What is going on in the USA and stuff

[MrFigg]

This one's for you , Figg...

Saw them twice when they were still the Beatnigs . Awesome.

[Proboscis]

What's also interesting of Micheal Franti , he 'dropped out' of USA society, and has been living in Bali, Indonesia for many years, and runs a yoga/spiritual retreat centre in a south pacific paradise that's world's apart from the American homeland bullshit.

[joeyluck]

Some people miss the facts that this isn't simply about a murderer who is white and a black victim. Yes, there is racism involved in the disgusting act itself and the reason why George Floyd was killed...

But this is about the fact that you wouldn't know about it if it wasn't filmed. Because if it wasn't filmed, the racist system would take the white cop at his word. Their police report said nothing remotely close to what happened or why the ambulance was called and when it was called. If it wasn't filmed there wouldn't be any arrests and there would be no investigation. And then you have the local coroner delivering very false autopsy findings (another coroner concluded homicide by asphyxiation). The system is broken and incredibly racist.

The same goes for the case with Ahmaud Arbery, whose killers weren't arrested and the situation thoroughly investigated until two months later when video surfaced. The men who killed Ahmaud, reported the killing to police as self-defense, and then they went about their day. It's almost no different than them calling to report hitting a deer with their car. It is absolutely disgusting—they are taken at their word, and that is it. And more about that surfacing now: https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/04/us/mcmic ... index.html

Racial injustice and the broken system are incredibly huge problems that need to be addressed.

[selig]

Saw them twice when they were still the Beatnigs . Awesome.

Man I just remembered I saw the Beatnigs in SF (probably 1990?) with The Wolfgang Press opening (and another band IIRC), at Club DV8. Ahh, good times…

[MrFigg]

Saw them twice when they were still the Beatnigs . Awesome.

Man I just remembered I saw the Beatnigs in SF (probably 1990?) with The Wolfgang Press opening (and another band IIRC), at Club DV8. Ahh, good times…

I was listening to the Wolfgang Press yesterday man. Weird. On that 4AD Lonely is an Eyesore compilation. Got Dead Can Dance in my head so dig out the vinyl .
One of the times I saw the Beatnigs they were playing with Billy Bragg and Michelle Shocked. They all did a cover of the Smiths Panic as an encore. Axle Grinders at the ready haha.

[Proboscis]

Some people miss the facts that this isn't simply about a murderer who is white and a black victim. Yes, there is racism involved in the disgusting act itself and the reason why George Floyd was killed...

But this is about the fact that you wouldn't know about it if it wasn't filmed. Because if it wasn't filmed, the racist system would take the white cop at his word. Their police report said nothing remotely close to what happened or why the ambulance was called and when it was called. If it wasn't filmed there wouldn't be any arrests and there would be no investigation. And then you have the local coroner delivering very false autopsy findings. The system is broken and incredibly racist.

"White Cop=Bad Guy" should not be the message across the USA though. And nor should it be. Many city & state cops have expressed unity with the message that the George Floyd murder was unacceptable. I'm not one for emotions too much, but I have *actually* cried when seeing some powerful statements from "white" police, in relation to the current state of anarchy.

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[Proboscis]

Man I just remembered I saw the Beatnigs in SF (probably 1990?) with The Wolfgang Press opening (and another band IIRC), at Club DV8. Ahh, good times…

Wow !

Do you know that M. Franti now lives in the most Muslim-populated country in the word ?

His own version of 'turn on, tune in, drop out'.

[Proboscis]

But this is about the fact that you wouldn't know about it if it wasn't filmed.

Really, Joey ? You wouldn't know about racial bias if it weren't filmed ?

The male population of USA prisons are occupied by 38% African-Americans. Yet the overall population of African-Americans is 12%

Do you need stuff to 'be filmed' to see a disparity ?

[Proboscis]

[Boombastix]

So the death of Floyd ignited the protests. But besides police brutality, another issue at hand that may be less widely understood is the economic injustice.
This video explains very well. Educate yourself.

[joeyluck]

But this is about the fact that you wouldn't know about it if it wasn't filmed.

Really, Joey ? You wouldn't know about racial bias if it weren't filmed ?

The male population of USA prisons are occupied by 38% African-Americans. Yet the overall population of African-Americans is 12%

Do you need stuff to 'be filmed' to see a disparity ?

You are completely misunderstanding. Yes, disparity is clear.

[Proboscis]

No CGI by the way.

