

[Aosta]

Do you know how easy it is to find thousands of videos on yt? You type something like, I don't know, "real ufo videos".

Ok, let's play devil's advocate here....
Make of these what you will?

[bxbrkrz]

Do you know how easy it is to find thousands of videos on yt? You type something like, I don't know, "real ufo videos".

Ok, let's play devil's advocate here....
Make of these what you will?

Debunked! None of them were filmed in 8K!
Goalpost movers win again.

Edit: video #2 @ 12:37, lower left corner "Germany" 100% fake.

[EnochLight]

No one should trust their government. Ideally the government should trust its citizenry. I know, it is unrealistic. Tyranny always finds a way. Human Nature.

Exactly. So why suggest that the government "evidence" (and I use that word loosely) being presented is worth anything more than what is easily available to the billions of average citizens on Earth with their own eyes and ability to record video?

Do you know how easy it is to find thousands of videos on yt? You type something like, I don't know, "real ufo videos". Do you think that would be enough to convince you the phenomenon is real? I think 99.9% of them are fake. It is not difficult to find what you seek, if you are willing to have open mind. Materialism is the illusion. Don't be afraid to watch the videos in the thread.

Wait - you're suggesting YouTube is a reliable source of evidence for alien spacecraft in our possession, alien bodies, etc? Dude... anything you want to believe - real or made up - there are videos on YouTube.

Again, you seem to be confused, so I'll spell it out once again - I am not denying there is video footage of aerial phenomena/UFO's. There's been video of such things for decades, far before the Internet ever came a long. What I am calling 100% absolute horse shit on is - there is ZERO evidence that we have extraterrestrial spacecraft and alien bodies in our possession, and we have ZERO evidence that anything on video are aliens from another world/dimension. Some talking heads *CLAIMING* we have it is worth about as much as a wet fart in a hurricane. These "government" talking heads need to show the proof, or shut up.

Through the Looking-Glass...

Is difficult for someone to explain how it is, when you go through that looking-glass, especially when it wasn't your intention. After that, all you have are questions, and a void without answers.

I wish I was still like you, still on the other side of the mirror. Hmm. Not really no

OK. You keep on smoking that funny leaf and come back and talk when you can speak plainly, because I have no idea what the hell you're getting on about.

[EnochLight]

And on that note, here's a lovely article to consider:

Opinion: Congress is too credulous on UFOs

https://www.cnn.com/2023/07/28/opinions ... index.html

Over the course of 25 years, 11 seasons, 218 episodes and two movies, FBI agents Fox Mulder and Dana Scully attempted to unravel a government conspiracy of extraterrestrial proportions on “The X-Files” as an all-powerful Deep State covered up research on non-human biological matter and alien murders of Americans. How foolish of them, when in real life all it seemed to take was one whistleblower talking on a second-tier cable news channel earlier this summer about hearing someone else’s stories of dead UFO pilots for Congress to hold a hearing in order to expose the whole conspiracy on its own!

On Wednesday, former military intelligence officer and so-called UFO “whistleblower” David Grusch testified to a House Oversight subcommittee that he had heard from other unnamed officials that the US government has a secret program to recover and reverse engineer non-human spacecraft.

He was invited to testify by House members of both parties who are urging the defense establishment to be more transparent about its investigations of unidentified anomalous phenomena. In the Senate, Majority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-NY) has sponsored a bipartisan amendment to the National Defense Authorization Act to require the declassification of government records related to UAPs.

In a statement after the hearing, the Pentagon disputed Grusch’s testimony and emphasized that it has found no evidence of crashed saucer programs or space aliens. We can’t entirely rule out the possibility that Grusch discovered something real. Certainly, pilots see things in the sky they don’t understand. It’s also very likely that the Pentagon isn’t completely transparent about all of its advanced aerospace programs. The trouble is that Grusch’s stories are, in all likelihood, not evidence of non-human activity.

Congress and UFO enthusiasts have been all too willing to accept witness reports at face value when we know eyewitness testimony is unreliable. This problem has been compounded by the fact that much of this testimony comes from seemingly unassailable military pilots who are trained to observe airborne threats. This dynamic has been a problem from the dawn of UFO investigations last century until the present day.

At the hearing, Grusch said that he had not seen any aliens from the recovered UFOs himself, but “biologics came with some of these recoveries.” He added that “the assessment of people with direct knowledge on the program I talked to” about the “multi-decade UAP crash retrieval and reverse engineering program” was that such “biologics” were “non-human.”

These stories have circulated in UFO circles since the 1940s. Declassified documents show that during the Cold War, the government repeatedly recovered items first reported as UFOs that in fact were meteors, industrial waste, hoaxed objects and human-made technology. So there were “crash retrievals” — just not of alien ships.

The first major UFO sighting came in June 1947. A month later, the first “crash retrieval” of a supposed alien spaceship occurred. But the “crash” was a hoax. The military sent officers to Maury Island, Washington, to recover chunks of industrial waste that two men falsely claimed was debris from a flying saucer. A government investigation followed.

