How Generative Music Works

[Marco Raaphorst]

Excellent presentation:
https://teropa.info/loop/

[plaamook]

Yeah that's clever. And pretty much how I make music. I can't stand making deep desicions about what I make. I need to generate systems that surprise me so it's more about discovery rather than having a solid idea and seeing it through. I basically design systems and edit them.

[selig]

That's an amazing presentation, and on a subject I love too - thanks for the link Marco!

I tried many years ago to create a system with Reason I called "infinite tracks", but found little bugs in how things were triggered that totally defeated the purpose of the concept.

Will return to this one day if I can find REs that can accomplish the same thing, which is to build small generative modules or "phrases", controlled by a larger generative "arranger" that algorithmically structured the composition in real time based on weighting/rules defined by the "author".

It was the larger "arranger" part that fell apart due to how Thor's sequencer worked with triggering Matrix devices, IIRC. The problem was the trigger didn't catch the start of a new section and thus would totally miss certain phrases. Never found a workaround, ended in frustration!

Need to look at the current crop of devices and maybe build a custom RE for this purpose, which would probably be better, more useful and more fun in the long run!

[jimmyklane]

Yeah that's clever. And pretty much how I make music. I can't stand making deep desicions about what I make. I need to generate systems that surprise me so it's more about discovery rather than having a solid idea and seeing it through. I basically design systems and edit them.

I’ll have to check out the video....but perhaps I have a closed-loop mind. I’ve always found generative music to be so random as to be unlistenable except as an avant-grade experience. I did once see a show where a guy had several laptops set up, along with a vibraphone, and his show was pretty neat. Occasionally, he’d strike a drum trigger (like a Roland octo pad) and a burst of notes that were harmonically related to what he had just played would flow. Not delay, but like a random arpeggio that only took from the last chord or 5-6 notes he had previously played. THAT type of usage, where the generation is following your playing? That is something I’m interested in.

For example: I’ve been working on creating a combinator that uses scales and chords along with a dual arpeggios to grab MIDI and occasionally play it based on probability set up from a drum sequencer. It’s more what I would call “deterministic” music, because I have so much control, but it’s as close as I’ve gotten. Again, I’ll watch the video now, as maybe it sheds light on some of the points I’ve raised here.

[Marco Raaphorst]

That's an amazing presentation, and on a subject I love too - thanks for the link Marco!

I tried many years ago to create a system with Reason I called "infinite tracks", but found little bugs in how things were triggered that totally defeated the purpose of the concept.

Will return to this one day if I can find REs that can accomplish the same thing, which is to build small generative modules or "phrases", controlled by a larger generative "arranger" that algorithmically structured the composition in real time based on weighting/rules defined by the "author".

It was the larger "arranger" part that fell apart due to how Thor's sequencer worked with triggering Matrix devices, IIRC. The problem was the trigger didn't catch the start of a new section and thus would totally miss certain phrases. Never found a workaround, ended in frustration!

Need to look at the current crop of devices and maybe build a custom RE for this purpose, which would probably be better, more useful and more fun in the long run!

I made this in Reason 9 in 2016:



It randomly chooses a note from a pentatonic scale on every bar and this triggers a chord which randomly is made more complex or less complex via additional notes. Moreover, the tone remains the same. The question when building the framework is: what to randomise and what not? You do not want the music to sound as chaos, but you also do not want it to be predictable and boring.

[plaamook]

Well, it's not like I'm trying to make something that's purely generative in some way. you can make things as generative as you like. You can use genrative processes to kick start ideas then take it from there or make it all generative. Or use randomness to get past barriers. As you like.

[dandandaaan]

Really enjoyed that presentation, also an area I'm very interested in exploring more. Thanks for sharing.

You can use genrative processes to kick start ideas then take it from there or make it all generative. Or use randomness to get past barriers. As you like.

For me, I try and use at least some generated elements in everything I write. Whether it's just a hi-hat pattern with an odd number of steps (so it "phases out" from the rest of the groove over time), a semi-random arpeggiator, or random LFOs for some subtle automation.

For all its limitations, I really liked the features of the Drum Sequencer that allowed for some generative/random elements, particularly the "probability" for each hit, which isn't something I've seen anywhere before - nice to see PH encouraging some organised chaos!