That Buddhist Monk (Thich Quang Duc) set himself alight in the streets of Saigon, in protest of government persecution

How many BLM are self-immolating for the cause ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-immolation

[Boombastix]

No CGI by the way.

That Buddhist Monk (Thich Quang Duc) set himself alight in the streets of Saigon, in protest of government persecution

How many BLM are self-immolating for the cause ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-immolation

Not sure I understand the point of this post.

People are out protesting, being shot with rubber bullets. I've seen many pictures of gaping and bleeding holes in their heads, destroyed eyes, blindness. Documenting with video, sending it to the press, sharing, calling out perpetrators, things are happening.

[Proboscis]

Not sure I understand the point of this post.

People are out protesting, being shot with rubber bullets. I've seen many pictures of gaping and bleeding holes in their heads, destroyed eyes, blindness. Documenting with video, sending it to the press, sharing, calling out perpetrators, things are happening.

How does a government enforce law & order, when there are rioters, looters & vandals dispersed among the 'peaceful protesters' ? Do they do nothing ?

The message of unity becomes diluted when radical fools are smashing windows and burning down buildings.

[Proboscis]

You are completely misunderstanding.

No sir, I think you may be of a misunderstanding. But whatever....

Yes, disparity is clear.

Yup. We need to think of this as a symptom of a sick society. America is a mess.

[joeyluck]

You are completely misunderstanding.

No sir, I think you may be of a misunderstanding. But whatever....

Yes, disparity is clear.

Yup. We need to think of this as a symptom of a sick society. America is a mess.

Try re-reading maybe? My point is about murders being filmed. It's about the system taking white people at their word as it relates to the killing of black people and any POC. If those murders weren't filmed, there would be no arrests and no investigations. That's how screwed up it is. If there weren't the protests and public outcry, there also would be no action taken.

Yes the US is a mess and has been a mess. The movement must continue and more steps must be taken.

[Boombastix]

How does a government enforce law & order, when there are rioters, looters & vandals dispersed among the 'peaceful protesters' ? Do they do nothing ?

The message of unity becomes diluted when radical fools are smashing windows and burning down buildings.

No, I was expecting a clarification to the statement "How many BLM are self-immolating for the cause ?"

What exactly do you mean by that?

[Kalm]

And it certainly doesn't change the reality of life for many POC. There's documented, real history in America of real institutional racism and discrimination, much of it still within living memory. If you don't think that has any lasting effect on subsequent generations and their prospects and opportunities...well I'm not sure what to say.

I don't think that's the main cause of the problem. Not the memory of institutional racism of some racist state of mind play the main role, but the existing socioeconomic disparity that reproduces itself through generations. If you erase the minds of everyone, people will still be poor, communities will still be living together compactly, and they will be recreating the same thing again and again since their childhood, because race will become a convenient distinguishing feature, like it is now for the cops. It has been 3-4 generations already since the the last racist law was eliminated and we're still there, nothing has been changing.

truth

[Kalm]

Not sure I understand the point of this post.

People are out protesting, being shot with rubber bullets. I've seen many pictures of gaping and bleeding holes in their heads, destroyed eyes, blindness. Documenting with video, sending it to the press, sharing, calling out perpetrators, things are happening.

How does a government enforce law & order, when there are rioters, looters & vandals dispersed among the 'peaceful protesters' ? Do they do nothing ?

The message of unity becomes diluted when radical fools are smashing windows and burning down buildings.

Eh that's debatable. It actually makes America out to be the socio-ignorant country that it is. If one were to concentrate on the rioting and the looting without taking heed to the majority of peaceful protest that are happening, then you know where their interest lies. It's like having a bad child in a well of, well-mannered family. Do you oust the family as a whole? No, you attempt to wonder how there is such a bad child when everyone else is well-mannered.

Second, my take still stands (not here but on my other social media). If governors, mayors, yada-yada want to stop the rioters and looters then it would be in there best interest to act swiftly on bringing the awareness and plans of action into fruition to answer the ongoing problems in America. You see Trump is wasting no time attempting to bring in the military to do something about it (albeit the worst possible measure you can take), but everyone wants to talk. I'm not condemning the social communities of not doing anything as I'm critically speaking to those in law enforcement and political offices. You had the chief of popo in Minneapolis literally higher four attorneys to get these cops out of their charges and their jobs back . Where are our lawyers to fight against this idea? Are our political leaders drafting plans to radically fix the issues in law enforcement?

If people in power wants the rioting and looting to stop to "protect fellow Americans" as some of us are called, I suggest they stop complaining and begin hashing out some ideas.