Frank Scully of Variety magazine also fell for a hoax, publishing in 1950 a widely repeated account of the government’s recovery of a crashed flying saucer and its alien pilots. Another real-life federal investigation followed before the hoaxer, Silas Newton, was identified.

More importantly, those undertaking the first official military investigation into UFOs, 1948’s Project Sign, became convinced aliens were real despite a lack of evidence other than first-hand accounts from military pilots. According to Edward Ruppelt, the former head of Project Blue Book, a successor to Sign, the team found no physical evidence of space aliens. But apparently aliens seemed more logical than heroic, trained military pilots being mistaken about what they saw. And yet we know pilots can and do make mistakes. Pilots have chased Venus, and even radar blips caused by weather, mistaking them for alien ships.

According to the head of the Pentagon’s UFO office, Sean Kirkpatrick, most reported UFOs turn out to be balloons, airborne garbage, drones and animals — the vast majority, in fact. I haven’t heard even the most committed UFO advocate dispute this. The UFO issue thus reduces to the tiny remainder of unknowns. For the UFO community, it seems that so long as even one case remains unidentified, usually due to lack of information, there is still hope we will find space aliens.

But military pilots report UFOs in numbers far exceeding the unresolved cases, meaning that at least some pilots believe they see things that scientific analysis concludes they did not correctly interpret. We watched this in February when various balloons flying over the United States triggered national security concerns. The pilots tasked with chasing the balloons struggled to describe their size, material and movements because they did not recognize them.

For the past several years, Grusch has been working alongside a network of government-adjacent UFO believers (many now working for defense contractors or UFO think tanks) who have been sources in stories about flying saucers and dead aliens across the media and in the halls of Congress. You might have seen some of them on cable UFO shows like “The Secret of Skinwalker Ranch,” in which a former Pentagon UFO analystwho served on the task force that helped write the government’s 2021 UFO report now leads a reality TV crew hunting harmful, disembodied quantum “hitchhiker” entities, one of which he claims attached itself to him. It would be funny, except that the Pentagon regularly employs believers in space ghosts and Congress listens to them.

Eric W. Davis, a physicist and longtime UFO researcher, briefed the Pentagon and Congress on the same supposed crash retrieval programs a couple years back. None of the evidence he or Grusch provided over the past few years, however, has been enough to convince Congress — as credulous as some members have been — that aliens are here. Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-NY), who has helped lead the charge in Congress for UFO research, recently told The Los Angeles Times that she hadn’t seen definitive evidence of aliens.

It’s important to note that there have been no claims that military pilots have crashed into or captured alien spaceships. Instead, veterans like David Fravor and Ryan Graves, who appeared along with Grusch at Wednesday’s hearing to testify about their personal UFO encounters (but did not mention aliens), have only claimed to have seen objects they could not explain or to have observed sensor signatures of such objects.

The scientific process of evaluating such sightings is difficult, involving visual evidence, sensor data, witness testimony and records of air traffic, weather and more, as the government’s own 2021 UFO report outlines. But when there is enough data, cases can be solved. Indeed, in its most recent UFO report, the government found the majority of solved cases were balloons.

When there is not enough data, they remain unsolved. However, unsolved doesn’t automatically translate to alien, only to a lack of information. Since the majority of solved cases have normal explanations, we would need extraordinary evidence to suggest that low-information cases are anything but the same.

Perhaps most telling, in response to direct questions at the hearing about his cable TV and other media interviews, Grusch under oath did not re-state, or he attributed to others, his own most dramatic claims about dead aliens, Vatican meddling and murder plots.

Grusch may well be telling the truth about hearing these stories, but the stories were old when “The X-Files” was new. Congress must do better than take them at face value.

[bxbrkrz]

No one should trust their government. Ideally the government should trust its citizenry. I know, it is unrealistic. Tyranny always finds a way. Human Nature.

Exactly. So why suggest that the government "evidence" (and I use that word loosely) being presented is worth anything more than what is easily available to the billions of average citizens on Earth with their own eyes and ability to record video?

Do you know how easy it is to find thousands of videos on yt? You type something like, I don't know, "real ufo videos". Do you think that would be enough to convince you the phenomenon is real? I think 99.9% of them are fake. It is not difficult to find what you seek, if you are willing to have open mind. Materialism is the illusion. Don't be afraid to watch the videos in the thread.

Wait - you're suggesting YouTube is a reliable source of evidence for alien spacecraft in our possession, alien bodies, etc? Dude... anything you want to believe - real or made up - there are videos on YouTube.

Again, you seem to be confused, so I'll spell it out once again - I am not denying there is video footage of aerial phenomena/UFO's. There's been video of such things for decades, far before the Internet ever came a long. What I am calling 100% absolute horse shit on is - there is ZERO evidence that we have extraterrestrial spacecraft and alien bodies in our possession, and we have ZERO evidence that anything on video are aliens from another world/dimension. Some talking heads *CLAIMING* we have it is worth about as much as a wet fart in a hurricane. These "government" talking heads need to show the proof, or shut up.

Through the Looking-Glass...

Is difficult for someone to explain how it is, when you go through that looking-glass, especially when it wasn't your intention. After that, all you have are questions, and a void without answers.

I wish I was still like you, still on the other side of the mirror. Hmm. Not really no

OK. You keep on smoking that funny leaf and come back and talk when you can speak plainly, because I have no idea what the hell you're getting on about.

Drugs are an extension of that materialistic illusion, so I don't do any. If you've never witnessed anything you could not explain then I understand your position, as it was mine for decades. what I wrote was easy to comprehend

[motuscott]

I believe they're out there but they've swiped left, as the kids say.

[EnochLight]

If you've never witnessed anything you could not explain then I understand your position, as it was mine for decades. what I wrote was easy to comprehend

So at the end of the day, this is all about faith? Got it.

I believe they're out there but they've swiped left, as the kids say.

[bxbrkrz]

If you've never witnessed anything you could not explain then I understand your position, as it was mine for decades. what I wrote was easy to comprehend

So at the end of the day, this is all about faith? Got it.

I believe they're out there but they've swiped left, as the kids say.

That would be your perspective, not mine.

[EnochLight]

I'm sure the answers you seek can be found on Mystery Mountain.

[bxbrkrz]

[Aosta]

An interesting and level headed discussion on the subject..

[bxbrkrz]

An interesting and level headed discussion on the subject..

In the end even more doors were opened for a phenomenon witnessed by many going back way back, literally to biblical times.
Keeping an open mind helps analyzing anything from multiple angles

Recap and follow up. Around 34 min is cool.

[EnochLight]

In the end even more doors were opened for a phenomenon witnessed by many going back way back, literally to biblical times.

Indeed - we learned about this when Dr. Jones met with those government chaps.

raiders.jpg (134.95 KiB) Viewed 17465 times

[bxbrkrz]

In the end even more doors were opened for a phenomenon witnessed by many going back way back, literally to biblical times.

Indeed - we learned about this when Dr. Jones met with those government chaps.


raiders.jpg

There are only 3 Indy films. 1, 2, and 3.

[bxbrkrz]

Hmm... He lost me a bit when mentioning Julian A.

[jappe]

Hmm... He lost me a bit when mentioning Julian A.

I listened with one ear while working so might have missed something, but he referred to the Julian case as the way of sharing Grusch didn't want to follow: to share the evidence publicly, and not following the procedures for whistleblowing legally right?

This should be pretty simple to sort out. Grusch had a list of first hand witnesses, and locations where he say he's been told crafts are being stored and reverse engineered.

So there's nice plausible deniability, like almost immediately.

What's often missed in reporting on this, is that it somehow isn't news worthy if the claims are false.

Is say that'd be a really huge scandal worthy of serious media coverage. No reason to let the U-word stop the media show from that perspective

Personally, it just doesn't make sense to me that you can hide downed UFOs from being confirmed for 85 years.

Add the Vatican and Mussolini to get a real shit soup that'd be laughable if it didn't taste so bad. Just a gut reaction.

But like I said, the alternative explanation might be highly astonishing too.

I just don't see anything less motivating such a spectacle where so many people would conspire to trick Grusch.

[Aosta]

But like I said, the alternative explanation might be highly astonishing too.

Agreed, it could turn out that this whole thing is a misappropriation of funds in the billions that have been filtered into these unaudited 'dark' projects and some people in the military, government and private contractors have been stealing and getting insanely wealthy and powerful for decades. Greed is a very basic human motivator especially if you are psychopathic with no moral compass.

[bxbrkrz]

Hmm... He lost me a bit when mentioning Julian A.

I listened with one ear while working so might have missed something, but he referred to the Julian case as the way of sharing Grusch didn't want to follow: to share the evidence publicly, and not following the procedures for whistleblowing legally right?

This should be pretty simple to sort out. Grusch had a list of first hand witnesses, and locations where he say he's been told crafts are being stored and reverse engineered.

So there's nice plausible deniability, like almost immediately.

What's often missed in reporting on this, is that it somehow isn't news worthy if the claims are false.

Is say that'd be a really huge scandal worthy of serious media coverage. No reason to let the U-word stop the media show from that perspective

Personally, it just doesn't make sense to me that you can hide downed UFOs from being confirmed for 85 years.

Add the Vatican and Mussolini to get a real shit soup that'd be laughable if it didn't taste so bad. Just a gut reaction.

But like I said, the alternative explanation might be highly astonishing too.

I just don't see anything less motivating such a spectacle where so many people would conspire to trick Grusch.

It was about how journalists should protect their sources, and what to share and not to share with the public.
It was subjective imho.
From time to time they talk about patriotism, but at the same time describing a corruption so deep the need of the private sector was required, a private sector financed with billions the government has allocated to other projects. Billions missing every year, no one cares.
How can you get a patent on a technology using stolen money?
Beside federal prison, all patents should be null and void.

There is a show called Severance. To me that's the only level of secrecy that should be in place if anyone needs to keep such a huge secret for 85 years.

Popcorn time no matter how the story ends.

[Tiny Montgomery]