[MarkTarlton]

[selig]

I was listening to the Wolfgang Press yesterday man. Weird. On that 4AD Lonely is an Eyesore compilation. Got Dead Can Dance in my head so dig out the vinyl .
One of the times I saw the Beatnigs they were playing with Billy Bragg and Michelle Shocked. They all did a cover of the Smiths Panic as an encore. Axle Grinders at the ready haha.

I DO remember the sparks a flying!

[selig]

If one were to concentrate on the rioting and the looting without taking heed to the majority of peaceful protest that are happening, then you know where their interest lies. It's like having a bad child in a well of, well-mannered family. Do you oust the family as a whole? No, you attempt to wonder how there is such a bad child when everyone else is well-mannered.

I see it more like a good intentioned forum with few trolls. One bad apple don't spoil the whole bunch, etc…
With the family example, it's the family that raised the child, so you CAN point some of the blame at the family…

The issue is that anyone can join the march, it's not the marchers fault there are looters hiding in the ranks. Many marchers are now more actively running off the trouble makers, now that they're on to the tactics. And many cities are getting smart to the tactics as well, NYC for one (despite some past bad actors) is now doing a better job of differentiating between peaceful protesters and violent agitators.

It's a tricky thing when then whole idea of the agitators is to use the protesters as cover, in a "wolves in sheep's clothing" way.

[Kalm]

If one were to concentrate on the rioting and the looting without taking heed to the majority of peaceful protest that are happening, then you know where their interest lies. It's like having a bad child in a well of, well-mannered family. Do you oust the family as a whole? No, you attempt to wonder how there is such a bad child when everyone else is well-mannered.

I see it more like a good intentioned forum with few trolls. One bad apple don't spoil the whole bunch, etc…
With the family example, it's the family that raised the child, so you CAN point some of the blame at the family…

The issue is that anyone can join the march, it's not the marchers fault there are looters hiding in the ranks. Many marchers are now more actively running off the trouble makers, now that they're on to the tactics. And many cities are getting smart to the tactics as well, NYC for one (despite some past bad actors) is now doing a better job of differentiating between peaceful protesters and violent agitators.

It's a tricky thing when then whole idea of the agitators is to use the protesters as cover, in a "wolves in sheep's clothing" way.

But that’s my point. You CAN blame the family, like you CAN blame the movement. But your efforts doesn’t constitute the behavior of said child or people. Everyone even that must speak and take responsibility for themselves.

What I find really helpful is how many police officers and chiefs are protesting alongside the protestors , or giving respect to the movement by taking a kneel themselves. Ain’t with an ex secretary of defense I feel like the interest of the protestors are pretty much solidified at this point. Rioting and looting seems to be an obvious wolf tactic like you said and becoming less of a blaming tactic.

We have rioters and looters, protestors, ANTIFA believers, Trump and supporters, COVID-19, and political leaders on both sides. Grab your kernel corn

[-008']

One good thing about the protests and riots and stuff is that at least we now know the Covid stuff was a big fake hoax. Because if it was real... (so deadly, so dangerous, so contagious!) then why would every democrat city mayor/gov support their own people going out and catching/spreading it en masse?

They say they're organizing for 1 million on streets in DC this weekend. In the midst of a Pandemic lockdown?

So either a.) it was a fake/hyped disease and we all got quarantined and lost jobs, tanked economy, etc all for nothing...
or b.) someone WANTS that disease to spread way more for it's 2nd phase. (which is RIGHT NOW)

Which one is it ReasonTalk? Either answer creates many more questions.

For the record I 100% believe that Black Lives Matter! ...so then why do they want them to risk all those mattering lives, and catch Covid-19 while protesting in the streets ? It doesn't make much sense to a simple man like me. Help me understand.

[selig]

But that’s my point. You CAN blame the family, like you CAN blame the movement. But your efforts doesn’t constitute the behavior of said child or people. Everyone even that must speak and take responsibility for themselves.

I don't think we're disagreeing on the situation at all, just on the way to describe it and which comparisons are more apt.

The difference is the family raised the child, and is responsible for the child from birth through the present. The looters are more like a parasite who at the last minute attaches themselves to the group. The protesters are not responsible for the looters because they did not raise them from their ranks, nor did they have any way of knowing they would appear (and blend in), and in most cases there is little if any central organization that would have been able to either weed out or groom the looters over the years to bring them into the fold. Two totally different things IMO, besides the obvious difference that the child may not yet be a fully developed human and the looters are full grown adults and thus responsible for their own actions.